02:17:21 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> I heard on a Bitcoin podcast today that a Bitcoin insurance product through Lloyds just got approved
02:18:12 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> And apparently if coins are lost through theft etc, and the insurance company reimburse, then the stolen coins legally become property of the insurance company
02:18:24 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> Cc articmine
02:19:25 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> It was on rabbit hole recap in this week
02:20:33 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> I don’t remember the name of the other company involved.  It sounded like a very new offering though for corporate as well as 5$ wrench attack recipients.
02:21:10 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> https://finance.yahoo.com/news/anchorwatch-becomes-lloyds-london-coverholder-202100569.html
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08:35:25 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:monero.social> this sounds like a great incentive to hunt down your own clients
08:36:02 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:monero.social> "hey, we give you back 50% of your coins value but if we can get them back their ours"
08:36:29 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:monero.social> do a fake data leak
08:36:51 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:monero.social> and then send gangs after your clients to get their coins at a steep discount
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08:42:45 <m-relay> <c​rispycat:calitabby.net> https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/calitabby.net/kILPAoTmDueNQVgBARvOBlMD
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08:45:31 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:matrix.org> yeah
09:29:53 <m-relay> <3​21bob321:monero.social> Here we go
09:30:43 <BlueyHealer> What benefit do they get from this?
09:35:52 <m-relay> <r​ottenwheel:unredacted.org> BlueyHealer compensate for their small penis.
11:11:21 <remiliascarlet> Spam attack.
12:17:28 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> plowsof thankful_for_day
12:17:29 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> hi
12:17:52 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> plowsof is thankful_for_day
12:19:11 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> No, thankful_for_today _is_ plowsof
12:19:35 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> thankful_for_day
12:19:41 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> plowsof
12:19:55 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Today*
12:20:09 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> day not today plowsof
12:20:55 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Yesterday
12:21:29 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> plowsof why make bitmonero
12:21:31 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> thankfulforday
12:21:38 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> thankful_for_day
12:22:29 <m-relay> <b​locboyy:matrix.org> Any Cashapp? Chime? Zelle? Btc? Usdt?Skrill? Apple Pay? Pay pal? Venmo? BOA? Wells Fargo? Join my channel
12:22:29 <m-relay> <b​locboyy:matrix.org> https://t.me/+zEFPK-AiVFEyZDM0
12:22:31 <m-relay> <b​locboyy:matrix.org> https://t.me/+zEFPK-AiVFEyZDM0
12:22:33 <m-relay> <b​locboyy:matrix.org> 
Got any of these
Chase?
BOA?
Wells Fargo?
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JOIN THE CHANNEL NOW TO GET PAID
Join the telegram channel✅
12:22:46 <BlueyHealer> moberator
12:23:00 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> t.me + matrix.org ur opsec (if not bot) police coming soon
12:23:09 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> I call them for u
12:24:00 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> plowsof why make bitmonero thankful_for_day
12:25:49 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> 🧞
12:26:26 <plowsof> 🧚
12:26:48 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> thankful_for_day thank you
12:27:16 <plowsof> i just wanted people to notice me, is that such a crime?? im sorry 
12:27:44 <m-relay> <z​:rollenspiel.chat> ok sorry
13:24:11 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> They cover lost coins 1:1, and they send the government backed gangs after the innocent coinbase user who winds up on receiving end of these coins from the thief.  The big piece of this insurance is the ability to blacklist of stolen coins.
13:25:27 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> This will probably have positive effect on price as coins go out of circulation and coins are repurchased for reimburse
15:49:08 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> anyone tried building monerujo latest release from source? there seems to be an issue https://github.com/m2049r/xmrwallet/issues/974
15:55:33 <m-relay> <c​t:xmr.mx> maybe ask in Monerujo ?
