00:05:32 * ofrnxmr[m] sent a code block: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/b24aeb39e3ccd04e3ea531161b181597f0d0aeef
00:12:51 <boog900[m]> yeah but for A block only 1/8 of the pruned peers will have it 
00:12:51 <boog900[m]> (although that is pretty much what you said I just want to make it clear)
01:21:05 <politicalweasel[> is there a downside to using --sync-pruned-blocks?
01:21:29 <politicalweasel[> or is it just a free efficiency boost?
01:23:05 <RavFX[m]>  downside is that you have a pruned node
01:23:34 <politicalweasel[> well yeah obviously but I mean when you're already running a pruned node
01:26:11 <RavFX[m]> You can't run things like explorers, if you want to do that yourself instead of probing public one.
01:27:41 <politicalweasel[> yeah but that goes for regular pruned nodes too
01:27:59 <politicalweasel[> i mean specifically when running this flag on a pruned node, is there a drawback?
01:30:27 <RavFX[m]> I think you get the same result politicalweasel It change nothing but download less data (data that would not have been kept anyway) It's good actually because it use less of the other peers bandwidth
01:30:45 <RavFX[m]> Just read about the option
01:30:46 <ofrnxmr[m]> You manually prune everything without it
01:31:28 <ofrnxmr[m]> So you could say youre trusting that your peer group isnt malicious 
01:32:30 <politicalweasel[> RavFX:  nice, id never heard of that option. Good to know
01:32:40 <ofrnxmr[m]> And when at chain tip, you should be pruning your own blocks
01:32:56 <politicalweasel[> ofrnxmr: Isn't the data committed to in the block header which are covered by checkpoints anyway?
01:33:11 <ofrnxmr[m]> yep
01:33:38 <politicalweasel[> then i dont see how it introduces any more trust
01:33:50 <ofrnxmr[m]> And there was also talk of adding running-checkpoints "hash of hashes" 
01:33:58 <ofrnxmr[m]> politicalweasel[: Right
01:35:02 <ofrnxmr[m]> instead of having to trust validity, peers could just be annoyinf
01:35:28 <ofrnxmr[m]> sending bad blocks
01:36:15 <ofrnxmr[m]> (more like, try to target a peer of a group to cut them off)
01:36:15 <ofrnxmr[m]> but really, meh.
01:36:15 <ofrnxmr[m]> i use it
02:10:32 <exist[m]> so what is the status nowadays on BTC atomic swaps? i feel like its been several years now with little actual progress
02:11:40 <vostoemisio[m]> exist[m]: https://unstoppableswap.net/
03:48:05 <bike[m]> <exist[m]> "so what is the status nowadays..." <- iirc you can transfer bitcoin to monero but not monero to bitcoin
04:16:43 <fmlatghor> is there much reason to use wownero over monero?
04:26:28 <side-trips[m]> <fmlatghor> "is there much reason to use..." <- I'm often told it's more fun
04:26:39 <side-trips[m]> Ymmv
06:59:55 <Mumuks> I just bough my wallet a couple days ago, and now they are all offering discounts. Fuck me. In case it can help someone else:
06:59:55 <Mumuks> Seizing Upon Ledger Stumble, Hardware Wallet Competitors Offer Discounts
06:59:55 <Mumuks> BitBox, Cold Card, Trezor and Blockstream all announced sale prices on their cold storage devices.
06:59:55 <Mumuks> https://decrypt.co/140520/ledger-recover-competitors-trezor-cold-card-blockstream-jade
07:11:11 <skeptdev[m]> If I'm not mistaken, only Trezor has support for XMR right?
