02:20:02 <ceetee[m]> <ofrnxmr[m]> "Keepass backup is local, so my..." <- Aegis autobackup also can be in local storage. I know because my syncthing has it.
02:21:26 <ceetee[m]> While we're on this topic: Guys make sure to backup your wallet data (manually in monerujo, automatic in stack), so you can restore your TX history if needed
02:58:06 <ofrnxmr[m]> <ceetee[m]> "Aegis autobackup also can be..." <- Yea, but its automatic. Its not "stored" there
02:59:37 <ofrnxmr[m]> Same as monerujo or stack. The backups are that: backups (of internally stored DBs)
02:59:37 <ofrnxmr[m]> keepass isnt a backup, but is the actual password db. ie thr db file isnt stored in appndata, and then backed up. Its stored on publicn storage to begin with
03:25:42 <ceetee[m]> oh, right
08:13:06 <modul8[m]> <gingeropolous> "best 2Fa app currently?" <- keepasscx password manager on desktop has totp support. handy dandy. 
08:58:18 <Nebraskka> classic keepass has embedded totp support too, though it's kinda hidden: https://keepass.info/help/base/placeholders.html#otp
09:46:25 <dudeitwasntme> comradeblin: Did you have a chance to look at how I might get the date/time of a transaction after we spoke the other day?
10:00:42 <comradeblin[m]> <dudeitwasntme> "comradeblin: Did you have a..." <- Ahh, man I completely forgot, I was planning MoneroKon. One sec.
10:01:40 <comradeblin[m]> is it a specific tx or the last tx?
10:01:57 <ofrnxmr[m]> You use ablock explorer or check the block info
10:02:06 <comradeblin[m]> ofrnxmr[m]: thats one way
10:02:44 <ofrnxmr[m]> Thats 2 ways
10:02:54 <comradeblin[m]> **
10:04:15 <comradeblin[m]> and the first one is the easiest so dudeitwasntme i suggest u that
10:05:50 <comradeblin[m]> get_transfers
10:05:50 <comradeblin[m]> get_transfer_by_txid
10:05:50 <comradeblin[m]> are methods that both have a "timestamp" you could parse the json if you really want to do it locally
10:33:57 <ofrnxmr[m]> Did you RTFM for me 💚
10:58:08 <susman1[m]> <comradeblin[m]> "Thats BS, that is what monero is..." <- but a given address would have a name tied to it
10:58:36 <naphtha[m]> right
10:58:44 <naphtha[m]> thats why subadresses were invented
11:03:07 <susman1[m]> is that not a massive problem?
11:10:04 <comradeblin[m]> no, it is not
11:10:17 <comradeblin[m]> thats why we use subaddresses
11:10:32 <susman1[m]> yeah but there is a finite amount of them too
11:10:35 <comradeblin[m]> I give you this: 877ftCd5oUmj7V2f52SFvWiThjn3o651k8gjwV1mjNQxitHmZSU9K3XXVLtKMNp6XcXpvGAo7KTxPdQjZ6B1qoPBBJu5ZZs
11:10:41 <comradeblin[m]> and I receive the amount on this:
11:10:46 <comradeblin[m]> 49U61eTsG45T7pppUQECocERLuPQgcQg6KsFizfxMJmyKcwjUWSuS1CFHNVjgEduGv9XqD2dyPidjKVRNrxyCTCE39JM4Fo
11:11:01 <comradeblin[m]> nobody is gonna know my address starting with 49U
11:11:11 <comradeblin[m]> just the 877ft.
