11:32:51 <snorch[m]> Hey! Hello, new here.
11:32:51 <snorch[m]> I plan on getting a VPS and mine on the p2pool, not for profitability of course.
11:32:51 <snorch[m]> But I don't know much about mining. It'd be my first time mining crypto.
11:32:51 <snorch[m]> How can I know how much hashrate the VPS has? To know if it's better the normal pool or the mini?
11:43:45 <sech1> First check with your VPS provider that it allows mining. You'll probably be banned quickly
11:44:10 <sech1> you can run monerod and p2pool on a VPS, but it's better to mine on your own hardware
11:47:51 <merope> You'll be lucky to earn back 1/10th of what you pay that vps
11:48:23 <merope> It really makes no sense to do it, and the contribution to the network will be negligible
11:48:57 <snorch[m]> <sech1> "First check with your VPS..." <- I asked (a year ago though) and they told me I can do whatever I can. It's Contabo.com.
11:48:58 <snorch[m]> I was running World Community Grid for a year with 0 issues
11:50:51 <snorch[m]> merope: Isn't the point of Monero that every CPU mining contributes a fair share to the network?
11:50:51 <snorch[m]> I'm always encouraged to do it. I like the project, It's not for money, it's for the cause.
11:50:56 <sech1> Many VPS providers don't like 100% usage because they oversell their capacity. But if they say it's ok then you can try
11:51:26 <snorch[m]> Yes I got their OK from email
11:51:32 <pauliouk> still surprises me mine doesn't mind me mining on it
11:51:38 <snorch[m]> * Isn't the point of Monero that every CPU mining contributes a fair share to the network?
11:51:38 <snorch[m]> I'm always encouraged to do it. I like the project, It's not for money, it's for the cause. And learning too, and having my own node.
11:52:01 <pauliouk> but I do one nmap of my home to see if I've got any external services open that shouldn't be, and I get an abuse email :P
11:54:17 <merope> > <@snorch:matrix.org> Isn't the point of Monero that every CPU mining contributes a fair share to the network?
11:54:17 <merope> > I'm always encouraged to do it. I like the project, It's not for money, it's for the cause. And learning too, and having my own node.
11:54:17 <merope> Current network hashrate is ~3100000000 H/s. You'll be lucky to get 1000-2000 H/s on a vps, unless you go for the extremely expensive ones
11:54:42 <merope> Hell, if you're going for 1-4 cores you'll be lucky to get more than 500 H/s
11:55:23 <pauliouk> 800h/s on 4 cores for me :P
11:55:28 <merope> It will literally be a drop in the ocean. You will be burning money for peanuts
11:55:34 <pauliouk> which is a shame, theres 64mb of L3 on hand
11:56:48 <merope> I get mining "for the cause", but you have to make a realistic assessment of what you're doing and how effective it is
12:00:06 <snorch[m]> Sure! I just wanted to know that's all.
12:00:06 <snorch[m]> If Monero has more than enough miners then It'd be just to understand how mining works.
12:00:06 <snorch[m]> I don't mind "burning" the 5 bucks a month a VPS costs if I anyways wanted to get one regardless if end up mining or not.
12:00:06 <snorch[m]> I actually am deciding between VPS and buying a computer, again for other purposes, but helping Monero was another thing on that list to justify paying for it.
12:00:16 <pauliouk> I've wondered in the past, is every hash that doesn't find a block wasted?
12:00:50 <merope> pauliouk: yes 
12:01:28 <merope> > <@snorch:matrix.org> Sure! I just wanted to know that's all.... (full message at https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/libera.chat/3b87659f3eaa4a3c2feafc01e70023075393bf5b)
12:01:33 <sech1> "if it's better the normal pool or the mini?" with VPS, definitely try p2pool-mini
12:01:47 <sech1> because it's better for low hashrate miners
12:01:57 <pauliouk> I'd say, if the VPS is a bit weak ($5 VPS is probably quite weak) then hosting a public monero node would be of better benefit than mining on it
12:02:15 <merope> ^
12:02:39 <snorch[m]> Ehm but to mine you have to get a node anyways no?
12:02:56 <merope> Only for solo-mining or mining on p2pool
12:03:11 <merope> But not required for "regular" pool mining
12:03:46 <snorch[m]> No no, p2p mining, mining on a pool is no longer recommend I've read, am I right?