07:14:52 <sech1> Ledger too
07:26:23 <skeptdev[m]> yes but this is the one I'm trying to replace now 😅
07:38:36 <Mumuks> Yes, Trezor and Ledger are the ones with xmr support
07:42:31 <HiV> ledgers xmr support was kind wonky, dunno if its better than before
07:54:12 <philnthropic[m]> https://protos.com/swiss-govt-supports-cash-referendum-amid-digital-payment-concerns/
09:16:59 <ofrnxmr[m]> <vostoemisio[m]> "https://unstoppableswap.net/" <- basicswapdex *
09:41:30 <DanIsnotthemanBr> Ledger has no issues with gui. But have to shamir my keys with plowsof and ledger third party company ( who will never get hacked, pinky promise)
10:42:58 <DanIsnotthemanBr> Wut wut!! stack works with self signed now
13:34:19 <plowsof> cue the return of 24/25 asking about the ledger key sharding shamir thing and if its safe or not 
14:53:12 <RickAstley> Hey, want to create a docker image to sync monero blockchain and run a daemon on my server
14:53:27 <RickAstley> Anyone have ideas on best practice and simplest / fastest way to do that
14:58:42 <gingeropolous> i think one exists RickAstley 
15:43:36 <plowsof11> RickAstley https://hub.docker.com/r/sethsimmons/simple-monerod 
16:03:43 <side-trips[m]> Stupid question: if you have the ability to purchase the same necessity with either fiat or xmr; is there any situation where it's actually better to use fiat currency?
16:28:30 <plowsof11> physical cash? 
16:29:14 <r4v3r23[m]> <side-trips[m]> "Stupid question: if you have the..." <- cash can be more private
16:29:38 <dreamcity[m]> <side-trips[m]> "Stupid question: if you have the..." <- If you struggle to get xmr where you are and fiat is easier to acquire, you can save your xmr for something else
16:30:09 <dreamcity[m]> If you value xmr more than fiat, you can save your xmr too
16:33:34 <dreamcity[m]> r4v3r23[m]: this too. It's hard to beat transactions not involving electronics, when It comes to privacy
16:49:59 <bike[m]> <side-trips[m]> "Stupid question: if you have the..." <- i would consider just paying with fiat if it's a necessity as in day to day item
16:50:19 <bike[m]> assuming you can't get xmr quickly then just paying for it in cash is best.
16:50:50 <bike[m]> even with a card is okay, cc company really doesn't care that you bought more toilet paper to wipe your ass with
17:02:56 <ofrnxmr[m]> Fiat is xmrs L2 lolol
17:03:34 <ofrnxmr[m]> .. i take that back
17:05:15 <mlcboss[m]> <side-trips[m]> "Stupid question: if you have the..." <- i prefer cash for offline purchases
17:05:51 <nioc> how 2 send cash online?  fax?
17:06:30 <nioc> oh you said offline  lol
17:06:33 <nioc> duh
17:07:42 <side-trips[m]> <dreamcity[m]> "If you value xmr more than fiat,..." <- This is the conundrum for me, the longer I lurk these communities the more I value and prefer saving monero. This is called something funny like Stockholm syndrome or something right? 
17:08:42 <k4r4b3y[m]1> <ofrnxmr[m]> "Fiat is xmrs L2 lolol" <- Few
17:10:56 <ofrnxmr[m]> Saving fiat would be stolkholm 
17:13:09 <FrankieYawkey[m]> <side-trips[m]> "This is the conundrum for me..." <- call it "stack 'em" syndrome.
17:28:49 <mlcboss[m]> <nioc> "how 2 send cash online?  fax?" <- in my country , an online platform will you a code 
17:28:49 <mlcboss[m]> you just go to a nearby store , tell the cashier the code and pay it with cash 
17:28:49 <mlcboss[m]> i do that all the time , until i found xmr which make the process easier
17:29:11 <mlcboss[m]> * in my country , an online platform will send you a payment code 
17:29:11 <mlcboss[m]> you just go to a nearby store , tell the cashier the code and pay it with cash 
17:29:11 <mlcboss[m]> i do that all the time until i found xmr which make the process easier
17:30:34 <nioc> Yes I have heard of that, not available here AFAIK
17:33:16 <k4r4b3y[m]1> <FrankieYawkey[m]> "call it "stack 'em" syndrome." <- > <@frawkey:matrix.org> 
17:33:16 <k4r4b3y[m]1> > call it "stack 'em" syndrome.