11:11:23 <comradeblin[m]> I am not traceable that way, as you can generate unlimited subaddresses
11:11:38 <comradeblin[m]> like this:
11:11:38 <comradeblin[m]> 8BGYee6BrfB4ZuSf5Rg4TFdEfoQ54kE4jhWVyrgP6HGhjom8txnwxspGS1DmCio1P4LJWJgxQiG4PDW2TekpUwGK6EXXwvt
11:11:38 <comradeblin[m]> and this:
11:11:38 <comradeblin[m]> 858TW2UixGFTm7xSkgXVyG4SgtgxQ6UYXfpXxiLZaPo7NueUfRRjPNB262LSBKeUQCN5P1gkdc9mAE4BrEfdYNth3og1DFB
11:12:14 <comradeblin[m]> all of them will direct the sent xmr to my 49U61 address
11:12:55 <comradeblin[m]> and if you are talking about the receiver site, it is really hard to determine the real transaction, the receiver wont know who sent the money
11:17:06 <merope> <comradeblin[m]> "nobody is gonna know my address..." <- Except now you told us 🤣
11:18:47 <merope> <susman1[m]> "yeah but there is a finite..." <- Given that we have just shy of 2^256 private keys to choose from, I'd say we don't need to worry about it anytime soon
11:19:00 <merope> Where soon = the heat death of the universe
11:19:41 <merope> And don't forget that Monero addresses don't show up on the chain
11:19:46 <susman1[m]> merope: how do you know the rate will stay the same
11:20:54 <merope> Because 2^256 ~= 10^77. That's almost as many as the number of atoms in the universe (~10^80). Do the math
11:21:37 <merope> The only way to break that would require breaking the cryptographic protocol itself
11:21:49 <sech1> as soon as numbers get more than 10 digits, people lose sense of scale
11:22:30 <merope> Yup
12:34:48 <k4r4b3y[m]> is there an onion instance of xmrchain.net ?
12:42:56 <k4r4b3y[m]> ok, found it here: https://github.com/moneroexamples/onion-monero-blockchain-explorer
12:45:03 <k4r4b3y[m]> however, the listed onion URL is unreachable
12:53:08 <susman1[m]> <merope> "Because 2^256 ~= 10^77. That's..." <- not enough what if the entire world is using it lol
12:53:47 <merope> you're acting very sus, man :)
12:54:35 <susman1[m]> merope: just sayin
12:54:48 <merope> 1) open calculator
12:54:49 <merope> 2) divide the two numbers
12:54:49 <merope> 3) figure out if the result is big enough
12:54:59 <merope> can't help you with much else
12:55:01 <susman1[m]> 8bn ppl doing multiple transactions a day will def cause that number to seem not as much
12:55:41 <merope> (also, addresses can be reused just fine)
12:55:49 <comradeblin[m]> Yea
12:56:08 <susman1[m]> merope: no they can't they will be recorded
12:56:29 <merope> <merope> "And don't forget that Monero..." <- ^
12:56:31 <sech1> k4r4b3y[m] try p2pool.io/explorer - it has onion link, tor browser will pick it up
12:56:37 <merope> acting sus part 2
12:58:22 <k4r4b3y[m]> sech1: > <@sech1:libera.chat> k4r4b3y try p2pool.io/explorer - it has onion link, tor browser will pick it up
12:58:23 <k4r4b3y[m]> thanks
12:58:27 <sech1> Even if 100bn people do 1000000 tx/second each, 10^77 is many many orders of magnitude larger
12:58:35 <susman1[m]> susman1[m]: like it will show up in the company's db that x addy was used for this purchase
13:10:19 <merope> <susman1[m]> "like it will show up in the..." <- The receiver doesn't know the sender's address. Try again
13:19:51 <comradeblin[m]> He is trying really hard lmao
13:24:43 <sech1> very sus
13:34:39 <dudeitwasntme> Thanks
13:35:27 <dudeitwasntme> I cant see how I pass the wallet address I am interested in to get_transfers, or am I meant to just grab everything and parse it locally?
14:12:35 <susman1[m]> <comradeblin[m]> "He is trying really hard lmao" <- you can't fucking re use addresses doe
14:13:03 <naphtha[m]> susman1[m]: you can, THOUGH
14:13:09 <naphtha[m]> unless you're receiving on that addreses
14:13:12 <naphtha[m]> s/addreses/address/
14:13:42 <sech1> there are 10^77 possible addresses, try to use all of them, lol
14:13:49 <sech1> but learn math first
14:14:01 <susman1[m]> sech1: not sustainable
14:14:16 <sech1> learn math
14:14:21 <sech1> or it's just words until you can prove it
14:14:24 <susman1[m]> CBDCs = ultimate opsex
14:15:12 <dudeitwasntme> get_address_index returns major and minor... is it these values that I pass to get_transfers as account_index and subaddr_indices parameters?
