00:05:42 "This man just went full statecoi..." <- Lmaowhat? 00:05:45 JUST?! 00:05:59 welcome to 2016/17? 00:06:44 Go search at fluffypony's twitter for vitalik, or vitalik for fluffypony. Vitalik has been a scammer since he printed eth 00:07:06 The messiah 00:07:28 puppet dictator vitalik 00:07:58 does anyone believe that miners agreed to the move to POS 00:57:47 ofrnxmr[m]: but vital guy is a genius, they said so 00:59:46 Cuz hes skinny 00:59:50 he is just trying to donate all the ETH to the goverment, his genoristy knows no bounds 00:59:55 His head looks big 01:00:10 nums[m]: Shiba ftw 01:00:24 Billions laundered to india 01:00:32 No wuestions asked 01:00:58 Hugescamatarian 01:02:07 100% premine 01:02:12 s/genoristy/generosity/ 01:02:24 The OG 01:03:26 First they make it extremely expensive to use 01:03:26 They they scam the miners :D 01:03:26 And people still transact stablecoins on that thing... 01:03:27 Eth being "good" is a joke. 01:03:27 the original idea, some software built on it,sure. 01:03:27 the foundation - eth - is questionable, at best 01:04:30 Even dai is is partially backed by eth and stables. The whole chain is half assed 01:04:45 ..on purpose 01:04:56 Eth had potential 01:05:23 Greed say "fk that, lets get rich quik" 01:06:27 TRX is fine for stables. 01:06:27 Work see better, faster, and at a fraction of the cost... 01:06:27 Yet people still use ETH... 01:06:27 It's like the same problem as BTC 01:07:09 100% premine, deflayionaty, pumped to 30k to run a node/validator 01:07:26 Talk about "were all just consumers now" 01:08:42 what about binance smart chain? are the funds safu? 01:11:28 spirobel[m]: If you are using it for stable you waste money in fees 01:11:46 Shitty systems can have strong network effects. Look at dollar. 01:11:56 Eth securities when 01:12:11 Yeah, the network effect help a lot. 01:12:11 also that they where the #first in the category 01:12:33 first does not mean better but they stick mostly to that 01:12:43 We don't even know what append to Satoshi 01:12:59 They continue absorbing all their competitors in the same cateogry. Network effects just continue growing 01:13:19 What if he only consider that as pension fund for himself in 30 years :D 01:13:34 The same applies to Monero is you consider "privacy" a category. Every competitor privacy chain eventually will lose all their users to Monero. 01:13:44 and using already a ton he probably mined with other systems 01:14:15 At least Monero do it better and better 01:14:42 Where all satoshi  01:14:51 Unless your craig wrong 01:14:52 BTC and ETH network, mostly, get less usable with time and usage (With ETH that will eventually improve, wait and see) 01:15:46 Monero will only be more network/storage intensive... But in the same time storage is cheap so 01:16:35 I only see 3 categories. Dumb Chains, Smart Chains and Private Chains. 01:16:43 It's a winner take all for each category 01:16:43 #first don't mean it have to be the best, bit it can be the best 01:18:06 If bitcoin did stick to plan, it would have been more usable for sure 01:20:42 does anyone have experience with P2Pool/ I am mostly wondering if there are currently enough participants to make it an attractive option. 01:20:55 s///?/ 01:21:04 "They continue absorbing all..." <- Competitors? Rof 01:21:13 "The same applies to Monero is..." <- I dont 01:21:55 Private chains = cryptoCURRENCY 01:22:20 The rest are just pet rocks and pryamid schemes 01:22:39 I don't disagree naturally. I just point out what most of the world sees. 01:22:51 nums[m]: That metric makes no sense 01:23:06 louissignet[m]: I dont care what pplwatch on tv 01:23:12 I dont have tv 01:23:15 ofrnxmr[m]: ah? 01:23:29 It's an observation of the market. Can't deny reality with numbers. 01:23:32 nums[m]: Enough participants 01:23:42 louissignet[m]: Yee you can 01:23:49 Its cslled 100x futures 01:23:56 100% premine 01:24:11 Staking / no circulating supply 01:24:17 = fake numbers 01:24:44 Monero no cex = no 100x futures 01:24:56 No pos = no artificial supplysqueeze 01:24:57 ofrnxmr[m]: I must have misunderstood how it works I will research it properly tomorrow 01:25:38 Its more about your personal hashrate 01:26:01 And whether to mine on mini or main 01:28:08 Ideally you just want the pool to find blocks regularly within thepplns widows, so that you can get paid for all of your shares 01:28:44 ofrnxmr[m]: My assumption was that if my hash rate is very low and I am the only one in the pool the chance that there will be a payout at some point is close to zero. But with more participants I would see at least some returns? 01:29:00 and to have enough hr to get a large enough % of the block 01:29:20 nums[m]: Mini and main find more than enough blocks 01:29:47 Thats long not been a concern. 01:29:48 if you spin up a custom p2pool pool, youll be alone 01:30:09 p2pool.observer 01:30:22 * https://p2pool.observer 01:31:27 ofrnxmr[m]: > <@ofrnxmr:monero.social> Thats long not been a concern. 01:31:27 > if you spin up a custom p2pool pool, youll be alone 01:31:27 great that's more encouraging than I had expected 01:32:38 https://mini.p2pool.observer/ 01:33:07 You can see blocks mined, miners etc at these links 06:27:20 "If you are using it for stable..." <- so TRX is cheaper in transaction fees than binance smart chain? 