00:00:27 dont mention serpahis and fcmp, those are not a solution right now 00:00:30 isnt 40 make the TX the same size as it will be for FCMP? Only difference is that FCMP is actually properly prunable (I think). 00:00:32 u sgp in disguise? ofrnxmr told me truth about u fed 00:00:36 liar fed 00:01:02 increase fee = destruction of xmr 00:01:22 solution simple. increase ringsize so it effective around 24 then we wait until fcmp 00:01:32 anything else will destroy xmr may price worse and uncertainty up 00:01:49 40 ringsize + 10x increase in fees & you make it expensive for the attackers to own a high percentage of outputs ; go do your counterspam after that nobody will stop you 00:02:02 u actual fed or sgp 00:02:24 go analyze some text patter and see if you find any resemblance with sgp 00:02:37 go analyze some text pattern and see if you find any resemblance with sgp 00:02:45 ik u sgp 00:02:56 only idiot recommend fee increase like sgp 00:03:28 anyone giving some solution is a fed & you wanting cheap spam is a dmn vendor using tornado lol 00:03:40 i suggest ringsize 40 00:03:43 do u agree with me? 00:04:01 only bcoz sgp recommened increase fee doesnt mean its wrong 00:04:01 this enough because current decoy for 16 in 40 equivalent to 24 00:04:05 it also become more expensive to attack 00:04:23 anything above 32 is fine, but fix decoy selection along with it 00:04:27 i dont agree with fee increase for many reason. if u agree ok but no one going to introduce that change 00:04:49 xmrcracked is the new ceo 00:04:59 ringsize will get introduced 100% but if seraphis or fcmp take until 2027 or 2030 this shit gone 00:05:19 are you artic ? bcoz you talk about cheap fees lol 00:05:20 no many smarter people than dumbass sgp agree with me 00:05:30 arctic is smart his solution is right 00:05:38 im not artic but i agree with him 00:06:02 xmrcracked if you can expedite fcmp or serpahis, be our guest and do it ; or else just dump your bags right now as its not coming before end of the decade 00:06:16 wtf who told u this shit 00:06:26 if not coming by end of decade xmr is gone already we go back to btc 00:06:38 i sell rn 00:06:44 go track past developement track record, thats shows the speed lol 00:07:00 Do you have evidence of how much more expensive it will be if it were changed to this 40 rings and 10x fee but the same supposed spam was happening from March. Expensive is a relative thing and if it cost them just 10 xmr/day from 4 xmr/day then it wouldn't make a difference to their pockets lmao. Expensive to you is most likely going to always be cheap to a persistent attacker. 00:07:02 yes sell it rn and tell your buddies 00:07:13 where i need proof actually 00:07:32 give me link 00:08:33 it will be 100% more expensive by 10x in xmr term. in usd term which attacker is in will have no guarantee because of price. this is hwy fee change is shitty solution. for ringsize change there guarantee of how much decoy will be in effective. rn decoy is equivalent to 5 decoys instead of 16 because of this attack. with ringsize 40 it will be 24 instead of 5. 00:08:41 if you increase ringsize, they need to own a much higher % of recent decoys so they need to increase their txs & making it 5c tx its going to cost many folds as currently it cost sub cent 00:09:03 see u say 5c tx but u cant guarantee this so dumb 00:09:35 it will be 10x in xmr. in usd? we dont know 00:10:13 jack ma dont know why u pushing this when 40 ring is enough. u must be sgp fed 00:10:37 increase xmr fee mean it going to be the same as other chain. if this case then everyone will be like why use xmr when u can go to tornado cash or btc whirlpool 00:11:58 xmrcracked here is your link https://r.mtdv.me/videos/iBLyOmocrC 00:12:34 fed i not clicking any sus link 00:12:40 "Many folds" and "expensive" are all still vague amounts just saying. Pay someone to crunch the numbers else your bullet has no powder. 00:13:12 u can crunch easy. 10x = 10x current fee in xmr 00:13:26 it impossible to calculate in usd because jack ma is retard who doesnt understand that xmr price is not fixed 00:13:34 https://github.com/Rucknium/misc-research/blob/main/Monero-Black-Marble-Flood/pdf/images/projected-effective-ring-size-non-log.png 00:13:43 attend next week MRL meeting and ask them directly , you are not going to trust my numbers anyways :) 00:13:47 if we increase ring size it better change here is the graph for expected decoy 00:14:32 bitcoin fee is $0.37 rn better than xmr if we increase fee 00:14:38 lucky for us we have people who have the skills to understand what is happening and to make the correct decisions 00:14:52 $0.75 for low priority 00:15:16 yes and these people know that increasing fee is STUPID DECISION 00:15:25 increasing fee directly what i mean here 00:15:30 best way to increase monero's fee is to pump the price :D lol 00:15:53 then we can pay devs more 00:15:59 how much in xmr is it costing this guy again 00:16:02 per day 00:16:04 is it 8 xmr? 00:16:13 and how big is that btc tx size ? how often are the fees this low ? 