00:27:19 <nioc> nikg83[m]: view tags are being worked on
00:27:51 <nioc> all these things are for a hard fork
00:28:03 <nioc> there will be a release before that
00:28:16 <selsta> yes that release is only delayed by ledger being SLOW
00:29:14 <nioc> s l    o        w
00:29:53 <selsta> waiting 3 weeks now
00:30:03 <selsta> Ledger: soon™
00:30:13 <nioc> soon+
00:30:46 <BusyBoredom[m]> What all does ledger need to do for the next release? 
00:30:54 <selsta> Ledger version locks their app
00:31:11 <nioc> forced holding 
00:31:13 <nioc> nice
00:31:19 <selsta> so if we update from v0.17.2.0 to v0.17.3.0 they have to put out an update
00:31:41 <nioc> oh, that type of lock
00:33:17 <BusyBoredom[m]> ... they just need to update a version number? 
00:36:00 <selsta> yes...
00:38:15 <Rucknium[m]> I don't know if you have been following things, but Ledger has had debacle after debacle recently. It's not too surprising that they don't have the bandwidth to handle even simple things like this.
00:38:40 <Rucknium[m]> Are we at the point where we should publicly pressure them?
00:39:49 <selsta> I even did the code changes for them https://github.com/LedgerHQ/app-monero/pull/100
00:41:06 <selsta> they just have to publish it
00:43:30 <Rucknium[m]> So...should we say something on their Reddit or something? Or Twitter?
00:44:48 <BusyBoredom[m]> I haven't done well following crypto news lately, my day job is pharma automation so I might as well be living under a rock thanks to covid.
00:46:19 <BusyBoredom[m]> This seems to warrant a reddit post in my eyes. 
00:47:30 <crypto_grampy[m]> Rucknium[m]: I would 100% be happy to put them on blast
00:48:50 <crypto_grampy[m]> 17.3 contains bp+ and ringsize bump?
00:50:02 <Rucknium[m]> Let's ask nicely in public first...
00:50:51 <crypto_grampy[m]> how many picos you want to bet that some moron says that Ledger is a point of failure in Monero.. AHAHAH YOU CAN'T UPDATE BC OF LEDGER.  WOW MUH DECENTRALIZED FUTURE OF MONEY 
00:52:35 <Rucknium[m]> Ledger already broke lots of functionality with their new 2.0 LedgerLive. The ship may be going down...
00:55:07 <nioc> crypto_grampy[m]: I assume that bp+ and ringsize increase change consensus and would be in the hardfork, 18.0
00:56:25 <BusyBoredom[m]> I'm surprised they check the minor version numbers. They should only be locking funds on breaking changes. 
00:57:36 <BusyBoredom[m]> Or locking the app I guess, same deal. 
00:57:49 <nioc> *0.18.0
00:58:43 <selsta> "They should only be locking funds on breaking changes." <-- yes, that's how it should be
00:59:38 <selsta> 01:46 <BusyBoredom[m]> This seems to warrant a reddit post in my eyes.  <-- wouldn't do that yet, I reached out to someone on Ledger dev slack now, hopefully they can speed things up
01:00:30 <BusyBoredom[m]> Makes sense, carrot first and stick later. 
01:37:37 <xmrscott[m]> > <@anarkiocrypto:halogen.city> > Exchanges do not dox their customers as they have no financial reason to do so... (full message at https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/libera.chat/2604ca17b162e2dfc2a18249d12011706c72931b)
01:43:55 <anarkiocrypto[m]> People have been targeted for theft, homes raided, imprisoned or even murdered from KYC leaks before...
02:00:04 <xmrscott[m]> Yeah, so who is posting those leaks? It's not exchanges like Coinbase. It's malicious actors. Feel free to lambast KYC or whatever all you want though. And, that's my bit on conflation of concepts. Peace ☻
02:03:13 <anarkiocrypto[m]> Coinbase voluntarily discloses people's sensitive information on a regular basis, which endangers people in real life. I don't know why you are shilling statist attacks on crypto in a Monero channel.
02:03:46 <anarkiocrypto[m]> The state and state-backed, state-compliant corporations are the malicious actors.
02:05:07 <unscottable[m]> yes i will continue to lambast kyc
02:54:54 <Torr> Hey
02:55:24 <Torr> How do I restrict monerod's RAM usage?
02:55:46 <Torr> If that's is possible.
03:00:45 <nioc> Torr: it will take as much ram as it likes but will release it if other programs need it, up to a point  
03:00:59 <nioc> don't know how much it actually needs
03:02:43 <Torr> Hm
03:04:49 <Torr> By the way, does monerod also mines? I saw a flag for this in the options.
03:05:20 <Torr> I thought a dedicated software was required for this, e.g., xmr-stak.
03:06:41 <nioc> it will solo mine but at a lower hash rate than xmrig as it is not optimized 
03:07:16 <Torr> I see
03:07:22 <Torr> Thank you
03:07:26 <nioc> xmrstack is not maintained 
03:07:57 <selsta> yep use xmrig instead
03:08:35 <Torr> Oh
03:09:24 <Torr> Will have a look.
05:09:21 <DiegoSalazar[m]> Lots of spam on the repo.getmonero.org
05:17:06 <selsta> we deleted them once but they come back
08:15:34 <Halver[m]> <crypto_grampy[m]> "There's a similar project (..." <- From https://academy.particl.io/en/latest/in-depth/indepth_part_coin.html
08:15:34 <Halver[m]> PART is the untraceable cryptocurrency of the Particl Blockchain; a blockchain based on the Bitcoin code on which several privacy and utility technologies have been added. 