07:34:27 .network 07:37:50 "My assumption was that if my..." <- If you are the only miner in a pool, then you are effectively mining solo. The average income over time is always the same, but solo mining has the greatest variance (ie "all or nothing", with long intervals of nothing and one big payout at some point) 07:39:59 big payout is 0.6 XMR, or $100 right now 07:40:55 it depends on hashrate. If someone has rigs that total around $2-3/day, it's not so impossible to mine solo and wait 30-50 days on average for a block 07:41:18 My rule of thumb for a "bare minimum" solo miner is to find at least 2 blocks/month on average - which currently requires ~250 kH/s. Both existing p2pools have way more than that 07:41:49 price, network hashrate and block reward have been stable for more than a year now, so variance can average out 07:43:44 yeah, I still wouldn't mine solo even with 250 kh/s. P2Pool is much better at providing stable payouts. 07:43:59 but some people like solo for it being a "lottery" 08:55:11 What is a good HDD speed for syncing the Monero blockchain locally? 08:59:10 HDDs are trash because of their terrible random IO performance 08:59:14 I have a 24-hdd array in 4vdev raidz2, and i have very high read speeds but not very high write speeds 08:59:25 As far as I know people more or less gave up on HDD for syncing Monero from scratch: It's slow anyway, whatever HDD you may have 08:59:32 the shittiest SSD will outperform the best HDD 08:59:52 rbrunner: I have the blockchain on an ssd for a personal computer 09:00:05 I was thinking of putting it on my servers so I could run a Monero node publicly instead of privately 09:00:26 A 1TB m.2 SSD is regularly available for 40€ these days 09:00:27 If I copy it there, would it be able to keep up adequately? 09:00:40 If you can copy it over, no problem then, because even slow HDDs will be fast enough to stay in sync and just take in new blocks 09:00:53 I willing to buy a 500gb used SAS ssd 09:01:06 rbrunner: Oh, ok, great. It's just the initial sync which is the problem? 09:01:24 if you want to offer it publically as as a service, using HDDs is still a bad idea 09:01:25 Define "problem". If you can wait a few days, it's not :) 09:01:36 more like a week to sync on HDD 09:01:44 Believe me, I tried 09:02:03 raid doesn't help, because it's limited by random access time 09:02:16 Oh 09:02:32 15k RPM SAS drives will be faster, but any SSD will be much much faster 09:02:41 recanman[m]: I will probably buy one on ebay, just not sure where to place it 😅 09:02:50 sech1: mine are 10k 12tb sas 09:02:55 > <@sech1:libera.chat> 15k RPM SAS drives will be faster, but any SSD will be much much faster 09:02:55 * Mine are 10k 12tb sas, not sure if that helps 09:03:22 just sync on any ssd, even on your laptop and then copy it over to your raid array 09:03:25 Isn't SAS supposed to be better at random access, or is that something I don't remember correctly? 09:03:27 it will be faster 09:03:46 Will I have to do that multiple times or just once? 09:04:00 just once, after that you can run it on HDD 09:04:04 it will keep up just fine 09:04:05 I'd rather just sync it from the network/my node, then leave it running publicly 09:04:13 but it will still be very bad to sync wallets from 09:04:15 sech1: Great, thanks. If it doesn't work I'll buy an SSD. 09:04:16 I tried that too 09:04:28 in the end, I just stopped running a node on HDD 09:04:35 I might be back home in another few months, if so, then I will try this 09:04:37 because it can keep up, but is otherwise unusable 09:04:50 even single wallet syncing makes the server grind to a halt 09:04:54 and syncing is very slow 09:05:16 The Monero official wallet software (cli/gui) use uPnP to open the port, right? 09:05:26 Maybe that changed now with bigger blocks and bigger rings. A few years ago that used to work reasonably ... 09:06:42 Something like this will work? https://www.ebay.com/itm/274757828187 09:07:32 the main thing you need is random read iops 09:08:23 I don't know too much about benchmarking storage mediums 09:08:38 recanman[m]: I assume something like this will work, its 12gbps and it is an ssd 09:08:48 just look at the spec sheet, bigger number go brrr 09:08:52 >the shittiest SSD will outperform the best HDD 09:09:00 Ok, thanks 09:09:59 Spec sheet says: 09:09:59 • 1100MB/s / 700MB/s sequential R/W 09:09:59 • 130K / 30K IOPS random R/W 09:09:59 • 50K IOPS on 70/30 mix R/W 09:13:45 Syncing requires mostly random reads 09:45:13 yes that would work. If you have an m.2 slot, the evo 970 plus would be a better deal though: https://www.amazon.com//dp/B07MBQPQ62/... (full message at ) 09:46:49 i have one of those as my main drives 09:46:58 was like 120€ back then 09:47:05 s/then/when i got it/ 10:22:57 How will i have redundancy now without raid!  10:25:51 a blockchain is a raid 0 with 10000+ copies 10:26:15 s/0/1/ 10:26:19 But i want 110% node uptime 10:56:45 "was like 120€ back then" <- I also got one for around 100 usd three years ago 10:56:55 "yes