00:16:44 28.65 kb for coinjoin 00:16:56 btc fees only go up when I have to use it and I haven't used it this year so............... 00:17:35 Cat feel free to keep buying it daily from dnm vendors dumping it, there is no way to pump it as tomm some kid dnm vendor will come and markeet sell becoasuse he loves his butcoin 00:17:57 i love bitcoin yes so please increase xmr fee so this shit go to 0 and bitcoin wins 00:17:58 and how much does that coinjoin tx cost usually ? and right now ? 00:18:01 stupid i want xmr to do good 00:18:56 it doesnt matter. the privacy guarantee is what matter now. 20%+ prediction rate = 0 privacy xmr lying 00:19:10 u have to churn for privayc what happen to xmr being simple and private just sned and it private? 00:19:12 its not used because its 0.01cent fee, its used because it had a so called effective ringsize of 16 before this cheap spam 00:19:40 ringsize was 7 for a long time 00:19:45 xmrcracked can you please leave xmr and keep using your butcoin 00:19:53 u leave fed sgp sucker 00:20:11 cant wait for 100 forks we change fee everytime price changes so msart 00:20:19 cat there was no chain analysis company looking at monero 00:20:20 cant wait for 100 forks we change fee everytime price changes so smart 00:20:24 ok retard moonboy 00:20:55 btc whirlpool is not moon it better privacy 00:20:57 you guys could DM instead of ..... spam the channel 00:21:03 normally not better 00:21:04 retard again talking about price going up , when its going to zero without a defence 00:21:16 i agree before xmr spam xmr was better than btc and eth but now it shittier 00:21:19 maybe we should charge per post 00:21:29 ok cat, i will go back to my cave 00:21:53 im spamming because jack ma is fed tyring to capture xmr 00:22:02 yes get out of here sgp fed 00:22:03 I need to go see another cat tonight 00:22:18 apologize to ofrn 00:22:22 per post, then butcoin moonboy will complain 00:23:02 stfu xmrcracked only feds say others are fed 00:23:09 i dont care this win win for me 00:23:40 ok crack head, go take some pill 00:23:41 if xmr shitty implements higher fee then fed capture price go to 0 and bitcoin win AGAIN 00:23:41 if xmr doesnt do this stupid and use ring size the coin may survive but u say 2030 seraphis so maybe no bitcoin win AGAIN 00:24:06 sgp fed 00:24:30 again butcoin retard, go mute yourself 00:24:30 go read what arctic and smarter people have to say 00:24:36 not sgp dumbass who got banned for fraud 00:24:48 ofrn still banned not fair 00:25:09 ok dan 00:25:51 sethforprivacy moved to btc 00:25:51 we know why now this shit going to 0 00:25:53 because of u sgp fed 00:26:20 and other fed take over xmr 00:34:43 you can also go to butcoin, stop wasting your time here 00:35:44 i actually wrong was before and i agree with u now. 40 ringsize and 10x fee 00:39:20 good for you, hope you can sleep well now 02:40:49 Yet another strawman joined specifically to pick a fight, oh boy! 02:45:05 As for sethforprivacy moving to BTC, if you read his blog post correctly ( https://sethforprivacy.com/posts/why-i-focus-on-bitcoin/ ), it has nothing to do with Monero going to 0 (which is not gonna happen anyway), but more with following the hurd basically. 02:47:47 And it's currently tempting to temporarily swap all your XMR for BTC because of the halving event happening in 24 days from now, so you can expect Bitcoin to go up by a lot and Monero slightly going down for the next 2 or so months. 03:25:57 <321bob321:monero.social> Maybe its the doco guy 03:26:05 The halving is actually bearish if people understood the implications of not having Tail Emission. And having an ASIC mined network. But BTC people don't like to think of solutions to poor long term network security. Or keeping the clearinghouse (miners) decentralized and well behaved 03:27:29 Normally halving could be considered bullish because the rate of dilution is halved. But in a network where that continues indefinitely then the tether between unit price of coin and hashrate is broken. and the tether becomes fees paid and hashrate 11:13:49 Not sure what you're talking about. 