01:30:56 <m-relay> <m​odul8:matrix.org> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dat6fSlKrNA&t=52s what makes people think after "they" have fucked around with monero enough to try to curb adoption that they will not attack all other coins and users similarly? sounds like they making sure nobody can exit to monero easily first and then screw up everything else. glad to know that monero is not a good for nothing blockchain tho lol
07:23:16 <m-relay> <p​cre:monero.social> Bitcoin is practically in bed with the state at the moment. If the state starts to manipulate software development, then things will get interesting. Otherwise the sweet cantillion candy will be taken away.
08:41:37 <m-relay> <a​remor:matrix.org> Are collaborative transactions possible in Monero? 
08:41:39 <m-relay> <a​remor:matrix.org> (Multiple inputs in one tx that require completely different set of private spend keys in order for the TX to be valid.)
08:44:39 <sech1> yes
09:13:39 <aaabbb> /3/
09:13:46 <aaabbb> oops gnore me
09:20:46 <m-relay> <5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> Haveno's mainnet integration has been released btw
11:39:28 <m-relay> <n​ihilist:m.datura.network> https://github.com/haveno-dex/haveno/blob/master/docs/create-mainnet.md yup, its starting to launch it seems
11:45:45 <Lyza> I don't see how taking fees from this isn't going to get people in trouble
11:46:16 <Lyza> it seems really obvious at this point that the benefactors of this will be seen to be operating a MSB
12:35:58 <m-relay> <k​arano:poddery.com> selsta monero development is now funded !!
12:35:59 <m-relay> <k​arano:poddery.com> https://ccs.getmonero.org/proposals/selsta-13.html
12:36:05 <m-relay> <k​arano:poddery.com> selsta monero development is now fully funded !!
12:36:07 <m-relay> <k​arano:poddery.com> https://ccs.getmonero.org/proposals/selsta-13.html
15:06:43 <m-relay> <b​abeler:matrix.org> I've been trying to send and having trouble. Just re-installed and waiting for it to sync. I was getting transaction sent, but then no confirmations and transaction failed. Have you been able to send funds recently? I saw the network was held up a few days ago on reddit.
15:07:30 <BoBeR182> how much fee?
15:19:35 <m-relay> <p​epe86frog:matrix.org> I wonder... it probably is a product of the state.
15:19:56 <m-relay> <p​epe86frog:matrix.org> How it evolved seems sus.
15:20:58 <BoBeR182> pepe86frog what do you mean?
16:31:28 <m-relay> <a​remor:matrix.org> Get rich quick bankers jumped all over Bitcoin and outnumbered the punks to where the project was basically killed
16:32:25 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> I'll never forget watching the asset correlation coefficients converge
16:32:35 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> That was equal parts funny and fascinating
16:33:10 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> Couldn't claim it diversified worth shit anymore lol
16:33:21 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> Or at least, not as well as it used to.
16:34:04 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> But yeah I find it hard to believe that some of these decades-active well educated proponents are all state rubes
16:34:12 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> Post-hoc rationalization is a mf
16:42:37 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> https://www.wired.com/story/tornado-cash-money-laundering-case-crypto-privacy/
16:42:47 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> >Tomorrow a Dutch court decides the fate of Alexey Pertsev, cofounder of Tornado Cash, which allegedly enabled $2.3 billion in crypto money laundering. The result may shape the future of crypto privacy and liability for open-source, decentralized systems.
16:43:52 <m-relay> <p​epe86frog:matrix.org> So you think it was actually hijacked... Probably.  I think it might have been the og cbdc.
17:31:57 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> rip then
17:32:48 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> its need to be truly decentralized with no central fee or custody or server
17:33:56 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> if btc implements MWEB it will be funny to watch it lol
17:35:27 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> pcre: pepe86frog btc will show us what can soft forks even do and its limits lol
17:35:45 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> will be fun to watch lol
17:35:51 <vthor> what is MWEB? I have seen this now various times the last days
17:49:49 <m-relay> <a​remor:matrix.org> Do you know where I can find docs on this? https://web.getmonero.org/resources/user-guides/multisig-messaging-system.html does not seem to cover it.
