15:27:23 <hashem> hello
15:57:00 <ttnk> hello good morning, im new to monero, i want to start using it but i would like to get advice on how to best do it
15:57:53 <ttnk> i have a little server where i run some vm on proxmox, is it a good idea to run a vm for monero? and connect from my laptop to there? sorry if im asking noob stuff
15:59:32 <ttnk> i installed like 2 months ago monero monero-feather and monero-gui at my laptop with archlinux
16:05:20 <moneromooo> VMs are always a good idea for isolation if you've got the resources.
16:06:36 <moneromooo> The daemon is just a network daemon like many others.
16:07:09 <ttnk> the wallet is the process that when started it takes forever to synch?
16:07:25 <moneromooo> No. It's the one that just takes a while.
16:07:50 <moneromooo> "monerod" is what I called the daemon, and which I should really call the node.
16:07:59 <ttnk> i went to getmonero.org to read and try to understand how it works, i need a very very basic reading on how it works, what are the parts 
16:08:02 <moneromooo> Feather and monero-gui would be the wallets in your case.
16:08:16 <ttnk> ok
16:08:55 <ttnk> so i can run monerod on a VM and then connect the gui from my laptop?
16:09:06 <moneromooo> Yes, you can.
16:09:37 <moneromooo> Always run the wallets from hardware you control btw. The node, not so important.
16:10:19 <ttnk> the node can run on a vps for example? 
16:10:23 <moneromooo> Yes.
16:12:23 <ttnk> why is the node not that important? and how big the VM needs to be?
16:12:43 <ttnk> i mean space, CPU and RAM?
16:13:09 <ttnk> thanks for your help moneromooo by the way :D
16:13:55 <moneromooo> It does not know your keys, so if it gets pwned, you don't lose your monero.
16:14:13 <moneromooo> The chain is something like 140 or 150 GB IIRC. Pruned, it's more like < 50 GB.
16:14:30 <moneromooo> You want at least 1 GB free. 2 GB free to be comfortable.
16:14:39 <moneromooo> More if you want to build it on that VM.
16:14:47 <moneromooo> More for the initial sync to avoid slowdowns.
16:15:10 <moneromooo> You want a CPU with hardware AES. More cache is always good.
16:15:27 <moneromooo> After you've done the initial sync, it won't use much.
16:15:44 <moneromooo> (CPU)
16:15:56 <moneromooo> Well, relatively I guess.
16:18:04 <ttnk> any preferred distro? or it doesnt matter?
16:18:41 <moneromooo> Some Linux. IIRC BSDs are tricky to build on.
16:19:16 <moneromooo> The README has a list of Debian packages. Also for... Fedora and arch IIRC.
16:19:39 <moneromooo> But it should be fine on any reasonably modern Linux distro.
16:20:30 <moneromooo> Also biulds on Mac and Windows if you're into those.
16:24:06 <ttnk> ok cool, so just to be sure, i will build an  archlinux VM with 180G HD, 2G RAM 2CPU with aes
16:24:09 <ttnk> is that ok?
16:26:30 <moneromooo> 2 GB will probably be not quite enough to build.
16:26:56 <moneromooo> Unless you meant 2 GB free, not total.
16:27:14 <moneromooo> In that case, make sure you add some swap, and it should be fine (no parallel make).
16:27:50 <ttnk> ah ok, so ill make it 4G then
16:31:56 <hyc> 4G should be ok
16:44:48 <Mochi101> moneromooo, is there any way to derive a hash from the data at certain points in the blockchain?
16:46:16 <Mochi101> For example, a node could sync 250k blocks and create a hash from the data and store it locally, then again at 500k, 750k, etc.
16:46:54 <Mochi101> These could be shared on the network to verify the blockchain data rather than full verification by every member.
16:48:45 <Mochi101> Monero has an accessibility problem... a lot has to do with syncing the chain... maybe something like this could help.
16:50:04 <Mochi101> If it's even possible it could be made as an opt-in fast sync.
16:50:30 <hyc> doesn't help a whole lot since you still need access to all txn/txo data to construct your own txns
16:51:33 <hyc> syncing a new node generally isn't heavily CPU bound. every new release already contains checkpoint hashes up to a recent point in time.
16:52:02 <hyc> all blocks up to the last checkpoint are indeed "verified" only by checking their hash, no heavy computation or lookups
17:04:13 <Mochi101> hyc, so why does it take so long to sync a new node?
17:04:40 <hyc> network and disk I/O mostly
17:05:05 <Mochi101> I can download the whole chain in an hour but it takes 30 hours to sync.
17:05:11 <hyc> see for yourself. set up 2 nodes on your own LAN, one full and one empty
17:05:29 <hyc> set the empty node to use the sync'd node as an -exclusive-node
17:05:40 <hyc> time how long it takes, record system utilization stats as it goes.
17:09:46 <moneromooo> It is possible. However, a hash is just a hash. You need a way to tell whether this hash is correct.
17:10:03 <moneromooo> It could be signed by trusted people, like gitian builds, maybe.
17:10:26 <moneromooo> Is this so you could download a ready made lmdb file ?
17:10:36 <moneromooo> (and sync the small remainder)
17:11:17 <moneromooo> Something like that is on my list for TF, but mostly to detect bugs (I have lots of db tables).
17:12:10 <moneromooo> You need a way to go through the DB in a determistic fashion. I believe monero-blockchain-export is one example of this.
17:15:05 <Mochi101> moneromooo, no, this is not what I'm thinking. If p2p nodes are sharing and verifying blockchain data together, why can't they share the data and then the hash derived from said data.
17:15:55 <Mochi101> So rather than ask everybody on the network for a block at a time just share the data for the first 250k blocks and then the hash derived from it.
17:17:37 <Mochi101> If I want to run a full node, I sync until 250k blocks and then create a hash from the data... then 500k... and 750k.. so that those who want to do a fast sync can just download the data and verify with the hashes.
17:18:28 <Mochi101> or maybe I'm missing something...
17:38:02 <selsta> Mochi101: and how do you know which nodes to trust?
17:41:52 <Mochi101> selsta, mmm.. yeah.. I see now.
17:42:58 <Mochi101> Man... Monero is probably the most verified and scrutinized chain out of all of the currencies that are out there.
17:44:14 <moneromooo> Second most, probably ^_^
17:45:11 <Mochi101> moneromooo, you think BTC more?
17:45:22 <Mochi101> No real verification needed if it's an open book.
17:45:29 <moneromooo> I would be flabbergasted if not.
17:46:36 <moneromooo> Even Ethereum is probably more scrutinized than monero, come to think of it. Just the sheer amount of people, even if diluted by the sheer amount of... stuff.
18:05:18 <Mochi101> moneromooo, but who even syncs an ETH node?
18:25:06 <moneromooo> Good point. Maybe it is a clever DoS attack on the NSA...
19:10:05 <ttnk> hi, im back, so i created my VM, my node is running, ti will take like 1 day to finish the sync
19:11:19 <ttnk> i was watching on how to connect the wallet to the node, but i cant find how to add user/pass to it
19:16:09 <ttnk> thanks for the help guys, have a great day
19:43:50 <Mochi101> ttnk so patient