15:58:10 <rbrunner> I don't understand that 974 issue at all, and got from a discussion that this is probably a misunderstanding, or somebody not knowing what they do
16:01:17 <rbrunner> Also note the title of that issue, it's not "Can't compile", it's "Add to f-droid.org repo"
16:04:39 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Licaon on an fdroid maintainer
16:05:13 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> They are trying to add monerujo to fdroid's reproducible build server
16:05:42 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Licaon is an fdroid maintainer
16:06:25 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> They tested the build as-is and it doesnt work, so they posted an issue to figure out what is missing from the repo to allow building via ci
16:07:30 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> monerujo dev replies to the issue were terrible and didn't help with OP's questions at all
16:09:05 <rbrunner> I am not terribly close to Monerujo, but even *I* know that the main dev decided *long ago* that they don't want to add to f-droid.org
16:10:01 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> M2049r's "i doubt this will ever get merged" is either "this isnt foss enough" or "i dont think fdroid would merge". If the latter, he probably doesnt know that licaon is a maintainer
16:10:14 <rbrunner> And every few months somebody flies in and asks that, and when the dev tells that he doesn't want, things tend to get ugly
16:11:09 <rbrunner> Sorry, "this is not FOSS enough" is simply bullshit
16:11:22 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> linsui created an f-droid capable session messenger fork, for example. I think licaon is doing the same. But step 1 is "get dev's permission", so licaon stopped on account of m2049r's NACK-leaning comment
16:12:04 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Fdroid.org has strict guidelines about libs and uses reproducible build process
16:12:26 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> If exolix stuff isnt foss, than it cant ship
16:12:58 <rbrunner> All very well, but deducting from problems adding to f-droid that Monerujo is not compilable under other circumstances isn't valid
16:13:02 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Same reason torbrowser isn't in fdroid. Non-free dependencies
16:14:01 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> The deducting was interpretation (or mis) of m2049r's comment
16:14:11 <rbrunner> Pretty sure for a regular, non-reproducible Monerujo build you don't have to build all dependencies as well, right?
16:14:23 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Either he doesnt want it there, or its incompatible due to not being totally foss
16:14:54 <rbrunner> Or both
16:15:07 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> As i said, linsui dis a session messenger fork because session shipped non-free stuff (like fcm and a cryptolib that didnt have source available)
16:15:44 <rbrunner> What do you mean exactly with "ship"?
16:15:52 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> So licaon can (likely easily) create a foss monerujo lib (which is what it appears he/she's attempting), but stopped because of NACK from m2049r
16:16:02 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Session messenger isnt foss
16:16:24 <rbrunner> The messenger itself, or some third-party external dependencies?
16:16:27 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> It includes software that doesn't gave source available and some proprietary
16:16:46 <rbrunner> From the same people that program the messenger?
16:17:35 <rbrunner> So for some parts of their own messenger, developed by them, they say "Nope, you don't get the source for *that*"
16:17:48 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Yes
16:18:11 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Also google firecloud messenging
16:18:13 <rbrunner> Ok. Is there a suspicion that the situation with Monerujo might be the same?
16:18:34 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> The lib that session didnt provide source for, iirc, was a netcipher fork
16:19:13 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Linsui replaced it with a foss version, removed google fcm, and pushed a truly foss version of session to fdroid
16:19:29 <rbrunner> Frankly, I don't care much about non-Monero things like these messengers. If people try to throw mud at Monerujo without merit, I care very much.
16:19:56 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> they don't require builds to be reproducible but encourages devs to support it afaik.
16:20:01 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I think "suspicion" is the wrong word
16:20:35 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> It simple fails to build reproducibly, and  licaon is trying to make it build so it can be included in fdroid
16:21:40 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> M2049r, instead of helping, just responded "I doubt this would ever get merged"
16:21:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Which leads to "why?"
