00:37:58 <nioCat> plowman fully funded !!! https://ccs.getmonero.org/proposals/plowsof-ccs-coordinator-4.html 00:38:21 <nioCat> sloth is faster than bot 00:40:16 <n1oc> CCS Coordinator is now fully funded! https://ccs.getmonero.org/proposals/plowsof-ccs-coordinator-4.html @luigi1111 00:42:12 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> Nice 00:43:44 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Back to work plowsof 01:08:36 <luigi1111w> issues are enabled now syntheticbird 01:11:18 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Can someone remove the troll accounts in ccs. Its a shit show. If you have an issue with ofrn css or any grow some ballz and not hide like weaklings 01:12:46 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Can someone upvote ofrn ccs post for me? 01:14:30 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> are older CCS proposals expected to ever be cleaned up? 01:14:58 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> the ones listed as work in progress, i mean. 01:16:34 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Can someone upvote ofrn ccs post for me? 01:16:34 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Or move the CCS git on a non hostile provider 01:18:37 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Plowsof job 01:19:20 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> There is a focalboard with the status of the wip projects 01:22:15 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> SyntheticBird: thank you for 01:23:18 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> SyntheticBird: thank you for carrying the conversation of setting some community politeness guidelines in a way that I was unsuccessful in getting set up. Thank you luigi for being open to setting some standards. It really means a lot to me 01:25:02 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> It was pre setup. I wasnt born the last rain shower 01:46:23 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> @ofrnxmr You make no sense. If whoever disagrees with you deserves a ban, Monero will turn authoritarian. My name states what I want as the result of this CCS drama. I have already exposed your true intentions, and instead of addressing them you choose to slander me. I have noticed that you label anyone who disagrees with you a slur word, undercover agent, or some other nonsense. <clipped mes 01:46:23 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Grow a pair and thank you for proving why I need an alt account. I feel sorry for sgp, xmrscott and luigi who have to deal with your harassment 01:51:44 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> How well would anti surveillance/anti face recognitoon clothing from aliexpress work because they seem pretty affordable like $15-20 AUD 02:08:19 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> just wear a ski mask and sunglasses 02:08:58 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> It depend of the type 02:09:01 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> can you show some 02:10:54 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Some ai use a set of specific pattern many many time in different orientation and size all over the image to recognize the specific face. I know it's how opencv work and there a lot of cloths and face tattoes that totally defeat it 02:10:57 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> So mods can you do YOUR FUCKEN JOB. 02:11:18 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Bunch of soft cocks 02:11:36 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> But what work on a specific "ai" might not work on another one 02:11:57 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I don't think sunglasses are enough 02:12:38 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Honestly wearing this type of clothing will only increase attention from law enforcement. Hiding in plain sight is better 02:12:49 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005484880770.html?utparam-url=scene%3ApcDetailTopMoreOtherSeller%7Cquery_from%3A#nav-review https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006739952637.html?utparam-url=scene%3ApcDetailTopMoreOtherSeller%7Cquery_from%3A#nav-review https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006171227085.html?utparam-url=scene%3ApcDetailTopMoreOtherSeller%7Cquery_from%3A#nav-review<clipped message> 02:12:50 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003311913750.html?utparam-url=scene%3Asearch%7Cquery_from%3A#nav-specificationhttps://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003906463029.html?utparam-url=scene%3ApcDetailTopMoreOtherSeller%7Cquery_from%3A https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005212501138.html?utparam-url=scene%3ApcDetailTopMoreOtherSeller%7Cquery_from%3A#nav-review 02:13:03 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Whoops didn't realise the output would look like that... 02:13:04 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Jesus Christ... 02:13:09 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Sorry about that 02:13:30 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> An anti opencv shirt will make the ai think you have ton and ton of faces instead of a shirt 02:14:03 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> What stops governments from flagging people who have an anti opencv shirt and then targeting them? 02:15:38 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> surgical mask is also nice, and generally more socially acceptable than ski mask 02:15:51 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> but maybe let's move to #monero-offtopic:monero.social 02:16:12 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Anyone know the best way to buy xmr in Australia?? 02:16:30 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Localmonero 02:16:41 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> That is a pain in the arse though :/ 02:17:18 <nioCat> Surgical masks don't work 02:17:50 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Do you have access to an exchange? 02:17:51 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Do I have to buy like paypal or some other currency and then pay them with that rather then just a debit card transaction... No one seems to accept credit card transactions it seems they only accept like revolut, paypal, payid and weird forms of payment rather then a direct just credit card transaction... 02:17:55 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> CEX 02:18:21 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> You can buy a coin with cheap fees and then swap from that coin to XMR 02:18:37 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> CEX -> coin with cheap fees -> off chain -> XMR 02:19:03 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Swap at changenow? 02:19:34 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Wait a second. What amounts are you buying? 02:19:38 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> For these purposes is using electrom fine? 02:19:51 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> At any time like only 100 AUD worth of XMR 02:19:55 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> I don't need a tonne bro 02:20:27 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> Haveno is expected to launch soon, fwiw. 02:20:35 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Hmm?? 02:20:39 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Whats that?? 02:20:45 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> For these purposes is using electrum fine? 02:20:47 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> https://haveno.exchange/ 02:20:49 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Localmonero but DEX 02:20:57 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> DEX? 02:21:07 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> I'm not great with acryonyms lol 02:21:09 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Decentralized Exchange 02:21:10 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Soz 02:21:11 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Nothing :) 02:21:12 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Also they are likely to use thing better then opencv, they have money to hire brains to make more reliable ai 02:21:13 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Ah 02:27:18 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Nothing :) 02:27:19 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Also they are likely to use thing better then opencv, they have money to hire brains to make more reliable ai. 02:27:20 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> But most cheap anti ai merch probably only effective again opencv. 02:28:17 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> In your case you can do this: 02:28:18 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Buy LTC on CEX -> Transfer to MajesticBank (0.5% fee) -> Swap for XMR 02:29:05 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Hmm 02:29:08 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Cheers bro 02:29:28 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Only problem then will be my banks if they are hostile to these different crypto exchanges... 🤔 02:30:32 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> I know commonwealth bank flip flops like no tomorrow they are 1 second very pro cryptocurrency and the next second basically ban you from buying any or selling any from any exchange they know about... 02:32:33 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Localmonero supports directly transferring funds from your bank to a user for P2P swaps 02:33:03 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> You said you want credit card however and CEX would be best for this 02:33:52 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> I guess I could always try at a later date to set up an account with these folks and see what happens... 02:34:16 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> For the amounts you're talking about I don't think any bank will care 02:35:14 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Seems CEX only accept USD 02:35:23 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Hmm yeah I hope not 02:35:54 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> I just want to purchase like burner numbers for signing up for normie social medias anonymously and VPN subscriptions and stuff is what I want my monero for 02:36:53 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> You can just say you're investing in meme coins or something else that normies do with "crypto" 02:40:47 <m-relay> <pawism:techsaviours.org> Ah ok good point lol 03:05:11 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Thank you Luigi 03:05:19 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Youre so helpful! 03:05:33 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Imagine being so humble as to thank yourself 06:13:16 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Looks like the spam is back 06:14:05 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> 4.5k pending transactions in the mempool 06:15:18 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> And most are 1/2 in/out 06:17:34 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Yeah, since 1 UTC 06:17:55 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Graph is in #monero 06:21:13 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> If all goes well then GBPs with FCMP should resolved this issue within a year hopefully 06:21:20 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> If all goes well then GBPs with FCMP should resolve this issue within a year hopefully 08:18:27 <m-relay> <aremor:matrix.org> Who merged it? 08:20:55 <m-relay> <aremor:matrix.org> If the majority of people are wearing them 08:30:49 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> https://github.com/monero-project/monero-community-guideline 08:30:51 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> fuck off 08:32:03 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> What's wrong? 08:33:39 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> we dont need this crap 08:34:20 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I think we do. ofrnxmr has proven that we need some sort of rules in place for what the expected behavior should be in this community 08:34:44 <midipoet> monerobull: how do you stop channels descending into insults, slurs, and inflammatory language? 08:35:11 <midipoet> or do you not care when that happens? 08:35:13 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> exactly, this entire "drama" only exists because a few people are uncomfortable with ofrn pointing out issues in a harsh way 08:35:46 <midipoet> monerobull: do you honestly believe that is all he does? 08:39:05 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> guy isnt even following his own rules 08:39:06 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> fuck that 08:39:38 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Completely incorrect. This "drama" is happening because: 08:39:39 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> 1) ofrnxmr is a liar. He has overstated his position in contributing to Haveno and other Monero projects. 08:39:40 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> 2) Immature and offensive. I don't mind the occasional swears here and there but ofrnxmr constantly goes off on rants equivalent to spam in the Matrix channels. None of this is productive and if another user does this, they would be banned immediately. 08:39:41 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> 3) ofrnxmr's CCS proposal is ridiculous with no proof of future work. 08:39:42 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> No one minds ofrnxmr getting donations or contributing the project. What we do mind however is his constant harassment of people and a CCS proposal that shouldn't be merged unless it's improved upon. These community guidelines ensure that this "drama" does not happen again. Rules are not necessary bad. Free markets operate under rules and so can Monero social channels 08:41:28 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> i think insults are unnecessary but so is this shitty CoC 08:41:43 <midipoet> so how do you stop someone insulting people? 08:43:44 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> ofrn should tone it down a bit, sure 08:44:08 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> but some of the shit thats going on here 100% deserves his toxicity 08:44:30 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Can you please explain what "shit" exactly? 08:45:59 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> for example how movie ccs & msvb get a pass but then the same people go and try to block kayabas ccs+ 08:46:01 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> for example how movie ccs & msvb get a pass but then the same people go and try to block kayabas ccs 08:47:28 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I do agree some of that is ridiculous too but it does not warrant the ofrn's behavior 08:47:36 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I do agree some of that is ridiculous too but it does not warrant ofrn's behavior 08:50:23 <midipoet> It's completely ok to disagree with people, including how they act, vote, or even who they support/don't support in discussions and debates, whether technical, ideological, or with regards to funding and governance. What isn't ok, is persistent inflammatory and derogatory language, specifically designed to insult people. 08:51:33 <m-relay> <dayssincelastdrama:matrix.org> https://dayssincelastdramainmonerocommunitygrouponmatrixorirc.xyz/ 08:51:46 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Even if you disagree with this CoC project. Could you at least report in the issue section what happened with CCS. This repo will not only cover moderation but CCS rules as well 08:52:10 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> lol 08:52:11 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> LMFAO 08:52:23 <midipoet> monerobull: you have said ofrnxmr should tone done a bit. How do we ensure that happens? He has been asked numerous times, but we keep going around in circles. The only way to avoid subjective banning (a criticism of previous moderation) is to have a clear guide as to what is, and what is not, acceptable. 08:53:08 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> having a big community also have downsides unfortunetly 08:53:23 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I think we've been going in circles because ofrnxmr simply disagree with mods point of view and generally people's opinions on insults and harsh language. 08:54:01 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Why was this repo instantly merged into the main monero project on GitHub? 08:54:17 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> There are mistakes in the CoC. I actually had to reread it and I don't agree with it now 08:54:53 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> "No insulsts" 08:54:58 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I simply opened the repo and luigi said he prefered it to be under monero-project since its going to proposed to the project in the long-term 08:55:14 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> yeah I know sorry for the typo I'll correct them later. I opened the repo at like 3 am 08:55:31 <midipoet> Because everyone is tired of the circles. We need something to resolve the issue. This is the only solution proposed so far. 08:55:49 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> The idea is good, but I hope it won't turn into a dictatorship. 