that would work. If you have..." <- > <@ctrej:matrix.org> yes that would work. If you have an m.2 slot, the evo 970 plus would be a better deal though: https://www.amazon.com//dp/B07MBQPQ62/... (full message at ) 10:57:29 There are PCIe slots 10:58:15 Doesn't seem that there is M.2 unfortunately 11:01:11 You could get an adapter like this: https://www.amazon.com//dp/B0BRV8FWMB/ 11:01:14 should work out of the box, but I never used one 11:01:42 M.2 slots (m key, those for nvme ssds) use 4 PCIe lanes 11:02:20 Tbh I would rather buy another NetApp DS4246 and then just buy a large lot of used SAS ssds, put them in there on zfs 11:02:36 * on zfs, then daisy chain it to the other ds4246 11:02:49 I'm beginning to run out of storage anyway 11:02:53 I may be off topic 11:03:00 * off topic, but I just like storage 11:03:39 I'm not familiar with server hardware, I just know good bang per buck in the consumer space 11:04:23 I've never bought SSDs other than the one that I have, but used enterprise server hardware is usually much cheaper 11:05:08 I got 12x3tb for $180, and they had low hours + passed smart tests. Been running them for two years, they are very nice. 11:05:08 Albeit I won a bit at the last second, so it isn't really a good benchmark. 11:05:16 s/smart/all/ 11:05:24 s/smart/all/, s/bit/bid/ 11:05:45 I just like servers, a lot. I like to talk about them. 13:34:27 "so TRX is cheaper in transaction..." <- When stablecoins are involved, TRX seam to be the best choice yes. 14:59:31 Monero.town down?. Tried to signup, now get "502 Bad Gateway" 15:02:30 yeah i get the same message 15:02:34 lemmy process probably crashed 15:03:29 anyone here on mastodon/oma/key/etc? i want to follow more people 15:03:39 s////_\/, s////_\/ 15:03:46 how tf do you bypass formatting 15:03:57 s////_**/, s//key//**_key/ 15:04:06 s////****/, s////****/ 15:04:34 s////∗/, s////∗/ 15:04:42 aha 15:05:16 You should see how this orgy of corrections look on IRC ... 15:05:51 lmao i forgot irc doesnt have editing 15:05:52 sorry 15:15:36 Monero.town is back again, just signed up. 15:33:36 naphtha: You can follow me on the fediverse at https://pleroma.rucknium.me/Rucknium 15:45:12 "naphtha: You can follow me on..." <- followed 👍️ 16:29:18 hi 16:30:11 how  monero mining is connected with cpu core 16:30:47 for example 80 intel xeon cores gives 0.05 monero daily 16:46:01 That's a lot! 16:46:52 I usually got 50 cents worth of xmr with my Ryzen 5800 and another cheaper ryzen 16:46:53 0.0596219 16:47:02 in one month 16:47:13 e7-4870 16:47:16 4 16:47:47 p2pool 16:47:54 no solo 16:48:14 https://xmrig.com/benchmark/6Djs48 16:49:17 is 64 gb i have 426 16:50:27 ah here is the full overview https://xmrig.com/benchmark?cpu=Intel%28R%29+Xeon%28R%29+CPU+E7-+4870+%40+2.40GHz&bench_id=6MBRai i believe 16:51:14 a price/hashrate ratio for that site would be nice 16:52:15 how much hashrate do you have Guest14 ? 16:57:19 10000 16:58:17 "a price/hashrate ratio for..." <- what price do you consider? launch? msrp? current retail? used? from which vendor/source? 16:58:30 Guest14: KHs? 16:58:40 ebay 16:58:43 used 16:58:55 merope: if i were to code it i would scrape marketplaces such as ebay/whatever 17:00:45 Guest14: 10000 isnt of much help, is it hashes per second, kilo hashes, mega hashes? 17:01:00 h/s 17:02:20 10000 H/s => 0.001934 XMR/day, 0.319 $/day 17:02:24 right now 17:03:02 (before electricity) 17:03:04 how u did that 17:03:45 there are mining profit calculators 17:03:58 some good link 17:04:58 https://www.nicehash.com/profitability-calculator?time=1688749476791 17:05:19 https://www.cryptocompare.com/mining/calculator/xmr?HashingPower=10000&HashingUnit=H%2Fs&PowerConsumption=200&CostPerkWh=0.1&MiningPoolFee=0 17:05:19 actually, thats a bad one 19:59:59 This might be interesting: https://ploum.net/2023-06-23-how-to-kill-decentralised-networks.html 20:09:55 title is misleading 20:10:22 youre not "killing" decentralised networks by adopting them and then leaving them 20:13:03 xmpp is still popular with the userbase that was actually interested in using it in the first place, so is samba, so is....uhh...everything else? 20:14:10 I think people would rather not federate with meta because it's lotsa cancer there 20:14:47 i dont like this victim mentality in the open source community 20:14:59 Siren[m]: i cant even federate with threads 20:15:03 i dont know how to 20:15:30 Being in Threads is Proof-Of-NPC 20:16:40 i cant even access the site now that i try lol 20:16:50 its just a redirect loop 20:16:59 big corpos really build the most dogshit software 20:17:32 https://www.threads.net/accounts/login/?next=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.threads.net%2Faccounts%2Flogin%2F%3Fnext%3Dhttps%253A%252F%252Fwww.threads.net%252Faccounts%252Flogin%252F%253Fnext%253Dhttps%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.threads.net%25252Faccounts%25252Flogin%25252F%25253Fnext%25253Dhttps%2525253A%2525252F%2525252Fwww.threads.net%2525252Faccounts%2525252Flogin%2525252F%25252 20:17:32 Facts 20:17:59 trimmed the url so its not a wall of text but it goes on like this forever 20:18:07 until the browser stops it 20:18:37 somehow, the only good software fagman ever makes is open source 20:18:51 facebook with react, microsoft with typescript 20:19:08 Who is fagman? 