17:50:17 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> Hello, I'm trying to run XPG, which uses the monero wallet RPC daemon, but I want to do so on a machine with these sysctl's enabled: `net.ipv4.ip_forward` & `net.ipv4.ip_nonlocal_bind`. This is because I want to be running HAProxy on these machines, and thus need the ability to forward packets that arrive to this machine to another machine. Unfortunately, when I use those sysctl's<clipped message>
17:50:19 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> , XPG reports that the monero wallet rpc daemon is unable to connect.
17:50:21 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> I tried disabling these sysctl's, and sure enough, MW just connects perfectly.
17:50:23 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> Is this a known issue? If it is, is there a known work-around?
17:50:43 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> Hello, I'm trying to run XPG, which uses the monero wallet RPC daemon, but I want to do so on a machine with these sysctl's enabled: `net.ipv4.ip_forward` & `net.ipv4.ip_nonlocal_bind`. This is because I want to be running HAProxy on this machine, and thus need the ability to forward packets that arrive to this machine to another machine. Unfortunately, when I use those sysctl's, <clipped message>
17:50:45 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> XPG reports that the monero wallet rpc daemon is unable to connect.
17:50:47 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> I tried disabling these sysctl's, and sure enough, MW just connects perfectly.
17:50:49 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> Is this a known issue? If it is, is there a known work-around?
17:59:49 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> https://getmonero.dev/docs/multisignature.html doesn't cover it?
18:09:55 <m-relay> <a​remor:matrix.org> Hmm well the first paragraph after those first bullet points suggests that it's not possible
18:10:24 <m-relay> <a​remor:matrix.org> > Monero doesn’t directly implement multisignatures (at least not in a classical sense). Monero emulates the feature by secret splitting.
18:11:20 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> multi-sig bane of monero lol
18:11:25 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> 🥲
18:15:28 <m-relay> <5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> bought 3K worth of XMR through trocador and i have 0.2 XMR wtf
18:15:30 <m-relay> <5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> it's still syncing though so it will hopefully fix it
18:16:21 <m-relay> <x​mrfamily:matrix.org> maybe use majesticbank next time? not the biggest fan of them tho after they went dark last year for a week
18:16:23 <m-relay> <a​remor:matrix.org> Mimble Wemble I think
18:16:25 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> no pointers from any available linux greybeards? I'd hate to lose out on load balancing by namespacing XPG
18:17:28 <m-relay> <s​huroii:matrix.org> I'm assuming the problem isn't with *XPG* but with *the Monero RPC Wallet daemon* regardless
18:18:12 <m-relay> <5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> it has the correct amount on the tracking website so it should be okay i guess
18:18:19 <m-relay> <5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> 1.5M blocks behind
18:18:54 <plowsof> 3k for 0.2xmr wow i remember when that would get you alot more
18:20:06 <m-relay> <5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> dunno majestic seems sus the whole reddit is filled with PSA about them doing an exit scam
18:20:37 <m-relay> <5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> it should give me a lot more based on the tracking website
18:21:38 <m-relay> <p​lowsof:monero.social> Shane i was joking. Youve been here long enough to know that "actual balance wont show until wallet is fully synced"
18:22:36 <m-relay> <5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> i actually don't know that i never had this situation to happen before in the whole time i am using XMR :D
18:24:29 <m-relay> <5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> though that's BTC thing tbh
18:24:54 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> MimbleWimble (non-interactive as per their claim)(if possible lol)
18:25:30 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> MimbleWimble from grin & beam(non-interactive as per their claim)(if possible lol)
18:26:38 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> MimbleWimble from grin & beam(this time non-interactive as per their claim)(if possible lol)
18:35:51 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Do you guys imagine a world where grin&beam and Monero communities are friend
18:46:38 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> this is a great primer on the MW transaction scheme: https://medium.com/@brandonarvanaghi/grin-transactions-explained-step-by-step-fdceb905a853
18:46:59 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> it's tailored to GRIN, but they are the most minimal implementation of MW
18:50:48 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> yep
19:07:12 <m-relay> <t​hedragon44:matrix.org> Anyone able to suggest a method for an organisation to accept Monero donations,  with minimal hassle on their end?
