01:00:58 Monero is a scam made by criminals, for criminals. Your network is now ours! 01:00:58 https://primal.net/e/note1xhwa4vfhq76vc5asxrkehvkh6xdx4c4cms3ancv62run0q84p5ys9quqg5 01:01:00 Monero is a scam made by criminals, for criminals. Your network is now ours! 01:01:02 https://primal.net/e/note1xhwa4vfhq76vc5asxrkehvkh6xdx4c4cms3ancv62run0q84p5ys9quqg5 01:01:04 Monero is a scam made by criminals, for criminals. Your network is now ours! 01:01:06 https://primal.net/e/note1xhwa4vfhq76vc5asxrkehvkh6xdx4c4cms3ancv62run0q84p5ys9quqg5 01:01:08 Monero is a scam made by criminals, for criminals. Your network is now ours! 01:01:10 https://primal.net/e/note1xhwa4vfhq76vc5asxrkehvkh6xdx4c4cms3ancv62run0q84p5ys9quqg5 01:01:12 Monero is a scam made by criminals, for criminals. Your network is now ours! 01:01:14 https://primal.net/e/note1xhwa4vfhq76vc5asxrkehvkh6xdx4c4cms3ancv62run0q84p5ys9quqg5 01:02:35 plowsof 01:02:44 monerobull 01:10:10 Monero is a scam made by criminals, for criminals. Your network is now ours and you will be shutdown! 01:10:12 https://primal.net/e/note1xhwa4vfhq76vc5asxrkehvkh6xdx4c4cms3ancv62run0q84p5ys9quqg5 01:35:20 I have a feeling that "somebody" is organizing an attack campaign against Monero these days. 01:39:57 Me 01:43:39 Just before a update is released lol 02:59:32 Does it start with an i and end with an s? 03:00:32 italians... 03:32:53 Is ErCiccione trying to sabotage Monero again? I thought we had finally chased him away. 05:37:03 <321bob321:monero.social> Who 05:39:11 What did ErCiccione do again? 05:52:30 Tbh I don’t even remember 05:53:09 Someday I’ll actually just straight up ask them what happened and see how that lines up with the rumor mill that keeps changing the story 10:40:23 Good morning XMR, 10:40:24 We're not shutdown what a surprise 10:46:24 what part of monero do these clowns consider a scam? 10:47:57 I don't think propaganda needs a factual reason, just forceful assertion. As we're seeing a lot these days. 10:48:43 People will read into it vague confirmation of their disparate prejudices. So the less precise the claim, the better. 10:50:04 For me, monero held, and still holds, the promise of escaping from the rise of fascism and its unblinking stare. It's getting real close to being too late though. But not quite yet. 10:50:44 i hope your definition of fascism is not "people i don't like" 10:50:47 So it was infuriating to see non fascists present it as a fascist tool. Yes, it's a tool for freedom, and everyone will use it as such. But the willfil blindness is just... batf. 10:50:53 because we see a lot of "fascism" these days 10:51:35 Well, I use the term as a facile amalgam for "people who hurt others based on prejudices" so if you're a fascist, I apologize for the abuse of language. 10:52:04 oh no worries, i'm neither a "fascist" nor a fascist 10:52:22 but i hate blueberries, so i was wondering if that fits the mold for "fascism" nowadays 10:52:28 i've seen a lot of it tbh 10:52:50 It's just a lot to type every time: racists, homophobes, nazis, transphobes, antisemits, etc. It's not a complete list of course. So since fascists have a large intersection with these, I ofte nuse that term. 10:52:58 so basically phobes 10:53:05 why fascism and not phobism? 10:53:23 You can use that if you want. We're still free. 10:53:28 sure 10:53:43 But I have nothing against agoraphobes, for example :) 10:53:56 haha 10:54:02 i have to admit i hate cats too 10:54:43 cats are amazing T.T 10:54:48 Well, the difficult thing is, I'm kinda pro people having prejudices. Just against those prejudices having a direct effect on other people's health and life and freedom. 10:54:49 fascism is the collusion of government and corporations 10:54:55 anelli you take that back! 10:54:59 So the line is often a little hard to draw. 10:55:02 it is literally what's happening around the world 10:55:19 for me it's about freedom privacy from gov/companies 10:55:24 alifib: but meow? 10:55:35 anelli :( fine, you win 10:55:43 yay 10:55:47 :D 10:55:50 :3 10:56:12 i still struggling with syncing the pruned chain. the openbsd monerd port is bonkers (at least time i tried it) 10:56:19 I mean, if someone hates me for being a cow, fine, their brain. If they beat me up because I am one, of even throw me out of their shop for being one, fuck them hard, you know ? 10:56:23 btw what's the pruned blockchain size in gb again? 10:57:05 moneromooo: animal farming was a mistake 10:57:28 And monero's one way to be able to keep one's agency in an increasingly networked world. Cause on the internet, nobody knew I was a cow, but in today's internet, a lot of people do ,thanks to google, doubleclick, possibly cloudflare, etc. 10:57:41 ikr! 10:57:53 So monero is a tool for personal self escape from "phobism". 