16:22:03 <rbrunner> So in this discussion we did not yet gain any knowledge about whether Monerujo currently builds non-reproducibly or not
16:22:16 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Licaon, an fdroid maintainer, is themself trying to get it merged. Usually the job of the dev
16:22:34 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> It doesnt build reproducibly
16:22:42 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> We know that and have for years
16:23:06 <rbrunner> But it builds
16:23:32 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> yes, but has to build reproducibly to be eligible for fdroid
16:24:18 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Monero gui builds. Monero gui isnt reproducible
16:24:28 <rbrunner> Right. "It doesn't build" is a quite heavy accusation, and I think we should be careful not to let it grow if that accusation is not true.
16:24:29 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Feather builds. Feather is reproducible
16:24:43 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> https://reproducible-builds.org/
16:25:10 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> There are no reproducible monero mobile wallets
16:25:18 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Who said "it doesnt build"?
16:25:24 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> it definitely builds
16:25:45 <rbrunner> Alright. We already get a nice Android Monero wallet more or less for free. We don't get it reproducible as it seems, and we don't get it on f-droid.org
16:25:53 <rbrunner> Well, ok, that's life. It goes on.
16:26:51 <rbrunner> From the backlog, question from basses: " anyone tried building monerujo latest release from source? there seems to be an issue https://github.com/m2049r/xmrwallet/issues/974"
16:27:29 <rbrunner> So we can answer the question: There is no issue for a standard build
16:27:32 <rbrunner> Probably
16:27:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Theres no reason why we shouldnt allow liacon to pursue the reproducible build
16:28:00 <rbrunner> Fully agree.
16:28:14 <rbrunner> They are just on their own
16:28:52 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Fdroid maintainers dont often so the work for devs
16:28:57 <rbrunner> They can even fork and make "Monerujo-R" with "R" for "Reproducible"
16:29:17 <rbrunner> Yeah, why should they?
16:29:34 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Its up to the devs to create reproducible branches for fdroid to build from. Izzysoft helped cake, and cake / justin didnt want to go that route
16:29:49 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Linsui did session, when session backed out of it
16:30:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I think we should applaud liacon, linsui and izzy for going out of their way to help ship secure privacy tools
16:31:04 <rbrunner> All very well. It's just dangerous if people with a limited technical background read discussions like the one we have right now, or that 974
16:31:11 <rbrunner> and get away with wrong impressions
16:31:48 <rbrunner> "I think we should applaud liacon" I help applauding, that's not what irks me
16:32:37 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I see. Its the wording of "unable to build" question
16:33:41 <rbrunner> But a nice effect of this discussion is that now I understand that 974 issue, and that's a win for me. Thanks!
16:33:48 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> As licaon says, they are working on recipe for fdroid and running into some problems. But m2049r NACK means that licaon cant submit without permission, so its dead unless m2049r green lights it
16:34:53 <rbrunner> Teachers won't explain you in elementary school what a "recipe for fdroid" is :)
16:37:24 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Thats a typr of soup, isnt it?
16:39:34 <plowsof> NACK reproducible 😄
16:41:34 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> anhdres  can you let m2049r know that licaon is an fdroid maintainer? And greenlight the build?
16:41:58 <rbrunner> Well, good luck with that ...
16:42:21 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> (not just some noob who wants to force m2049r to modify monerujo, but a dev who wants help understanding the roadblocks)
16:43:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> For session, all it took was for keejef to say "sure. Do what you want, but label it as oxen unofficial"
16:43:51 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Now we have the only free / foss version of session in fdroid and has been for years
16:43:58 <plowsof> NACK reproducible builds 😄
16:44:47 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> The "recipe" removes fcm and replaces netcipher (iirc)
16:44:50 <plowsof> Sorry for the echo*
16:45:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Don't be sorry lol. Cake NACK'd too
16:46:14 <plowsof> A fork without our referral / api keys thats reproducible? NACK 
16:46:48 <rbrunner> As far as I know and understand, A) m2049r doesn't want Monerujo on f-droid.org, and B) he doesn't tell why not. If anybody is worried by that, then well, take another wallet, problem solved.