08:56:14 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> tbc while I wish this to succeed. I can't do that alone and I need other people POV and help at writing parts of this guideline. Discussion is already a lot 08:56:21 <midipoet> as long as the moderators follow the community dirven guidelines, it should be ok. 08:56:34 <midipoet> OR we just have a free for all, and everything is allowed. 08:57:14 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> We must have community driven guidelines. Our community is not even "big" on the Matrix compared to something like Bitcoin 08:57:36 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> One day it will grow exponentially and we need rules in place for when that time comes 08:58:26 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Like I said before. It's not the fact that we're big, but the fact that because Monero is a private cryptocurrency, we enter the realm of privacy community, and we're more opinionated than the average human in a society. 08:58:42 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> This is imo what drives to conflict so quickly 08:58:49 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> we just have to take that into consideration 08:59:49 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> What has driven conflict so quickly is not opinions but ridiculous behavior by a certain individual 09:00:18 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> anarchy baby 09:00:54 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> This will not work in the long term. When we have 10K members for example active in this channel, anarchy will lead to chaos. We must have rules in place 09:01:15 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> ofc it will not work, just joking 09:01:37 <jwinterm> honestly I think it just doesn't work when the "community" is beyond a certain size 09:02:12 <jwinterm> there is no bitcoin loose-knit collective for funding nearly all of bitcoin R&D and code updates and infra 09:02:18 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> how about you do the same that happened with @crypto's @monero on telegram? Some people didn't like being moderated and they moved to @MoneroUncensored, where the only rule is don't spam 09:02:30 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> beyond a certain size its no more a community but a society 09:02:52 <jwinterm> and having "rules" imposed on a society doesn't seem like the right way to grow a decentralized network imo 09:03:37 <jwinterm> I don't know what the alternative is here 09:03:50 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> I'd be happy to be in both groups, the formal one with rules, and the informal one that doesn't really care about what kind of language somebody uses. 09:04:01 <jwinterm> and it is great that work like cypherstack paper gets instafunded 09:04:05 <jwinterm> so maybe it's fine 09:04:08 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Issue are that *hardened* people will have ease in these channels were harsh languages and insults are maybe use as a joke. But other people just wishing to gather informations or discuss kindly will find themselves uncomfortable, while the opposite is completely possible. 09:04:11 <jwinterm> 🤷♀️ 09:05:23 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> I'm 100% for freedom of speech, but also I don't really like having to read about how somebody is using a harsh language, and how badly written CoC solves word hunger and makes dreams come true 09:05:31 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Any channels under the Monero space ought to have rules in my opinion. There should be guidelines for how people should act and behave in a respectful manner (no trolling, excessive swearing, shilling, etc.). Anyone is welcome to create an unofficial Monero channel without rules but any related to Monero need guidelines to avoid all this nonsense 09:05:53 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I don't these are relatable. The monero project is already a centralization of the development force of Monero, a decentralized cryptocurrency. What I want with these "rules" are making it more welcoming for everyone 09:07:09 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> Then how about - don't join the unmoderated channel if you are so sensitive? 09:07:28 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> tbh, I wouldn't have cared about all of this, but the fact is that these so called drama are tiring the dev community. and that's unacceptable from my pov. If the dev is tired of its community and if the community don't trust the project anymore. Monero is dead. 09:07:57 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> then let's make one not in monero space 09:08:02 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> ofrnxmr spamming xmrscott's DMs with threats and swears has nothing to do with sensitivity 09:08:03 <jwinterm> I don't think it makes sense to have the same rules for contributing to monero daemon/wallet as there is for creating a ccs as there is for speaking in a chat 09:08:09 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> haha. fair argument but for me the official #monero channel actually turns into that sometimes. And I can't ignore that. 09:08:18 <plowsof> Are cuprate devs suffering because of the drama? 09:08:33 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> This could be a proposal 09:08:41 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Harassment shouldn't be tolerated. Period. 09:08:43 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> no no absolutely not 09:08:45 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> idk, when my ex did that to me I blocked her. 09:08:54 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Cuprate's devs are doing fine 09:08:55 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> We need a safe environment for developers to contribute in. This requires strict rules and guidelines 09:09:13 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> #monerouncensored:matrix.org how about no... 09:09:25 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Yeah these rules would be different. 09:09:28 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> it is just about having a place to chat 09:09:30 <plowsof> Your name/alts identity is based on a negative sentiment toward someone else 'keepofrnxmrbanned' lol 09:09:33 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> let's keep this one formal 09:09:50 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> and move to another one if we want to be informal 09:10:13 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> also talking anything in DMs to anybody shouldn't have impact on somebodys presence in a group chat 09:10:14 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> @plowsof I have actually changed my username on Matrix. I was just expressing my opinion as ofrn was still banned and spamming in the chat 09:10:34 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> First it was in this chat but after ofrn got banned he continued to harass xmrscott privately 09:10:44 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> @plowsof I have actually changed my username on Matrix. I was just expressing my opinion as ofrn was still unbanned and spamming in the chat 09:10:51 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> ofrnxmr if you see this chat you're welcome to open an issue in the repo as well 09:11:05 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> matrix banned users aren't banned from the guideline repo 09:11:25 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> I'm getting harassed privately by scammers multiple times a day, learn to block somebody and move on 09:11:43 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> hate speech shouldn't be tolerated111!1111!! 09:11:50 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I don't see how this is related. ofrnxmr isn't a simple scammer 09:12:36 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Please stop this nonsense. Me expressing my opinion on current drama is not hate speech. ofrn's rants are however 09:13:21 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> thankyouluigi is kinda funny but keepofrnxmrbanned can be interpreted as trolling imo. 09:13:25 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> if somebody sends you a private message, and you feel harassed, then simply... block that person. 09:13:27 <plowsof> Both sides are enjoying the lack of moderation on the ccs comments. The detractors can point to/quote instances of insults/foul language/slurs etc whilst the supporters point to it as toxicity being deserved because of other issues 09:13:29 <jwinterm> lol I can't even tell if keepofrnbanned is actually in favor of keeping him banned or he is trying to be over the top and actually wants him unbanned 09:14:14 <plowsof> Jwinterm ye... 09:14:27 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> If you read my backlogs I haven't trolled once. I've been helping newcomers and commenting on development stuff. If usernames are going to be moderated then I don't know what to say 09:14:43 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> plowsof were you born this soft, or it was an acquired skill you got as you were growing up? 09:14:47 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> Asking for a friend. 09:15:17 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> thats what lies in "can be interpreted". If I was mod I wouldn't ban you for such. I would wait to see if you were actually trolling. 09:15:21 <midipoet> plowsof: i don't enjoy the language in the CCS 09:15:34 <midipoet> Newcomers to the CCS might be affronted 09:15:39 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> thats what lies in "can be interpreted". If I was mod I wouldn't ban you for such. I would wait to see if you are actually trolling. 09:15:43 <midipoet> And wonder if they should bother writing a proposal 09:15:53 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> anyway - I don't care enough about the whole drama to spend more time arguing, ofrn is helpful, I like him, but I have code to write so.. it's better for somebody else to continue arguing, have fun guys 09:15:57 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Or if ofrnxmr felt harassed, then I would give a warning 09:16:04 <midipoet> It's a terrible look for the predominant funding platform of Monero 09:16:32 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> have a good day 09:16:46 <jwinterm> I think for me maybe the issue is that the CCS is so closely aligned with "Monero Core" (although I don't think whatever the fuck monero core is has actually been made public), and I agree you need gatekeeping and rules for a fundraising envirmonment 09:16:54 <midipoet> Don't forget that issues with the CCS process, harassment, and incessant prodding distinctly turned researchers away from the CCS 09:17:09 <jwinterm> but it's a really bad look to have the CEO of Monero telling people they're banned from raising funds cause they hurt someone's feelings in a chat 09:17:16 <jwinterm> and that's what it looks like 09:17:20 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> freeofrn now 09:17:38 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> ofrn banned again? what happen this shit coin shitty gone to 0 because of this 09:17:45 <jwinterm> F 09:18:06 <midipoet> jwinterm: nobody told anybody they are banned from proposing a CCS 09:18:07 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> .bbl dumping all my XMR for XRP 09:18:14 <jwinterm> I didn't say that midipoet 09:18:20 <jwinterm> I said that's what it looks like 09:18:27 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Behavior like this should be banned on sight. I agree with banning trolls as you mentioned @syntheticbird:monero.social in the guidelines 09:18:56 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> fuck off you troll. you ruin xmr bullshitter. ofrn is not liar ofrn is savior for xmr. you should get banned. fuck guideline scammer 09:19:39 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> see thankyouluigi. If everything was under my rules. I would simply give a warning 09:19:41 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> Can we get a podcast with voice actors that read messages in here? 09:19:48 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> another one lol 09:19:59 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> lmao that would be epic 09:20:22 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Opened an issue related to CCS. Share your thoughts on what rules should the CCS respect: https://github.com/monero-project/monero-community-guideline/issues/2 09:20:48 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> what the fuck this bullshit huh 09:21:10 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Can anyone make a post on reddit about the repo ? My account is still banned 09:21:20 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> Some suggestions regarding Core Crowdfunding System I think 09:21:21 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I need as much opinions as possible 09:21:24 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> thankyouluigi i know who youre identity is. why you hide behind your account sock puppet scammer 09:21:58 <m-relay> <rbrunner7:monero.social> If I was admin here I sure would shoot down any such brand-new nonsense propaganda username at sight. That truly is a new low for the discussion here. 09:22:00 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> erc you fucking scammer 09:22:08 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> stop hiding behind accounts 09:22:18 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> and syntheticbird has literal transphobic jokes in their github and for mysterious reasons got their reddit banned :P 09:22:34 <plowsof> It would be best to lock the thread(?) after its ran its course / both sides are happy that enough feedback / points has been raised. A statement / round up of the sentiment be made (as it seems the supporters are requesting changes even) 09:22:45 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> ? didn't knew helicopter/attack could be taken so seriously 09:22:48 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> popaganda? im scared for xmr. we have erc with his alt here fucking lying about ofrn scammer 09:23:06 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> erc you scammer 09:23:54 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> i dont but a good chunk of good devs are trans 09:24:13 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> come on, are we really going woke? 09:24:22 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> you cant be the one to set up a no-toxicity CoC and than have transphobic jokes in your bio 09:24:30 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> xmr is gone 09:24:32 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> you cant be the one to set up a no-toxicity CoC and then have transphobic jokes in your bio 09:24:54 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> whatever makes you feel proud ig. And I was banned because I'm using Tor. Sorry if your deduction is wrong 09:24:58 <jwinterm> you can't tell him what to do monerobull :P 09:25:01 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> A psychology/psychiatric hospital would have so much fun going through the backlog of this channel and the CCS repository comments of all proposals to date. 09:25:02 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> read ofrn twitter. all woke. CoC = cock all xmr dev like cock in there ass scammer lying faggot 09:25:30 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> how is thankyouluigi allowed here but ofrn banned? thankyouluigi IS FUCKING ERC cant believe here 09:25:47 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I guess you raise a fair point I'll remove this pronouns. 