00:20:07 😅 00:42:35 nothing? wdym? 00:45:26 <321bob321:monero.social> Welfare check 04:43:15 Markets was spammed for a long time w/o any resistance afaik 04:56:30 <321bob321:monero.social> It was a matrix server load test 04:56:39 <321bob321:monero.social> And we pasted! 04:56:49 <321bob321:monero.social> Passed* 05:32:01 Just read that yesterday some people reported problems with the "Monero Dev" Matrix room 05:32:44 I have also problems in Element in Chrome: The room stopped to update some time yesterday and hasn't recovered so far. 05:33:11 Wanted to leave and re-join, only to be greeted by a warning that I would need an invite to re-join, so refrained from doing so 05:33:51 (as a way to hopefully force refresh, and/or getting it to work again) 05:35:04 Ah, no, it stopped already to update Wednesday 06:13:47 <321bob321:monero.social> just open the rooms and have a proper bot and take it like a man. Locking them does nothing trust me 06:21:14 Idk why theyre locked 06:21:42 All that says is that some 12 year old won 06:22:11 The guy literally told me directly that his goal was goal was to force us to make all rooms invite-only 06:22:19 <321bob321:monero.social> exactly 06:23:27 none of the rooms that i mod/admin are invite-only. Thats a nice stop-gap for when things get out of hand or youre busy, but its a non-solution 06:24:52 Anyone who thinks that its ok to have rooms locks down for weeks, doesnt understand that there are only 52 weeks in a year. That is a lot of potential loss of productivity by excluding outsiders from contributing 06:24:54 Diego 06:24:57 Open her up 06:33:05 <321bob321:monero.social> thats what she said 07:30:47 ofrnxmr 09:23:46 We seems to experience the exact same issue. If the moderator kick don't work, I will make an IRC account. 09:48:24 what hashrate level is not worth solomining? 09:49:57 "what hashrate level is not worth solomining?" <--- you should answer that on your own, as it depends on your subjective preferences around cost vs. benefit 10:04:45 k4r4b3y, yeah. Just wondering at which point one is basically not going to get a reward, even if there is a non 0 chance 10:12:20 Hi, I have never bought any cryptocurrency before. Can monero viably be used as normal currency for purchases of less than 100usd. Like if I want to buy something for maybe just 10usd worth of monero. Does it make any sense to use it like that? 10:16:08 Yeah, absolutely, I do that. The fees are very small. 10:16:22 Hmmm okay 10:16:48 meidam: yes you can use Monero to make small purchases 10:16:56 I regularly use XMR to pay for my 3 bucks VPS bills 10:17:01 I don't remember how much, either cents or fractions of them. Just a sum you don't notice. 10:17:30 3 bucks? Where do you get such a VPS? Seems like everyone accepting XMR raised their prices... That's cool. 10:17:35 kyun.host 10:17:40 get a danbo 10:17:42 Ah. 10:17:46 I have considered if it made sense to try buying crypto currency to use as money and Monero is the one that find myself most interested in. I might be a bit influenced by the youtuber mental outlaw in that regard 10:17:52 they give you 10 percent discount when you pay with xmr 10:18:11 How is the experience? Are they reliable? 10:18:21 meidam: mental outlaw is cool 10:18:29 BlueyHealer: kyun works for me 10:18:37 I host karapara.kyun.li on there 10:18:58 meidam, yeah, right now Monero is the main one used as a currency, LTC might be more widespread but it doesn't have the privacy protections. 10:19:07 k4r4b3y, okay, TIL! 10:19:12 Could be cool trying to use xmr to pay for mullvad vpn instead of using paypal, like I do now 10:19:21 LTC is an onboarding coin into XMR. 10:19:27 XMR is the real deal. 10:19:38 k4r4b3y, that too, but I thought more about all the services not accepting XMR. 10:19:56 XMR is widespread but not as widespread as it could be. 10:20:35 Like some domain registrars (although I paid for mine in XMR too). You can find these for XMR but it is just not as common. 10:20:46 meidam, good luck with this! 10:21:42 There does seem to be a lot to get into before buying anything... Like all the wallets and exchanges and stuff... 10:22:29 It's of course good to have a good password and 2fa, but it's not like you also need to use a vpn everytime you use it, right? 