08:43:00 Hi, is there any official information about 51% attack? 09:06:59 No. Depending on who you ask you will also get quite different assessments on the quickly developing situation. It's a hotly debated topic on the Monero subreddit however, you will find a number of comments e.g. here: https://old.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/1mod130/psa_qubic_is_lying_they_dont_have_50_hash_rate/ 09:20:01 thanks! 11:57:12 I’m still not quite sure what to make of the Q* attack on Monero. 11:57:13 It proved: 11:57:15 a) it’s possible 11:57:17 b) the ~$100k block reward every 24 hours is not an insurmountable amount of “security” 11:57:19 c) It justifies people waiting for 10 confirmations (20 minutes) before accepting big payments. As the biggest re-org went about 6 blocks deep. 11:57:21 But I’m not sure where things go from here 🤔 11:59:44 In the sense that Q* haven't: 11:59:45 - Kept the attack up for long enough to cause the network to become unusable. 11:59:47 - They haven't done a big double spend attack on an exchange - and the drama that would bring 12:11:37 I see a 7 block reorg on moneroconsensus 12:13:26 What you need is not PoW, what you need is a mechanism with greater mathematical certainty - [DSM](https://decentralizedstatemachine.com/). A permanent lightning network, driven by ZK commitment chains rather than hash time locks. 12:15:15 But can't NSA just team up with Pubic and do the real attack?🤔 12:16:08 But can't NSA just team up with Pubic and do the real attack, by running more Pubic nodes?🤔 12:19:39 We always knew it was possible that is why the 10 block lock exists, they have not managed to reorg that far yet. 12:19:41 It would be interesting to know how much they spent on this attack but we'll probably never know. 12:23:05 <321bob321:monero.social> CCS funded 12:26:56 plowsof: 7? ok, I stand corrected :) 12:28:31 boog900: prfd666 point on MRL Github makes estimating the cost even harder. i.e. that Q* were able to bribe existing miners to "work for them" and earn more as a result. 12:28:31 https://github.com/monero-project/research-lab/issues/136#issuecomment-3182159600 12:32:59 If I had to guess I would say most of their hashrate was not from miners switching 12:44:48 https://explorer.jetskipool.ai/pool 12:45:01 sort by XMR and look at the aliases 12:45:27 `7B12-Dual-2` 12:45:29 `RIGEPYC-04` 12:45:31 `Epyc_7742_8` 12:45:34 top 3^ 12:46:50 not proof of anything but doesn't seem like just ordinary miners to me 13:02:58 There should be an option on p2pool to donate a chosen % of the mining rewards to other miners who chose p2pool, as a small p2pool miner who doesn't care too much about microneros I receive I don't care giving 100% of it to selfish miner as long as they choose p2pool. 13:06:11 I like the term *bribary attack*. I think we should start to use it. 13:06:39 Er, of course *bribery attack* :) 13:08:21 Not proposing it as a solution to the current qubic situation but as a good way to make p2pool domination larger and by that as a more default option. 13:10:32 Actually we can use it as a good way to attract miners from qubic to p2pool. 13:12:01 If they joined qubic for monetary reasons, can they be convinced to join p2pool? 13:12:17 While the subsidies continue 13:14:22 I'm sure that if we combine all the mining rewards of miners who care more about decentralization then the reward we can make a good counter attack of subsidies. 13:14:23 People are renting hash power and mining in lose any way, let's use it to shrink qubic hash power 13:18:16 People renting hashes are motivated by moneys too surely 13:19:08 Those who provided the hashes* 13:21:05 How does it interrupt my evil plan? 13:23:43 This is a good idea that should be considered, as long as it doable 13:25:22 Well, if im willing to pay more to the provider than you i can use them instead, unless you think the provider will ignore my offer for 7x the listed price , anyone can use these rented hashes for any purpose it would seem 13:28:51 I think you didn't understand the idea, start here. 15:04:48 Let's say I could spend 1k USD per day on mining for at least 30 days... Is there any place to easily buy mining power that does now require KYC and can be paid in Monero? Where I wouldn't need any extra setup, just order to mine Monero for P2Pool? 15:05:42 Another question is, would 1k USD be noticeable? How much hashrate would I get for it? 15:07:50 Maybe renting few VPS for a month instead is better? I know OVH reseller who does not require KYC and accepts crypto payments. 