20:19:26 facebook, apple, google, microsoft, amazon, netflix 20:19:34 kek 20:19:51 I'm happy to say that I do not use any of those. 20:20:08 I block all of those and much more, but many sites break for me. 20:20:15 i use instagram to talk with my normie friends 20:20:23 but thats pretty much it 20:20:25 Isn't a problem for me, I don't have JS on lol 20:20:35 * on lol. Sites that load things from 'fagman' often use JS. 20:21:02 most sites with good ux use js tbh 20:21:08 its really hard to build a good experience without js 20:21:20 recanman[m]: If I really need it, I enable LibreJS, but nothing else. 20:21:30 Usually the site still breaks 😅 20:21:52 I would be fine with js as long as it is not used to identify anyone. 20:21:59 * fine with client-side js as 20:21:59 what i would like is an extension that allows you to audit every script before it's loaded and whitelist the hash of the script 20:22:03 For effects and whatnot 20:22:29 naphtha[m]: That wouldn't be too hard to make. What about minified JS files? 20:24:35 naphtha[m]: with a rudimentary analysis of what features the script uses that could be bad for privacy and security, such as eval, accessing the screen size, available fonts, etc. if i were to make this i would start with creepjs since it's open source and very good at fingerprinting, see what features it uses 20:24:41 recanman[m]: wouldnt be an issue 20:24:56 naphtha[m]: LibreJS does this. 20:25:19 unless you mean obfuscated in which case you would need a more complex dynamic analysis during runtime 20:25:28 recanman[m]: really? i thought it just checked the license 20:25:29 naphtha[m]: Also that 20:25:30 I mean webpack 20:25:34 * I mean initially webpack 20:25:48 naphtha[m]: It does both 20:26:25 It calls javascript that is fine 'trivial javascript'. Otherwise it blocks it. 20:26:38 I am running it on Parabola Iceweasel, and it is very nice and convenient. 20:26:53 https://www.gnu.org/software/librejs/free-your-javascript.html 20:29:32 seems like its pretty dumb 20:30:10 Well, I guess this is what you call "free software extremism" 20:30:10 and doesnt actually do any analysis 20:30:11 naphtha[m]: It's pretty hard to do that. 20:30:11 recanman[m]: It 'just werks' for me 20:30:27 recanman[m]: of course, im aware. still not impossible 20:30:53 naphtha[m]: I guess so. GNU and FSF are so overloaded and kind-of unorganized. It is hard for them to maintain all of this. 20:31:48 with the complexity of js engines nowadays it would be very, very hard to fully bypass fingerprinting, but the situation could be made a little better still 20:32:14 considering even the ORDER of your http headers can be used to fingerprint you, and that doesn't even require js 20:32:25 naphtha[m]: What?! 20:32:43 "title is misleading" <- i don't think so. leverage an existing organic network to make your service interesting to users, and once your share of the network goes large enough (companies can afford marketing) you close it down again and take the network effect with you 20:33:24 recanman[m]: lol obviously it's not a way to individually uniquely fingerprint a large number of users but it still could be used as a parameter 20:33:27 https://noscriptfingerprint.com/ 20:33:31 * a parameter for the fingerprint 20:33:38 naphtha[m]: I pass all of this 20:33:55 My threat model is very strict, took me months to harden everything, browser was last 20:34:08 HTTP header order though, how stupid is that?! 20:35:35 ceetee[m]: yes, but it was the company that brought the new, normie users. the users that used the platform in the first place will still use it after the company leaves 20:36:46 recanman[m]: scraping and trying to bypass very well funded bot protection systems such as datadome or imperva is a very fun and interesting activity 20:36:57 its how i got started doing freelance work a couple years back 20:37:03 It made it accessible to normie friends. Imagine convincing them to join, because now it is easy, and they did, and now you are the asshole which can be contacted anymore 20:37:37 * recanman[m] uploaded an image: (1661KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/agoradesk.com/mtXopwByhVmZmCzgWHSKPSWH/funny.png > 20:37:39 I like this image 20:37:46 right, but thats why i keep my normie life and autistic online life separate 20:37:57 recanman[m]: fr 20:38:11 Also it doesn’t matter it’s federated if the feed algorithm is closed source and not changeable. Users in threads will never see anything not deemed “okey” 20:38:31 naphtha[m]: haha same 20:38:35 naphtha[m]: I am not as conventionally attractive as that, but scraping is the main reason why I am running out of storage on my 288tb raw/192tb usable 20:38:53 damn thats crazy 20:39:10 what do you even scrape 20:39:19 As much as I can 20:39:25 I crawl everything 20:39:33 I organize it 20:39:39 manually?? 