09:26:02 <plowsof> We are now in the age of - join a random community - wait 10 mins to see if theres any drama - sift through the topic at hand - learn what both sides are complaining about - create aliases to join in on both sides of the argument 09:26:14 <ComplyLast> I guess the biggest question is why is jwinterm not banned tbh 09:26:21 <jwinterm> :0 09:26:42 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> charuto plowsof @plowsof:matrix.org 🎯🛠 09:26:44 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> #freeofrn 09:27:08 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Yeah I would ban also 09:27:23 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> no effort at all from monerodeadgone 09:27:28 <plowsof> Monerodeadgone.can you stop? We know 09:27:30 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> plz ban thankyouluigi 09:27:33 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> has been sending at least 3 trolling message 09:27:38 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> I did not expect this much drama in the community 09:27:38 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> HOW U BAN ME BUT NOT ERC ALT FUCK YOU 09:27:57 <jwinterm> welcome to crypto shkeezy 09:28:02 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> you must be new here 09:28:05 <plowsof> The loudest noise is now you, just stop 09:28:14 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> happened because ofrnxmr is influencial 09:28:19 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> but controversial 09:28:24 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> somewhat 09:29:15 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> @ofrnxmr k but why not ban thankyouluigi he is FUCKING ERC 09:29:18 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> we do a lil bit of drama from time to time to keep things interesting 09:29:31 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> erc? 09:29:32 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> manipulator he manipulate votes on ccs and try to get ofrn banned forever fucker 09:29:55 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> A lil bit? 09:30:05 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> that was its own drama arc 09:30:10 <ComplyLast> fuck, why are they doing this to ofrn? 09:30:17 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> ofrn criticuqe erc who was before dev of haveno. erc hate ofrn and now he make alts sock puppet to get ofrn banned 09:30:41 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> How dare we do this to our lord and savior support guru ofrnxmr!? 09:30:44 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Just you see thumbs reaction don't mean there are votes in CCS. 09:30:58 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> CCS has always been accepted by core team discretion 09:31:06 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Why are we being over dramatic about this. It's getting beyond ridiculous 09:31:40 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> Proposal should be merged, insta funded and he should join core immediately thereafter. Accompanied with a community letter as an apology! 09:31:42 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> other notable arcs are the secretary arc, the mb vs spirobel arc, the FCMP arc, etc 09:31:45 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> ofrnxmr is Jesus Christ! Praise our lord! 09:31:47 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> fuck you. why you support erc alt 09:31:48 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Ok I'll stop 09:31:52 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> monerodeadgone go rub one off bb. 09:32:01 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> thankyouluigi respond to me pussy ass fucker 09:32:09 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> erc you pussy respond to me 09:32:26 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> Will plowsof ever kick/ban anybody? 09:32:34 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I advise muting this person. I'm having a brief read on monerologs and they are delusional 09:32:37 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I'm surprised they are not banned yet 09:32:52 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> YOU NEED BAN ERC YOUR ALT SOCK PUPPET SCAMMER 09:32:53 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> secretary arc was spicy, i also want a 7k/month paycheck straight from jet-fund 09:33:10 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> talks like ofrnxmr 09:33:27 <midipoet> this channel is now worse than #monero 09:33:32 <midipoet> That's a new low 09:33:33 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> Took you this long to figure that one out? 09:33:37 <midipoet> Lol 09:33:58 <midipoet> I think i was in denial 09:34:00 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> faggot im not ofrnxmr he is better than me he is a genius. ofrnxmr is the savior 09:34:01 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> password length limits are so cringe 09:34:02 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> its not 09:34:13 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> lolllll. ofrn, you should stop it. 09:34:27 <jwinterm> monerobull, you are missing important early storyline arcs like bitcoinexpress attack, risto cryptokingdom game, and fluffy marketing/trolling (and also that weird music CCS thing for half million bucks) 09:34:46 <midipoet> Project Coral Reef 09:34:52 <jwinterm> yep 09:34:52 <midipoet> And anonimal thingy 09:34:58 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> tesla ccs 09:34:59 <jwinterm> ohya good old anonimal 09:35:00 <midipoet> Though he did buy us all lunch 09:35:03 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> fuck you bitches 09:35:04 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> you vote against ofrn. he has wages to pay. cant pay minimum wage pussy? 09:35:05 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> fluffygate big amnoucnement 09:35:05 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> excatly, I want to use my 4GB keyfile and facebook login form won't let me :< 09:35:11 <ComplyLast> fuck we need more storyline arcs tbh 09:35:17 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> i still have a folder with obscure monero stuff 09:35:18 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Are you sure? Who would act like this? I don't even see supporters on the CCS defending ofrn this much 09:35:28 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> 4gb is insane 09:35:38 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> ERC YOU SCAMMER REPLY TO ME IN DM 09:35:49 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> im pretty sure its not ofrn 09:35:54 <midipoet> I remember the time we all went for Ceaser's Palace buffet and ate crab claws till we felt sick. Those were good times. 09:36:21 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> its him doing a dumb ESL larp 09:36:25 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/EYZryNabEabuoURLAyQNBZcl 09:36:31 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> grow up baka 09:36:41 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> Damn 09:36:42 <midipoet> Now, we are writing our (third or fourth?!) CoC. 09:36:44 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> that time when fortnite accepted monero (and only monero) 09:36:49 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> IM NOT FUCKING OFRN 09:37:06 <ComplyLast> you are not? 09:37:09 <ComplyLast> that's disappointed 09:37:12 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> whatever dood 09:37:14 <ComplyLast> I was actually rooting for you 09:37:20 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> no ofrn has lot of supporter 09:37:29 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/CiNBeDXlBjfwoIXSMnnZJUXB 09:37:29 <ComplyLast> I'm one, ofc 09:37:30 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> hehe 09:37:44 <ComplyLast> *disappointing 09:37:46 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> I'm playing fortnite now I guess 09:37:58 <ComplyLast> proper cypherpunk game, respect 09:38:14 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> Holy shit, this chat can go silent for days. What did you all throw in the coffee today? 09:38:19 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> Drama sells. 09:38:47 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> sad reality 09:38:49 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> rotten why you vote against ofrn 09:38:50 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> huh why you vote against him 09:38:55 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> i support the idea of having this chat on mute except for CCS meeting 09:38:56 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> thrmo simping for ofrn, I didn't have that in my bingo card. 09:39:01 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I believe Fortnite said this was a "mistake" a couple days later. How odd 09:39:15 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> ERC YOU FUCKER 09:39:49 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> yeah but still fun 09:40:22 <jwinterm> I didn't realize globee went out of business 09:40:44 <ComplyLast> rottenwheel I'm really not, but here's where all the action is, so I might as well partake on it 09:41:40 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> oh no how are we going to onboard mariah carey superfans now 09:41:43 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> How do you do this by mistake 09:41:58 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I also support the idea 09:42:14 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Let's mute this channel until next meeting saturday 09:42:23 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> It was a while back but I remember Fortnite mentioned that a third party added the Monero payment method by accident. It's a weird story 09:43:17 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Not sure how you add a whole payment system, Monero specifically, on accident 09:43:42 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> honestly I'm leaving this room, I'll join back on saturday, don't have time for people arguing over nonsense. 09:43:43 <jwinterm> I think they were using some third party provider like nowpayments or something and they enabled it or something 09:44:23 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> ❄️ 09:44:39 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> jwinterm how many likes and something and I guess you say per day? 09:44:41 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> 😂 09:45:09 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> fuck you pussy 09:46:35 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I'm being bombarded with private messages from this troll harassing me. @plowsof:libera.chat can you issue a ban please? 09:46:49 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> bitch fucker 09:47:06 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I think plowsof is away 09:47:10 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> erc you slimy slimy scammer. you got kicked out for reason get the fuck out of here go work on firo bitch ass 09:47:23 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> let monerodeadgone go crazy in the chat. That will be easier to screenshot 09:47:26 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> How unfortunate 09:48:43 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> fuck you 09:50:31 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> can you insult more creatively 09:50:53 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> fuck you sgp BITCH 09:51:17 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> sgp? 09:51:19 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> sgp_: pussy why you using an alt fucker 09:52:56 <dEBRUYNE> This shouldn't have been merged without some discussion -> https://github.com/monero-project/monero-community-guideline 09:53:06 <dEBRUYNE> I think it should be reverted, or hosted on a separate repo 09:53:38 <m-relay> <shkeezy:matrix.org> do the members of the monero community that don't like each other often see each other at events? 09:54:06 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I would prefer like that but would you mind telling why ? 09:54:08 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I personally think it should be done in a separate repo. Once the guidelines are in order (correct spelling and a more accurate description of rules) we can merge it into the main repo 09:54:14 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I would prefer like it isbut would you mind telling why ? 09:55:03 <jwinterm> I agree with dEBRUYNE, it is pretty poorly written, and it seems like there is no "pseudo-consensus" or whatever other bs buzzwords were mentioned in the poorly written document itself before it was created 09:55:33 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I understand the idea that whatever is under monero-project organization is part of the monero project. But if the readme state is under work and will be proposed. It isn't carved into rock here. It can even fail. Luigi reasoning was that if it concerns the monero-project then it should be under monero-project orga 09:55:35 <jwinterm> I saw the repo, but I just now realized it is hosted on the "official" repositories 09:55:50 * plowsof waits for matrix to load 09:55:54 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> It's a rough sketch you wrote at 3am. Kayaba made a gist for FCMP for example and it wasn't merged into the Monero repo. Neither should this until it's fully fleshed out 09:57:10 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Tbc, there is nothing yet. And I asked yesterday if people were against, no one told me they weren't. Some said they were interested. I took the opportunity to open it. 09:57:14 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> how isnt this community more angry about ofrn 09:57:25 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> these shitty mods banned ofrn for no reason. all liars 09:57:30 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I plan on improving the Readme 09:57:37 <m-relay> <monerodeadgone:hackliberty.org> FUCKING ALLOW SGP/ERC ALT ON BUT 09:57:52 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> I was on your side until you went full troll mode 09:58:07 <ComplyLast> tbh I like the vibes you gave to it syntheticbird, trying to appeal to the younger crowd, trying to appeal to spiritual crowd, it's good, keep up the good work. 09:59:21 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I'll try my best. 09:59:22 <dEBRUYNE> SyntheticBird: Most people aren't online permanently and therefore not everyone can comment within, say, 12h 09:59:27 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> Hallelujah! 09:59:34 <dEBRUYNE> This should have been discussed for at least a couple of days, even a week 09:59:47 <jwinterm> or..maybe...like at a meeting or something? 09:59:56 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> fair point. I'll wait the meeting 10:00:08 <dEBRUYNE> People evidently value the repository, but it arguably shouldn't be hosted on the official repository 10:00:28 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> I understand that you will improve it and I respect your contributions but I didn't even realize that this was merged until now. No mention of this was publicized anywhere else either 10:00:30 <dEBRUYNE> Community is also subjective, in the sense that parts of the community have differnet ideals 10:00:36 <dEBRUYNE> So difficult to impose a general rule on them 10:01:17 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> That's why I encourage everyone to say their ideas. Ofc it is difficult but I think it is possible 10:01:33 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Not really. I think we can all agree to banning trolls and other rules that need to be imposed 10:02:02 <m-relay> <keepofrnbanned:bitcoinist.org> Also, rules for moderation like how long someone should be banned for and how many strikes should be given are also helpful to have 10:02:20 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I opened a second issue for moderation 10:02:26 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> if you want to write out ideas 10:02:50 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> for me, except for trolling, definitive ban shouldn't be allowed 10:04:01 <jwinterm> trolling is part of my religion tho 10:04:35 <m-relay> <plowsof:matrix.org> Keepofrnxmrbanned i appreciate your renaming matrix side but it does not carry to irc. That is inflammatory so realistically you have to make a new alt 10:05:42 <m-relay> <aremor:matrix.org> It’s sad that supposedly smart people keep feeding into it 10:06:41 <ComplyLast> I'm not sure I would call them necessarily smart though 10:07:16 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I don't see how why we would be smarter than average? 10:10:22 <plowsof> Keepofrnxmrbanned i appreciate your renaming matrix side but it does not carry to irc. That is inflammatory so realistically you have to make a new alt 10:11:13 <m-relay> <aremor:matrix.org> Ban them 10:12:53 <m-relay> <aremor:matrix.org> A dictatorship would be better than this drama everyday 10:23:22 <jwinterm> pretty sure we already have a dictatorship no? 10:57:48 <m-relay> <rbrunner7:monero.social> Wow, this blissfull quiet. No message for half an hour already. 11:00:28 <m-relay> <dave.jp:matrix.org> How’s the cheap fees working out 11:01:05 <ComplyLast> rbrunner7 let's get it going again? 11:01:17 <ComplyLast> I'm pretty sure you're a sockpuppet for jwinterm 11:02:18 <rbrunner> That's an interesting theory. 11:02:56 <ComplyLast> now we start crying for bans 11:03:02 <ComplyLast> we insult each other for 2 hours 11:03:07 <ComplyLast> and then we stop, right? 11:03:38 <rbrunner> I guess many participants sit in the Americas somewhere and simply went to sleep. 11:05:37 <ComplyLast> sad 11:06:40 <rbrunner> You'd prefer 24h fights? :) 11:07:27 <ComplyLast> offc 11:13:43 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> who can reset getmonero gitlab signup requests 11:19:04 <plowsof> What would that do r4v3r23? Is there an issue / too many? (I know manual approval has to happen when emails get dropped) 11:19:47 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> i signed up with an email i cant access 11:21:57 <plowsof> Oh, we can get you approved manually then no worries , What is the username? 