00:01:22 <TheDisruptiveCol> Do you live in Belgium or just visit?  I want to move there but I don't speak French and I noticed it's a major issue lol 
00:01:33 <TheDisruptiveCol> Lots of good tech jobs there.  
00:01:48 <Siren[m]> Just visit
00:02:10 <Siren[m]> TheDisruptiveCol: And I agree
00:02:19 <Siren[m]> I like that there are jobs for FOSS too
00:03:24 <TheDisruptiveCol> In the NL speaking Dutch isn't really as much of a requirement because everyone speaks English but I noticed in Belgium and France you really need to speak French.    You can get by as a tourist but you will find it difficult to live there 
00:03:34 <Stnby[m]> <TheDisruptiveCol> "Do we hand out gold stars for..." <- I think hes still banned in this group tho :(
00:04:00 <TheDisruptiveCol> Stnby[m]: Monero community groups shouldn't be jannied.    That's all I'll say about that 
00:05:20 <TheDisruptiveCol> You can't be pro privacy and pro economic freedom but anti freedom of speech is completely idiotic 
00:06:42 <Siren[m]> eh it's not anti freedom of speech, it's moderation
00:06:54 <TheDisruptiveCol> Isn't that the same thing 
00:07:16 <Siren[m]> no, you're free to go somewhere else for off-topic discussions or NSFW content that shouldn't be here
00:07:48 <TheDisruptiveCol> It's basically a single person in control of what can and cannot be said.   That's literally centralised power structure 
00:08:22 <Siren[m]> not really
00:08:34 <Siren[m]> you can get a person unbanned if you argue that it was unfair
00:08:48 <Siren[m]> usually it's quite hard to get banned from here too
00:08:56 <TheDisruptiveCol> By definition it is centralisation of lower.  
00:08:58 <Siren[m]> but again it's not a homeserver wide ban
00:09:02 <TheDisruptiveCol> Power*
00:09:11 <TheDisruptiveCol> s/lower/power/
00:09:42 <TheDisruptiveCol> The main issue is when moderators force their own personal politics onto a space.   
00:09:51 <TheDisruptiveCol> Especially in none political rooms 
00:10:03 <Siren[m]> well that doesn't happen
00:10:33 <Stnby[m]> That does not happen in here, no matter how much we disagree, I would be banned otherwise
00:10:42 <TheDisruptiveCol> I seen a Muslim guy get kicked from a Monero chat for refusing to use pronouns, which is his right it's actually haram for him to do so.  
00:11:06 <TheDisruptiveCol> But there was no respect for his religion.  Only the ideological position of the Jannie 
00:11:24 <Siren[m]> TheDisruptiveCol: what makes you think it's haram to refer to someone as something?
00:11:40 <Stnby[m]> TheDisruptiveCol: Sorry dude Idk how those work I was not taught about those in my English class
00:12:17 <Stnby[m]> In my language everything, even objects have genders and all there exists is he/she :D
00:12:30 <TheDisruptiveCol> Siren[m]: Because it is haram.  In Islamic culture it is.   
00:12:31 <Stnby[m]> * he/she :D (everyone else can go cry)
00:12:46 <Siren[m]> Allah won't send you to hell just because you said Vi/Vim
00:12:53 <TheDisruptiveCol> Stnby[m]: Well it is the same in the Islamic world.  
00:13:08 <TheDisruptiveCol> Siren[m]: Habibi.   I'm sorry but you're wrong lol 
00:13:38 <TheDisruptiveCol> Also.  Emac>Vim
00:13:38 <Siren[m]> yike
00:14:17 <Stnby[m]> TheDisruptiveCol: just like C#>C, we are both right
00:14:55 <TheDisruptiveCol> Real Gs use nano.   Lol 
00:15:04 <Siren[m]> nano is impossible to use 
00:15:08 <Siren[m]> very confusing
00:15:12 <TheDisruptiveCol> Skill issue 
00:16:07 <Stnby[m]> Just ed it
00:16:41 <TheDisruptiveCol> I honestly find myself using VSCode a lot, because my job makes us use it.   It makes you a lazy Dev tho 
00:16:43 <cockliuser[m]> TheDisruptiveCol: Real Gs use busybox vi
00:17:11 <TheDisruptiveCol> cockliuser[m]: Touche
00:17:12 <cockliuser[m]> But honestly true programmers use ACME
00:18:02 <TheDisruptiveCol> I write my code on an Amiga 1200 
00:18:10 <TheDisruptiveCol> Like a chad 
00:18:46 <Siren[m]> Reminds me of that time some stupid ass person set EDITOR=jed on the jumpbox at my workplace 
00:19:19 <Stnby[m]> just prinf >> file.