16:48:40 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> https://github.com/cake-tech/cake_wallet/issues/113#issuecomment-1143704303
16:49:25 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Problem not solved, sir. There are 0 mobile monero wallets that are reproducible
16:49:37 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> And 2 desktop ones: cli and feather
16:50:26 <rbrunner> How bad is that, really, if I can compile the wallet myself?
16:50:57 <rbrunner> It's clearly not the same, ok, ok, but how bad?
16:52:56 <rbrunner> And well, do you already know m2049r's stance regarding reproducible builds per se, f-droid or not?
16:52:56 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Look at mysu
16:53:05 <plowsof> Why does monero bother with gitian process 
16:53:13 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> When the dev took the repo down, only 1 person had a copy. Aka, NOBODY actually tried to build it
16:53:15 <plowsof> And soon GUIX 
16:53:31 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Yes, he doesnt care about them.
16:53:47 <rbrunner> Bad luck then.
16:54:20 <rbrunner> For me this merely goes into the "can't have it all" bucket
16:55:30 <rbrunner> mysu was really its very own class of clusterfuck. A need for hunting down the source of a wallet because the dev calls it quits? Jesus.
16:56:20 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> https://github.com/m2049r/xmrwallet/issues/57#issuecomment-382763008
16:57:02 <rbrunner> 2018
16:58:20 <rbrunner> m2049r should set up a script that posts once every month to here, to Reddit, and X "Sorry, no f-droid.org for you. Live with it"
16:59:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> That's not the comment i was looking for
17:03:43 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I can't find it, but he said something like "Even if you build it yourself, there is no trustless pipeline. reproducibility doesnt add security. you either read every line of code or you trust the dev" or something like that
17:05:18 <rbrunner> Yeah, you can build backdoors reproducibly, I am sure. And trojans :)
17:06:48 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> If you’re not rewriting each line of code in your own editor and building your own apps, you don’t deserve to use Monero
17:07:40 <rbrunner> That's what you take away from our discussion?
17:08:14 <rbrunner> Good job :)
17:09:04 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Hahaha
17:09:05 <rbrunner> Rewriting every second line would be enough, by the way.
17:09:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> rbrunner. Right? Nobody read mysu's source code. Nobody even had a copy
17:10:25 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Dont writr the code.. dont even look need to look at it tbh. Just trust that because the code was posted, that its 100% clean
17:16:04 <m-relay> <a​nhdres:matrix.org> I've already pinged him again about this conversation. I'm not even discussing this F-Droid thing because it's over my technical level.
17:16:57 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> just about the issue 974 iirc
17:24:04 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> bruh there's a copy and forked with minimal commits
17:24:36 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> it is because of dev's weird decision to only allow source code to be behind an onion address
17:29:35 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Bruh nothinf
17:30:07 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Nobody had a copy of the latest release, meaning nobody forked the repo
17:31:00 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> r4v3r23 had a copy of a recent version, due to work on anonero
17:31:08 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 0 users of the wallet forked the repo
17:32:17 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> An onion address makes 0 difference. You could only download the app from onion/i2p but none of those users every thought to clone the repo
17:33:00 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> And.. dont you use an iphone?
17:44:26 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:matrix.org> https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/wQHRrqiXKVllkTvvglPrWLkc
17:44:33 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:matrix.org> coinmarketcap is cooked
18:17:17 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> how do u know?
18:18:11 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> there are probably a handful of people that have it but only anonero dev uploaded this frok to his codeberg acc
18:18:27 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> yeah and?
18:18:54 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> inaccessible for majority of users
18:19:47 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> ??? 100% of userbase were tor/i2p users
18:19:58 <m-relay> <r​ottenwheel:unredacted.org> No it isn't lol.
18:20:37 <m-relay> <r​ottenwheel:unredacted.org> Just in: rbrunner thinks asking for reproducible builds, or rather, having a FOSS project be reproducible builds isn't that big of a deal!
18:20:48 <m-relay> <r​ottenwheel:unredacted.org> What's next? Source available is the same as open source?
18:20:54 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> bruh are u seriously want to argue about this too when it is clear?
