00:27:58 <m-relay> <c​aptaincanaryllc:matrix.org> XMR p2p buying/selling SimpleX group: https://simplex.chat/contact#/?v=2-5&smp=smp%3A%2F%2FenEkec4hlR3UtKx2NMpOUK_K4ZuDxjWBO1d9Y4YXVaA%3D%40smp14.simplex.im%2F31p3Z5ccouG1crN08zjsElWxe7tufGkm%23%2F%3Fv%3D1-2%26dh%3DMCowBQYDK2VuAyEAZjc2rcks6D7MPzId8K2eYo_VQ3hcGMt0Pif7TghB_k4%253D%26srv%3Daspkyu2sopsnizbyfabtsicikr2s4r3ti35jogbcekhm3fsoeyjvgrid.onion&data=%7B%22type%22%3A%22group%22<clipped messa
00:27:59 <m-relay> <c​aptaincanaryllc:matrix.org> %2C%22groupLinkId%22%3A%22alyVRzAfeUhl7pBZQDtVBg%3D%3D%22%7D
13:57:04 <plowsof> serhack have you seen this PR for updating the magneto payment integration https://github.com/monero-integrations/moneromagento/pull/13 
16:42:54 <plowsof> closed source projects are, to quote rbrunner, 'dead on arrival' for the ccs https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/463 
16:47:01 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> AFAIK, the Mobazha developers have changed their minds a couple of times about becoming open source:
16:47:40 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> https://old.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/repg4j/the_new_openbazaar_project_has_been_open_sourced/
16:47:46 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> https://old.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/1388pba/hi_guys_mobazha_openbazaar_is_finished_hoping/jj1gcr8/
16:48:02 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> Note that the second link appears to be dated more recently than the first.
16:50:44 <plowsof> thanks Rucknium
16:58:28 <m-relay> <r​brunner7:monero.social> One more, related post, but doesn't really answer the question about "why not open source" either: https://www.reddit.com/r/Mobazha/comments/13bmtto/openbazaar_is_alive_now_it_is_mobazha
17:01:01 <m-relay> <r​brunner7:monero.social> I have a suspicion that the team has no clear plan and no clear approach how to finance the whole thing long-term. That is what I always found the most striking about the OB1 company already many years back when it was still alive: I never read about *any* idea how to finance.
17:01:17 <plowsof> theyre open to our questions <3 
17:02:32 <plowsof> our source is closed but our hearts are open 
17:03:08 <m-relay> <r​brunner7:monero.social> The post I linked has an interesting number: OB1 burned through about USD 4,000,000. And after no new venture capital came forth, they faltered and closed shop. More or less, as I remember it personally, just like that. "Oh? Money is finished? Alright, it was nice, but now we are bankrupt, bye"
17:06:08 <m-relay> <r​brunner7:monero.social> I don't have any good idea here either, by the way. But just not trying anything, or at least discussing the "elefant in the room", is not the way to go IMHO.
17:07:37 <plowsof> we also have a comment from the BasicSwapDEX team on ofrnxmrs' proposal https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/457#note_24657 
17:08:54 <m-relay> <r​brunner7:monero.social> Yes, that's real progress, if you ask me. As for me, only now I can take the whole proposal serious at all.
17:14:41 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> Arps & Christin (2020) "Open Market or Ghost Town? The Curious Case of OpenBazaar"
17:14:53 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> Abstract:
17:15:01 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> > OpenBazaar, a decentralized electronic commerce marketplace, has received significant attention since its development was first announced in early 2014. Using multiple daily crawls of the OpenBazaar network over approximately 14 months (June 25, 2018–September 3, 2019), we measure its evolution over time. We observed 6,651 unique participants overall, including 980 who used To<clipped message>
17:15:03 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> r at one point or another. More than half of all users (3,521) were only observed on a single day or less, and, on average, only approximately 80 users are simultaneously active on a given day. As a result, economic activity is, unsurprisingly, much smaller than on centralized anonymous marketplaces. Furthermore, while a majority of the 24,379 distinct items listed seem to be lega<clipped message>
17:15:05 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> l offerings, a majority of the measurable economic activity appears to be related to illicit products. We also discover that vendors are not always using prudent security practices, which makes a strong case for imposing secure defaults. We conclude that OpenBazaar, so far, has not gained much traction to usher in the new era of decentralized, private, and legitimate electronic co<clipped message>
17:15:07 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> mmerce it was promising. This could be due to a lack of user demand for decentralized marketplaces, lack of integration of private features, or other factors, such as a higher learning curve for users compared to centralized alternatives.