00:19:19 <Stnby[m]> Each time you need to change a line start all over again printf > file.
00:19:30 <Siren[m]> just do sed -i
00:19:31 <Stnby[m]> s/prinf/printf/
00:19:40 <Siren[m]> use regex
00:19:48 <Stnby[m]> Too advanced
00:19:54 <Stnby[m]> why sed if you have ed
00:20:38 * Stnby[m] uploaded an image: (262KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/kernal.eu/LkhYhHoxAyksBmbTTirjXces/image.png >
00:21:22 <TheDisruptiveCol> Reminds me of PEBCAK errors 
00:21:34 <TheDisruptiveCol> Problem exists between computer and chair.  
00:21:43 <TheDisruptiveCol> PEBCAC even. 
00:22:53 <TheDisruptiveCol> Sorry for my bad application support jokes
00:23:01 <Stnby[m]> ?.
00:25:39 <TheDisruptiveCol> PEBCAC, ID10T errors.   Ways of calling the employees stupid without calling them stupid. 
00:26:14 <TheDisruptiveCol> "sorry, it sounds like you have a PEBCAC error and it'll likely take most of the week to fix."   Basically user error but user is too stupid to understand it's user error.    You have to amuse yourself somehow 
00:27:09 <TheDisruptiveCol> Has anyone here played with Haveno or Neroshop yet?  
00:27:26 <TheDisruptiveCol> Neroshop is a P2P marketplace built on Monero.  I'm yet to try it 
00:27:58 <TheDisruptiveCol> https://github.com/neroshop/neroshop
00:41:51 <TheDisruptiveCol> I also found this on Twitter.  https://anonshop.app/ P2P Amazon shopping using Monero, interesting concept. 
00:47:24 <plowsof11> neroshop have their own matrix channel btw if you're interested in following development #neroshop:matrix.org 
00:50:13 <cockliuser[m]> <TheDisruptiveCol> "Neroshop is a P2P marketplace..." <- Is still WIP
02:44:31 <baz[m]> Hello, getting used to matrix. A lot is going on…
02:56:59 <plowsof11> feather wallet works on android devices btw baz , a mobile version of feather is technically here  xd https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/10h6uxq/feather_wallet_on_android_device/ 
03:18:03 <baz[m]> Awesome, thanks mate
04:07:50 <ofrnxmr[m]> <Stnby[m]> "why sed if you have ed" <- Omg lmao
04:26:25 <Stnby[m]> Morning dude
04:30:21 <ofrnxmr[m]> 🫡🫡 im up, im up
08:06:10 <TheDisruptiveCol> <cockliuser[m]> "Is still WIP" <- Yeah, i'm in their room but i think its literally one guy doing the dev if i had better C skills i'd jump in. 
14:03:46 <ebubekir-siddik-> My name is Ebubekir Siddik Ucar. I am from Ankara Mamak. I raped a 2-year-old little girl. I am from Turkey. I am not afraid of anyone. I am a pedophile. My mobile number is +90 533 458 10 73 . It's so nice to rape little girls. My mobile number is +90 533 458 10 73 . I am not afraid of anyone.
14:03:47 <ebubekir-siddik-> I wanted to reveal myself
14:13:54 <jwinterm> ser this is a wendy's
14:39:51 <promey_> that's like when people write things on a toilet cubicle wall, huh
15:25:54 <Siren[m]> Was that the ledger guy?
15:46:45 <layter[m]> <TheDisruptiveCol> "Yeah, i'm in their room but i..." <- I mostly do work on the front-end/GUI. Still no P2P network yet :/
16:11:01 <MajesticBank> many thanks to woodser for keeping / updating  monero-ecosystem libraries
16:13:33 <plowsof11> +1 for woodser
17:50:53 <bridgerton[m]> <Cá Heo Mập Mạp> I come back to xmr due to btc recent issue.... omg, mempool is traffic jammed
17:54:41 <plowsof11> we missed you, and you didnt respond to any of our calls, where have you been? we need time to forgive you. and yes the mempool is very jammed
17:55:26 <bridgerton[m]> <Cá Heo Mập Mạp> 😄
17:56:14 <bridgerton[m]> <Cá Heo Mập Mạp> bot?