18:20:55 <m-relay> <r​ottenwheel:unredacted.org> Windows is the best operating system?
18:21:02 <m-relay> <r​ottenwheel:unredacted.org> Everyone should get an iPhone? 😂
18:21:15 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> yes, yes fr fr
18:22:50 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> only a handful of users downloaded the source code becomes of that exact reason
18:22:52 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> What is clear, that literally everyone larps about foss and users dont actual fork repos or read code?
18:23:00 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> only a handful of users downloaded the source code because of that exact reason
18:23:09 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Wrong
18:23:17 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> yes
18:23:21 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> only a handful of users downloaded the source code
18:23:21 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> fify
18:23:53 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> only a handful of users download source code
18:23:53 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> fixed***
18:24:02 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> I think the source code was even behind i2p that's why I didn't bother myself checking it out as I didn't have an i2p client
18:24:11 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> was browsing using Tor browser
18:24:51 <m-relay> <r​ottenwheel:unredacted.org> Ya.
18:25:02 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> how do u know?
18:25:22 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> that no one except anonero had a copy
18:27:02 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Because we looked for months?
18:27:33 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I had a very old copy. Nobody, incl anonero, had the latest release
18:28:06 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> u did? because I was who found it from anon's codeberg and gave it to rotten where he uploaded to other Git instances
18:28:43 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> mrcyjanek probably also had a copy as he was researching other mobile wallets source codes
18:31:50 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> https://bounties.monero.social/posts/151/2-809m-mysu-maintenance-and-further-development
18:32:00 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Wrong
18:32:10 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Lol bs
18:32:30 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I asked r4v3r and r4v3r had it on r4v3r's repo
18:32:32 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> idk if that was the latest build
18:32:44 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> it wasnt
18:33:02 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> R4v3r had it, not mrcyjanek. I asked cyjan too
18:33:41 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> yeah it was r4v3r23 https://codeberg.org/r4v3r23/mysu
18:39:36 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> not really - monerujo is under the apache 2 license so forks cannot use the name
18:41:32 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> It wouldn't really be a fork, would it?
18:41:53 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> It would just be a reproducible build pipeline for monerujo
18:43:23 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> The repo could still be hosted on one of your github branches, or could potentially be the main branch
18:43:40 <m-relay> <m​1r3dk:gnulinux.club> Hi there! I go by m1r3dk on the internet. I’m a security researcher with a deep passion for privacy and security. From the very beginning, I've been committed to exploring and advocating for secure digital practices.
18:44:04 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> ??? I can't find the exact channel and search doesn't help at all. rotten can confirm
18:44:08 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> How do you pronounce that
18:44:22 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> this is just not true - we have our own f-droid repo (which is in line with what f-droid is about). just like e.g. the guardian project
18:44:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Thats not inline
18:45:18 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> There are 2 diff types of fdroid servers/repos. Build servers and ones where you can drop drop an apk in
18:45:55 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> F-droid.org hosts a build server. Guardianproject ships non-foss binaries, like tor browser
18:46:43 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> And despite being there, the guardianproject repo is technically ineligible for inclusion in f-droid
18:46:58 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> (Due to shipping non-free libs)
18:48:13 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> F-droid is about 2 things. 