17:33:16 <k4r4b3y[m]1> stash them neros boii
17:33:56 <M5M400> .usd
17:33:56 <Wallet> M5M400: DURR.. 1 USD = 1 USD genious! [sic]
17:34:18 <M5M400> rude
17:37:05 <side-trips[m]> <FrankieYawkey[m]> "call it "stack 'em" syndrome." <- I thought it was something else... Why stack internet money? Stack/heap reference? 
18:37:40 <side-trips[m]> What all should I read to adequately understand the whitepapers? Assuming they're still worth reading ofc
18:38:05 <side-trips[m]> should I start with cryptpad whitepaper?
18:38:25 <side-trips[m]> omfg cryptnote sorry imnew
18:39:24 <k4r4b3y[m]1> cryptonote whitepaper is worth reading
18:39:49 <k4r4b3y[m]1> it has some interesting critique of btc design.
18:40:05 <side-trips[m]> which means I gotta review btc whitepaper
18:40:07 <k4r4b3y[m]1> shows that monero was designed as a critique of btc.
18:40:14 <k4r4b3y[m]1> side-trips[m]: > <@side-trips:matrix.org> which means I gotta review btc whitepaper
18:40:14 <k4r4b3y[m]1> ofc
18:41:37 <k4r4b3y[m]1> btc whitepaper and cypherpunk's manifesto are required readings
18:42:29 <dreamcity[m]> k4r4b3y[m]1: Didn't they evolve to have different goals tho? Coins like btc are just designed to hoard value like gold, whereas coins like bch are designed for convenient and fast transactions. Monero wants to be "convenient enough", but private and secure
18:42:35 <side-trips[m]> im old and missed all news of a cypherpunk's manifesto? I have a lot of work ahead of me
18:44:39 <k4r4b3y[m]1> dreamcity[m]: > <@dreamcity:matrix.org> 
18:44:39 <k4r4b3y[m]1> > Didn't they evolve to have different goals tho? Coins like btc are just designed to hoard value like gold, whereas coins like bch are designed for convenient and fast transactions. Monero wants to be "convenient enough", but private and secure
18:44:39 <k4r4b3y[m]1> "coins like btc are just designed to hoard value like gold" --- what makes you say that it "was designed" to be like that?? I don't remember satohsi mentioning a use case like this. If anything, he was thinking btc would be a digital cash.
18:45:17 <k4r4b3y[m]1> "monero wants to be convenient enough and private and secure" ---> btc wanted to be that, too.
18:45:30 <k4r4b3y[m]1> but it failed to adopt to its shown-weaknesses.
18:45:36 <k4r4b3y[m]1> *adapt
18:46:14 <side-trips[m]> any other theory I should brush up before btc whitepaper? Sorry to be excessive/obsessive ishutupnow
18:46:39 <k4r4b3y[m]1> just start with the btc whitepaper, then read cryptonote whitepaper, and then read cypherpunk's manifesto
18:47:25 <k4r4b3y[m]1> if you want to keep diving into monero's theoretics, read mastering monero (though it sorely needs a new edition)
18:49:30 <cockliuser[m]> <k4r4b3y[m]1> "shows that monero was designed..." <- > <@k4r4b3y:karapara.net> shows that monero was designed as a critique of btc.
18:49:31 <cockliuser[m]> > 
18:49:31 <cockliuser[m]> Cryptonote was a critique
18:50:06 <cockliuser[m]> Monero doesn't have people involved with Cryptonote as contributors currently 
18:51:45 <dreamcity[m]> <k4r4b3y[m]1> "> <@dreamcity:matrix.org>..." <- You are right, that's more like... the new direction that btc seems to have taken recently ^^. The pro-btc guys seem to want to use it as a store of value and that wasn't Satoshi's intent x)
18:52:25 <k4r4b3y[m]1> yep.