11:22:14 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> ANONERO 11:24:23 <plowsof> Ack 11:26:03 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> can you change my email too 11:30:20 <plowsof> After anonero is added i think its possible in the settings.. lets wait for approvak 11:32:27 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> how long will that take? 11:45:25 <nioCat> good morning! 11:45:35 <nioCat> what's new guys? 11:46:17 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> moar spam apparently 11:47:32 <nioCat> I was served that to eat when I was a kid :( 11:49:42 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> who in charge of gitlab? there spam account by fucking sgp/erc alt all attack innocent ofrn: 11:49:43 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/ofrnscammer 11:49:44 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/ofrnbanned 11:49:45 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/ofrnnoo 11:49:46 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/ofrnnooo 11:49:47 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/AnonymousOfrnxmrHater 11:49:48 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/cancelofrn 11:49:49 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/banofrn 11:49:50 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> all acc list are fucking fakers. im not ofrn but this for ofrn ccs 11:50:05 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Yeah 11:50:09 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Mods dont care 11:50:13 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> all dislike and comment potential fake 11:50:33 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> look here 15 dislikes almost all fake 11:50:33 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/444 11:52:21 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> if you think fake accounts have the same influence than known members of the community or monero contributors you're deeply mistaken, the CCS does not work like a democracy. 11:52:35 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> if you think fake accounts have the same influence as known members of the community or monero contributors you're deeply mistaken, the CCS does not work like a democracy. 11:52:44 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> good because sgp fucker try to get in many vote 11:53:28 <nioCat> you sure of that? lol 11:54:05 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> no mods ban fake fucking luigi acc until i come to expose the pussy faggot 11:54:19 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> many prominent community members are against the proposal, not just sgp, i don't know why you assume it's him, it could be me, you know? 11:54:19 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> sgp control that acc that why 11:54:23 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> stop with the insults. only warning. 11:55:09 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> no not u 11:55:13 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> i know it sgp 11:55:27 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> ofrn told me 11:55:47 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> its a conspiracy franco 11:56:27 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> not it not. how that fucker allowed to have account against my name and then i not me but ofrn and defender of ofrn get ban instant 11:57:09 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> i know spg was a petty tyrannt, but isnt she gone? 11:57:31 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> look at ofrn ccs 11:57:39 <m-relay> <monerogoingto1million:hackliberty.org> sgp 11:58:53 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> So i assume you banned banofrnxmr too for trolling and spread fud 11:59:18 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Being equal and all 12:07:34 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> he was banned 12:15:39 <dEBRUYNE> charutocafe: I don't see much opposition against ofrnxmr receiving funding to work on Monero, most of the oppisition seems to be geared at the specifics of the proposal 12:16:19 <m-relay> <dave.jp:matrix.org> She ? 12:16:38 <m-relay> <joiboi.crypto:matrix.org> https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/TQHXXHlpZVmhIwlsBujuVOnv 12:27:54 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> Let's solve the issue of some guy breaking rules by creating more rules! 12:27:55 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> Note that ofrn never ever treated newcomers badly, he only lashes out against people who hold key community roles and/or get paid by us. He does so only when he believes that they did not fulfill their duty. Most of the time I agree with his acessment. 12:27:56 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> Therefore I'd argue a CoC is not about creating "a welcoming environment for everyone", rather about keeping it comfy for those being criticized. Fuck that. 12:27:57 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> You need a padded room with all sharp words removed? Fine, make your own, appoint your own mods, make it invite only, whatever. A decentralized open community *needs* a town square. Dont wanna here it? Nobody forces you to come. We used to have a room for that Monero Beef , but recently if was cucked to be "nice words only", and then people wonder why complains surface like the ofrn CCS. 12:28:33 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> Matrix ate the formatting, sry 12:29:08 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> Let's solve the issue of some guy breaking rules by creating more rules! /s 12:29:09 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> Note that ofrn never ever treated newcomers badly, he only lashes out against people who hold key community roles and/or get paid by us. He does so only when he believes that they did not fulfill their duty. Most of the time I agree with his acessment. 12:29:10 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> Therefore I'd argue a CoC is not about creating "a welcoming environment for everyone", rather about keeping it comfy for those being criticized. Fuck that. 12:29:11 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> You need a padded room with all sharp words removed? Fine, make your own, appoint your own mods, make it invite only, whatever. A decentralized open community needs a town square. Dont wanna here it? Nobody forces you to come. We used to have a room for that (# monero beef) , but recently if was cucked to be "nice words only", and then people wonder why complains surface like the ofrn CCS. 12:31:18 <m-relay> <anxietyinducing:matrix.org> so cash by mail is now the only somewhat anonymous option? and you use gloves then? haha 12:41:05 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> I agree with ofrn on many topics however I can't deny that sometimes he degrades the quality of discussions. It would be great if he stopped sending 10-20 messages of single line slurs tbh. 12:42:36 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> dEBRUYNE: for the most part, yes. kayaba and sgp seem to be against most of the proposal. others like ct or mb seem to be against the specifics. 12:46:24 <nioCat> ceetee it seems that monero-beef was set up for devs to discuss their technical beefs lol 12:46:53 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> devwarzzzz 12:47:02 <nioCat> that's the excuse to bam ofrn from there 12:48:08 <nioCat> meanwhile in the past people were invited to go there by the channels creator with their beefs so as not to spam the other channels 12:48:29 <nioCat> make monero-beef great again!!!! 12:49:35 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Basically scott invited banhammer to beef and then ruck left room 12:49:54 <nioCat> I remember when ofrn used to try to keep this channel ontopic lololololol 12:52:34 <nioCat> monero's tenth birthday is coming up on the 18th at 10:49:53 UTC 12:53:25 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > Therefore I'd argue a CoC is not about creating "a welcoming environment for everyone", rather about keeping it comfy for those being criticized. Fuck that. 12:53:26 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> This repository isn't a simple CoC. Stop simplifying it as such. If you really agree with ofrnxmr on the fact that some don't fulfill their duty. This repo is the occasion for you to raise your voice. This is an opportunity to harden or alleviate the CCS rules as well. To redefine what the community expect from workgroup. 12:53:27 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> This guideline isn't just a moderation rule document. There is so much to discuss, yet everyone is complaining but don't dare take the opportunity to share it correctly 12:54:47 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> That you agree or disagree with me. I don't care, please just share it in details. I want to work with everyone opinion, even ofrnxmr one. 12:56:24 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> oh thats cool 13:07:27 <m-relay> <rucknium:monero.social> monerobull: Can you approve my comment?: https://reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/1c24xn4/massive_spam_attack_on_the_monero_network_underway/kz85duj/ or dEBRUYNE 13:19:26 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> the issue is not something extra rules will solve 13:19:38 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> therefore I reject your entire premise 13:20:15 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> how talked about extra rules ? 13:20:34 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> again stop prejudging the entire thing 13:20:36 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> >The moderators will always, except for trolling, discuss what sanction is appropriate. 13:20:38 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> lol 13:20:47 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> These are rules for the repository 13:20:50 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> not the guideline 13:21:00 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> that has worked great so far 13:21:49 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> approved 13:22:12 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> stupid fucking matrix 13:22:18 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> only got that message now 13:22:39 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> If one was to conduct a multi modal attack on Monero spanning a few months, this is sort of how it would look: 1. Steal funds from GF, 2. Reg pressure, 3. BM/Spam attack, 4. Disruptive actors attempting reputation attacks in community, 5. Split social channels to disrupt communication. The only thing that is missing is predominant devs GitHub accounts' getting hacked/deleted/suspended. 13:22:40 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> you doing 2. and 5. 13:23:16 <m-relay> <rucknium:monero.social> monerobull: Thank you! 13:24:03 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> you're doing 3 and 5 13:24:11 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> ig we're both bad actors 13:24:33 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> sure i do black marble... 13:24:48 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > Spam attack 13:24:56 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> or maybe I shouldn't have read the slash 13:25:48 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> yes like every government blame X event and introduce Y bad rule 13:26:25 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> yes like every everyone blame ofrnxmr and introduce number of bans on their supporters. You're not more right than anyone else 13:26:29 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> no they fucking didnt @banofrnxmr:bitcoinist.org still here 13:28:00 <plowsof> Keepofrnxmrbanned was removed 13:28:20 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> plowsof can you pls read my msg i sent you on matrix 13:29:17 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> introduce these rule wont work. why? because someone will always have problem then you going to add more rule and more rule until this chat and other become like r/bitcoin. nothing here other than NGU price talk and retardation 13:29:40 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > because someone will always have problem then you going to add more rule and more rule 13:29:40 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> touch grass 13:29:41 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> there something called ignore/mute button. dont like use it 13:29:43 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > because someone will always have problem then you going to add more rule and more rule 13:29:43 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> touch grass 13:29:46 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> no need for dumbass guideline 13:29:54 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> go learn to spell 13:30:03 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> embarassing 13:30:29 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> go on kym. you're cringe 13:32:22 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 13:32:29 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> you say it better than me 13:34:47 <nioCat> I have never used an ignore/mute button 13:36:56 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> This is not correct. It's not imposing rules on everyone who uses Monero. It only imposes guidelines on how to moderate mediums that are part of "official" infrastructure. People like ofrn can make their own servers and try to build their own communities elsewhere, that's fine and unavoidable (and arguably healthy) 13:37:07 <m-relay> <kjeks:matrix.org> Srry real noob question. I don't understand why on those 'attacks' they made 1 input 2 output, but why does it matter? isn't the block suppose to merge a bunch of transactions together? Like mixing a lot of inputs from many users? 13:37:23 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> so sgp why you launch a sybil attack against ofrn huh? 13:37:35 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> your new project for moonstone research to fuck up ofrn for no reason? 13:38:31 <m-relay> <dave.jp:matrix.org> If it’s a single entity doing spam, effective ringsize drops a lot. 13:38:40 <plowsof> At least 1 dev has left this channel because of the influx of messages / drama on the same topic 13:38:56 <m-relay> <rucknium:monero.social> kjeks: Each input in a transaction has 16 ring members in its ring signature. If a tx is 1in/2out, there is one ring with 16 ring members. If the tx is 2in/2out, there are two separate rings with 16 ring members each. A total of 32 ring members. Same with 3in, 4in, etc. 13:39:17 <m-relay> <kjeks:matrix.org> dave.jp: yea but why 'spam'? they wont just be pilled in the next block all together? 13:39:33 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> Then do your job (along with luigi) and moderate the room 13:39:56 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> Get past the "theory of moderating" circular discussion and do something 13:40:02 <m-relay> <dave.jp:matrix.org> No, block size doesn’t grown like that ; also spam = reducing privacy of other users 13:40:10 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> you slimy bastard 13:40:30 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> plowsof and luigi doing a good job. they already banned but we keep coming 13:40:43 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> because we fighting against your alts fucking up ofrn 13:41:48 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> I haven't made a single alt and yet here you are saying you're ban evading with an alt. C'mon, enough with this nonsense. Ban and let the community room move on. It's not hard 13:42:08 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> so who is botting ofrn ccs? 13:42:20 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> and why you sound exactly the same as other alts who target ofrn? 13:42:46 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> lmao that must be the most subjective attack I've ever seen 13:43:26 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> "Please stop this nonsense. Me expressing my opinion on current drama is not hate speech. ofrn's rants are however" 13:43:47 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> Everyone defending ofrn seems to think that using insulting slurs on a regular basis is appropriate, which I can't get behind at all 13:43:58 <plowsof> Yes, it would be nice if we could all take a step back (if this is not malicious) and keep it mainly to gitlab, it seems that everything? Has been said now. Votes on the ccs are not equally weighted (this might upset some) but a number / emoji isnt going to get a proposal merged/closed 13:44:04 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> keep dodging questions 13:44:22 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> im not going to use a single slur for my next accusations 13:45:12 <SyntheticBird> I'll stop for the day, I'll wait for the meeting. sgp I advise you to do the same, not that you're wrong but we can let monero1million speak whenever we wants just below 13:45:24 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> 1) someone is 100% botting ofrn's ccs. look at the like/dislike ratio and the users. almost all dislikes are from accounts created today or very recently. 