18:48:13 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 1. A self-hosted app store
18:48:15 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 2. A reproducible app store
18:48:17 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Or 3. A combination
18:49:12 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Licaton is trying to create a reproducible version of monerujo, so that monerujo can be included in f-droid
18:51:03 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> monerujo could likewise host the reproducible build server on their own, but would still need to figure out how to build it reproducibly. Liacon seems to have taken that upon themselves and simply seeks 1. Permission to post in fdroid 2. help with issues during the build
18:53:02 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> i am all for a reproducible build. it would still not be the build which would be deployed as we have api keys in there which won't be in git
18:55:14 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> and we don't want it to be on the main repo as we would lose control over the signing keys. which would also mean that that build would be the one to deploy to play store which would break all current installations and delete thousands of wallet
18:56:40 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> if we really need it in the main repo so people find it, maybe we should make a wrapper which basically adds the monerujo repo and installs from there
19:00:19 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> the point of the main repo is reproducibility, not convenience
19:03:20 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> if we have a reproducible (docker?) build, we don't need fdroid then. monero has a reproducible build without fdroid
19:03:31 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> The fdroid build wouldnt be the one deployed to play store. Plenty if apps are like this. Play store has free or pro version, fdroid has foss version. Either they conflict, or fdroid Use's a different package name and can be installed alongside
19:03:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Only cli does
19:04:04 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> and feather. Gui isnt reproducible
19:16:45 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> not true https://f-droid.org/2023/09/03/reproducible-builds-signing-keys-and-binary-repos.html
19:16:45 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> >All the years before, F-Droid created a dedicated key for each app to sign the published APKs, but now with reproducible builds F-Droid ships APKs that are signed by the upstream developer(s). Which proves to you that the developer confirmed: „this is what I intended to publish, this was built from my code“. And that it’s distributed by F-Droid tells you: „F-Droid confirm<clipped message>
19:16:47 <m-relay> <b​asses:matrix.org> s, too, that this is the APK built from the very code the developer provided“. So neither of the two could have „sneaked in“ something not contained in the app’s source code repository.
19:17:23 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> will read
19:26:34 <m-relay> <k​evino:tchncs.de> sidekick ded ?
19:27:10 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> why?
19:27:57 <m-relay> <k​evino:tchncs.de> wen bug fix ?
19:28:47 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> which bug?
19:28:47 <m-relay> <k​evino:tchncs.de> can't open the wallet , it just crashes
19:28:49 <m-relay> <k​evino:tchncs.de> https://github.com/m2049r/sidekick/issues/1
19:28:55 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> whats missing is PR to monero code to "claim" the enum
19:29:05 <m-relay> <k​evino:tchncs.de> opened since a month
19:29:41 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> been on vacation
19:30:13 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> and no android 14 device
19:30:14 <m-relay> <k​evino:tchncs.de> hmm i see
19:30:25 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> because: works for me :)
19:32:15 <m-relay> <k​evino:tchncs.de> i shifted to cupcake
19:32:27 <m-relay> <k​evino:tchncs.de> coz it works for me 🤪
19:32:52 <m-relay> <k​evino:tchncs.de> (honestly not tested yet)
19:33:57 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> hehe - the crash log in the issue is very helpful - will fix it asap
19:34:10 <m-relay> <m​2049r:matrix.org> ü
19:43:33 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Element x is one such app that, iirc, is built using elements key
21:47:35 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> Can someone get a hold of the Monero Twitter account and have it start a PR blitz.  Just say we very excited about FCMP and booba
21:58:30 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> No
21:58:45 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Are you implementing fcmp?
21:59:25 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> Are we not ?
22:00:08 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> are you**
22:00:27 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> My point is, you shouldnt count eggs before they hatch
22:01:07 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> Yes, but didn’t we do all of that on getmonero blog ?
22:01:10 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Pr blitz should start after a testnet is viable
22:01:32 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> Seraphis, fcmp++ , tryptichhh
22:01:36 <plowsof> im not implementing anything but expect it to be done Q1 2025 else i will let out an audible exhale 
22:01:42 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Weve been larping about setaphis for like 4yrs
22:02:08 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Ever heard of the boy who cried wolf?
22:02:12 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> Yup and it’s still 4 yrs away
22:02:42 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> Maybe the wolf is monero
22:02:50 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Some other blockchain might just take fcmp and integrate on mobilecoin or dero while we tweet about it
22:03:17 <plowsof> this is why wownero has to do it first, to prevent this
22:03:25 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> Good for them, our testnet 🤣
22:03:46 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> Let’s see too far away
22:03:50 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> precisely. Wownero should do it first
22:04:15 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> Is wow team ready
22:04:19 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> just like randomx. If not for wownero, we might still be debating randomx
22:04:34 <plowsof> FCMP is not currently on the wownero roadmap 
22:04:41 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Yes. But the rest of the code isnt
22:05:10 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> So yah, a year before them going mainnet ?