11:13:49 Halving is bullish. 11:13:50 There will be a short bear period afterwards, as always, then to the moon, as always. 12:30:29 Are there any articles about Monero Seraphis? I just want to know what he does and briefly understand what its principle is. 12:39:25 dufebo98: https://localmonero.co/knowledge/seraphis-for-monero 13:54:40 Transaction pool 13:54:40 no of txs: 10023, size: 16615.38 kB 13:54:56 Did someone start a counter spam ? 13:55:20 is possible 13:56:52 50 blocks in mempool 😅 14:03:24 Mass adoption 14:04:39 If Tom hanks started raving about Monero, this is what would happen 14:05:07 Stress tests are good 14:05:44 Where is the best visualizer for Monero tx data 14:23:53 Not everything is spam. 14:26:00 prove it 14:52:31 and everything is organic 15:12:48 Obviously not. 15:13:22 Are you a Sith, can't see gray can you. 15:30:29 grey isnt visible in this flood of black marbles 15:36:56 i'm pretty sure "flood of black marbles" is not the correct way to put it 15:40:31 sorry i am chinese, but you do get my point 15:55:05 Is it just me or all the public nodes dead now lol 15:56:01 no idea, I haz my own 15:57:24 a few modes are working, check monero.fail 15:57:57 All the ones on there that I’m checking are failing (unless it’s an issue with Cake Wallet) 16:03:47 11k txs pending 16:03:48 geez whats happening 16:07:28 dexes doing 1/2 transactions, serai is online 🤣 16:09:18 on a serious note, attacker is paying ~0.306 XMR for 10k txs 16:09:28 only if we had some legit fees 16:09:51 sub cents for the win! 16:13:39 What concerns me is how the increased size of mem_pool hampers node syncing…. 16:13:40 Like legitimately if someone were to pour like 10k worth of XMR into an attack, I’m not sure what would happen 16:14:46 nothing would happen, Argentinians would demand remote nodes to be fixed and would want sub cent fees 16:15:00 Lol 16:15:21 I’m just thinking in terms of block height desync 16:15:26 my node is fine 16:15:42 Isn’t it currently like over 50 blocks between the highest and hashvault 16:16:12 blocksize would grow slowly and some remote nodes will go out of biz, argentenians cant afford localnodes anyways as they cant even afford 5 cent fee 16:16:40 monero will be be dead in matter of weeks 16:17:03 The problem isn't the minimum protocol fee. The problem is that not many people use Monero lol. If tx-pool was congested with honest users then this attack would be much more expensive 16:17:15 and someone from polar region will wakeup to see the mess & after 6 months we will have a HF 16:17:28 in the meanwhile you get to buy cheap moneros 16:18:00 my node is using 4% of my cpu 16:19:04 if i do 100 txs, the attacker just has to do 900txs and own a huge majority of decoys while the fee is cheap its easily doable 16:19:40 you cant outgrow spam with legit transaction, while keeping the fees low 16:19:50 My current take on the attack we are facing is the following: (1) If we had Full Membership Proofs then the privacy implications of this attack would be low. But Full Membership proof will take time to be assessed and implemented in a secure manner. So this is a good future goal, but can't solve the issue at hand. (2) If honest usage was high then fees would be higher. If fees wer 16:19:50 e higher it would be harder for a flood attack like this to happen. 16:20:21 Cat you are a different animal, humans with mobiles dont have a node; our poor Argentinians cant afford local nodes 16:20:54 You can outgrow spam with legit transactions, but it takes time. Clearly Monero's adoption growth has been slow and steady haha. So this isn't something that will magically appear either. 