10:33:04 Well, there has recently been a leak of a video about how Monero gets traced, and a large part in that were KYC exchanges cooperating with the tracing company, as well as compromised nodes. So yeah, if you use a remote node, it would be a good idea to use an .onion one. 10:35:42 but he says a lot of misinfo 10:36:37 How much money would you have in monero at a time? 10:37:51 as much as possible 10:39:13 https://monero.garden/1-manual-for-users/get_started 10:39:20 good guide 10:41:31 basses, haven't watched him, what misinfo? 10:44:24 BlueyHealer: you can watch it here: https://vimeo.com/1009284260 10:44:26 VPN -> Tor is bad 10:44:52 and https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/16334-mental-outlaw-shilling-false-cybernews-article 10:46:12 Wrong 10:46:35 Tor foundation even had to make an issue about it 10:46:40 On gitlab 10:47:12 It doesn't worsen your opsec but just don't improve it either 10:47:13 ik, check https://www.privacyguides.org/en/advanced/tor-overview/#safely-connecting-to-tor 10:47:19 it does 10:47:30 improve your opsec 10:47:32 Oh my bad i misread 10:47:57 np, it is not Tor over Vpn 10:48:34 <321bob321:monero.social> https://gitlab.torproject.org/legacy/trac/-/wikis/doc/TorPlusVPN 10:48:49 So you saying that tor over vpn is not bad? 10:49:16 Thanks for the link to the get started with monero thing btw, basses 10:49:47 np, it is not vpn over tor 10:49:48 syntheticbird, I am still figuring out if it introduces weak points. Because a VPN (like a VLESS setup) might be more stable than a bridge so would make sense to use it. 10:50:26 vpn over tor is bad, I just made the same mistake as Syn lol 10:50:48 VPN over Tor? Not sure how you would even do so but I guess it does have a usecase, as long as i 10:50:48 it is strictly one VPN per identity. Just for services that block Tor. 10:51:04 that's why I say VPN -> Tor to not confuse myself and readers 10:52:01 Yeah. 10:52:38 Right now it has been a while of me using the same bridge, but sometimes I go through multiples of them in a short period. 10:52:38 SyntheticBird sorry I edited it. connecting to Tor then VPN is bad 10:53:30 Yeah, just still figuring out if it introduces *extra* risk if it is not for OPSEC but just because your ISP is obnoxious about blocking Tor. Not bad here but, say, in China? 10:54:13 I think I do okay with being private. At least better than some. But I am probably terrible compared to you guys 10:54:58 have you read the privacyguides link I sent earlier? 10:55:16 meidam, nah, I am a noob myself. 10:56:09 basses, ah, now see that. Missed it. 10:56:30 if you read privacyguides you probably covered 80% of privacy topics, hand out around more in their room or grapheneos room then you will have avery great knowledge 10:56:44 hang out* 10:57:38 everyone please switch to matrix so I can edit messages without it becoming irritating in IRC 😭 10:57:53 Nah, it is fine) 10:58:02 Understandable at least. 10:58:17 ok good 10:58:47 I borked my Matrix server so now thinking about switching to Synapse, but I have 1 gig RAM total plus the same Swap, so idk how it would work out. 11:00:21 I have a matrix account, but where do I find you, basses? 11:00:39 (used to use Conduit) 11:00:42 I barely use matrix these days... 11:01:20 I prefer IRC because a bouncer is lighter and doesn't eat up disk space. 11:01:25 I use element as a client. Do you guys have any other client recommendation for matrix? 11:01:28 join this room on matrix 11:01:45 meidam, I use Cinny because not Electron. 11:02:01 Nheko for efficiency 11:02:14 Element have the best UI tho 11:02:27 Matrix seems to load messages slowly. But that might be because I have been using element, idk 11:03:01 nheko is fast 11:03:19 built with Qt C++ 11:03:20 I use weechat for IRC and am pretty sure that it has a matrix plugin, but I haven't figured out how to install it 11:03:30 Has also been a while since I tried 11:17:09 Yeah, that too! Switched when I thought Nheko was causing problems but it was apparently just me messing up the server. 13:06:18 wtf why is it so good? https://pod.xmr.fan/pod/2024-10-11 13:20:31 Can someone give me the link of price chat for Monero in Matrix? 13:21:47 #monero-markets:monero.social 13:22:27 I'm still banned there. Smh 13:22:40 I have been trying to replicate this using docker networking 13:23:15 And what is the monero version of this channel? 13:23:18 It was a good bit of software I’m not yet sure why it’s considered legacy 13:23:20 I mean matrix version 14:15:10 Monero Markets 14:15:49 Says I am not invited to this room, interesting. 