20:39:44 No 20:39:48 With a few tools 20:39:54 Here is one that I use https://archivebox.io/ 20:39:57 aha 20:40:34 My final goal is to train LLMs, but I'm still learning 20:40:47 * still learning. I don't understand that stuff too much. 20:40:50 recanman: how much did your hhds cost 20:41:14 they are 24x12tb used sas hard drives, they were around $14 per tb 20:41:42 They had low hours and passed badblocks, good enough for me. Been using them for around a year and a half or so 20:42:10 recanman[m]: This was on ebay, the seller was hdda_to_z or something like that 20:42:14 s/hdda_to_z/hdd_a\_to\_z/ 20:42:21 do you want to host watchparty.me 👉👈 20:42:26 or a jellyfin instance 20:42:37 I already host a Jellyfin instance 20:42:51 probably bigger selection than netflix 20:42:57 I don't consume too much hollywood goyslop, but my family likes it. I have around 30tb or so. 20:43:21 It's all 1080p/4k with some 720p mixed in, I'm around the same amount as netflix. 20:43:29 s/./, but there are people who have hundreds of tbs/ 20:43:37 I have around 40tb total I think. 20:44:12 It doesn't handle transcoding too well because these are poweredge r620 servers and the cpus are around 10 years old, so I allocated 10 vcpus to the vm 20:44:25 i have never even seen a 1400p 140hz torrent 😿 20:44:36 Neither have I 20:45:53 Problem is that I have 10mbps upload and 400mbps download 20:46:26 i have 10 up on a good day and 50 down :,) 20:46:31 I run a tor bridge that gives 1mbps and a bunch of alternate frontends (libreddit, whatnot), but seeding is something doesn't work too well 20:46:57 i give 70% of my up to i2p and the rest to my monero node 20:47:25 If my situation clears and I can go home, then I will run a monero node 20:48:01 TLS handshake takes 5 minutes from where I am to my house on wireguard 20:48:06 Can't access anything 20:48:50 * monero node. I have to buy an SSD though 20:49:06 first thing i do when i get to work is remote into my machine via rustdesk 20:49:35 Is it written in Rust? 20:49:53 It seems so 20:49:58 yeah, its in the name lmao 20:50:27 recanman[m]: What do you mean by the emoji that you gave to my message? 20:50:54 probably that you dont have a ssd in the year of our lord 2023 20:51:04 recanman[m]: oh i wanted to give it to the 5 minute handshake sorry 20:51:04 I mean for the servers 20:51:13 storage shaming 20:51:43 Storage discrimination, I need reparations immediately! 20:51:53 oh my science 20:52:09 hdds are just as valid as other storage methods! 20:52:16 * naphtha[m] uploaded a video: (802KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/kyun.host/vehCPgUIgEXSTmvpuOYGxrkf/You%20Stupid%20Fucking%20Chud..mp4 > 20:53:11 I have never heard someone use the word 'chud' in person 20:53:25 This is quite humorous. 20:53:48 its really fuckin funny 20:54:00 that people like this actually exist 20:54:34 I do agree. 20:55:05 I read somewhere that 80% of people do not have an inner monologue, I disagree with that statement, but I believe that maybe it means that most people don't really critically think. 20:55:26 recanman[m]: no fucking way its that high 20:55:41 20-30% i could believe but not 80 20:55:58 Probably a lie, that is why I said that I do not agree. 20:56:16 Maybe the poster was trying to signify that 68.2% of the population (iq bell curve) do not think critically. 20:56:34 usually these people think too emotionally 20:56:51 Emotion is by definition not thinking 20:56:53 because of everything nowadays having endocrine disrupting chemicals 20:56:59 they think like women 20:57:09 IM NOT SAYING ITS RIGHT IM NOT A CHUD I SWEAR 20:57:16 but theres a reason why women couldnt vote 20:57:50 Monero Offtopic 20:57:54 While I would not like to confirm/deny any biases that I have because these chats are logged, I do agree that the chemicals that they put in the food of what the 'normal' people eat do disrupt their thinking. 20:57:54 all this time talking and we could have been learning about recanmans ccs proposal 20:58:03 oh well 20:58:14 plowsof11: What would you like to know? 20:58:28 I assume that the decision will be made tomorrow, but if you have any questions, go ahead. 20:58:32 i can't remember anymore 20:59:08 Recan, can you post the link 20:59:17 Otherwise ill take a look later 20:59:45 https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/395 21:00:44 Are you ableto finish in less time? 21:00:58 Sure. 21:01:10 I gave myself an extra month because I don't want to deliver late. 21:01:37 I can also increase the amount I work per week. 21:03:52 Right. 6 months really means 12 21:04:05 Why is that? 21:04:09 Juse ask plowsof @plowsof:matrix.org: 21:04:21 You are the same people, no? 21:04:23 This guy doesnt know how to collect a milestone 21:04:34 In reality, I will work more per week, but I do not want to propose too much. 21:04:38 * In reality, I will work triple the time per week, but I do not want to propose too much. 21:04:44 Yeah, im ofrnxmr, not collctingxmr 21:05:05 I've just been working on a hobby project, I want to do something useful. 21:05:08 s/collctingxmr/collctnxmr/ 21:06:31 recanman[m]: Theres a saying.. about budgeting hours 21:06:48 Please let me know what it is. 21:07:14 I would say that six months is pretty reasonable. 21:07:28 All of my freetime goes towards programming. 