13:45:25 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> 2) many alts have joined after ofrn's ccs and THEY HAVEN'T been banned until today when they got exposed. almost like they have influence like you sgp. ofrn supporters got banned quicker 13:45:55 <plowsof> Its entirely possible that all of the alt accounts are myself, theres no point in making accusations or getting worked up over alts 13:46:35 <plowsof> Botting doesnt work (to get merged or to close) 13:46:46 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> when theyre are alts targeting someone saying keep them banned and ban them and cancel them hard to not get worked up 13:47:02 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> and spreading lies/rumors 13:47:20 <plowsof> Keepofrnbanned was warned/told to make a new account (that user did change his name on matrix side and seems polite/calm) 13:48:06 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> yes but where did they go? gone after sgp appeared? 13:48:15 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> deactivate their account after sgp appear 13:48:30 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> ill let ofrn expose the rest on twitter 13:49:03 <m-relay> <pointoffailure:monero.social> Why do you guys have CoC and mods when both matrix and IRC support ignoring by nickname? 13:53:38 <midipoet> plowsof: to be honest, i don't think that ofrnxmr has the correct temperament or the correct communication skills for the role they are proposing in the CCS. I also think it's absolutely bonkers to even consider merging a CCS when the proposer doesn't seem able to maintain an attitude and demeanor that doesn't get him banned from community channels. However, i don't want to let my personal judge of character hold all of 13:53:38 <midipoet> you people making a decision on what you think is best for the Monero project and its community. 13:54:08 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> midipoet have u ever thought why ofrn act like this? 13:54:24 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> when you getting attacked by bad actors in the community 24/7 hard to act kind all the time 13:54:29 <midipoet> cause he is a bit bat shit crazy? 13:54:51 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> ofrn only acts like this not to newcomer but to the guys who are targeting and censoring him 13:55:07 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> generalizing his behavior doesnt help 13:56:20 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> imagine someone on matrix, gitlab and twitter create alt accounts saying keep MIDIPOET banned, MIDIPOET is a scammer, MIDIPOET is exit scamming 13:56:27 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> how would you act? say I love oyu ot these people? 13:56:53 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> People like SGP can make their own servers and try to build their own communities elsewhere, thats fine and unavoidable (and arguably healthy) 13:56:57 <plowsof> Ack midipoet thanks 13:57:01 <m-relay> <kjeks:matrix.org> Why not just excluding the possibility of mordinals? monero is supposed to be fungible, not NFT 13:57:29 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> ofrn is just being targetted because he say what he think. 13:57:30 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> While being one of the most helpful person here (free 24/7 support) 13:57:31 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Then now we get a CoC wtf 13:57:32 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> I usually dump everything that have a CoC... Should I? 13:58:15 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> its very dangerous time now. monero is getting attacked from everywhere. delisting, chain attack with spam, attack against community member and more 13:58:25 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> CoC… Clash of Clans? 13:58:26 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> probably stay we have to defend no matter what 13:58:30 <plowsof> To be fair, the getmonero forum has had a CoC . Thats as close to a 'monero project' CoC as you can get 13:58:33 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> code of conduct 13:58:34 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Attacked from inside and out yeah 13:58:58 <m-relay> <aremor:matrix.org> this room looks like a shit show 13:59:16 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> I did not read the full buffer, I think it never been that long lol 13:59:20 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> I will say that there is definitely an ongoing social engineering attack against Monero. At least on the Reddit 13:59:38 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> haha the reddit is nothing compared to what happening to ofrn 13:59:41 <midipoet> ctrej: wasnt monero.social just that? And actually, so was this channel?! 13:59:49 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> As for Ofnr, idk. He alts so much I wouldn’t even be surprised if monero1mollion is an alt 13:59:53 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> All new accounts should not be trusted 14:00:01 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> I doubt it is just limited to the Reddit 14:00:14 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> on both sides of the argument 14:00:16 <midipoet> as far as i remember sgp, diego, needmoney and xmrscott started both 14:00:27 <midipoet> could be wrong though! 14:00:32 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> Anyways I gotta enter my Faraday cage I’ll see y’all in a few hours 14:00:37 <m-relay> <aremor:matrix.org> it's sad that people cannot realize when they're being trolled and that ignoring is the best response 14:00:38 <plowsof> Monero community is the brain child of sgp iirc 14:01:19 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> entities opposing monero benefit from our internal struggles and if I were them I'd try to pour as much oil into the fire as I can 14:01:19 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/ofrnscammer 14:01:20 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/ofrnbanned 14:01:21 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/ofrnnoo 14:01:22 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/ofrnnooo 14:01:23 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/AnonymousOfrnxmrHater 14:01:24 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/cancelofrn 14:01:25 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/banofrn 14:01:26 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> yes this trolling and not sybil attack 14:01:31 <midipoet> preland: yeah, i agree. Has been going on a while 14:01:54 <midipoet> Basically disruptive actors that have engineered a split in the community 14:02:10 <midipoet> It's quite clever really 14:02:13 <plowsof> "sybil attacks" are ignored, no need to get worked up / spam them here. Please assume corr have brain cells 14:02:20 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> can't tell if sarcastic or not 14:02:21 <plowsof> Core 14:02:35 <m-relay> <dave.jp:matrix.org> Useless ids, which can be ignored if you are smart 14:02:54 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> plowsof just showing aremor that this not trolling but someone attempting to destroy ofrn's identity 14:03:09 <m-relay> <diego:cypherstack.com> Incorrect plowsof. It was mine 14:03:12 <m-relay> <dave.jp:matrix.org> “Monero community” ?? 14:03:36 <m-relay> <diego:cypherstack.com> The story goes in the following way: 14:03:56 <plowsof> Monero community was diego rehrars brain child* 14:04:01 <m-relay> <diego:cypherstack.com> I just joined and wanted to help. Made Monero Marketing. Did some stuff with it. People didn't like marketing and got cranky. 14:04:44 <m-relay> <diego:cypherstack.com> Decided to change it to Community. Talked with sgp who was helping a bit with my marketing thing. He said he'd be interested. He joined me for Community launch. So we're co-creators of Community. 14:04:59 <m-relay> <diego:cypherstack.com> But my brain child 14:06:54 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> yes like US government brainchild of TOR and other invention. brainchild = backdoor 14:07:52 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> nah Diego is alright 14:08:02 <plowsof> Offtopic^ lol thanks for clarifying diego 14:08:11 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> yes I like diego 14:08:25 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> cypherstack lovely group but i dont like alphabet agency 14:08:29 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> alphabet name 14:08:43 <plowsof> Numbers only 14:09:10 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Don't want to stir up anything but just saying...this new community guideline on the main Monero Github is horrible. Who wrote that and who decided to green light it? It's as if no one proof-read it?? Full of obvious typos and badly written english. 14:09:11 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> This is really not a good look, and besides, does Monero REALLY need to push this on the main repo. Individual Monero communities should make their own guidelines, this seems like an attempt to centralize the discourse moderation when in reality, Monero's strength is its decentralized and fragmented community. 14:09:29 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> its not greenlit 14:09:30 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> pls pls read the backlog many conversation about this 14:09:48 <plowsof> I thought Cryptogrampt had returned 14:10:03 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> my message been censored and deleted so if you want full history 14:10:06 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Okay will do, just saw that before I went to sleep and couldn't believe 14:10:14 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> read on https://libera.monerologs.net 14:10:37 <m-relay> <aremor:matrix.org> the mods of this room need to take control of the situation. there is no reason this room should be disrupted like this every single single day. if someone breaks the rules, deal with them, and that's the last word. anyone bitching about it can be banned too. stop this non-sense bickering every day. lay the law down, or will this will never end. @plowof, @luigi, @xmrscott, @sgp_ 14:10:40 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> IRC always best place to read unaltered logs indeed, will check on mine too 14:10:42 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> SyntheticBird: you remember when I left like 6 hours ago, are they going like this non-stop? 14:11:41 <luigi1111w> the repo is deleted. SyntheticBird can continue his efforts in the original repo if wanted and if it gets to a good state we can look at it again 14:12:20 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> this not disruption if you bother to read backlog it was lots of discussion 14:12:39 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> backlog very long 14:13:50 <m-relay> <someoneelse495495:matrix.org> yes 14:14:00 <plowsof> We need a family therapist 14:14:05 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> Damn 14:14:39 <dEBRUYNE> Thanks luigi1111w! 14:14:51 <m-relay> <someoneelse495495:matrix.org> It's me and you're right to notify that. I wrote the readme at 3 am. Planned on improving it later 14:17:35 <m-relay> <someoneelse495495:matrix.org> Repo is under my username again. If you want to give ideas, proposal or just insult you can go in the discussion section 14:18:08 <luigi1111w> nioCat> monero's tenth birthday is coming up on the 18th at 10:49:53 UTC <= someone should organize something wow 14:21:28 <midipoet> how about a combined CoC Grand Super Huge Launch Party and a 10th Anniversary party all rolled into one? Cmon you know it's a good idea. We could even get some of those inflatable suit thingies and a ring, and we could bring -beef to real life, sumo style. 14:25:13 <m-relay> <rucknium:monero.social> There are a couple of people trying to open new Matrix DMs with me. When I try to join the DMs I see `MatrixError: [502] Failed to make_join via any server`. I am not ignoring you FWIW. You can DM me on Libera Chat IRC, but remember that IRC DMs are not e2e encrypted by default. 14:26:23 <plowsof> Synthetic birds CoC and chatgpt proposal, never forget :D 14:40:09 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Alright sounds good, having it under the Monero repo made it look officially released. 14:40:10 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> My opinion is that we shouldn't really need a CoC besides "no spam". That's it. 14:40:11 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Any language about "hate speech" is a slippery slope. CoC guidelines are often abused by power hungry moderators in the vast majority of online communities. This would open a pandora's box and vector to neuter the community's freedom of speech. 14:40:12 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Don't forget that moderation jobs and anything that gives a bit of power attracts leeches. 14:40:13 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Just my two cents, which is worth what you make of it. 14:41:19 <dEBRUYNE> CryptoGuard: I agree with a kind of laissez-faire approach, as long as there is no spam and it is kept civil 14:42:06 <m-relay> <someoneelse495495:matrix.org> I'll try to address that concern 14:45:43 <nioCat> does kept civil mean no hate 14:47:22 <nioCat> if someone perseverates is that considered spam 14:47:58 <nioCat> please forgive me lol 14:49:23 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> is that direct tot me niocat 14:49:47 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Alright sounds good, having it under the Monero repo made it look officially released. 14:49:48 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> My opinion is that we shouldn't really need a CoC besides "no spam". That's it. 14:49:49 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Any language about "hate speech" is a slippery slope. CoC guidelines are often abused by power hungry moderators in the vast majority of online communities. This would open a pandora's box and vector to neuter the community's freedom of speech. 14:49:50 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Don't forget that moderation jobs and anything that gives a bit of power attracts leeches. 14:49:51 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Just my two cents, which is worth what you make of it. 14:49:52 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Note: Not saying current mod team are leeches, let's make that clear lol 14:50:19 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> i think perseverance if for a good cause not consider spam but if for something bad like shilling scam crypto then bad 14:50:23 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> but up to mod to decide 14:51:11 <nioCat> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> is that direct tot me niocat <>lose context much? 14:51:24 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Exactly, "no spam" is a good filter because it lets people express themselves. But people start harrassing others, it almost always takes the form of spam anyway. 14:51:27 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> current mod team very fair. leeches you describe good example is any reddit community. introduce coc and we become echo chamber with unfair ruling 14:51:32 <nioCat> look just above 14:52:19 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Yes, I edited my comment to make sure people understand I'm not saying current mod team are leeches, just speaking in a general sense 14:52:32 <nioCat> there is always a line, just matters where you put/perceive it 14:52:54 <m-relay> <rbrunner7:monero.social> "Any language about "hate speech" is a slippery slope." Yeah, that "slippery slope" argument. Is that why I had to endure smearwords in groups of 3 and 4 in every second sentence in this room a few hours ago? Because heaven forbid we draw some lines in the sand. 14:54:20 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> man this get tiring. backlog have this argument already it all done 14:54:41 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> but backlog very long to be fair so can be hard to read all of it 14:54:59 <m-relay> <rbrunner7:monero.social> I am here since 8:00 UTC, thanks very much. 14:55:18 <nioCat> required reading: "All I Really Need To Know I Learned in Kindergarten" 14:55:25 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> unless you read logs on libera or irc many message delete thank you 14:56:01 <nioCat> omg matrix censors, what are you guys doing there? 14:56:10 <m-relay> <rbrunner7:monero.social> There was any argument arguing convincingly that putting up with rows of swearwords is the least bad solution? 14:56:11 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> plowsof 14:57:31 <nioCat> too much popcorn, I am now changing to chocolate 14:58:10 <plowsof> r4v3r23 no estimate sorry. When the admin sees my message 14:58:21 <m-relay> <rbrunner7:monero.social> If "free speech" enters the ring, it's anyway time for me to run the other way :) 14:58:34 <nioCat> 78% 14:58:44 <midipoet> there was no convincing argument for no CoC, other than "free speech" and "anarchism". 14:59:29 <midipoet> There has also been absolutely no solution to what happens when someone hurls insults and slurs towards another. 