14:16:26 Now you are. 😉 14:17:10 I can’t imagine what it’s like in that room 14:17:11 https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/monero.social/KSwZbuwSyODlrhNOLBXcnduG 14:17:14 Fuck Matrix. 14:17:56 Crypto bros with their ands all over eachothers asses selling their new trading bot method 14:18:06 Crypto bros with their hands all over eachothers asses selling their new trading bot method 14:20:14 Where was my ping? Don't have the time right now to scroll up to find. 14:20:48 Same just happened to me, probably matrix home server 14:20:55 Your boss pinged you. Diego Salazar 14:21:12 He gave you his new order. 😂😂 14:21:27 You can use the search future in public (not E2EE) rooms. 14:21:42 You can use the search feature in public (not E2EE) rooms. 14:21:43 Ah 14:21:59 The invite-only is definitely not intended to be a permanent thing. 14:25:56 mweb for ltc in stackwallet wen 14:26:40 cakewallet seems to have it 👀 14:26:52 There are too many wallets... 14:27:17 meidam: if you are a newcomer, I recommend feaether wallet on desktop 14:27:29 hmmm okay 14:27:35 Second that. 14:27:38 start here: https://karapara.kyun.li/wiki/feather-wallet/ 14:28:30 I have to get it through tor? 14:29:39 No, you don't have to. Depends on your opsec requirements :) 14:29:44 And I can even use the wallet through at tor bridge? huh 14:30:33 opsec requirements? As in what I want to use my monero on? rbrunner. I know what opsec is, I am not questioning that 14:30:43 I use Tor for mine just because surveillance like shown in the Chainalysis vid is passive, it doesn't subtract from anything anyway. 14:31:21 meidam, yeah. In the torrc file, you can set a bridge option. 14:31:48 I understood "get it" as "how to download Feather Wallet for installing it". Maybe you don't want anybody to know you got the binary. 14:31:56 Tor is also blocked for direct access for you? 14:32:26 BlueyHealer: Can I use feather wallet with a tor bridge on my bare metal linux machine and browse the clear web at the same time on a normal browser, without it being a viability? 14:32:31 The file is small anyway, I'd do it through Tor anyway just to leave less of a trace. 14:32:48 Yes, that is how I meant it, rbrunner 14:32:54 meidam, yeah, system Tor can work in parallel with normal browsing. 14:33:16 Okay, BlueyHealer 14:34:10 And here we are talking about it on IRC. That does leave leave a trace, I'd say. I am not using IRC with a vpn.... 14:34:23 Or through tor, if that's even possible 14:35:07 Yeah, IRC is pretty much public, even the message of the day says "People can & do log this channel". 14:35:30 Through Tor - some networks are fine, but Libera needs prior registration. 14:35:49 Yes. I even talk on Matrix, imagine that. Because "leaving traces" is, in my particular case, acceptable. Your mileage may vary :) 14:36:08 https://tor.stackexchange.com/questions/3924/how-do-i-add-obfs3-bridges-in-torrc - the question is old, now the bridges are obfs4 (plus snowflake/meek/webtunnel), but the overall syntax is still like this. 14:38:18 Wait, more like ClientTransportPlugin obfs4 exec /usr/bin/obfs4proxy managed, yeah. And brodges are "Bridge ". 14:39:27 rbrunner: It's also pretty much okay for me I'd say 14:40:06 BlueyHealer, I have no idea where to find bridges to use. Or anything about changing them regularly or whatever. But maybe that website has guides on that as well 14:41:09 https://bridges.torproject.org/ 14:41:22 Also, you can get them right in your Tor Browser. 14:42:50 Plus there are some other methods of getting them - https://tb-manual.torproject.org/bridges/ 14:43:36 I tried something with bridges on tails I think. But I feel like they maybe didn't work 14:43:41 I don't remember 14:44:43 Yeah, bridges stop working a lot. I have been using the same one for a while but know it's luck - there are times when you have to go through multiple of them in a short period. Blocking them is an ongoing effort. 14:45:06 Just wonder: can you access Tor normally? 14:45:30 I always feel like one shouldn't just use the tor browser on bare metal. Like it should either be on tails os on a usb or on a vm. maybe even whonix vm. I have used a whonix vm before 14:46:14 Depends on activity. I use Tor for low-sensitivity one-time lookups so I have it on bare metal. But if you're at least somewhat fearful - yeah, Tails or Whonix makes sense. 