15:10:36 https://xmrvsbeast.com/p2pool/ works like that, but unsure how to become a sponsor for XvB raflle 15:11:21 At 1k/day, why not build rigs? 15:14:11 Additional hardware cost, time for shipping and setup, local high electricity bills 15:15:20 By the way, FYI from https://miningpoolstats.stream/qubic it seems their biggest mining pool is minerlab. Not like I suggest to mass report their domain as a phishing or malware... 15:27:00 I think you would get 3-4 MHs, and that’s quite a lot 15:27:26 Eh, the top p2pool miner is like 80mh 15:30:13 How many AMD cpu’s does one need to get to 1Mhs? 15:34:17 https://www.ovhcloud.com/en/bare-metal/prices/?display=list&cpu_brand=Intel&use_cases=hpc - seems to be the highest tier available now in terms of CPU 15:34:42 https://versus.com/en/intel-xeon-gold-5515-plus-vs-intel-xeon-gold-6526y are in very similar power 15:35:05 https://xmrig.com/benchmark/3yDfVM this benchmark is available for 6526Y 15:35:26 28865.78 H/s = 28.86578 KH/s 15:37:57 https://xmrig.com/benchmark?vendor=amd 15:38:51 https://www.ovhcloud.com/en/public-cloud/prices/#16640 might be more suitable for it but who knows what hashrate is expected there 15:53:31 I am considering renting this one: 15:53:33 c3-128 128 GB 64 400 GB NVMe 8 Gbps 8 Gbps max. $805.17 * 15:53:48 > These instances are perfect for applications that require high-frequency computing, or for parallel processing of workloads. vCores are clocked at 2.3 GHz and higher. 16:01:38 Alfie Edwards: Ask advice in #xmrmine:matrix.org 16:03:00 AFAIK your plan isn't the best because OVH prohibits mining on their machines and VMs don't allow you to change some parameters that can boost hashrate. You would want a dedicated server from a provider that allows mining. 16:03:24 But going in a good general direction! 16:04:35 AFAIK, servers.guru allows you to mine, but they may have limited capacity. 16:04:40 And they accept XMR 16:06:07 It may depend on kind of service, for shared CPUs on VPS there may be limits, for bare metal, afaik mining is not forbidden. Also, cloud compute is even dedicated to CPU intensive operations 16:08:27 They have no way of knowing what you are doing on the baremetal servers you rent them if you remove their ssh key from .authorized_keys. Plus mining is only if you actually build blocks, not if you perform hashes for someone else, right? 16:08:29 https://www.nicehash.com/my/marketplace/RANDOMXMONERO 21.021652302 MH/s for 1k USD on NiceHash seem to be the best option but there is KYC 16:09:34 miningrigrentals doesn't require KYC AFAIK. Accepts BTC ETH, and a few PoW payment coins, but not XMR AFAIK. 16:26:13 Are there any browser based miners for Monero? I just found https://monerominer.rocks/ , tried it, doesn't work. Would be great to have a site where people could, without having to download and install anything, just start mining to P2Pool. 16:28:14 Probably this one should work https://github.com/NajmAjmal/monero-webminer 16:28:53 Because it is opensource and by default points to moneroocean.stream mining pool which currently has 206.52 MH/s 16:30:43 By the way, an interesting idea to spend 1k USD a day for XMR faucet that would require users to webmine XMR, instead of renting miners 16:30:47 <17lifers:matrix.org> miner.paleoagtech.com 16:30:51 <17lifers:matrix.org> do you guys srs not know abt this? 16:30:57 <17lifers:matrix.org> always works 16:31:00 <17lifers:matrix.org> chrome/firefox 70+ 16:35:49 Page does not load 16:37:00 <17lifers:matrix.org> how doesnt it 16:37:07 <17lifers:matrix.org> https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/GvkbPWQypcLOhxKstDxrUOqg 16:38:01 Maybe it blocks Tor 16:39:57 <17lifers:matrix.org> yes just use a monero paid vpn lmao 16:41:04 I can use Tor+Socks5 from a residential botnet, but already visited it through archive.org 16:42:44 It seem to use https://www.crypto-webminer.com/miningguides.html 16:44:38 https://github.com/PiTi2k5/Crypto-Webminer 16:44:41 <17lifers:matrix.org> "residential botnet" 16:44:43 <17lifers:matrix.org> based 16:54:25 <17lifers:matrix.org> image.png 16:54:25 <17lifers:matrix.org> this aged well 16:58:42 https://www.coindesk.com/business/2025/08/12/monero-s-51-attack-problem-inside-qubic-s-controversial-network-takeover of course, no word about it not being true. 17:00:14 > Oliver Knight is the co-leader of CoinDesk data tokens and data team. Before joining CoinDesk in 2022 Oliver spent three years as the chief reporter at Coin Rivet. He first started investing in ... 