14:59:40 <midipoet> dEBRUYNE: says things should be civil 14:59:45 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> yes there has. ban 14:59:55 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> that why ofrn not here right now 15:00:23 <nioCat> he is here in spirit 15:00:26 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> overcomplicate with coc and we end up with restricted chat. no spam keep it simple 15:00:28 <midipoet> But there has been countless instances of things not being civil, on here, matrix, and the CCS and yet it took a lot of handwaving before anything was done by those with the powers to do anything 15:00:44 <midipoet> And that, in my opinion, is the root of the issue 15:00:49 <midipoet> Everything else is a symptom 15:01:12 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> cool opinion 15:01:37 <nioCat> please read the book 15:01:52 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> my english is not the best to read a book that long 15:01:56 <midipoet> People having to handwave, makes them targets, and i think it's what those with power want, so they don't have to take the "blame" for keeping things civil 15:02:08 <nioCat> it's simple 15:02:11 <m-relay> <rbrunner7:monero.social> ISBN or Amazon link please :) 15:02:13 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> People need to agree at a fundamental level that if someone throws insults and harasses people, that that person should be removed from the room until they apologize, understand why it's wrong, and agree not to do it again. If the mods can't agree to enforce that, then there's no point of this room, since it'll be continuously ruined by bad actors 15:02:33 <nioCat> I believe it has been translated 15:02:35 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> sgp everything you say is irrelevant as your a bad actor yourself 15:02:38 <midipoet> i agree with sgp_ 15:02:40 <m-relay> <ctrej:matrix.org> there was no argument that did convince you. On the other hand there was no argument that we need a CoC for me (and many others) 15:03:05 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> there is a reason you stepped down from mod and a good one 15:03:07 <dEBRUYNE> <midipoet> dEBRUYNE: says things should be civil <= Right, but just to clarify I am not necessarily arguing in faovr of a CoC 15:03:10 <midipoet> ctrej: a CoC means that we can "try" and ensure that moderation is done in an objectively fair manner 15:03:14 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> stick to chain analysis and helping the fed 15:03:15 <dEBRUYNE> A codified code of conduct that is 15:03:23 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> thats your avenue and attacking ofrn how can we forget 15:03:42 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> It's the cost to pay for freedom of speech, even though it may not be always nice. 15:03:43 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> But as I said, of the same person keeps on insulting you over and over and over then it may be considered as spam. 15:03:44 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> But hey, it's just the way I think about online moderation. I've seen communities go mute and get neutered into echo chambers way too often in the past few years, sickens me to see what the internet has become. I just hope the Monero community doesn't end up this way as well. 15:03:51 <midipoet> In my opinion, if there isn't a CoC, moderation is up to the whims of whomever has the permission 15:04:14 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> midipoet -> no the community can say this X person being annoying ban and people can come to agreement 15:04:16 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> code of conducts, or any other name they are given, set expectations for the room, which is important when we have people here arguing that they should be able to insult anyone however they want. Moderators still have discretion; it isn't "if A happens then must do B" 15:04:40 <midipoet> dEBRUYNE: i know you aren't, and that's fine. But you have said you want things to be civil, but we have ample evidence that they haven't been 15:04:45 <midipoet> So what's the solution? 15:05:25 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> if there was solution society would be lovely, no wars and we all in peace 15:05:32 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> no solution perfect 15:05:43 <nioCat> rbrunner7 so many ISBN numbers as it has been translated and also audio books 15:06:40 <dEBRUYNE> midipoet: Fair point 15:06:48 <dEBRUYNE> <midipoet> So what's the solution? <= Don't really have an answer to that currently 15:07:06 <nioCat> easy enough to search 15:08:03 <m-relay> <rbrunner7:monero.social> I think there are no clear-cut answers, otherwise they would be universally known and applied already. It's always trade-offs and compromises in the end. Which is exactly I would accuse some people here today: No compromise in sight. 15:08:35 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> I wrote up some basic starting points a while back, let me pull those up. It's an example of setting some fundamental expectations, and in those expectations is restraint against taking anything unreasonably far 15:09:38 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> https://cryptpad.disroot.org/pad/#/2/pad/edit/NF37n6EF4rhV4+irPNfbUtCc/ 15:10:21 <midipoet> We did have years and years ago, really simple rules for Monero. There was a graphic. 15:10:30 <midipoet> I think there were like 7 15:11:23 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> go create your own server with these rules 15:11:30 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> we see how many people join 15:11:40 <nioCat> be good 15:12:35 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> always with rules the list keeps getting bigger until you end up with every other shitty social media in exist 15:14:41 <m-relay> <someoneelse495495:matrix.org> Ffs touch grass. Anyone with a decent thinking know this is bs 15:15:02 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> You're advocating for no rules and no moderation, which makes no sense 15:15:06 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> people who touch grass dont know how internet works properly. ive been here long enough in many community see them all destroyed 15:15:39 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> no im not stop putting words in my mouth. i say that there are basic, basic rule like no spam. then if someone annoy or community dont agree with actions by one user they can ping mod to ban and reach agreement. not come up with bullshit list 15:15:42 <m-relay> <someoneelse495495:matrix.org> LMAO 15:15:50 <midipoet> I'd be up for experimenting with no rules 15:16:03 <midipoet> i think we could make this a fantastic place 15:16:11 <midipoet> And indeed all channels could be fantastic 15:16:13 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> sgp should have no say in moderation/admin rules 15:16:41 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> theyve already proven they cant be trusted with them 15:16:44 <midipoet> shall we try a month of no rules in all channels? 15:16:47 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> he used to breaking rules on chain. wants to find out how much XMR you have in your wallet for the fed buddies 15:16:51 <midipoet> See how we go? 15:17:21 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> i know 15:17:24 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> who said no rules. i just say no rule list bullshit 15:17:33 <midipoet> oh! 15:17:35 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> why try to overcomplicate thing? 15:17:42 <midipoet> So what are the rules? 15:17:50 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> the document I linked really isn't that complicated lol 15:17:54 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> rules -> imply list 15:17:57 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> no spam 15:18:00 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> there should be one rule 15:18:04 <midipoet> on rule. 15:18:05 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> bingo 15:18:08 <midipoet> No spam? 15:18:11 <midipoet> That's it 15:18:21 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> you trolling now 15:18:27 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> all words allowed 15:18:28 <nioCat> #1 be good 15:18:51 <nioCat> .bbl 15:18:51 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> its super verbose 15:19:05 <midipoet> #be good to each other and stay on topic# would be a good one 15:19:38 <midipoet> r4v3r23: insults? They allowed? 15:19:39 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> ...it's TWO pages lol 15:19:44 <m-relay> <someoneelse495495:matrix.org> I wish you guys had the same strength at discussing that in my repo instead 15:19:57 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> i assume were all adults here 15:19:59 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> midipoet 15:20:01 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> sticks and stones 15:20:04 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> even Tor has a code of conduct https://community.torproject.org/policies/code_of_conduct/ 15:20:06 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> idk if you are dumb 15:20:09 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> but this was discuss in backlogs 15:20:19 <m-relay> <ocean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> tldr. heh 😎 15:20:19 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> "even tor" LMFAO 15:20:20 <midipoet> r4v3r23: obviously we arent! We again, have ample evidence of this 15:20:23 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> monero also has coc already 15:21:03 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> if some one cant hand le a rando online talking shit, maybe they shouldnt be online 15:21:18 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> midipoet as a basement person who always on internet introduce bullshit rules will actually be worse and cause more dama => then people who sick of this move to other platform with less rules 15:21:36 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> youre always free to ignore the troll. they usually disappear 15:21:58 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> you can mute on irc/matrix 15:21:59 <m-relay> <someoneelse495495:matrix.org> Yeah i'm sure we're all have been on this channel for only 1 hour for sure 15:22:00 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> there no excuse 15:22:12 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> anyway, ignore any of sgp's suggestions 15:22:14 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> https://sqlite.org/codeofethics.html 15:22:14 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> I vote for this one :) 15:22:15 <midipoet> r4v3r23: again, ample evidence, they dont. 15:22:29 <m-relay> <tuxsudo:tux.pizza> based 15:22:56 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> It was so good it triggered CoC people by simply existing 15:23:06 <midipoet> r4v3r23: i heard a funny story about you the other day 15:23:15 <midipoet> Was about your past dealings in the space 15:23:16 <m-relay> <someoneelse495495:matrix.org> TIL 15:24:04 <midipoet> Supposedly you tried to rip someone off in another community (won't name it as it might be obvious who) 15:24:24 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> probably bullshit. but go ahead, it might give me another reason to leave 15:24:30 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> midipoet go back and make some conspiracy theory 15:24:44 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> ive been accused of everything already 15:24:46 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> before you leave read my dm 15:24:48 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> give me specifics 15:24:49 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> at least 15:25:27 <midipoet> r4v3r23: I'll DM you. Don't want to do it in public 15:25:34 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> ok 15:28:32 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> what do you mean by space? monero? 15:31:22 <SyntheticBird> if be any chance this channel got deleted, where else would the drama go ? 15:32:01 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> we already have a place but all of you dont like the drama we keep it private 15:32:58 <SyntheticBird> If you have a special place where you spend time being more toxic than this channel since the last 12 hours, I can only imagine why you are being so opinionated right now 15:33:07 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> the quote on quote drama is only criticing poor implementations like the quickly merge misspell repo 15:33:17 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> and attacks on ofrn 15:33:40 <SyntheticBird> yeah you better don't forget. because everything started from ofrn /s 15:36:38 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> dont you got cuprate work to do? 15:37:09 <SyntheticBird> I'm actively part of the project at the moment. And I've other interesting things to do right now. But thanks for asking 15:37:10 <m-relay> <monero1million:hackliberty.org> sorry may seem harsh but you keep telling me to touch grass and blah. go do work or touch grass yourself 15:37:21 <SyntheticBird> I'm not* 15:46:57 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/monero.social/UATQUrAgaeCczMlLuazTqfMS 15:47:06 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> @plowsof i keep getting this when trying to fork ccs 15:48:43 <plowsof> Can not fork from a 3rd party account , have to wait for approval 15:49:09 <plowsof> Or use protonmail (which receives emails) 15:53:24 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> great, i deleted my account to re-registed the user name 15:53:35 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> now it says account blocked and username taken 15:53:49 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> Ah yes a cesspit full of antisocial behavior, then all the sane people will quit 15:54:27 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> @midipoet ?? 15:56:05 <luigi1111w> r4v3r23 we can probably fix that, what's the account name? 15:57:10 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> nvm luigi all good. just needed to wait 15:57:15 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> can you approve ANONERO account? 15:58:29 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> If we let this happens I wonder if the devs will jump on the sane channel or stay on the toxic one 15:59:57 <midipoet> r4v3r23: i can't get into my client to DM you, unfortunately. Wouldn't worry about it, was probably bullshit or some weird reputation attack 16:00:22 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> was it some one from here? 16:01:41 <midipoet> no, fairly sure it wasn't 16:02:40 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> the only other community i was in was samourai 16:03:13 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> i left years ago tho. and i definitely triggered the fuck out of them 16:03:45 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> > It's the cost to pay for freedom of speech, even though it may not be always nice. 16:03:58 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> Freedom of speech pertains to government censorship, not voluntary associations. 16:04:26 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> @midipoet you can hit me up on telegram or protonmail with same user 16:04:34 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> if some ones talking shit they best come correct 16:05:03 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> What a difficult question to answer really. Move on the uninterrupted on-topic chat, or stay in the cesspit. Especially when people appointed by them and themselves are the ones swinging the banhammer currently and not allowing this to happen. 16:05:23 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> To hear this argument from you Cryptoguard, who banned me from Particl channels for criticizing the project management, is fucking hilarious 16:05:42 <midipoet> r4v3r23: i don't like people talking shit either to be honest 16:05:59 <midipoet> But it happens 16:06:57 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> > <@syntheticbird:monero.social> If we let this happens I wonder if the devs will jump on the sane channel or stay on the toxic one 16:06:58 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> What a difficult question to answer really. Move onto the uninterrupted on-topic chat, or stay in the cesspit. Especially when people appointed by them and themselves are the ones swinging the banhammer currently and not allowing this to happen. 16:07:14 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> same, but since im involved in a project now id like to know what these "dealings" were 16:07:24 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> Disagreement is obviously fine and necessary for healthy discourse and the development of new ideas. Disagreement is different than disruption however, and the latter is a method used to attack free associations. 16:08:08 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> If people don't want a CoC, they need to have established methods and norms for keeping equillibrium and productivity. The ofrn affair has demonstrated that his ardent supports do not have this capacity. 