14:46:23 But that's just what it feels like from what I think I've heard. I don't know if there are ways of using it on bare metal that are safe 14:46:43 hmm okay 14:49:28 Again - depends on what you're doing in said Tor Browser) 14:49:52 Also, you can use Tor Browser as a proxy instead of system Tor if you want bridges more easily. 14:56:34 okay 15:06:05 Hi guys 15:06:32 Hi Juliu 15:06:58 Hey kewbit, what's new? 15:07:25 Tbh a lot, if you thinking in the space of haveno 15:07:32 Tbh a lot, if your thinking in the space of haveno 15:07:37 What is haveno? 15:08:11 :O have you not heard? It’s the best way to exchange fiat for XMR in the entire world 15:09:39 I don't have any XMRs 15:14:12 That’s a shame 15:30:19 Don't know 15:35:19 You have other crypto? 15:45:00 Not anymore. I had to sell it all 16:17:37 Hi as2333 16:18:57 hey Juliu 16:19:21 What's new? 16:22:35 I want it in, yeah. We'll look into it soon. 19:28:46 <321bob321:monero.social> Point towards mods 19:29:50 I blame Matrix, Python and Israel. 19:31:46 more Zcash than Israel tbh. 19:32:25 python is tolerable 19:32:59 you meant intolerable. 19:33:43 compared to the other two things you mentioned, python is perfection 19:36:33 Ah as2333, you have a shit take but you're speaking to my sentiments. I can only agree on this one. 19:37:24 s/shit take/bad take 19:37:33 not shit, its a bad word. 19:43:00 Electric coin company really funded so many open source projects its shocking. 19:43:59 Any that aren't a scam? 19:44:28 Arti? (Tor rust implementation) 19:44:54 How's Tor not a scam? 19:45:17 If there is an intellectual humanoids in here that have successfully setup a macOS virtual box VM on an Ubuntu desktop host, I would love to hear from you! 19:46:02 AMD processor 19:46:04 Juliu pure opinion on that. I still find Tor useful these days 19:46:23 That doesn't answer my question 19:46:31 and relatively sound. 19:46:52 sound? 19:47:28 Yeah like, the protocol and implementation make sense. The tor foundation may be a scam but the Tor project/Tor software make sense and is useful is what I'm trying to convey 19:47:52 kewbit: good luck. 19:48:20 How is cryptography sound? I don't hear anything 19:49:11 Definition of sound: 19:49:13 > Based on valid reasoning; having no logical flaws: synonym: valid. 19:49:34 Cryptography isn't based on anything except for wrong assumptions 19:50:04 pardon me 19:50:37 Which part should I pardon? 19:51:10 last sentence you just said. I don't understand. 19:51:53 How can I pardon you for what I said? That makes no sense 19:52:11 What don't you understand? 19:53:58 Juliu 19:53:59 pardon me meaning: 19:54:01 > (US) Polite expression to get someone to repeat. 19:54:03 you says: Cryptography isn't based on anything. Unless if it contains wrong assumptions? 19:54:09 s/> you/you/ 19:54:35 Actually I said 19:54:36 Cryptography isn't based on anything except for wrong assumptions 19:55:58 Yes Juliu but that sentence is ambiguous. I see two meanings: 19:55:59 - Cryptography isn't based on anything. Unless if it contains wrong assumptions. 19:56:01 - Cryptography isn't based on anything but wrong assumptions. 19:56:03 Meaning that the only thing cryptography is based on is wrong assumptions, which is pretty much as good as being based on nothing 19:56:12 ah ok 19:56:20 well I disagree 19:56:33 completely 19:56:48 what do you call wrong assumptions? 19:56:49 You can, but at least you have to admit that it's based on unproven assumptions, since this is a fact 19:57:28 Wanna hear some of the unproven and likely wrong assumption that for example Bitcoin is based on? 19:57:43 *assumptionS 19:58:15 no i don't care. Enlight me dear Juliu on what wrong assumptions are cryptography based upon? 19:58:38 So what is it, wanting to be enlightened or not caring? 19:59:26 enlightened on your seemingly very straight opinion on the theory. While not caring that much about implementation tomfooleries. 