21:07:29 Basically, everything takes twice as long as stated 21:07:46 recreating craigslist / shopify / and gofund me, rewriting bitejo, then creating indeed all in 6 months? 21:07:59 It is all CRUD 21:08:03 So if you say 3 months, it will take 6 due to roadblocks or chsnges in ideas etc 21:08:48 really dont think its that hard of a task 21:08:49 plowsof11: Skip 1 2 3, and then do 4 5, is the proposal 21:08:52 Frontend for everything is already finished. I already wrote the basis of the backend and I am about 40% of the way doing database 21:09:10 recanman[m]: with some Monero integration and other stuff 21:09:15 the scope of your ccs for me is just too big, i want anarkios service to boom, why not add small features? show us they actually help? 21:09:23 Not gonna be like molly server is it. Say do everything and then go can’t do everything? And chain split 21:10:18 I think the ccs is just "clean up anarks code aka do a proper review and rewrite necessart sections" 21:10:18 then 21:10:18 "add jobs, accounts etc" 21:10:41 It's a full rewrite in Nodejs, not PHP 21:10:44 ofrnxmr[m]: > <@ofrnxmr:monero.social> I think the ccs is just "clean up anarks code aka do a proper review and rewrite necessart sections"... (full message at ) 21:12:16 CCS proposal 21:12:24 raise 100 XMR 21:12:29 I support your CCS 100%. But after the Node.js rewrite is finished, there is still the difficulty to find people who would use the website (signup, post listings, buy products). No one wants to use Bitejo now (and 99% of people don't even know it is coded in bad PHP). But if the Node.js version becomes a community project (part of the Monero ecosystem, rather than one guy's low quality PHP project) and the CCS gives it some hype/interes 21:12:29 find marketers and community organizers. 21:12:29 I coded Bitejo very sporadically as a hobbyist project between 2019-2021, but it was e.g. 3 months nothing, 1-2 weeks concentrated work, 3 months nothing again. If it would be compressed into full-time work, it would have taken 4-5 months to code it from scratch. 21:12:29 Bitejo already has a jobs section that no one uses. It may just need the "order comment" field to be changed to "quote/proposal". There is currently no escrow, but it is because I can't mediate anything personally. An escrow would give additional trust. 21:12:30 bet it all on red 21:12:45 In 5 star casino? 21:12:51 hmm 21:12:57 could knock 25xmr off and do an separate one for jobs part after the rest is up and running 21:13:06 monerobull[m]: xmr casino whennnnnn 21:13:10 monerobull[m]: What does that mean? 21:13:14 xmr.win 21:13:19 recanman[m]: roulette 21:13:29 Hmm. We’re having trouble finding that site. 21:13:30 We can’t connect to the server at xmr.win. 21:13:30 Oops, I don't gamble. 21:13:33 ofrnxmr[m]: Sure. 21:13:48 have you got a loicense for that escrow 21:13:48 Your in crypto 21:13:53 Gamble away  21:13:53 Or I can just add it in "free-of-charge" 21:14:04 is monero really gambling 21:14:27 With your life 21:14:27 oh its https://monero.win 21:14:38 I try not to look at XMR/USD pair, I try my best to use XMR as much as I can within the closed economy. 21:14:40 Stablecoin!! 21:14:40 seems to be struggling right now 21:14:50 i lost like 25$ to them 21:14:53 yeah doesnt load but isnt that just a minigame 21:14:57 where you guess the last character of whatever 21:15:02 Where's the one where you bet on the next block hash character 21:15:06 of the next block yeah 21:15:09 i mean like a full casino 21:15:13 with slots 21:15:21 live games 21:15:25 betcrypto.cr I think has Monero 21:15:28 even vr would be really nice 21:15:28 That makes it... (full message at ) 21:15:30 I think they're still developing it 21:15:39 i really want to do this but i dont have the time 21:15:44 ofrnxmr[m]: > <@ofrnxmr:monero.social> That makes it... (full message at ) 21:15:45 man you know those livestream casinos 21:15:51 i should host one 21:15:53 monerobull[m]: I do not! 21:15:55 have you heard of ethercrash? or uhm I forget the name of the original btc version 21:15:56 Elaborate! 21:15:59 * Elaborate, please. 21:16:09 Based from monero island 21:16:30 theres a stream of a poker / whatever table and your coins are digital but the cars and dealer are real recanman 21:16:35 recanman[m]: I didnt :P 21:16:35 wondering what everyone else thinks 21:16:37 * recanman[m] uploaded an image: (89KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/agoradesk.com/GZZWwnxMvCKCXxuzZPwWCcFR/Screenshot%202023-07-08%20at%2012.16.29%20AM.png > 21:16:57 monerobull[m]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2SdKcRLIZHE 21:17:03 monerobull[m]: yeah thats what i meant by live games 21:17:03 Excuse the vscodium cringe, but I have not had any time to do configurations of lvim and whatnot 21:17:07 Thank you. 21:17:12 * Thank you. (monerobull) 21:17:24 imagine this 21:17:25 vrchat 21:17:27 but 21:17:29 with monero gambling 21:17:36 Pretty simple 21:17:36 THIS is the real metaverse 21:17:38 I think 21:17:40 Ask meta 21:17:45 something like this could be done with XMR: https://www.ethercrash.io/faq 21:17:48 But if the Bitejo code is bad, why don't you want to code it from scratch? 