14:39:59 <SNeedlewoods> hey SerHack, first I want to say thanks for Mastering Monero
14:40:48 <SNeedlewoods> may I ask in which state the second edition is in right now? I hope it's not discontinued, because I think an updated version would be great for new users
14:48:32 <k4r4b3y[m]> Eager to learn about that too
16:37:56 <plowsof11> +1 to remove susman 
16:43:04 <comradeblin[m]> +1 to remove susman
16:46:29 <luks2[m]> what is susman
16:47:05 <comradeblin[m]> a  man in this group, who is really sus
16:47:09 <comradeblin[m]> and is also called susman
16:47:49 <plowsof11> Highlights include "monero mining is bad for the environment" in the markets room
16:48:12 <luks2[m]> plowsof11: is that factually incorrect?
16:48:54 <luks2[m]> can i get an invite to the markets room?
16:52:33 <plowsof11> A CPU that is powered on is doing damage to the environment if you want to be pedantic. But RandomX uses CPU's , general purpose hardware instead of an ASIC (which become waste when theye not profitable, a cpu can be used to stream videos of cats being cute instead)
16:59:48 <ceetee[m]> Monero Markets 
17:02:18 <ceetee[m]> consumerist culture fueled by a targeted exponential inflation rate of >2% is also really bad for the environment
17:51:51 <suitslie[m]> <ceetee[m]> "consumerist culture fueled by..." <- agreed
17:51:58 <merope> <luks2[m]> "is that factually incorrect?" <- If you want to get technical about it, yes. It's not the cpu being powered on by itself, it's the energy source. If renewable sources are used, then there's no pollution caused by it
17:51:59 <suitslie[m]> so many people shouldn't own cars
17:52:59 <luks2[m]> cities shouldnt be built to make people who dont want to use cars at a disadvantage
17:53:02 <merope> (and yes, I'm aware that producing the infrastructure and components and materials required for the energy production does generate some pollution, but it's still way less than that caused by sources such as coal, for example)
19:36:59 <DanrdarkIsnotthe> Is cake ios release only in certain countries? Haven’t seen the latest come up.
21:21:29 <Popcorn[m]> What non custodial exchange does everybody prefer?  I'm having trouble with agoradesk because the cash by mail people require trusted buyers and the online payment people do kyc and I am not giving my info to a stranger with no legal protections
21:44:06 <ofrnxmr[m]> "trusted buyer" is what?
21:44:16 <ofrnxmr[m]> To me, its a repeat trader.
21:44:21 <Popcorn[m]> Yeah
21:44:27 <Popcorn[m]> You have to repeat trade
21:44:38 <Popcorn[m]> But nobody is willing to accept non repeat trades
21:44:40 <ofrnxmr[m]> I wont deal with you first time in large amounts etc.
21:44:44 <Popcorn[m]> So its impossible to get started
21:45:04 <ofrnxmr[m]> Blame scammers
21:45:25 <ofrnxmr[m]> Either you prove youre not a pos, or you go elsewhere
21:45:26 <naphtha[m]> what payment method are you trying to use?
21:45:31 <naphtha[m]> for online payment
21:45:39 <Popcorn[m]> ofrnxmr[m]: How can I prove that
21:45:52 <Popcorn[m]> If nobody will trade with somebody who has no history
21:46:05 <Popcorn[m]> naphtha[m]: Zelle/cashapp/wire
21:46:29 <ofrnxmr[m]> Basically i dont require kyc. I just require trade #2 details match trade #1. Same name on transfer, same return address or handwritibg on envelope etc
21:46:33 <naphtha[m]> youre being asked for kyc for cashapp? im not american but ive heard its very hard to chargeback with cashapp
21:46:34 * litty[m] uploaded an image: (119KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/EYnjYtxdpOvAqNAphQqKGkmz/IMG-20230620-WA0103.jpg >
21:46:39 <naphtha[m]> if not impossible
21:46:53 <ofrnxmr[m]> naphtha[m]: Yeah
21:46:56 <naphtha[m]> generally if you use payment methods that cant be reversed you wont be asked for kyc
21:47:00 <litty[m]> ❕ EVERYTHING U WANT IS CLOSER THAN U THINK... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/da0e14cd0a77f46c15650516017df77cb500983a>)
21:47:05 <ofrnxmr[m]> Alex | LocalMonero | AgoraDesk:
21:47:07 <naphtha[m]> sigh
21:47:32 <ofrnxmr[m]> Yo litty. #XMRorDIE
21:48:23 <litty[m]> ofrnxmr[m]: Xmr is acceptable too buddy 
21:48:37 <ofrnxmr[m]> Bnb n trc
21:48:55 <ofrnxmr[m]> Jump off a bridge, shitcoiner
21:49:25 <naphtha[m]> litty[m]: > <@litty:matrix.org> ❕ EVERYTHING U WANT IS CLOSER THAN U THINK... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/22b088a080dfbd776a2f8d9dc09a492d0de31d32>)
21:49:25 <ofrnxmr[m]> "too". 