12:03:46 <pauliouk> I have 4 'beefy' VPS, (4 core 8->16gb memory, 1TB ssd) and 3 weak VPS (2core 4->8gb mem 300gb ssd) - all mine into my node as 'every little helps' especially on mini :)
12:04:28 <merope> Mining on a pool is fine, as long as you avoid the biggest ones (like Minexmr)
12:04:30 <sech1> VPS capable of running a Monero node will be beefy anyway
12:04:45 <merope> But that's just to avoid centralization
12:04:46 <pauliouk> now that p2pool exists, pool mining on the smaller pools is still fine, but I'd avoid the top 5 centralised pools
12:05:28 <snorch[m]> But why anyone would mine in a regular pool, if p2pool exists? 
12:05:47 <pauliouk> we ask ourselves that a lot
12:06:00 <pauliouk> laziness I guess... they don't want to setup a monero node and p2pool node
12:06:02 <snorch[m]> Isn't p2pool 0% fee and not centralised? Seems there's no downside beside irregular payments
12:06:45 <merope> Because p2pool requires running a node (even pruned), which in turn requires a significant amount of storage. Not everyone has that
12:07:12 <pauliouk> there are public options available though
12:07:28 <merope> Plus p2pool requires running a second bit of software, and some people are not technically skilled enough to figure it out
12:07:28 <snorch[m]> A pruned node is like 30 GB or so, no? It seems pretty low
12:07:46 <merope> More like 40-50GB nowadays
12:08:15 <snorch[m]> Who does want to run a mining rig and is short of 50GB of space? Seems odd to me
12:08:49 <merope> Somebody mining on their regular/work computer/laptop
12:09:02 <merope> My desktop has like 20GB free disk lol
12:09:30 <snorch[m]> Okay we are talking about very specific situations here then 😅
12:10:02 <snorch[m]> Anyways thanks for the info people :)
12:10:02 <snorch[m]> The more I learn about Monero the more I like it.
12:11:06 <sech1> Gamers have no problems with installing 100-200 GB games, so it's more force of habit to mine on centralized pools
12:12:26 <pauliouk> for the lazy folk, I might get around to spinning up a node host eventually
12:12:55 <pauliouk> I'll try and keep them decentralised and host them across the VPSs I have available
12:14:22 <pauliouk> the thing that matters the most is that the p2pool node is as close to the monero node as possible - the miners can be scattered around the globe
12:16:29 <pauliouk> I've found on my new machine, I can leave xmrig running quite happily while I play DayZ. hashrate drops as to be expected, but then its windows, so it drops randomly anyway
12:16:30 <sech1> overall latency from miner to Monero node matters too
12:16:42 <sech1> or we'll get orphan blocks
12:17:15 <pauliouk> omg :/ see this is why I don't use windows normally, feking machine rebooted for updates last night :|
12:17:18 <pauliouk> wasted hashrate :o
12:17:41 <sech1> I set up autologin and xmrig autostart on all my windows machines
12:18:11 <sech1> because they're overclocked and reboot randomly ~once a week
12:18:13 <pauliouk> this thing only runs windows for recording the video guides and playing dayz :P
12:18:25 <pauliouk> it'll be on debian most of its life
12:18:38 <merope> Dang, dayz still a thing?
12:20:03 <pauliouk> DayZ never dies :P
12:24:25 <snorch[m]> It still takes 4 literal hours to meet with your friend? I remember what a pain that was
12:25:44 <pauliouk> nah I decided to throw it on the new build to see how the Ryzen 5700G handled gaming - so playing on a custom mod server. didn't take long to get a vehicle, and grabbed my first heli last night
12:44:58 <pauliouk> hmm in regards to miner->monero proximity, I might spin up some node hosts in the US and farther out in Europe, mine are all in the London area
14:21:30 <_gingeropolous> it makes no sense to discourage small mining. if the network continues to grow, *all* mining will be small mining in comparison
14:29:23 <snorch[m]> You saying this reminded me: How so there's 1 miner in the mini p2pool that has 90% of the hashrate lol?
14:31:43 <pauliouk> that's beasty :)
14:32:04 <pauliouk> helps avoid the risk of someone dropping a load of hashrate on the pool and orphaning shares