19:07:13 <m-relay> <t​hedragon44:matrix.org> Currently their only reason for not offering the option is concerns around low amounts of donations and extra work for their organisation...
19:07:15 <m-relay> <t​hedragon44:matrix.org> Just wondered if any recommendations that might allow them to reconsider
19:09:26 <m-relay> <t​hedragon44:matrix.org> Anyone able to suggest a method for an organisation to accept Monero donations,  with minimal hassle on their end?
19:09:27 <m-relay> <t​hedragon44:matrix.org> Currently their only reason for not offering the option is concerns around low amounts of donations and extra work for their organisation...
19:09:29 <m-relay> <t​hedragon44:matrix.org> Just wondered if anyone had recommendations that might allow them to reconsider
19:10:59 <m-relay> <t​hedragon44:matrix.org> As from all communications with them, they really want to offer it, but this is the final hurdle
19:11:32 <m-relay> <x​mrfamily:matrix.org> tell them to look at crypto for homeless
19:12:59 <m-relay> <x​mrfamily:matrix.org> cryptoforthehomeless.com
19:14:31 <m-relay> <b​abeler:matrix.org> restarted it and tried to send. No failure but now it's been sending for the last hour or two. Think I should restart the GUI and node?
19:14:58 <m-relay> <b​abeler:matrix.org> or is that a reasonable amount of time?
19:17:50 <m-relay> <x​mrfamily:matrix.org> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tMbxDPebCt_zeqrAJLjtEA8gjgkh-7G5HCz_eVjRbHY/edit#gid=1097637714 thats the "books" for them look how many donations
19:29:33 <m-relay> <g​ee:matrix.start9labs.com> Coming from the Bitcoin world some things about monero confuse me.  Is there really no way to call the equivalent of bitcoin's `loadwallet` rpc command?  If not, is literally the only way to get access to wallet calls is to run monero-wallet-rpc with the `--wallet` switch?
19:31:01 <m-relay> <g​ee:matrix.start9labs.com> So in other words do I really need to run 5 different copies of the monero-wallet-rpc program if I want to interact with 5 different wallets?
19:32:10 <m-relay> <h​elasse:linarphy.net> I think the wallet rpc allows you to switch to an other wallet from the rpc without reloading
19:32:54 <m-relay> <g​ee:matrix.start9labs.com> Maybe I'm just blind but I don't see it here: https://getmonero.dev/docs/interacting/monero-wallet-rpc-reference.html
19:33:10 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> i don't want to be friends with beam
19:33:16 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> corpo coin scam
19:34:09 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> their code base is enormously complex
19:34:14 <m-relay> <h​elasse:linarphy.net> https://www.getmonero.org/resources/developer-guides/wallet-rpc.html
19:34:30 <m-relay> <h​elasse:linarphy.net> See:
19:34:31 <m-relay> <h​elasse:linarphy.net> open_wallet
19:34:33 <m-relay> <h​elasse:linarphy.net> create_wallet
19:34:35 <m-relay> <h​elasse:linarphy.net> stop_wallet
19:35:22 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> but the GRIN community is largely favorable to XMR, though critical of RingSigs' reliance of statistical modelling
19:37:26 <m-relay> <a​remor:matrix.org> No idea what grin and beam is
19:38:13 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> GRIN is an implementation of the MimbleWimble protocol, which is a blockchain design that was conceived of in early bitcointalk days
19:38:17 <m-relay> <r​ucknium:monero.social> George: If you want to do that simultaneously with 5 different wallets, yes. It's painful IMHO. Maybe go to #monero-community-dev:monero.social
19:38:34 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> https://phyro.github.io/what-is-grin/mimblewimble.html
19:39:37 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> This link gives a history of the discussions about the design with Satoshi: https://phyro.github.io/what-is-grin/commitment_chains.html
19:40:08 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> despite being speculated on it wasn't formalized until around 2016, and then implemented around 2019
19:40:31 <m-relay> <a​remor:matrix.org> Ok. And why would we "friend" them? What's that even mean?