16:08:48 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Just ignore someone Lol 16:09:12 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> They would rather see the topic of ofrn dominate all these channels for days, weeks on end. Even throughout the delistings and spam attacks. That they choose to heap more disruption on top is extraordinarily sus. 16:09:20 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Blocking others from speaking to someone is the literal definition of "blocking free association" 16:09:30 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> And thats what "bans" do 16:09:34 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> You can ignore someone. Ignoring an enormous amount of brigaders is not so simple. 16:09:49 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> I still think it's just not good idea to have "the holy core team" also in charge of fundraising for anything besides keeping the lights on website and DNS bootstrap or whatever 16:10:06 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> No it's not the opposite of free association. No one's obligated to listen to your bullshit. If they block you, that's them telling you they think you're an asshole and want nothing more to do with you. 16:10:43 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> When money is involved, things get political, and having Monero for meditate messy politics is not appropriate scope for steward of decentralized projects "official" website and repo 16:10:58 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> *mediate 16:11:15 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> *Monero Core mediate 16:11:55 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> Anyone who prioritizes their ability to brigade, insult, and spam slurs should go start an #monero-freespeechzone channel 16:12:17 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> No one's stopping you from doing that. 16:12:31 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> Obviously 16:13:02 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> Then the people who compulsive needs to do so can get that out of their systems, and the people who prioritize discussing monero can use the current channels established for doing so. 16:13:06 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> Actually Monero Core could get your channel banned for infringing on their single hashtag namespace 16:13:23 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> ##monero-freespeechzone 16:14:28 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> Even better if they quit wasting monero.social resources and start administrating their own homeserver 16:14:41 <elucidator> jwinterm: you mean #monero-pools ? :P 16:14:44 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> Agreed! 16:14:54 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> The Monero project is owned by its creators and maintainers. They have all powers and its good like that 16:15:08 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Ignoring 3 people because they hurt your feelies takes seconds and doesn't negate the fact you have no right to prevent others from speaking to them 16:15:11 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> They should put their money where their mouths are. You love decentralization and free speech? Fucking prove it and start another instance where you can define the norms. 16:15:45 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> no joke this channel cause me brainrot 16:15:51 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> You all keep saying this is one person, it's three people, it's only a handful of bad apples. It's disingenuous af and obviously wrong to anyone who can scroll up to read the last weeks of conversation. 16:16:34 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> You keep trying to minimize the fact that this is derailing the conversations during the time where the project is seeing rapid delistings and repeated spam attacks. 16:16:47 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> sus af 16:17:09 <m-relay> <dave.jp:matrix.org> Wonderful we have someone attacking monero and we are arguing about chat moderation 😂 16:18:29 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> tbf, the spam attack is technical, not community-related or social 16:18:40 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> so it's pretty ok not to discuss it under #monero-community:monero.social 16:19:51 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> Additionally, monero.social is hosted in Hetzner Finland. Where hate speech is illegal and not permitted by terms and conditions. 16:21:27 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> Someone owns getmonero.org 16:21:32 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> And it's not all the creators 16:21:47 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> Someone has GitHub access 16:21:51 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> And it's not all the creators 16:22:12 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> And essentially one person is gatekeeping finding opportunities still it seems 16:22:17 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> Funding 16:23:26 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> I just think it's always going to ugly, and it's better not to have the official Monero brand involved in something that will always necessarily be messy, loud, political, etc 16:24:16 <midipoet> gydcmr: IRC users can't ignore matrix users and visa versa 16:24:24 <midipoet> As you have to ignore the bridge 16:24:29 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> And as you can see the optics of Luigi hastily posting some new vibes document on the "official" Monero repo has not been universally well received by all community members on Twitter 16:24:34 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> I miss the old bridge 16:24:38 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> but it was broken 16:24:49 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> Or even fellow core team member debruyne coming in earlier and voicing objections 16:24:57 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> What kind of process is this? 16:26:06 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> There seems to be no defined process and no defined core team either really 16:26:09 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> It's called: 16:26:10 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > Hey I've opened a repo 16:26:11 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > I prefer it to be under monero orga since its monero related 16:26:12 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > Oh can you migrate it ? 16:26:13 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > What ? 16:26:14 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > I thought you wanted to migrate it 16:26:15 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > Yeah I can do that 16:26:16 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > Thanks 16:26:17 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> I appreciate saying all contributors own the project but imo that means nothing in reality 16:26:24 <midipoet> RavFX: the old bridge also didn't allow ignore to work properly, as far as i remember. 16:26:58 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I'm really asking with all due respect and I'm begging you. Can you write this frustration out in the repository 16:27:03 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> The old bridge did show each bridged users are normal users so I assume it was working for that 16:27:35 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> I'm not frustrated I'm just here for the vibes 😸 16:29:53 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> why has it been removed ? 16:30:06 <luigi1111w> <yasabi:matrix.org> Anyone who prioritizes their ability to brigade, insult, and spam slurs should go start an #monero-freespeechzone channel <= maybe don't use the "monero" prefix because then the project owns it by default. 16:30:11 <midipoet> ravfx: perhaps, but unfortunately technological determinism now means all IRC users must take matrix users as an aggregate, so you are only as productive as your lowest common denominator, and vice versa of course. 16:30:35 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> really the issue isn't a new CoC, there's already a CoC that covers the core of the issue here. the issue is that it's not consistently applied 16:30:54 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> a new CoC isn't going to fix anything if it's also inconsistently applied 16:31:09 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Its was not doing it's job (bridging use text) anymore 16:31:57 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I disagree. The nearest CoC we have is related to the old forum. 16:31:58 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Making a new one permit to both hear each parties in the conflict and show an interest by the community to see mods apply these rules. 16:32:25 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> luigi1111w: thanks, as you can tell i'm a lowly matrix pleb and not fully accustomed to IRC conventions 16:33:04 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> @luigi1111w are you gitlab admin? 16:33:30 <luigi1111w> <syntheticbird:monero.social> > I prefer it to be under monero orga since its monero related <= this was ill-considered by me since the repo is very preliminary. That's my bad. 16:33:30 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> but really i think it needs to be asked what difference does another document make. why is it some people who are charged with the application of these things are preferring not to? 16:34:08 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> it seems to me that's because their cultural/political sympathies towards an understanding of freespeech as including insults and slurs is taking priority over the duties of moderating that they signed up for. 16:34:31 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> which is fine, that's their perogative, but then why are they moderators? 16:34:44 <luigi1111w> <r4v3r23:monero.social> @luigi1111w are you gitlab admin? <= no moneromooo is, I think plowsof contacted him already 16:37:18 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> DEBRUYNE is a core team member? Since when? 🤔 16:37:47 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> this question appears to cover all the monero channels. the discord server for example, which has multiple "official project people" in the mod and admin team, already has just one single rule which is simply "No slurs". Guess what? It's never enforced. 16:37:54 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> its meme channel is full of images of just the n-word 16:38:04 <m-relay> <r4v3r23:monero.social> gotchya thanks 16:38:15 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> everyone is constantly calling eachother faggot and retarded 16:38:32 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> what's the point of having the rule? either don't have the rule, or actually enforce the rule 16:38:48 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> I can only agree with that. 16:39:04 <m-relay> <jwinterm:matrix.org> Whatever close enough 16:39:38 <m-relay> <rottenwheel:kernal.eu> Ban jw for being a troll! Derailing our very on-topic channel! 16:40:44 <luigi1111w> hmm what is this monero discord 16:41:45 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> either not having the rule, or actually applying it, will resolve all this ambiguity by informing the "types" of people who may be interested as to the cultural norms of the space. 16:42:14 <luigi1111w> it sounds like it's just not modded at all 16:42:33 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> people who prefer not to be in spaces with those norms, who see the rule and join and then see the actual behavior, are not to be faulted if they come to the conclusion that "this is just how the monero community is" and decide not to involve themselves with it 16:43:28 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> The community is vital to Monero. And the worst fate it can get is devs to be disgusted by the community 16:47:38 <m-relay> <CryptoGuard:matrix.org> Can't remember if it was me or another mod but it was consistant with my spamming stance. We've discussed this on Reddit a few months ago when I invited you back into the chat. 16:47:53 <luigi1111w> <yasabi:matrix.org> but really i think it needs to be asked what difference does another document make. why is it some people who are charged with the application of these things are preferring not to? <= there isn't really a mod team on IRC. There are some admins and plowsof. Moderation on IRC in most channels just hasn't been an issue throughout most of the project's history. Matrix came along and built its own mod team, but th 16:47:53 <luigi1111w> e bridge joining it to IRC made it a part of the IRC stuff unlike any other platforms 16:50:00 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> CryptoGuard: funny the timing of it then immediately after i simply observed that due to coin distribution it was impossible to outvote the core team on their own funding proposals 16:50:16 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> And I have no such reddit DM. 16:51:01 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> But that's beside the point of this channel and conversation. 16:52:08 <luigi1111w> oh particl 16:52:18 <luigi1111w> I was wondering how coin distribution mattered lol 17:03:45 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> yeah it looks like the bridge doesn't include comments quoted within messages lol 17:04:00 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> its confused me more than once so far 17:05:32 <luigi1111w> yeah replies don't show. IRC is archaic 17:06:22 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Discord: 🌟 17:06:26 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> just kidding 17:06:28 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> JUST KIDDING 17:07:19 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> In theory we could have Matrix bridged to both IRC and Discord 17:07:26 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> and even Twitter 17:07:28 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> and even Signal 17:07:35 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> and even XMPP 17:09:13 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> sgp_ (New Account: @sgp:magicgrants.org): charuto: this person from this room keeps spamming room invites, FYI 17:09:29 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/kernal.eu/qiVBrUXtfzmgyRUBJHksKGse 17:10:04 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> i got one of those invites as well, i found the symbol in the background of the user icon curious 17:10:50 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> Yeah didn't join obviously 17:12:53 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> Joined accidently. But messages didn't load 17:12:58 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> They invited me when I was on monero.social 17:12:59 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> They invited me again on my new xmr.mx account 17:13:48 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Still have the pending invite. 17:13:48 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> I know that if I reject it they are going to invite me again and again 😂 17:14:15 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Wait I can probably block it too lol 17:17:26 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> MR 444 should be merged just because of the ton of fake account downvoting it 17:18:10 <m-relay> <pointoffailure:monero.social> Bruh, just open a context menu -> ignore user and its done 17:21:04 <m-relay> <pointoffailure:monero.social> Year 2024: Decentralized anarchist communities are begging for strict rules, a strong hand, and mods(police) to keep everything in order. 17:21:59 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> rottenwheel 17:22:00 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Well, if you filter out the fakes, more people upvotted than downvotted. 17:22:01 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> It say it all, more people want ofrn back and the one that don't want it back have to amplify there hate by creating fake accounts to pump number 😂 17:23:41 <m-relay> <pointoffailure:monero.social> Imagine faces of your grand sons and grand daughters when the AI will be telling them about you 😬 17:25:05 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> mods are not police, that's insane. police can kill you and get a paid six month vacation 17:25:17 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> mods are volunteering their time and can remove you from the channel at worst 17:25:23 <m-relay> <pointoffailure:monero.social> Ban is a virtual kill 17:25:26 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> comparing the two is absolutely idiotic or completely disingenuous 17:25:30 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> LMAO 17:30:26 <m-relay> <pointoffailure:monero.social> You transit the subject into nonexistence in the virtual space without his consent, so how do you differ from an executioner? 