13:00:48 <hyc> ok
13:02:23 <hyc> in this status line
13:02:25 <hyc> Your shares position      = [3.............................]
13:02:37 <hyc> would be nice to know if left or right end is head or tail
13:03:05 <pauliouk> we had this discussion with DataHoarder ... trying to work out the best way to show it
13:03:47 <hyc> I would use ^...$ 
13:03:53 <DataHoarder> > .... >
13:03:54 <pauliouk> [3.....................>]   might work
13:04:16 <hyc> hm thats not bad
13:04:42 <pauliouk> I like the idea of ^...$  but it might confuse the none-devs who might think $ means money and not expiry :)
13:04:51 <DataHoarder> it's too dev-like :)
13:04:59 <hyc> this is a CLI...
13:05:01 <DataHoarder> though I like it...
13:05:11 <DataHoarder> yeah not just devs use CLI
13:05:18 <DataHoarder> tech-savvy vs dev
13:05:56 <moneromooo> ^$ is unclear too fwiw.
13:06:12 <hyc> not if you use regexps
13:06:42 <moneromooo> I took it to mean most recent (ie, chronological, ends now), but "< pauliouk> I like the idea of ^...$  but it might confuse the none-devs who might think $ means money and not expiry :)"
13:06:43 <DataHoarder> maybe just
13:06:43 <hyc> maybe |.........>
13:06:47 <DataHoarder> [3.............................
13:06:48 <pauliouk> hmm, how about colour? [GGGGGGGYYYYYYRRRRRRR]
13:07:04 <DataHoarder> yeah I had that example, not great tbh, but also nice
13:07:33 <garth> My vote is [………………….>]
13:07:38 <DataHoarder> or, indicate "it's left to right"
13:08:13 <garth> Or >………………..> or [>……………….>]
13:08:42 <pauliouk> or KISS. recent[............]expiring
13:09:11 <pauliouk> or shorter: new[......[
13:09:15 <pauliouk> ]old
13:09:40 <garth> I think I like >……………….> the most
13:09:45 <sethsimmons> Wow I always thought it was the opposite for some reason :P
13:10:08 <sethsimmons> I read it like a sequence -- oldest on the left, newest on the right.
13:10:10 <hyc> i think >........> works
13:10:10 <sethsimmons> TIL
13:10:14 <pauliouk> this is like 90% of the dev meetings I sit in playing minesweeper :|
13:12:05 <DataHoarder> I think that's what I ended suggesting first on log channel, heh
13:12:43 <DataHoarder> don't mind here, I'll change bot to match output
13:12:58 <pauliouk> I still like the square brackets being there [>.93.3.9.848.2.4.2..59.2.1.111....>]
13:16:02 <hyc> I guess I don't care either way about the square brackets, but the > > definitely helps
13:19:54 <pauliouk> truthfully, I care little in either case as I never see it :D
13:20:52 <hyc> I only saw it for the first time today
14:07:02 <sethsimmons> https://github.com/cake-tech/cake_wallet/releases/tag/v4.2.7 fixes p2pool payout issues for Cake Wallet, just validated.
14:11:46 <sech1> good
14:12:04 <sech1> I'll wait for it to appear in play store and then I'll prepare p2pool/monero binaries for the release
14:47:20 <jaska087> is the official monerod working now with p2pool or do we still build from SChernykh repo?
14:48:10 <sech1> no official support yet
14:48:25 <sech1> first release will have monerod binaries
14:49:10 <jaska087> ok
15:51:51 <garth> Excited for binaries!
15:52:02 <garth> It’s been fun to watch this project develop and to have played a tiny part in it
15:52:16 <garth> If only to listen to hyc talk about his phone miners
17:59:50 <QuickBASIC> Regarding direction of the shares, I've always felt it was backwards. New blocks are added on the top of the blockchain, and we read from left to right in most cultures so the right is the newest characters being added when typing for example. I think it's more clear if you just swap the direction all together so they disappear to the left.
18:00:14 <QuickBASIC> i.e. like this:
18:00:14 <QuickBASIC> Your shares position      = [.1.1..1..1....1.1.1...........]
18:00:14 <QuickBASIC> Your shares position      = [1.1..1..1....1.1.1............]
18:00:14 <QuickBASIC> Your shares position      = [1..1..1....1.1.1.............1]
18:00:14 <QuickBASIC> Your shares position      = [..1..1....1.1.1.............1.]
18:00:14 <QuickBASIC> Your shares position      = [.1..1....1.1.1.............1..]