19:42:11 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> personally i think privacy-preserving coins with open, voluntary development models and without central corporations or devtaxes should work together more
19:52:39 <TuxFaroTheGreat> whats the best monero news site?
19:57:00 <nioCat> monero observer is good
20:14:01 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> grin & beam only good MW blockchain
20:14:57 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> others like epic cash, lite cash, MimbleWimble coin have their own touch lol
20:15:24 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> MW coins are super minorities lol
20:17:00 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> they were faster with c++ and MW development lol
20:20:59 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> MW Lantus v2 mix up dandelion++ from firo SBBS development all came to beam faster lol
20:21:43 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> MW Lelantus v2 mix up dandelion++ from firo SBBS development all came to beam faster lol
20:21:59 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> 😛
20:22:41 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> just like halo 2 orchard of zcash
20:22:57 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> no one can defeat capitalism lol
20:23:12 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> 😛
20:26:01 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> didn't their network crash more than once?
20:26:19 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> and lelantus negates the native MW cutthrough property meaning the scaling benefits are totally lost
20:27:11 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> i agree epic, litecash, MWC etc are junk, just pump and dump schemes
20:29:28 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> they wanted more non-interactive privacy they got them in beam somehow lol
20:29:58 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> and smart contract and atomic swaps dex lol
20:30:18 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> all dependent on tradeoffs
20:30:34 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> and no can defeat capitalism lol
20:30:39 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> yeah see, the interactivity was seen as an issue in the early days, but i don't think it really is.  the major hurdle was the need for early MW wallets to always be online but with Grin's slatepack format that's no longer required
20:30:41 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> 😛😛
20:31:03 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> without the cutthrough tho i don't see the point of MW, might as well do it on a traditional chain model
20:31:55 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> and the privacy benefits are arguable, while lelantus obscures the TX graph, since MW outputs are just commitment hashes it's not clear how much identifiable information is actually discernible with them
20:32:15 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> both beam & grin facing the problem of interactive part till now just look at exchange and dex adoption lol
20:32:34 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> worse then monero multi-sig & exchange adoptions lol
20:32:37 <m-relay> <x​mrfamily:matrix.org> we are in crisis since localmonero
20:32:41 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> i don't think it's interactivity preventing adoption, it's largely the exchanges don't want to take on new networks if they're not given an enormous bag of premined coins for it
20:32:50 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> yep
20:33:07 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> TradeOgre implemented slatepacks for Grin and it's totally seamless, GateIO uses the tor addressing scheme
20:33:13 <m-relay> <y​asabi:matrix.org> CEXes are just fucking scams
20:33:58 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> that true but no want to touch zero knowledge inner product & zk stark FRI coins too
20:34:26 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> no brain + no incentivize
20:34:43 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> that true but no want's to touch zero knowledge inner product & zkstark FRI coins too
20:35:25 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> yea last place for semi-darknet CEXs
20:36:26 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> that true but no want's to touch zero knowledge inner product arguments coins & ZKSTARK FRI coins too
20:41:00 <m-relay> <g​ee:matrix.start9labs.com> lol @ a cex that uses cloudflare being called semi-darknet! :P
20:42:28 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> Hey they're probably first to market with direct darknet->black site integration!