19:59:30 Ok, here's 4 unproven assumptions that Bitcoin is based on, and that I consider likely wrong: 19:59:34 P is not NP 19:59:47 One-was functions exist 19:59:56 Cryptographic one-way functions exist 20:00:06 SHA256 is a cryptographic one-way function 20:00:13 my life is based on unproven assumption yet here I am 20:00:31 nioCat, sure, but no one claimed you to be safe and proven 20:01:08 nothing is safe, heat death is coming 20:01:54 There's even more assumptions, like something about strong cryptographic one-way functions, I think. And about how we choose our primes for integer factorization, or probably also something equivalent for elliptic curves 20:02:03 one-way functions exist de facto - otherwise you should be able to easily compute the invereses - but you obviously can't. 20:02:04 nioCat, no, heat death is a scam as well 20:02:21 as2333, yes, you can easily compute the inverse 20:02:37 go ahead then Juliu - and send me some of the 'profits' 20:02:58 Dear Juliu, these are not even assumptions cryptography is based upon. The whole model of a cryptosystem is based on the computational ability of an attacker. On which we formally verify that one cannot break in polynomial time using any probabilistic algorithm respecting some conditions. What you're saying is: *We're going to find a solution to break it at some point. So it is in 20:02:59 secure.* NO JOKE JULIU. THAT'S THE WHOLE CONCEPT. THAT ISN'T WHAT CRYPTOGRAPHY IS SUPPOSED TO RESOLVE. 20:03:06 nioCat, if you're interested in that topic, I suggest you listen to what Roger Penrose has to say about the "big bang" and the "heat death of the universe" 20:03:46 The only wrong assumption here is thinking a cryptosystem will never be break. 20:03:54 why, everyone is incorrect 20:03:58 syntheticbird, if you had proven that, you'd get a million dollars since it's one of the unsolved Millennium Prize problems. Please think again! 20:04:21 nioCat, that's life. Most people are wrong 20:04:27 tf are you talking about. Juliu I'm not even trying to explain P=NP problem. 20:04:42 which is why I follow Cat 20:04:47 synth, I can write a program to break SHA256 in just 1 line of code 20:05:01 Juliu are you on drugs? 20:05:03 Juliu and if you can easily compute discrete logs or whatever you'd get a 'prize' of trillions so, again, do it and send us some free money. 20:05:49 synth, crypto systems requiring a superexponential time to be broken on average requires P to be unequal NP. P = NP would automatically mean that no crypto system works 20:05:55 also I stopped listening to roger long ago 20:06:14 I'm never on drugs. I just know what I'm talking about 20:06:23 you obviously don't 20:06:26 nioCat, why's that? He has some nice ideas 20:07:15 as2333, it's not my fault you guys can't read. I mean, go to the fucking wikipedia article on one-way functions. In the top right corner there's a fat box telling us right away that their existence is an unsolved problem 20:08:15 Julius water torture begins with "Hi"... starts getting unbearable when "P=NP" is mentioned, and then im begging for it to stop when the R word is mentioned 20:08:19 copypasting wikimierda - trolling can't any more stupid than that 20:09:02 plowsof, I haven't even started telling that that electricity does not flow in circles, that gravity is an illusion, or that we're living in an ice age since over 100k years 20:09:09 Ok Juliu, so for you: We've not yet proven that P=/=NP so any cryptosystem is broken. That is stupid. We've also not yet proven that P=NP, so there is no wrong assumptions yet. 20:09:18 ok now that stuff sounds interesting 20:09:47 unproven and wrong doesn't mean the same thing. 20:10:37 synth, you haven't proven that P != NP, that one-way functions exist, that SHA256 is a cryptographic one-way function, that the way you choose primes is a good idea, or any other of the many unproved assumptions that Bitcoin and all that cryptography hoax is based on 20:11:43 Yes, unproven and wrong is not the same. Which is why I corrected myself from "wrong" down to "unproven (and likely wrong)" 20:12:10 At least you have to admit it's all unproven fuckery and not one bit mathematical 20:13:11 plowsof, it's fun torturing people by telling the truth all the time. You should try it. They're going nuts 20:13:59 zamn 20:14:35 Remember when they all thought that Earth was flat, and then someone came and disproved it? Me neither, since this never happened 20:15:56 as2333, who is the real troll: The guy who says that P vs NP isn't proven either way, or they guy who constantly acts as if P != NP was a proven fact? 20:16:13 assumption is a key word here 20:16:21 I won't say anything else 20:16:39 Yes, crypto is based on many unproven assumptions, all of which could be untrue 20:17:06