22:07:43 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> once it hits a usable testnet and bugs fixed, i imagine wow will put it on their mainnet
22:08:15 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I think there are a lot of logistical issues that may lead to a contentions HF
22:08:44 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Like the proposed limiting of inputs per tx to 8
22:24:06 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> 8 inputs ? How much can we do right now ?
22:27:30 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 146
22:28:15 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> MOOOOOONIIIIIIINNNNNN TIIIIMMMEEEE 🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🌑🌑🌑🌑🌑🌑
22:30:31 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Boriiiinng
22:30:34 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> 8 will be enough ? Or fcmp isn’t feasible above 8
22:30:50 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Its feasible
22:30:53 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> Still way below ath
22:31:10 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> haha true
22:31:12 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> i hate you
22:31:13 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> imo, "hell no". 8 is terrible UX
22:31:16 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> 146 to 8 is quite a downgrade
22:31:41 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> still below haveno UI price (203)
22:31:45 <m-relay> <h​ardenedsteel:monero.social> do we know why?
22:31:59 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> dave.jp conspiracy probably
22:32:30 <m-relay> <f​reddi99:matrix.org> told a friend to buy today, he said "ill wait for the dip". thanks, friend
22:32:34 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Becauae i said so
22:32:58 <m-relay> <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Everything else is up 100%, where tha heckin so you think people park profits
22:33:22 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> What does that mean ?
22:33:30 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> meme
23:10:03 <m-relay> <p​reland:monero.social> Hmm
23:10:13 <m-relay> <p​reland:monero.social> So I take it no one else knows why this is happening
23:13:21 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> If someone knew that means either two things:
23:13:21 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> - he can the see the future
23:13:23 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> - he traveled back in time
23:16:46 <m-relay> <s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> Will FCMP still be able to work if price goes above 150
23:17:31 <m-relay> <p​reland:monero.social> Eh; it’d be retrospective viewing in this case
23:17:31 <m-relay> <p​reland:monero.social> I’m just a bit skeptical of the price rn because I’ve been on and off watching the price for over a year and it has never went up this quickly
23:17:52 <m-relay> <r​avfx:xmr.mx> Yes it did in the past
23:17:56 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:matrix.org> good question
23:18:06 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> from the experience of numerous people in this community. spike like that always happens at the end of the year
23:18:09 <m-relay> <p​reland:monero.social> But not in the past year I don’t think
23:18:11 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:matrix.org> liquidity crunch imo
23:18:14 <m-relay> <3​21bob321:monero.social> Moon when
23:18:16 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:matrix.org> you cant buy it anywhere
23:18:23 <m-relay> <r​avfx:xmr.mx> not in the past year, indeed
23:18:25 <m-relay> <p​reland:monero.social> That’s….actually very plausible lol
23:19:10 <m-relay> <m​onerobull:matrix.org> 1 fatfingered 1M buy can pump us to the moon
23:19:19 <m-relay> <p​reland:monero.social> *on paper
23:19:44 <m-relay> <3​21bob321:monero.social> Thanks to the dev who put themselves on fire for the pump
23:19:53 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> *on papyrus
23:20:28 <m-relay> <p​reland:monero.social> Seeing how the price is going down as quickly as it went up I think it actually was a liquidity crunch, which was probably caused by the price reaching 180 naturally which tripped something somewhere
23:20:59 <m-relay> <p​reland:monero.social> (Note: not investment advice)
23:21:23 <m-relay> <s​yntheticbird:monero.social> (Note: as long as its smarter than me its investment advice)
23:22:14 <m-relay> <e​longated:matrix.org> It is liquidity crunch, and at the same time vendor systems automatically selling