17:36:59 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> Very cool, get banned 😎 17:39:27 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> maybe you go should go outside and try hurling insults at a cop and let us know your feelings again afterwards, if you're still able to type lol 17:39:43 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Cope 17:39:56 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Y'all need to take your meds 17:40:03 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Schizo chuds who are terminally online 17:42:28 <m-relay> <cockliuser:matrix.org> The irony is that "terminally online" is a piece of terminally online lingo 17:43:39 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> sgp_ (New Account: @sgp:magicgrants.org): charuto: plowsof @plowsof:matrix.org: this person from this room keeps spamming room invites, FYI 17:44:06 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> The English language is now online somehow 17:44:18 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Incredible 17:44:20 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Go outside 17:45:49 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I support CoC expansion. I'm tired of being here to discuss Monero and seeing items such as transphobia and homophobia. Someone's gender identity has no relation to their ability to contribute to Monero so it should have no place here. 17:45:50 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> Specifically, I'll call out how today, pointing out an instance of transphobia (belittling people who specify pronouns in general really) was met with an accusation of Monero going woke. It's not woke to say we shouldn't insult/belittle people and make them feel unwelcome. 17:45:51 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> If we stop people from attacking people for completely irrelevant reasons to the project, we can get back to focusing on work. This chat is a mess, detracting from actually meaningful conversations. 17:45:52 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I don't believe the current CoC repo should exist. I'd call for someone to type a full draft, submit it to meta, and incorporate edits. Then I'd call for adoptance as a repo under the org. 17:45:53 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I'd call for a ban of remarks on race/ethnicity, gender identity, sexual orientation, and all slurs based on that premise. I'd note we should all be respectful and professional to each other. If someone continually breaks the rules, I'm perfectly fine saying 3 strike and you're out, not several days of dealing with your bs before finally ending it. 17:45:54 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I don't want to be dragged down by babysitting this process. I don't want to be dragged down by arguing about it. I definitely don't want to be dragged down by the bullshit here constantly occurring. I do want a future free of this. How can we end this before I just leave? If we can't, that's the decision of the community here, just as it'd be my decision to leave. 17:45:55 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> Also, yes, I'm still on matrix.org. Apologies if that makes me out of the conversation. 17:45:58 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> Can we, at a minimum, make a monero-discussofrn room and shunt all of this bs there? 17:46:15 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Tldr. I dont speak terminally online incel 17:46:23 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Nobody with a life does this 17:46:44 <m-relay> <gycdmr:mtrx.cz> Just go outside, make a few friends 😆 17:47:25 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> Shunting \* ofrn to a new room so this can be yelled about ad infinitum *somewhere else* sounds amazing to me. 18:02:36 <m-relay> <pointoffailure:monero.social> Some cops are my friends and I'm still able to type, lol. Try it at mods and you won't be able to type anything here very soon 🙂. 18:02:36 <m-relay> <pointoffailure:monero.social> If you embrace the same models currently existing in a state then your community is doomed in a long run. The fact that you're policing on a much much smaller scale and it's not as harmful as in the real world is not an excuse. You're just much smaller than a state today and your organization doesn't exist in the real world afterall. 18:20:26 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I'll post my CCS later today. The very brief is: 18:20:27 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> 880 XMR for my work on R&D for FCMPs, part of a total 3000 XMR raise for also funding review and audits (~250k allocated for that purpose). Funds held by the CCS, discretion for who to fulfill the included milestones (and for how much) by myself, jberman, and loose agreement by the MRL. Remaining funds, if any, upon success/failure to roll over into a new MRL discretionary fund (p<clipped message> 18:20:28 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> rocedures to be established upon roll over), as proposed in the meeting before last. 18:20:29 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> -- 18:20:30 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I'd expect the main discussion to be over if this should be split into two distinct proposals, one for my R&D, one for the slush fund. 18:21:19 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I am open to hearing, here and now, prior to my publication initial thoughts on that matter :) 18:23:05 <geonic> speak now or forever hold your peace :) 18:23:09 <m-relay> <rucknium:monero.social> kayabanerve: Thank you! Did you know that "slush fund' usually means a fund that is improper in some way? Maybe have a different term for it. 18:23:40 <m-relay> <plowsof:matrix.org> ⸸gycdmr⸸: are you mass inviting people here to join some room 'europol' room? 18:25:50 <geonic> kayabanerve: are we any closer to FCMPs since your last proposal? I saw your interview with the crypto lady and MT, but I'm having a hard time keeping track of the actual developments 18:26:28 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I was invited, did not realize it was an invite to a room (as I didn't know those existed), and was disturbed by the content. If that's the person who's performing the invites, I'd say they should be banned as a spammer. 18:27:22 <geonic> by "last proposal" I mean the retroactive one 18:28:51 <m-relay> <plowsof:matrix.org> sounds sane after all the corroborating reports. apparently there are other accounts spamming but that was the only one here 18:30:24 <m-relay> <dan:cypherstack.com> Thanks, I'm going to look into this account now. 18:34:45 <geonic> bridge ded? 18:34:48 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> Slush fund suggests impropriety??? 18:35:20 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I just thought it meant a loose allocation of funds that's slushy 18:35:33 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> Fluid enough to flow, frozen enough to go to certain things 18:35:46 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I'd recommend reading my gist 18:36:09 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> No, it's used to convey that people siphon from it, lol 18:36:21 <scoobybejesus> slush/discretionary... not necessarily improper 18:36:55 <m-relay> <rucknium:monero.social> kayabanerve: Slush fund on Wikipedia: "A slush fund is a fund or account used for miscellaneous income and expenses, particularly when these are corrupt or illegal. Such funds may be kept hidden and maintained separately from money that is used for legitimate purposes." 18:37:03 <m-relay> <sgp_:monero.social> "discretionary fund" is what people usually use if legitimate :) 18:38:36 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> It covers a proposal prior to Seraphis and the explicit steps we can take towards it 18:44:05 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> I'll drop the term "slush fund" which apparently is closely linked to corruption??? 18:44:08 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> Thanks for the heads up Rucknium 18:44:56 <m-relay> <potr:monero.social> Originally yes, but they've been misused enough for the term to acquire a negative connotation. Discretionary fund lacks the pejorative weight 18:46:10 <plowsof> geonic yes, matrix dot org <> monero social ded / severely delayed (the irc bridge -> matrix) 18:47:29 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> inb4 CCS RICO trial :smirk 18:50:37 <plowsof> new merge requests on the ccs monero dot observer and ANONERO version 1.0/rewrite https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests 19:00:38 <midipoet> > a loose allocation of funds that's slushy 19:00:41 <midipoet> ^^ to be fair that does sound naughty. 19:00:54 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Can i just say your pissing in the wind. We have resolution room and that its a joke, so beef was created and that turnned into a joke, co- opted. 19:01:31 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> A slush fund is pool of money i can do whatever i want without no oversight. 19:03:02 <midipoet> bob. Why can't you just have your ownatrix uncensored room then? 19:03:06 <midipoet> *own matrix 19:08:29 <m-relay> <plowsof:matrix.org> not a fund to buy slush puppies for everyone, oh 19:09:02 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Or slushies 19:13:02 <m-relay> <ravfx:xmr.mx> Should I start uncensored monero related matrix rooms on xmr.mx? (obviously no CP / actually illegal shiet) 19:13:21 <m-relay> <xmrscott:monero.social> This is factually wrong on several levels. -beef was created for civil, technical spats in 2021 and predates Resolutions. Resolutions was created in 2022, 9 months later so other homeserver admins could discuss issues originally, and now is also geared for flagging a bunch of mods at once for cases of flood, spam, and so forth 19:13:30 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> It's an earmarked fund with the confirmation process being fast tracked to two trusted people and a MRL meeting to confirm it's reasonable 19:34:27 <plowsof> confirming i have created a plowsof:monero.social account 19:42:34 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> you have my permission 19:43:04 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> but be aware that there's already a number of those rooms and there's a reason why they're not more popular 20:04:32 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/ttonuUDvhLAFHcrIIUDEdasc 20:04:37 <m-relay> <monerobull:matrix.org> we should adopt that! 20:31:01 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> You showed one level 1 btw. And two how come there was a meeting a couple of months ago where beef was created and ruck was incharge then with in a couple of weeks ofrn got banned and then ruck unbanned him and then you invited banhammer and then ruck left the room. 20:37:25 <m-relay> <xmrscott:monero.social> No, I showed that you got dates wrong which then also has the corollary that the entire statement is wrong as it was pretexted on order, so multiple levels of wrong 20:37:29 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> This all happened around the time erc suicide banned ofrn and you mutted me in resolution dor asking for him to be unbanned 20:38:34 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> I was in the room and go why did ruck leave oh bannerhammer was invited 20:39:49 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> All this shit started when you fifo in and started retroactive banning people and distrupted the community. 20:39:54 <m-relay> <xmrscott:monero.social> You weren't muted for asking to be unbanned; you were muted for choosing to ignore warnings and continue to make peanut gallery comments in a Support specific room when there are plenty of other less serious rooms to make peanut gallery comments in 20:40:27 <m-relay> <xmrscott:monero.social> You weren't muted for asking for someone to be unbanned; you were muted for choosing to ignore warnings and continue to make peanut gallery comments in a Support specific room when there are plenty of other less serious rooms to make peanut gallery comments in 20:41:04 <m-relay> <xmrscott:monero.social> Ruck is not an alt of mine; I can't comment on why they left 20:41:15 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> 🙄 20:41:50 <m-relay> <xmrscott:monero.social> Ruck is not an alt of mine; I can't comment on why they left Edit: To clarify, not saying Ruck is one period. Commenting that I'm not Ruck, so I can't speak to Ruck's decisions 20:42:35 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> I'm a fan of Grin's Code of Conduct, itself influence by Mozilla's: https://grin.mw/policies/code_of_conduct 20:44:08 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Fck off. Ask rav and siren 20:44:13 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> it clearly defines its own scope in as minimalistic a way as possible, and its enforcement guidelines are structured as such to dissuard the potential for abuse by mods which so many here claim is their primary concern. 20:44:15 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> For matrix and IRC this is actually a great policy 20:44:21 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> *dissuade 20:44:27 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> I said can you unban him cause he was stufd to do for community 20:45:21 <m-relay> <yasabi:matrix.org> it describes but does not mandate positive behavior, but succinctly defines what is unacceptable 20:46:00 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> What is the license ? 20:46:06 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> if there is one for a code of conduct 20:47:51 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> It's apparently based on contributor covenant which is CC BY 4.0 License. I'll use that as a basis for my proposal 20:52:42 <midipoet> You could just take the first two paragraphs and then say if people don't act accordingly there is a three strike rule. Then bans. 1 day. 7 days. 30 days. 180 days, and so on. 20:54:41 <midipoet> And if people complain it's too "woke", then just boil it down to this: "We, as contributors, want to make participation in our community a harassment-free experience for everyone. Act accordingly". 21:07:53 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> So will there be a monero kangaroo court too? 21:11:49 <plowsof> 99 xmr donation to the GF 0_0 21:12:07 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Waste 21:14:04 <nioCat> y not 100? 21:14:41 <plowsof> tii 21:15:25 <plowsof> too predictable 21:31:21 <midipoet> Doner is broke 21:32:29 <midipoet> that was their last 99 moneros 21:32:39 <midipoet> We're screwed 21:36:53 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> Döner > Donor 21:37:31 <m-relay> <syntheticbird:monero.social> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doner_kebab > GF 21:38:23 <m-relay> <no_2:matrix.org> xmrscott @xmrscott:monero.social: can you see my direct messages? I wanted to discuss marketing with the basic swap team. 21:38:23 <m-relay> <no_2:matrix.org> Basic swap is adding new coins and it's a great place to swap XMR from your own wallet. 21:39:15 <m-relay> <siren:kernal.eu> KebabFund >GF 21:45:54 <midipoet> it's late. Forgive me. What's a typo between ~*friends*~ random people on the internet 22:06:32 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> we do kebabs now? 22:06:33 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> How can I invest? 22:17:48 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> Lol 22:19:36 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> Btw Uniswap getting a Wells notice is probably something we should have on our radar, even though it’s ETH (eww) 22:19:36 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> If a decentralized exchange can be properly punished by authorities…. 22:40:27 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> https://9front.org/coc 22:40:38 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> (refresh page multiple times) 22:41:16 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> gigachat based sqlite obviously 22:41:19 <m-relay> <mrcyjanek0:matrix.org> gigachad based sqlite obviously 22:41:42 <m-relay> <shortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> Is it actually decentralized though? I've heard about some Uniswap company or something that is in charge of it, which is who they sent the Wells notice to. 22:43:00 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> personal favorite 22:43:01 <m-relay> <charutocafe:matrix.org> image.png 22:44:28 <m-relay> <detherminal:matrix.org> how tho, if uniswap takes the site down people can still swap 22:45:25 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> The government likely knows this 22:45:26 <m-relay> <preland:matrix.org> So why are they still going forward with it? That’s my concern. They might know something that we don’t. 23:25:05 <m-relay> <ajs_:matrix.org> Now accepting applications for MoneroKon Hackathon: https://monerokon.devfolio.co 23:26:04 <m-relay> <ajs_:matrix.org> Space limited to 100 hackers, $6k+ in prizes 23:44:16 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> Save one spot for ccs wallet hacker 23:49:19 <m-relay> <kayabanerve:matrix.org> https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/448 23:53:25 <m-relay> <321bob321:monero.social> New record?