20:42:38 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> *innovation*
20:43:56 <sT0p> oh boi I read this post on linkedin some woman saying regulating crypto is the way forward
20:44:00 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> yea lol https Clearnet un-regulated CEX let's see how long it last
20:44:02 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> sadly
20:44:43 <m-relay> <g​ee:matrix.start9labs.com> They don't dare stop it... otherwise it might move from the platform where they can see every trade and every user's every move
20:44:51 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> 🥲😥
20:45:07 <sT0p> Also EU has just launched extra crypto regulations
20:45:19 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> yea we will see
20:45:22 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> sadly
20:45:24 <sT0p> but they can't seem to actually stop bankers and politicans from fraud
20:45:31 <sT0p> with fiat currency
20:45:39 <sT0p> it's such a scam
20:46:13 <sT0p> in my book it is the behavior that should be regulated (and it already is), not the tool
20:46:15 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> 🥲😥😟😢😨😰
20:46:39 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> Hope they have a plan
20:47:00 <sT0p> it's like saying oh cars with electric engines should be regulated differently than cars on gasoline
20:47:24 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> lets hope so
20:47:28 <sT0p> nomatter what your car uses for fuel, speeding is still speeding, innit
20:47:43 <sT0p> imho same should apply to money
20:47:47 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> withdraw if you have coins lol
20:47:57 <sT0p> I don't uses CEXes
20:48:06 <m-relay> <x​mrfamily:matrix.org> still have till nov for that
20:48:09 <sT0p> I'm not worried for me
20:48:15 <sT0p> but for the newbies
20:48:38 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> 🥲😥
20:48:41 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> 👍️🫠
20:49:07 <sT0p> I have this theory... traditionally older men/women ruled the world, because the world was evolving slowly
20:49:22 <sT0p> but since the internet, the world goes too fast for old people
20:49:45 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> I'm lucky, I've been a cryptoboomer since iike the 2010s so not many places to worry about.
20:49:47 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> Last time I had a balance where I didnt control the keys was probably over 10 years ago
20:50:02 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> Missed out on some fun I suppose
20:50:03 <sT0p> same here
20:50:05 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> nice
20:50:15 <sT0p> I lost a few bucks on mt gox
20:50:19 <sT0p> that's it
20:50:22 <sT0p> they
20:50:31 <sT0p> 're even trying to repay me, which is nuts :D
20:50:35 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> Only ever had like $100 in ETH in total 😂
20:50:51 <m-relay> <0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> lol
20:50:52 <sT0p> so all these people talking about danger and unregulated exchanges
20:50:57 <sT0p> not in Japan bro
20:51:14 <sT0p> unregulated or not, they will find a way to reimburse you even if it takes a decade
20:51:29 <sT0p> even regulated banks wouldn't try that hard
20:51:32 <m-relay> <a​xmasta:matrix.org> I feel for the folks trying to sort it out now
20:51:59 <sT0p> for some I do too, for some I don't
20:52:24 <sT0p> you can't imagine how many people I tried to explain "not your keys not your crypto" and they're like "nah, binance is cool"
20:53:34 <sT0p> You know no two penises and vags are the same, so I think we should use that for KYC, impossible to crack
20:55:43 <great_taste> but when you send a dick pic you're exposing your private key
20:55:51 <sT0p> :D
20:56:16 <sT0p> I guess you can protect it with penisring signatures
20:56:27 <great_taste> heh
20:58:01 <sT0p> Someone here has good experience with unstoppable swaps or smth?
21:09:47 <m-relay> <3​21bob321:monero.social> Rav did i think
21:09:57 <m-relay> <3​21bob321:monero.social> Gone tho
21:54:28 <TuxFaroTheGreat> nioCat thanks bud
22:09:16 <aaabbb> how much benefit does "fcmp" provide over the current 16 rings?
22:22:52 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> insane benefits
22:23:25 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> meaning full privacy and full resiliency against actual statistical attacks
23:34:36 <m-relay> <y​ifyiyerdo:matrix.org> https://monero.town/post/3135463