21:49:26 <ofrnxmr[m]> no. Xmr us the only option
21:49:36 <ofrnxmr[m]> You scammers are trash 🚮
21:52:08 <naphtha[m]> im coolin wit my youngins... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/0f423bcaf27a36bd0616aea0d9a7c23551520e56>)
21:54:28 <Popcorn[m]> So
21:54:36 <Popcorn[m]> Does anybody have other platform recommendations
21:54:38 <Popcorn[m]> Or.....
21:55:10 <naphtha[m]> ive never bought xmr only sold but i heard the easiest way really is to just use a kyc exchange to buy ltc or btc or whatever
21:55:21 <naphtha[m]> and exchange that for xmr
21:57:03 <Popcorn[m]> naphtha[m]: How do you acquire?
21:57:39 <Popcorn[m]> naphtha[m]: You know of an easy non custodial btc ex?
21:58:41 <naphtha[m]> Popcorn[m]: trocador (?)
22:01:01 <Popcorn[m]> naphtha[m]: Doesn't accept fiat
22:02:23 <naphtha[m]> oh you mean from fiat
22:02:26 <naphtha[m]> no not really
22:02:32 <naphtha[m]> thats why i said to use an exchange that does kyc
22:05:09 <Popcorn[m]> naphtha[m]: But which kyc exchanges are non custodial
22:05:19 <Popcorn[m]> I dont like kyc but I will do it if I have to
22:05:27 <Popcorn[m]> Point is I need it to be non custodial
22:05:48 <Popcorn[m]> And I can't find one, which was the whole purpose of my first qurstion
22:06:03 <Jonah[m]1> ngl i want to buy me some xmr but no one sells it in my area for fiat
22:07:44 <Popcorn[m]> So I'll ask again, does anybody know of a non custodial centralized exchange?
22:10:25 <naphtha[m]> tbh i dont think there is one
22:10:36 <naphtha[m]> all non custodial exchanges i know of are crypto to crypto only
22:11:47 <RavFX[m]> Localmonero (if you're location allow)
22:12:16 <naphtha[m]> he was just saying earlier that localmonero traders ask him for kyc
22:12:18 <naphtha[m]> which is strange
22:12:24 <Popcorn[m]> RavFX[m]: Not centralized
22:13:01 <RavFX[m]> Popcorn[m]: most exchanges are not
22:13:01 <RavFX[m]> But you could use basic swap or maybe some atomic stuff
22:13:07 <naphtha[m]> but i remember seeing some traders that ask for kyc through a platform
22:13:11 <naphtha[m]> not directly to them
22:13:24 <naphtha[m]> so you trust the platform with your docuuments instead of the trader which is better i guess
22:13:32 <RavFX[m]> Usually it's for unsafe methods
22:13:37 <RavFX[m]> like scampal
22:13:51 <RavFX[m]> seller have to KYC to filter some of the scammers
22:14:33 <naphtha[m]> depending on how much you're trying to exchange you could set up an ad
22:14:35 <naphtha[m]> on localmonero
22:15:32 <Popcorn[m]> RavFX[m]: > <@gfdshygti53:monero.social> most exchanges are not
22:15:32 <Popcorn[m]> > But you could use basic swap or maybe some atomic stuff
22:15:32 <Popcorn[m]> Not fiat
22:15:43 <RavFX[m]> Can make a lot of money doing maker too indeed. Depending of your location
22:16:26 <RavFX[m]> Popcorn[m]: Yeah, for that there is only Bisk and soon:tm: Haveno afaik
22:18:47 <suitslie[m]> what if instead of a bitcoin ATM, a monero swapper
22:18:54 <suitslie[m]> basically two machines, as an example, in a city
22:19:03 <suitslie[m]> or probably more
22:19:15 <RavFX[m]> suitslie[m]: Nice target, but would be nice.