18:04:17 <sech1> what? Shares moving from left to right are more intuitive to me
18:04:52 <sethsimmons> Yes, same here
18:04:56 <sethsimmons> That's the way I read it until today
18:19:40 <gingeropolous> i honestly hadn't decided which way it was going, just figured if i had some 1s in there i was winning
18:42:06 <QuickBASIC> I imagine it would be difficult to get a consensus on this in the same way it would be difficult to get a consensus on stick direction for looking in video games. To me inverted feels the most natural, but to someone else it feels super wrong. Everybody's brain works different.
18:43:16 <QuickBASIC> But ultimately this is text, and when you're adding something in a console by typing it gets added to the right of everything that's already been typed. For instance if you're a text editor has word wrap turned off the new characters are added at the end and the characters that no longer fit in the console disappear to the left.
18:45:43 <QuickBASIC> The blocks are being added to the end of the blockchain, and so for me it makes most sense for that to be to the right. 
18:48:19 <QuickBASIC> Imagine if your console only fit 2160x1 characters in it and each time you found a share it printed a '1' in the console, where would the new ones be added and where would the old ones fall off?
18:48:54 <DataHoarder> Think of it like a progress bar QuickBASIC 
18:49:14 <DataHoarder> how do most progress bars fill, left to right, because writing systems
18:54:31 <QuickBASIC> Okay DataHoarder, but it's not really counting up to anything except each shares age which to me doesn't seem intuitive.
18:55:21 <DataHoarder> I mean I added that bar and that’s the direction that felt intuitive to me, which I believe is quite subjective 
18:56:36 <DataHoarder> Though I believe indicating start and end would be nice
18:56:39 <QuickBASIC> Right, I know. I'm just responding to the discussion triggered by hyc's comment about knowing which was head and tail.
18:57:11 <DataHoarder> though I see the point, if you think of it as a time series the x axis is reversed
18:57:34 <QuickBASIC> Well I agree that maybe adding directional indicators would be helpful, I feel like it would be less needed If it were the other way around so it was more intuitive, but as you said that's quite subjective.
18:58:13 <DataHoarder> Somehow it has ended up as the part people pay the most attention to heh :)
18:58:43 <QuickBASIC> It's an amazing addition and probably saved everyone from hundreds of questions about shares locations and how they fall out of the PPLNS window.
18:59:34 <DataHoarder> I might provide a weighted version of it on web later on, so you see heavier blocks better, but kinda out of topic
19:00:06 <DataHoarder> maybe we should have one parameter on CLI for direction, another one for delimiters and another one for dot count :)
19:00:28 <DataHoarder> Maybe dot count would be nice on wide terminals
19:01:46 <QuickBASIC> I honestly wish it always printed b/c I'm using: tail -n 40 /var/lib/p2pool/p2pool.log | grep "SideChain status" -A 21 to output status to console.
19:02:24 <DataHoarder> Just pipe status to it every x seconds
19:03:49 <QuickBASIC> Yeah, I'm piping echo "status" to stdin via socket to get it to output then getting it out of the log. That way I don't have to keep it running in interactive mode.
19:04:21 <QuickBASIC> I'm just saying that there's value to a command always having the same length of output.
19:05:46 <moneromooo> We clearly need a configuration option to select the direction, characters to use, frequency of output, color scheme and length of the status bar.
19:06:10 <QuickBASIC> ^ You forgot the /s
19:06:27 <DataHoarder> I remember the base64 suggestion instead of 0-9 then +
19:06:44 <QuickBASIC> Lol. That was definitely a joke.
19:09:09 <QuickBASIC> As archaic as my programming knowledge is, I'm pretty sure that I could change the way it displays if I really wanted. That's the beauty of open source software.
19:09:10 <DataHoarder> I guess we should at least prepare for many more people coming along if binaries are released
19:09:29 <sech1> "and length of the status bar" so that people could say "my status bar is longer than yours"
19:11:08 <DataHoarder> What about a multi line one that just makes shares a bar chart, then you can also adjust girth :>
19:11:42 <sech1> just make a nice png image and e-mail it /s
19:11:43 <QuickBASIC> DataHoarder:  "I guess we should at least prepare for many more people coming along if binaries are released" I may not be a dev, but that's one of my key strengths that I often bring to Monero subreddits and channels. I don't mind sitting here answering the same question over and over again if it means we get more adoption. I love teaching and explaining things to people.
19:12:29 <DataHoarder> Aye, I guess most people will place questions into github issues
19:12:49 <DataHoarder> so maybe a CONTRIBUTING.md file would be nice to have for that :)
19:14:07 <DataHoarder> although I am getting some nasty headache, so I’ll drop off for now. I expect to see tomorrow a status bar with 20 different knobs all the way to eleven
19:16:18 <QuickBASIC> sech1: "just make a nice png image and e-mail it /s" Ah finally a use for that SMTP code in the Monero code base. /s