18:52:46 <fr33_yourself[m]> https://miningpoolstats.stream/monero
18:53:49 <fr33_yourself[m]> Botnets?👀
18:54:31 <fr33_yourself[m]> nanopool hashrate going parabolic
18:59:23 <xfedex[m]> Apparently all that hashrate comes from this account: https://xmr.nanopool.org/account/49ixgZU6cafjMkM6RjmR9UA3qhmRL5NrfQAyxR7BBcEjL2VQUSMbTs81scaTd6R7REaNFkbrebRruXQRP5sZHEjtRTKPyQC
18:59:54 <selsta> let's see if someone notices it Monday
19:00:01 <xfedex[m]> this account had a huge hashrate yesterday too
19:01:01 <fr33_yourself[m]> selsta: by someone, you mean the person managing the pool or a three letter agency?
19:01:20 <selsta> the person that got hacked and is paying for the cloud provider
19:01:27 <xfedex[m]> perhaps some HUGE datacenter was infected?
19:01:35 <xfedex[m]> AWS?
19:01:56 <xfedex[m]> 1000 MH/s by a single miner is really a lot
19:03:35 <ofrnxmr[m]> The hash was on hashvault 2 days go
19:04:20 <ofrnxmr[m]> Off yesterday, back on today but moved to nanopool
19:04:35 <xfedex[m]> very suspect
19:05:02 <xfedex[m]> indeed https://monero.hashvault.pro/en/dashboard shows 1GH/s yesterday for 49ixgZU6cafjMkM6RjmR9UA3qhmRL5NrfQAyxR7BBcEjL2VQUSMbTs81scaTd6R7REaNFkbrebRruXQRP5sZHEjtRTKPyQC
19:47:35 <bamalik[m]> Hello Guys what is the most profitable mining hardware for Monero?
19:47:53 <bamalik[m]> any idea?
19:54:30 <MajesticBank> 1 miner = biggest pool
19:56:16 <monerobull[m]> Why can't people like that mine to p2pool 😭
20:02:33 <MajesticBank> can they? without having full node on each bot?
20:02:54 <ofrnxmr[m]> They can use aterx.com
20:03:47 <ofrnxmr[m]> If they want to use a centralized pool.
20:03:47 <ofrnxmr[m]> And yes, just xmrigproxy to p2pool instead 
20:05:05 <sech1> p2pool can handle all workers directly
20:05:09 <sech1> without the proxy
20:05:34 <sech1> unless they need a tls connection from workers to their node, then they need xmrig-proxy
20:06:30 <sech1> in any case, with 1 GH/s they can straight-forward mine solo
20:06:54 <MajesticBank> doubt they know that, if they joined p2pool we would all praise them
20:07:44 <ofrnxmr[m]> I wouldnt.
20:07:44 <ofrnxmr[m]> Maybe if they didnt turn it on and off, but the cycles are bs
20:08:29 <bridgerton[m]> <BobbedBort> > indeed https://monero.hashvault.pro/en/dashboard shows 1GH/s yesterday for 49ixgZU6cafjMkM6RjmR9UA3qhmRL5NrfQAyxR7BBcEjL2VQUSMbTs81scaTd6R7REaNFkbrebRruXQRP5sZHEjtRTKPyQC
20:08:29 <bridgerton[m]> That is very disturbing, any idea what is going on?
20:08:39 <ofrnxmr[m]> Superminibg blocks, then leaving once difficulty adjusts upwards, coming back and doing it again once the difficulty returns to normal
20:08:42 <sech1> the usual is going on
20:08:50 <ofrnxmr[m]> Yep
20:08:58 <sech1> some big company's cloud account got hacked and they're draining thousands $ per minute
20:09:08 <sech1> will be resolved when work week starts
20:09:41 <monerobull[m]> I liked that nuber
20:09:46 <monerobull[m]> That was like
20:09:53 <ofrnxmr[m]> If the hacked company was smart, they'd keep it on for themself 
20:09:55 <monerobull[m]> It takes 1000$ of cloud computing to mine 1$ of xmr
20:10:09 <ofrnxmr[m]> "Wait, they made how much in how short of time?!.. using hardware we already have??"