16:21:05 Public? Lol 16:22:18 fcmp isnt coming anytime soon, we can wait for it and keep monero unusable for Argentinians with cheap fees or increase fee and force Argentinians to starve as they cant buy that extra egg 16:23:03 It is a bit disheartening to see that a spammer is effectively reducing ringsize because demand for Monero block space as a medium of exchange is so low. The only two explanations for demand for monero block space being low are that there are better alternatives to Monero as a medium of exchange in the eyes of others OR that they are ignorant / unaware of Monero and the features t 16:23:03 hat make it desirable 16:23:24 you can wait for that organic legit tranasctions to come & in the meanwhile fill the blockchain and hit your effective ringsize 16:23:44 I think wait and see is actually the best response 16:23:58 maybe people aren't using crypto as a medium of exchange 16:24:04 speculate on that lol 16:24:18 My take on fee increases is this: it will effect both an attacker and normal users equally, which means the effective ratio of attacker transactions to normal transactions remains relatively the same. 16:24:18 Plus, keep in mind how little xmr is required to perform an attack of this power. To put it in perspective, almost the exact amount of money used on this attack is the same amount I am currently trying to use for a transaction 😂 I have basically nothing in xmr, so that’s a rly bad sign 16:24:37 But it is a risky gamble because high threat model dark net actors won't be pleased as the the effective ring size asymptotically decreases over time 16:24:38 Even if you increase fees tenfold, that is still too big an issue 16:25:30 This would be fine if mem_pool could realistically scale et infinitum. Unfortunately that clearly isn’t the case 16:25:37 why is it a issue ? its not expensive 16:25:54 monero is use for privacy , not because it has low fees 16:26:02 I agree with preland. I think we the Monero believers just have to take a temporary "loss" "take this L" in the form of reduced effective ring size and sit tight. There aren't really alternatives to Monero, so it's still better than competing privacy coins. 16:26:05 for low to zeero fees there is nano or ltc 16:26:08 As in it would still be easy to pull off 16:26:25 If there were competitors to Monero with meaningful advantages then it would be a different story 16:26:54 loss of privacy for 6 months , is not a small L 16:26:55 Hello there i send some XMR with gui wallet about and hour ago and in wallet transactions still doesnt appears this one, and also isnt arrive, what i cant do? please help 16:27:04 We just beaten old mempool constipation record. (old : 11.9K TX, current : 12K TX) 16:27:38 ok jack, what alternative will people use instead of Monero because of the attack? digital fiat is garbage. And BTC has little privacy features. Will they use Zcash? If so why? 16:27:48 yolo12: did you update your wallet in the last 10 days? 16:28:00 I just don't see what people will switch too just because Monero's ring size is 30% of it's nominal face value 16:28:12 a weird decoy selection algo taking in majority of recent outputs is also a thing to look at , making this spam attack effective 16:29:22 can somebody help me here please? 16:29:37 you cant predict what coin will be used, they just need to bribe a few dnms and get it rolling 16:29:45 I'll wait to hear what alternative you think high threat model actors will switch to with the decrease in effective ringsize. My point is that you are right, this is not a desirable situation. But in practice Monero is still better than everything else for private online transactions, so in practice people currently using Monero will still use Monero 16:30:07 i have a weird feeling zeph is behind this attack 16:30:09 Run your own node and connect to it. This will likely resolve the issue 16:30:59 using localnode doesnt solve your effective ringsize problem 16:31:12 are u talking to me? 16:31:44 I'm talking to you yolo 16:32:01 yolo12: no, its someone on the irc side 16:32:03 your description is too vague so I can't tell exactly what the problem is 16:32:10 Yes yolo12, did you update your wallet recently? 16:32:15 He wasn’t, and the reason it hasn’t sent is because the network is currently congested 16:32:20 or monero.social 16:32:32 the bridge is broken like anything monero 16:32:54 anyways jack ma, I still haven't heard you list any alternative currency that people using Monero will switch to? I'm waiting buddy 16:33:09 You need to use latest version of Monero GUI for auto fees to work properly, else TX get sent with low fees and currently, will take a few hours to get processed. You can alternatively select "normal" fees when you are making a new transaction. 16:33:13 Monero isn’t broken; it’s working exactly as intended 16:33:13 The issue is that we didn’t know the full extent of what that meant until now 16:33:36 so i just have to wait? bcs the money are gone from gui and i cant even find the hash of the transaction 16:33:42 @free i can predict which shitcoin is going to go and bribe those dnm operators 16:33:57 cant* 16:34:55