22:19:20 <RavFX[m]> more options
22:19:22 <suitslie[m]> and then you go two, other person goes to other, and escrowed exchange
22:19:59 <RavFX[m]> have to setup some contracts things online to plan the meetup
22:20:29 <suitslie[m]> or is some deaddrop method mathematically feasibly secure?
22:20:43 <RavFX[m]> at that point just make it so the buyer give you a code, then as the seller, you go to said monero atm to get the money 
22:20:45 <suitslie[m]> the problem is received that damn cash in hand
22:21:15 <suitslie[m]> s/received/receiving/
22:21:27 <RavFX[m]> Can't really do at the place on where the state is hostile.
22:22:17 <suitslie[m]> yeah also i guess all should be considered hostile... in that certain sense
22:23:54 <suitslie[m]> maybe there is some three person method where the third person is incentivizied via fee
22:24:36 <RavFX[m]> suitslie[m]: You also need to have enough volume to motivate the players at that point.
22:24:46 <suitslie[m]> how was that one arabic thing
22:25:06 <suitslie[m]> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawala
22:25:27 <RavFX[m]> But we have internet, and people are lazy
22:25:59 <RavFX[m]> Just don't use the fiats, would be the best way :)
22:26:13 <RavFX[m]> but look like the mass is still not ready
22:26:20 <suitslie[m]> agreed 👍
22:26:37 <suitslie[m]> mass won't be ready till life fucks them
22:26:53 <suitslie[m]> then they'll see its not about winning its about not getting fucked
22:27:06 <naphtha[m]> monero island when?
22:27:10 <naphtha[m]> something like epstein's island
22:27:12 <naphtha[m]> but based
22:27:15 <suitslie[m]> wait for global warming
22:27:16 <suitslie[m]> slowly
22:27:26 <naphtha[m]> 2 more weeks
22:27:35 <naphtha[m]> trust me guys global warming will destroy earth
22:27:36 <suitslie[m]> i heard the center of the earth has a giant monero logo
22:27:51 <suitslie[m]> earth core is actually a bitcoin miner
22:27:59 <naphtha[m]> sad!
22:28:28 <monerobull[m]> I don't get global warming denialists. Now i don't keep records but it feels like summer is always pretty hot
22:29:11 <suitslie[m]> yes me neither
22:29:29 <RavFX[m]> monerobull[m]: We just get the warmest decade in record, every decades
22:29:29 <RavFX[m]> I like beating records!
22:29:29 <monerobull[m]> naphtha[m]: >implying that Epstein island wasn- never mind
22:30:07 <suitslie[m]> increased avg temperatures correlate with mating activity ;)
22:30:11 <suitslie[m]> positively
22:30:21 <monerobull[m]> RavFX[m]: > <@gfdshygti53:monero.social> We just get the warmest decade in record, every decades
22:30:21 <monerobull[m]> > I like beating records!
22:30:21 <monerobull[m]> It's a sign of progress if you have the heatwave of the century every year
22:30:39 <monerobull[m]> Efficiency gains
22:32:39 <RavFX[m]> The problem with climate change is that people try to take advantage of it. (Like in anything)
22:32:51 <RavFX[m]> s/anything/everything/
22:34:03 <RavFX[m]> There deniers who think that "people" created it to take advantage of it
22:34:03 <RavFX[m]> And there people who know that it's real but that people still want to take advantage of it.