21:17:54 Just make a request to monero.win 21:17:56 Be a proxy 21:18:04 anarkiocrypto[m]: I do? That is the proposal? 21:18:05 who wants to take on meta and have the fate of mcafee? 21:18:14 if anyone else is in im in 21:18:17 recanman[m]: I will use Bitejo as the basis of design. 21:18:19 Sim city :monero version  21:18:26 naphtha[m]: No, don't have enough time. 21:18:30 recanman[m]: naah not that simple 21:18:34 So you are only taking the frontend? 21:18:43 Yeah 21:18:47 naphtha[m]: Why not? 21:18:54 i mean proper casino games 21:18:56 roulette 21:18:57 slots 21:18:58 "have you got a loicense for that..." <- Escrow is probably not a good idea without legal advice 21:19:01 blackjack 21:19:02 Oh 21:19:13 monero.win was sold for 10.000$ some time ago 21:19:29 i dont understand you people 21:19:30 here i am 21:19:37 To general fund 21:19:37 You get find a better frontend from a free Bootstrap/Tailwind template. 21:19:39 offering you at least a mil in the near future 21:19:41 ofrnxmr[m]: I can not implement escrow and make it noncustodial if you want me to 21:19:43 * You can get a better frontend from a free Bootstrap/Tailwind template. 21:19:47 and youre not taking me seriously! sad! 21:20:02 But that was a disadvantage that I may (not) have outlined in the proposal, that scams are pretty easy to encounter. 21:20:07 Ban 21:20:24 I guess milestone-based payments and reviews work, but for some trust if some users want it escrow is optional. 21:20:31 Or I can scrap the idea of escrow. 21:20:38 recanman[m]: I do think its probably best _for you_ to avoid legal trouble, and not hold funds for users 21:20:49 Sounds good 21:20:52 DanrdarkIsnotthe: bandee? 21:21:10 monerobull[m]: This is an online game? Odd 21:22:09 I support the development of a high quality marketplace, but don't see how it is "based on Bitejo" if you are scrapping the backend and only want to take the frontend (when there are much better free Tailwind/Bootstrap templates available). 21:22:34 If it is better, than I can do the frontend from scratch. 21:22:41 But then I feel that the price is getting a bit tight for me. 21:22:58 I think Bitejo UX is pretty nice. 21:23:10 Couple improvements 'here and there'. 21:23:54 I really want to purchase this https://bitejo.com/listing/PctQ/ 21:24:02 But I don't have a place I can ship it to 21:24:58 s/a/an/, s/place/address/ 21:25:12 Wasnt bitjeo u 21:25:24 What? 21:25:32 s/u/up for grabs?/ 21:25:33 lol 21:25:34 * monerobull[m] uploaded an image: (252KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/TVdfvpVnweZZUmRpuCNdDDmS/grafik.png > 21:25:45 I feel like the backend is 90% of Bitejo. So if you are scrapping the backend, there is only 10% (a vague idea) to work with. 21:26:03 * naphtha[m] uploaded an image: (58KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/kyun.host/CucAiNTraVfxtHRGyUUVZPUw/R.jpg > 21:26:03 All good with me. 21:26:16 monerobull[m]: not priced in BTC? 21:26:17 I just like how the frontend looks, maybe my opinion is 'incorrect'. 21:26:37 5 euro all you can eat? 21:26:37 You can pay in BTC or XMR based on what the seller lists, but prices are in USD 21:26:38 Lest we forget, we paid for a haveno front end (and only a front end) ⌛ 21:26:48 I was trying to find a new owner for Bitejo (and open sourced the code) when I was worried that I would become homeless in May and didn't want the project to go offline. I have living costs for July. I don't know about August. But it's my own fault I am failing. 21:26:59 Backend not included* 21:27:21 It isn't incorrect, you can take the frontend if you want. It is amateur HTML/CSS but if you like it, feel free to build a new backend. 21:27:24 Lol haveno 21:27:42 In other words, this ccs has always planned to use the existing front end, and to improve the backend 21:27:45 hbs[m]: its obviously priced at 1 btc, just a long time ago ;) 21:27:59 what happened with haveno and why is everyone so mad at them 21:28:00 * monerobull[m] uploaded an image: (506KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/eGzhhmfJSXtezMLoCVWgDxNG/grafik.png > 21:28:04 last time i checked it was still being updated 21:28:05 Unlike haveno, that promised a frontend, without a working backend 21:28:07 i need a qrd 21:28:14 * monerobull[m] uploaded an image: (840KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/REyuqzSDOvRIDcjNNAXxHeXd/grafik.png > 21:28:14 not sus at all 21:28:17 naphtha[m]: Wow, that is quite funny! 21:28:19 Wait, wrong reply. 21:28:19 monerobull[m]: This one. 21:28:20 It made me laugh out loud. 21:28:21 You can set prices in Bitcoin and Monero. And there is already an accounts system (email is not required, only optional for password resets or notifications). 21:28:50 Tldr css funded a front end (dunno why whats it going to connect to ether)  21:28:58 monerobull[m]: lmao i saw this exact same ad somewhere else a while back when i was lurking on tor 21:29:06 naphtha[m]: The ccs was for a frontend _only_ 21:29:06 never delivered, not in progress, and the backend isnt finished yet. 21:29:06 the original team leader keft the project and cake wallet took over 21:29:19 monerobull[m]: Officially verified by Tor 21:30:30 Tor pow verifies? 