08:15:56 <DaveyJones> former shadowcoin
16:19:45 <plowsof[m]> When the view tags update is added if you send yourself your wallets entire balance and use that block height of that tx as your new restore height - you will have a turbo sync mode wallet deluxe v2.0 extreme
16:29:53 <atomfried[m]> <plowsof[m]> "When the view tags update is..." <- while doing this you can create yourself a new wallet using 14 word seed from feather wallet. the restore height is implicitly encoded into the word seed there
16:32:35 <plowsof[m]> atomfried[m]: Thats the VIP version v3.0! 🪶🪶
17:05:20 <crypto_grampy[m]> I think I filed a feature request with cake and monero GUI for the 14 word seed... Someone should do the same with monerujo 
17:10:59 <nioc> 14 word seed is being upgraded to 16 words
17:11:31 <nioc> https://github.com/tevador/monero-seed
17:25:27 <selsta> 18:05 <crypto_grampy[m]> I think I filed a feature request with cake and monero GUI for the 14 word seed... Someone should do the same with monerujo  <-- CLI has to adopt it first
17:35:52 <tevador> Monero should use the updated 16-word seed
17:36:17 <atomfried[m]> tevador: care to explain that?
17:36:30 <atomfried[m]> never heard of a 16 word seed
17:36:47 <tevador> explained here: https://github.com/tevador/monero-seed#security
18:25:47 <atomfried[m]> nice, thank you
20:04:15 <crypto_grampy[m]> <tevador> "Monero should use the updated 16..." <- cc-ing tobtoht 
20:04:29 <crypto_grampy[m]> 16 word... so hot right now
20:04:37 <crypto_grampy[m]> Why not make it 25
20:05:04 <crypto_grampy[m]> Can't wait to update my PR's asking them to add the 16 instead of the 14
20:16:31 <tobtoht> crypto_grampy[m]: I'm aware, see discussion in #_oftc_#feather:matrix.org
20:29:46 <crypto_grampy[m]> selsta: is there any sort of Monero GUI feature roadmap?
20:42:03 <selsta> not really
20:42:15 <selsta> whatever gets developed
21:00:10 <crypto_grampy[m]> > twiddles fingers menacingly
21:30:57 <anhdres[m]> <crypto_grampy[m]> "I think I filed a feature..." <- is the 14 word seed less secure than the legacy one? or it uses a bigger dictionary?
21:31:58 <anhdres[m]> I like that the seed contains the height, such a headache for users who restore seeds wrong and see nothing on their balances
21:36:45 <crypto_grampy[m]> Yes this new seed resolves a massive amount of headache users have 
21:36:53 <crypto_grampy[m]> Newb users 😀
21:37:31 <crypto_grampy[m]> Apparently the 16 word is needed for comparable security to the 25 word if I'm reading the GitHub correctly and it does use a different dictionary
21:38:00 <crypto_grampy[m]> * the GitHub issue tevador  linked  correctly and
21:39:09 <crypto_grampy[m]> The only major downside I see to it is that it's not cross compatible/convertible with the 25 word seed and it won't really work with ledger/Trezor 
21:40:11 <crypto_grampy[m]> I think the upside is 100% worth it though.  That small percentage of hardware wallet users can learn how a 25 word and restore height works
21:48:43 <tobtoht> crypto_grampy[m]: 14/16 word seeds can be converted into 25 word seeds, just not the other way around.
21:49:03 <crypto_grampy[m]> ah interesting
21:49:21 <crypto_grampy[m]> so they can be used with a trezor/ledger
21:50:30 <tobtoht> I'm not sure if Ledger / Trezor use the same wordlists or derive the private spend/view key pair in the same way.
21:51:40 <crypto_grampy[m]> <selsta> "whatever gets developed" <- how do you feel about having a sort of group session/community meeting to go through the feature list and prioritize things?
21:52:57 <crypto_grampy[m]> there are a few ways of going about it... you could put the features into a kanban board and have people just all sort them into different buckets... say 'needs to happen yesterday', etc etc, or you could also put these in a big list, and have people go through and have say... 10 votes to put on things
21:53:55 <selsta> Ledger / Trezor seeds are incompatible with 25 word monero seeds
21:55:01 <selsta> crypto_grampy[m]: honestly the GUI doesn't have a lot of devs currently, I mostly focus on fixing bugs instead of larger changes currently
21:55:28 <crypto_grampy[m]> I totally get that. 
21:55:31 <selsta> you can open Github issues if you have a feature suggestion
21:59:35 <crypto_grampy[m]> I don't mean to bring it up as an attack, but I'm bringing it up as a way to get community feedback on what things people want most in Monero GUI so that the skeleton crew maintaining it has some idea of what people want the most out of that massive feature to-do list, whenever there's time to implement a feature
22:01:02 <selsta> didn't read it as an attack :D
22:01:17 <selsta> guess you can get some community feedback and open an issue with it
22:01:18 <crypto_grampy[m]> 👍️
22:01:20 <selsta> that would be a good idea
22:01:57 <crypto_grampy[m]> i'll make something happen 😀
22:04:56 <crypto_grampy[m]> s/I don't mean to bring it up as an attack, but I'm bringing it up as a way to get community feedback on what things people want most in Monero GUI so that the skeleton crew maintaining it has some idea of what people want the most out of that massive feature to-do list, whenever there's time to implement a feature/I don't mean to bring it up as an attack, but I'm bringing it up as a way to get community feedback on what
22:04:56 <crypto_grampy[m]> things people want _most_ in Monero GUI so that the skeleton crew maintaining it has some idea of priority in that massive feature to-do list, whenever there's spare time to implement a feature/