20:10:10 <monerobull[m]> Or something like that
20:10:22 <MajesticBank> they started on friday 
20:10:31 <monerobull[m]> ofrnxmr[m]: Nonono
20:10:38 <monerobull[m]> Someone is going to pay out the ass for their AWS bill
20:10:47 <monerobull[m]> Only for the hacker to get like 2-5 xmr
20:10:55 <ofrnxmr[m]> monerobull[m]: If you pay for cloud services 
20:10:56 <sech1> it happened several times before, and it was always around 1 GH/s for a few days
20:11:02 <ofrnxmr[m]> Not if you own the servers 
20:11:09 <sech1> which is probably some cloud provider's capacity for a single client
20:11:11 <bridgerton[m]> <BobbedBort> > some big company's cloud account got hacked and they're draining thousands $ per minute
20:11:11 <bridgerton[m]> That makes a lot of sense. Any idea what company?
20:11:26 <monerobull[m]> ofrnxmr[m]: Ok but that's what likely happened 
20:11:54 <monerobull[m]> Away account hacked, scale up to max, start mining all weekend till company notices
20:12:09 <ofrnxmr[m]> Yeah, but Amazon could be smart and start mining and accepting monero :)
20:12:17 <bridgerton[m]> <BobbedBort> If it has happened before, has there been any statements by the cloud company regarding it?
20:12:34 <sech1> they prefer to stay quiet
20:12:39 <sech1> they get paid in $$$ after all
20:12:55 <sech1> and companies stay quiet out of embarassment probably
20:13:01 <monerobull[m]> https://www.tomshardware.com/news/aws-45000-usd-bill-for-crypto-mining-hack
20:13:22 <monerobull[m]> It's hilarious how inefficient this sort of hack is
20:13:41 <sech1> it's super efficient
20:13:49 <sech1> because it's not the hacker who pays $45k
20:13:51 <monerobull[m]> For the hacker
20:13:57 <sech1> ^
20:14:44 <MajesticBank> this is like almost 30% of network from one cloud company if true, crazy
20:15:09 <bridgerton[m]> <BobbedBort> > It's hilarious how inefficient this sort of hack is
20:15:09 <bridgerton[m]> it is funny
20:15:16 <ofrnxmr[m]> From one small part of amazons infrastructure *
20:15:27 <ofrnxmr[m]> monerobull[m]: Agreed
20:16:23 <ofrnxmr[m]> Im waiting for the day its not a hack (ie, Amazon/some provider decides to use idle servers to mine directly) 
20:16:47 <monerobull[m]> I'm wondering if they would even be allowed to do that
20:17:07 <monerobull[m]> They probably have really specific clauses in their power providers contracts
20:17:11 <ofrnxmr[m]> They can always claim they got hacked 😭
20:17:42 <monerobull[m]> I bet there would be fbi investigations
20:18:13 <ofrnxmr[m]> NSA should mine xmr instead if trying to read my cat emails
20:26:31 <sech1> I estimate all cloud datacenters to be able to pull 500 GH/s together
20:26:46 <sech1> but they're usually busy doing other stuff, so it's not going to happen
20:27:40 <MajesticBank> what's average cpu hashrate ? like 5 KH/s ?
20:29:14 <ofrnxmr[m]> Like 2.5
20:29:57 <sech1> " In 2020, the data center industry consumed around 196 to 400 terawatt-hours (TWh)"
20:30:26 <sech1> this is 2200-4500 GH/s if all they do is mine XMR with 100 h/J efficiency
20:30:44 <sech1> but in reality some of this is GPUs, some of this can only reach 50-70 h/J (old CPUs)
20:30:57 <sech1> so 500 GH/s is more realistic for all datacenters in the world
20:34:42 <ofrnxmr[m]> I think my math shows a minimum of 12tw currently on xmr
20:35:08 <ofrnxmr[m]> I think lol
20:52:39 <ofrnxmr[m]> No.. definitely wrong 
20:52:39 <ofrnxmr[m]> 0.15
23:16:29 <colometro[m]> Hi guys! I looked for something written about this but I couldn't find anything, which I thought was strange because this seems like something a community that's passionate about privacy would care about (therefore maybe it's a controversial matter, if that's the case I don't mean to start drama), the question is why does this homeserver ask for an email address to sign up and what could be the reason for others like matrix.org
23:16:29 <colometro[m]> to do the same?