21:30:37 * Tor pow verified? 21:31:14 * RavFX[m] uploaded an image: (29KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/monero.social/KuvoiFzizNPQefmaBJwzmogv/image.png > 21:31:15 jannieeesss 21:31:15 lol 21:31:15 clean it up!!!! 21:31:15 🐶 21:31:17 Cheap 21:31:54 I don't understand why you are funding a rewrite, if you are just insulting the listings... 21:32:14 These are just jokes, not insults. 21:32:18 If you think Bitejo is trash, just rewrite something from scratch separately. 21:32:51 Well, using your language, I believe the backend is 'trash'. The frontend looks pretty great to me. 21:32:54 Seems like I am in the wrong place for this, but I have never been able to find the "right place". 21:33:52 Anyway this is out of my hands. +1 for Recanman's CCS (if my opinion is relevant). Hopefully he will be able to make a better marketplace. 21:33:59 anarkiocrypto: i think bitejo is cool, some of the listings are just interesting / funny 21:34:25 I also agree, simple to use, straightforward. 21:35:14 no ones insulting bitejo 21:35:21 "> <@ofrnxmr:monero.social..." <- The wording has me worried that this will take a lifetime to complete. Is the rewritten code already available somewhere?... (full message at ) 21:35:33 its like saying people are insulting tor because theres weird shit on there 21:35:50 I think something like monerobull implemented is a good idea. creating an listing's account cost 0.1xmr 21:36:04 jip[m]: > <@jip:monero.social> The wording has me worried that this will take a lifetime to complete. Is the rewritten code already available somewhere?... (full message at ) 21:36:06 Go look at moneromarket, feet photos being sold 21:36:19 tbh i don't think the ccs is going to go over the deadline or not be delivered 21:36:24 youre just nitpicking at this point 21:36:28 Or look at the nfts on mordinals 21:36:30 but i also dont see why it needs to be rewritten 21:36:30 Most of it is just CRUD operations, with the backend making it look good. After that, a little of PGP and Monero, and that is it. 21:36:34 probably because i havent used it before 21:36:51 naphtha[m]: Nitpicking is good, CCS is meant for criticism. 21:36:52 lemmy is 0.01 💢 21:36:56 I'm asking for money 21:37:04 shh 21:37:14 recanman[m]: spam mitigation 21:37:23 bringing up the same point 50 times and receiving the same response every time is retarded 21:37:27 Monerobull create css for lemmy server maintenance fees 21:37:34 nahj 21:37:35 * nah 21:37:49 And use it for holiday 21:37:49 Just make soystemd service with restart as always 21:37:53 run the binary and that is it 21:37:56 To vegas 21:38:08 go to sleep grandpa the kool kidz use docker 21:38:09 DanrdarkIsnotthe: haha see ya at defcon /s 21:38:16 😎️ 21:38:26 god docker is great 21:38:33 it really is 21:38:35 Compose is better 21:38:41 naphtha[m]: 👆 21:38:46 DanrdarkIsnotthe: of course 21:38:50 but thats still docker 21:38:52 i dont know if i have ever installed a program on linux before 21:39:29 We can make plowsof 21:39:29 Env: 21:39:29 Gid-1000 21:39:29 Uid-1000 21:39:41 monerobull[m]: I assumed that you would be good at this stuff 21:39:52 plow deez nuts goteeeeemmm 21:39:54 Your handle makes me think you have 10000+ XMR 21:40:01 recanman[m]: i know docker 👍 21:40:05 monero BVLL 21:40:07 Ballwr 21:40:12 Prove that you do or do not, right now. Send me your address and view key 21:40:19 * Ballar 21:40:19 I am joking 21:40:22 bitcoin cuckquean 21:40:29 10k xmr yeahr right lmao. i just joined in 2021 21:40:30 Scammer! 21:40:40 What? 21:40:50 naphtha[m]: What is that? 21:41:01 Asking for view key. Reporting to fluffy 21:41:02 naphtha[m]: Unsure what this is either 21:41:25 its better if it stays that way 21:43:19 Safer 21:43:33 For metal health 21:43:44 * For mental health 21:43:46 soyed to you by soyjak.party 21:58:29 When your rewrite is done, I could probably close down Bitejo or let the VPS expire (as it would be obsolete). If this happens, I can give you the domain name (but a new name is probably better than a random Esperanto word that people don't know how to pronounce). 23:04:50 https://gitlab.com/beardog/merkato is from the unsuccessful ccs forgotsudo marketplace https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/340 23:24:54 The biggest problem really seems to be marketing and community building... OpenBazaar had this problem too. Good tech, but difficult to buy and sell when there are few buyers and sellers... 23:31:23 This made me giggle maybe spam is the answer after all: https://bitejo.com/listing/Ru3p/ 23:32:08 jip[m]: thats actually cool 23:32:37 barely have anything come up when you search my name but still 23:32:42 some people may need this 23:34:00 if only I had the courage the give out my full name to some random internet person 23:34:22 what are they going to do with it lol 23:35:54 create spam accounts probably but it still feels wrong lol 23:37:21 no way of differentiating between your real name and a fake name 23:37:25 well in most cases 23:39:22 true but I should give them my real name if I really want to use the service 23:39:47 or maybe people use it to make someone they dislike harder to find lol