22:34:13 <naphtha[m]> the problem is that people rave on about retarded shit that they will NEVER be able to change
22:34:23 <naphtha[m]> i say it's a coping mechanism to run from their own personal problems
22:34:32 <monerobull[m]> True
22:34:38 <monerobull[m]> Germany is 2% of global emissions
22:35:07 <monerobull[m]> Why the FUCK do i have to use the trash ass paper straw
22:35:08 <RavFX[m]> monerobull[m]: does Germany still buy cold electricity from other countries.
22:35:12 <RavFX[m]> coal*
22:35:24 <naphtha[m]> paper straws are BASED though
22:35:28 <naphtha[m]> avoiding plastic in general is
22:35:33 <monerobull[m]> naphtha[m]: FUCK YOU
22:35:36 <naphtha[m]> not because of muh global warming
22:35:41 <monerobull[m]> Paper straws are add
22:35:46 <naphtha[m]> but because plastic is shit in general
22:35:46 <monerobull[m]> s/add/ass/
22:35:58 <RavFX[m]> If I remember, USA and Canada are the worst offender (par prorata)
22:36:08 <naphtha[m]> monerobull[m]: depends which ones you get
22:36:12 <naphtha[m]> get some thick ones
22:36:27 <RavFX[m]> Yet they complain about china 😂
22:36:31 <monerobull[m]> Sure plastic is shit but the point in a drink in plastic with a paper straw wrapped in plastic is obviously just pandering 
22:36:44 <naphtha[m]> maybe
22:36:45 <naphtha[m]> still
22:36:50 <naphtha[m]> plastic is le cringe
22:36:50 <RavFX[m]> Whole having exported most of there production there...
22:36:50 <RavFX[m]> And still be the worst par prorata
22:36:56 <naphtha[m]> and i avoid touching it whenever i can
22:37:11 <monerobull[m]> RavFX[m]: China manufacturing is le based
22:37:31 <RavFX[m]> There is many type of plastic too, a LOT. Some or worst than other.
22:37:59 <naphtha[m]> RavFX[m]: true
22:38:04 <monerobull[m]> I needed rubber bands for stickers. On Amazon 200 are EIGHT EUROS. on a Chinese website it's 1.5€ 
22:38:09 <RavFX[m]> China get more efficient too.
22:38:09 <RavFX[m]> Order 3-4 things on aliexpress... see how sometime they all endup on the same package before leaving china
22:38:17 <monerobull[m]> And they SHIPPED WITHIN A WEEK straight from china
22:38:49 <naphtha[m]> fun fact china has free shipping because first world countries pay for it
22:38:51 <RavFX[m]> monerobull[m]: And some countries receive there aliexpress stuff, after aobut 2 weeks...
22:39:01 <naphtha[m]> since they call themselves a developing nation
22:39:08 <monerobull[m]> RavFX[m]: That's what I said
22:39:31 <naphtha[m]> so when you buy something from aliexpress or whatever with free shipping its not really free you paid for it with taxes
22:39:39 <naphtha[m]> hypothetically
22:39:46 <naphtha[m]> if you had any taxable income
22:39:48 <monerobull[m]> I got rubber bands from china in the same time from China and 7 times cheaper than from Amazon and i have a Amazon distribution center within a 5 minute drive
22:41:07 <monerobull[m]> Now i wouldn't buy electronics from china
22:41:08 <monerobull[m]> But something like rubber bands? There's nothing that can go wrong 
22:41:16 <RavFX[m]> Ordering from china is often cheaper than walking then getting it lol
22:41:36 <RavFX[m]> monerobull[m]: Why is that?
22:42:29 <monerobull[m]> Too much fakery? If you buy a 1 TB SD card from temur.com it will most likely be 64gb and delete any data above 64 gb
22:42:46 <RavFX[m]> Ah yeah, use you're brain lol.
22:42:46 <RavFX[m]> There is good electronics and fake stuff
22:43:05 <monerobull[m]> Can't do much fakery on rubber bands outside from straight up shipping the wrong product
22:44:55 <monerobull[m]> Oh it's temu.com
22:45:14 <monerobull[m]> I can vouch for their rubber bands 😂
22:54:04 <DanrdarkIsnotthe> I use random usbs on the ground ;) stuxnet !!
23:00:35 <monerobull[m]> They don't even need that anymore
23:01:02 <monerobull[m]> They just exfiltrate your cryptographic keys based on your powerbill