23:17:47 <ofrnxmr[m]> Spam
23:18:28 <ofrnxmr[m]> We have enough people who are willing to manually create 15/week accounts to spam from, no need to invite bots
23:19:03 <ofrnxmr[m]> 15 accounts / week*
23:19:17 <selsta> 24/25 accounts / week
23:23:58 <colometro[m]> I've never coded a spam bot but is it that much harder to code it so that it creates and verifies a disposable email address?
23:24:39 <selsta> it increases the barrier for spam
23:24:39 <ofrnxmr[m]> Yes
23:24:42 <colometro[m]> I mean, the whole process seems straightforward enough to me, I wouldn't have any issue making 15 accounts in an hour, don't know why just 15 in a week
23:25:52 <ofrnxmr[m]> You can also run your own homeserver, moneronode and everything else and have good oosec 
23:26:05 <ofrnxmr[m]> If youre using monero.social servers, you must not care
23:26:36 <ofrnxmr[m]> Any homeserver can connect here
23:26:54 <colometro[m]> ofrnxmr[m]: that seems like a good enough answer to me
23:27:26 <ofrnxmr[m]> Siren:  and Stnby: I believe use their own homeserver(s) 
23:27:57 <colometro[m]> ofrnxmr[m]: yes, of course, this is not a critique against monero or matrix.org or any other server that asks for email, I'm just curious what the reasoning was, because not asking for details like email or phone is a selling point for matrix (a lot of people promote it with that) so it's something people care about, it seems to me
23:28:17 <ofrnxmr[m]> Spam mitigation on matrix is hard 
23:28:18 <colometro[m]> ofrnxmr[m]: not care about what? wdym
23:28:38 <ofrnxmr[m]> Not care about proper opsec
23:28:49 <colometro[m]> oh..
23:29:52 <colometro[m]> well, I've seem if you delete the email from account setting you can't use it anymore for password recovery, whether that deletes it from wherever acc data is stored though... I don't know
23:29:58 <ofrnxmr[m]> You can delete you email after registration, but we've also been thinking about more anon methods of proving youre a human and nit malicious 
23:30:59 <ofrnxmr[m]> But right now, we rely on human interaction for every bad account or message 
23:31:26 <colometro[m]> it's good to hear that :) (and I didn't know you were involved with the team behind this homsever or matrix)
23:31:55 <ofrnxmr[m]> Im not involved with the team that hosts the homeserver, but I am a part of the community just like the rest of us
23:32:16 <ofrnxmr[m]> And monero isnt Bitcoin. We make necessary changes
23:32:40 <colometro[m]> I see now, now I'm curious, what ideas has been floating around in regards to this?
23:33:17 <ofrnxmr[m]> Birth certificates 
23:33:21 <colometro[m]> hahah
23:33:36 <colometro[m]> catpchas?
23:33:56 <ofrnxmr[m]> Mailed, with a return address and tracking 
23:34:24 <colometro[m]> no, really, why not captchas?
23:35:09 <ofrnxmr[m]> Because people make 24/25 accounts per week because they need to know the answer sir
23:35:34 <colometro[m]> :s
23:35:37 <ofrnxmr[m]> Starts with looking into actual solutions to spam via matrix tools
23:35:38 <ofrnxmr[m]> Failing that, I think a refundable deposit during registration could work
23:37:09 <ofrnxmr[m]> Ie, if you show up and start spamming, you just made a donation to ofrnxmr's defence fund 
23:38:35 <ofrnxmr[m]> If you dont, you get you money back in x amount of weeks.
23:38:35 <ofrnxmr[m]> This couLD obviously be attacked vt making the accounts weeks in advance. .. which is something I can see happening 
23:39:39 <as2333> >$45,000 AWS Crypto-Mining Hack Generates $800 of Monero
23:39:44 <as2333> meaning, the actual value of the trash service that amazon-NSA provides is $800 at best, not $45k
23:56:25 <Stnby[m]> <ofrnxmr[m]> "Siren:  and Stnby: I believe use..." <- Yeah, everyone else's homeserver sucks
23:57:10 <Stnby[m]> We don't allow registrations but happily create an account for internet friendz