17:00:15 Apparently not spent three minutes fact-checking bs from Twitter posts 17:00:25 > Oliver Knight is the co-leader of CoinDesk data tokens and data team. Before joining CoinDesk in 2022 Oliver spent three years as the chief reporter at Coin Rivet. He first started investing in ...Apparently not spent three minutes fact-checking bs from Twitter posts 17:00:33 > Oliver Knight is the co-leader of CoinDesk data tokens and data team. Before joining CoinDesk in 2022 Oliver spent three years as the chief reporter at Coin Rivet. He first started investing in ... 17:00:35 Apparently not spent three minutes fact-checking bs from Twitter posts 17:00:37 Very cool, will check out those browser based miners. 17:05:13 FiatDemise: IIRC, DataHoarder said he was thinking about making "a site where people could, without having to download and install anything, just start mining to P2Pool." 17:05:33 (they'd still need xmrig or something compatible locally) 17:11:32 TOTAL SKISSUE BASED DIRECTION DEATH 17:13:02 I refuse to believe this is some kind of dumb data analyst that forgot to look at actual data, this is likely a paid article 17:16:10 And since this is from CoinDesk, many crypto news websites will now blindly quote this article 17:17:29 TOTAL SLOP NEWS DEATH 17:23:34 Strangely, this article has not been mentioned by either https://xcancel.com/OKnightCrypto or https://xcancel.com/CoinDesk 17:24:30 So there is no option to comment on it 17:28:59 Monero Project lacks spokeperson to clarify bs like this, like, for example Signal, Tor Project do 17:32:51 <17lifers:matrix.org> assign me as the spokesperson, i will always praise this magnificent coin 17:33:02 <17lifers:matrix.org> :3 17:37:49 I would contact Coindesk and this author on X but have no X account at the moment 17:39:11 Linking them https://old.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/1mod130/psa_qubic_is_lying_they_dont_have_50_hash_rate/ might be enough 17:39:43 They will either ignore it or update this article 18:27:29 Alfie Edwards: had a look at the article and whilst the quotes are inaccurate, the commentary by the author largely isn't. 18:27:31 i.e. Qubic (I think?) have claimed to have 51% of hashing power 18:27:33 and the Ledger CTO *did* inaccurately say the cost of the attack is in the tens of millions per day 18:27:35 but more ethical journalism would be to fact check the quotes or sources that they're writing about 18:33:39 browsers aren't designed to mine 18:37:05 What's your opinions on publishing blog post on getmonero.org? 18:39:10 We didn't have this level of FUD issue when there was black marble attack or in the past AFAIK. 18:39:11 I believe clarification would be helpful. 18:40:24 I dont think we should put our foot on our mouths, also dont think we should promote qubic 18:41:31 Foot in mouth = "they dont have 51%" and make empty promises that they wont acquire 51%, or that someone else hasnt taken notice and is amassing large quantities of hashpower to reproduce the "attack", bur successfully. 18:41:43 Its best to fix the issue / improve protocol, and then post a post-mortem 18:41:45 yes this is also my worry, that's also their intention 18:41:47 there was also other people who had this intention in the past. 18:43:13 We can try to avoid promoting them in the blog but i'm not sure how it would be effective 18:43:13 also another question do most people already know them or not? it may be too late to not promoting them. 18:43:15 Shitcoin journalists already promoted them a lot. 18:44:19 psa: by saying shitcoin im talking about the coins designed to be scam, pull rug, bad actor etc. 18:46:52 just point out that mining agi on cpus until 2027 is a turbo retarded play 18:47:25 and there is no exit ramp for their monero mining pool marketing 19:14:00 until 2027? 19:14:03 artificial intelligence with CPUs in 2025? 19:14:19 ??? 19:14:34 thats what qubic promisies 19:14:40 with their ai garden 19:14:44 called ai garth 19:14:52 its so fucking retarded its unreal 19:38:11 <321bob321:monero.social> Monero npu when ? 19:45:17 <321bob321:monero.social> Also maybe mrl needs a think tank about attack vectors for monero ? 20:20:25 I am excited to announce that we have confirmation of the first independent local deployment of `xmrconsensus` : https://github.com/Rucknium/xmrconsensus/issues/1#issuecomment-3184928759 20:20:51 Except for Qubic's apparent deployment, which will shall orphan from our memory banks.....now. 21:19:45 <321bob321:monero.social> Batman needs to post it?