17:15:41 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> You can read the article if you get the PDF here: https://moneroresearch.info/index.php?action=resource_RESOURCEVIEW_CORE&id=99
17:16:16 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> ^ That link is for a different article, but the PDF has the whole journal issue. You get the OpenBazaar article as a bonus :)
18:51:49 <m-relay> <p​epe86frog:matrix.org> did you get your name off the dread url?
19:10:55 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> I wish openbazaar had worked
19:11:16 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> I think the problem was that it was a VC funded and that was not going to work well. And it used Bitcoin which obviously did not work after the 2017 block wars.
19:11:26 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> The idea is fantastic. The implementation was totally fucked.
19:18:39 <m-relay> <d​oodi:matrix.org> Whats the new monero market place since localmonero got taken down
19:25:16 <m-relay> <n​ihilist:m.datura.network> Haveno dex, with the haveno reto network
19:30:46 <m-relay> <c​aptaincanaryllc:matrix.org> Haveno-reto is an option, but I’ve done more trading on my trading group
20:05:24 <vthor> for repo.getmonero.org are there any known issues for mail delivery to gmail?
20:05:30 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> Haveno for sure
20:06:03 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> https://github.com/retoaccess1/haveno-reto/actions
20:53:23 <m-relay> <m​x_mandelbrot42:matrix.org> Nihilist [blog.nihilism.network]:  you are absolutely killing it with these Haveno guides. Appreciate your work 🚀
20:54:13 <m-relay> <n​ihilist:m.datura.network> thx :)
21:17:30 <midipoet> Is the BasicSwap CCS asking for 2025 XMR in total?
21:22:02 <nioCat> looks so 
21:22:12 <midipoet> If the believe is that we misallocated funds to Haveno in some manner, i am not sure how we are certain this wouldn't be a similar misallocation. I guess the milestones help, but am not sure with the large lump sum payment up front to the Project Manager. Surely that should be spread out over the milestones in a similar manner to the rest of the dev work?
21:22:23 <midipoet> *if the belief
21:34:13 <plowsof> 2300 to be exact 
21:40:04 <plowsof> Cc silverpill majesticbank pluja : bsx responded to the opensourceness/p2p.network comments https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/457#note_24683
22:06:20 <m-relay> <3​21bob321:monero.social> Ath?
22:12:34 <m-relay> <3​21bob321:monero.social> Curious how much has been spent on haveno development
22:20:45 <MajesticBank> anyone built this so far? I am missing build instructions
22:21:10 <MajesticBank> if open-source then we can build our own binaries
22:22:18 <MajesticBank> i support ofrnxmr but I hadn't heard someone  or saw build instructions
22:23:12 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> https://github.com/retoaccess1/haveno-reto
22:23:14 <MajesticBank> and it doesn't seems like it would build to app there is to download
22:23:39 <m-relay> <3​21bob321:monero.social> basicswap?
22:23:45 <MajesticBank> yep
22:24:20 <m-relay> <3​21bob321:monero.social> ofrn made a script
22:25:06 <MajesticBank> it just unpack binaries
22:25:09 <MajesticBank> from github
22:25:24 <MajesticBank> installer
22:25:33 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> There are build instructions on there.
22:26:21 <MajesticBank> share please, I will build it and we close this question
22:30:01 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> https://github.com/haveno-dex/haveno/blob/master/docs/installing.md
22:30:16 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> That is for building the test net. Let me see if I can find the one for building the main net.
22:31:41 <m-relay> <s​hortwavesurfer2009:monero.social> Nope, I don't see anything specific for it, so I assume that it would tell you in that set of instructions how to build for mainnet instead of testnet.
22:36:02 <m-relay> <s​ilverpill:poa.st> Wow, interesting discussion.
22:36:03 <m-relay> <s​ilverpill:poa.st> I don't think SMSG is "decentralized to the fullest extent possible", but even if that is true, there's still Particl coin. Even CCS author says it is bad.
22:36:05 <m-relay> <s​ilverpill:poa.st> ofrn should fork the BasicSwap, remove SMSG and replace it with something else
23:01:41 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> Genius lol