18:52:40 <cockliuser[m]> Actual pro btc people would actually use it cash, imo it's been co-opted by state actors
18:53:17 <k4r4b3y[m]1> the bitcoin maxis that came with the whole saifedean-crowd really retconned the btc's intellectual roots
20:19:34 <k4r4b3y[m]1> Is it "normal" that my locally-compiled monerod has different sha256sum than the one I download directly from getmonero.org ?
20:19:59 <k4r4b3y[m]1> I have compiled monerod from source on my 32-bit armv7 hardware; on tag 0.18.2.2
20:23:19 <plowsof11> yes. gitian build process is how we create reproducible binaries (put simply: everyone is able to build on the 'same machine' which produces the same sigs (system clock time for example can effect the end hash)) 
20:26:07 <k4r4b3y[m]1> if my locally-build monerod binary's sha256sum is different, then how can I judge this is a reproducible build?
20:31:13 <plowsof11> sir, you didnt build it using the gitian build process 
20:31:56 <k4r4b3y[m]1> I just followed the README.md instructions for raspberry pi zero + debian
20:32:44 <plowsof11> if you build it again, you will get a different hash 
20:33:43 <plowsof11> thats normal
20:33:50 <k4r4b3y[m]1> alright
20:34:32 <plowsof11> more info here https://github.com/monero-project/monero/blob/master/contrib/gitian/README.md#gitian-building
20:35:03 <k4r4b3y[m]1> yeah I was checking that just now
20:35:11 <k4r4b3y[m]1> that gitian stuff is new to me
20:35:39 <k4r4b3y[m]1> also docker is no bueno
20:35:55 <k4r4b3y[m]1> any beginner's guides on these two that you recommend?
20:35:56 <plowsof11> a list of contributors who uploaded 'their' version of reality https://github.com/monero-project/gitian.sigs/tree/master/v0.18.2.2-win 
21:21:13 <vtnerd_> 5x
22:14:12 <toralien[m]> <plowsof11> "a list of contributors who..." <- what is this?
22:48:25 <guruji[m]> <k4r4b3y[m]1> "> <@vergio:matrix.org>..." <- > <@k4r4b3y:karapara.net> > <@vergio:matrix.org> 
22:48:25 <guruji[m]> > > You perceive community as a group of people tired to a common physical location. In that case you would need to have enough privacy/security/anonymity aware people concentrated in that area that would opt-out from the traditional system to Monero. That won't happen in this stage. 
22:48:25 <guruji[m]> > > 
22:48:25 <guruji[m]> ...(truncated)
22:49:13 <guruji[m]> <k4r4b3y[m]1> "Having said that, I would expect..." <- > <@k4r4b3y:karapara.net> Having said that, I would expect from that geographically-concentrated community have the willingness to get out of their government controlled economy/monetary systme.
22:49:13 <guruji[m]> > 
22:49:13 <guruji[m]> My point was that to find that many local awakened people is close to impossible. 
22:51:25 <guruji[m]> <ofrnxmr[m]> "If even simply for the fact that..." <- They all can save money even now, but it doesn't happen. That is the point. People are not logical beings. We need to work with and establish strong non-local communities.
22:51:35 <side-trips[m]> Anyone know where to find the cryptonote Whitepaper? 
22:52:45 <meow[m]> side-trips[m]: https://www.allcryptowhitepapers.com/cryptonote-whitepaper/
22:53:39 <side-trips[m]> How did you do that so fast? Nvm I hate being slow
22:53:46 <side-trips[m]> Thank you
23:00:17 <revuoxmr> Revuo Monero Issue 171: May 11 - 18, 2023. https://revuo-xmr.com/issue-171.html
23:39:45 <side-trips[m]> Holy cow, cypherpunks been out here since the 80's? Are they still fighting the good fight now? I imagine the mailing list is no longer around but did it evolve into anything else?