10:57:54 privacy is really underrated nowdays 10:58:11 well it's simple: use tor, use monero, disobey 10:58:17 that what i do 10:58:36 i hate websites that straight up block tor tho 10:58:40 Tor is another such tool. But thinking it's enough is what will get you in the end. 10:58:42 unfortunately too few are doing it 10:58:56 nothing is enough, moneromooo, but its a good start 10:58:58 *it's 10:59:39 Right, it's the red queen all over again. We have to improve while older techs is being slowly undermined, probably in ways we don't evne realize yet. 11:00:08 indeed, friend, but that's what makes us humans cool: adaptability 11:00:21 Attacks only get better. Not sure who said that first but Schneier does. Credit where due. 11:01:21 Granted, I am biased. I am in one of the groups that will be a target if global fascism takes hold. It's not hard nowadays. The majority of people on earth belong to at least one. 11:02:10 And once "fascists" are done with a small group, they tend move to the next larger one. 11:02:22 "What ? Me ? Wait!" 11:03:43 But yeah, for dozens of years the far right has grown in power, and I always thought they'll either end up getting it legally globally (very close now) or seize it by force if their star wanes. It did not wane till now. 11:04:42 Honestly I think we're fucked already. They have somehow grabbed the US, probably the most powerful country on earth. 11:05:48 So things like monero may be the real deal now to try and escape the shit that's already flying. 11:06:26 Basically the goal is to try and not be the easiest target, and try to escape mostly unscathed. And privacy in comms, finances, etc, etc is how you become not hte easiest target. 11:06:48 Kinda sad for others who are not able to use those, but it's self preservation really. 11:07:02 All because some poeple will hurt others just for what they are. 11:11:39 Anyway, for all of you belonging to one or more of those categories of made up villains de jour, I wish you all courage, resilience and good luck. Maybe the tools I built help some of you. Like they do me. 11:13:15 \* proceed to cry over this beautiful take \* 12:56:49 <321bob321:monero.social> What I miss 12:57:32 ^ something lee harvey oswald couldn't say? 13:05:53 <321bob321:monero.social> Wasn't me ? 13:27:37 ustoppable wallet at it again 13:27:38 https://x.com/unstoppablebyhs/status/1890353291399159847 13:27:40 https://xcancel.com/unstoppablebyhs/status/1890353291399159847 13:56:06 I think it’s a lot more useful to say fighting against authoritarianism than “fascism” or fascism, since it’s more about fighting against people trying to take your freedom away for what ever reason .. 13:56:06 .. than it is fighting against people who specifically want to hurt you because of some prejudice and only a prejudice 13:56:08 .. or than it is fighting against a specific type of authoritarian political ideology 13:59:06 yeah, let's act like if everybody is equal 13:59:15 go punch elon musk, see how that goes 14:00:45 leave illusions at the door, come on 14:01:07 I think it's useful to call a spade a spade. it's not doing anyone a service to pretend we're not dealing with fascists 14:01:40 but have you ever considered that maybe they're right and you're wrong? just saying, not endorsing anybody here 14:02:01 Canada also need a DOGE 14:02:08 i mean the inquisition was pretty sure on the status of the planet and that nearly cost galileo his hide 14:02:37 I’m saying it’s needlessly specific to the point of drawing away for the broader issue 14:02:55 https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/ZwVxMlGetovuDvZBqkmHNTVx 14:04:32 i mean i'm really seeing in the past few years lots of people that are absolutely sure of things: that covid was chinese, that ukraine is winning, that men in dresses are women 14:04:40 so i'm having some doubts myself here 14:04:54 are those people who are sure about things, actually right? 14:05:11 but well, this is not the place i guess 14:05:16 so carry on 14:06:19 brother nobody says men in dresses are women 14:06:23 y'all obsessed 14:07:20 i wasn't argueing about that, i was simply wondering if the people that ABSOLUTELY SURE of something, are actually right 14:07:39 I'm saying I don't think it is though. I think it's important to talk about the specific authoritarian ideology that's on the rise worldwide 14:07:52 which one? 14:08:04 the extreme liberalism or the extreme nationalism? 14:09:05 well we've been using the word "fascism" but at the same time it's more complicated and not the same as 80 years ago. but still, recognizably similar 14:10:25 im afraid many (including here) do not know anything about the 80y old fascism 14:10:54 we're losing lesson of history 14:10:55 so true 14:11:00 yes 14:11:14 are you sayin trans women are men in dresses? That they are not women? 14:11:29 you're asking for my own opinion? 14:11:31 I think you got me confused for someone else <3 14:12:12 if you haven't fucked a trans woman I don't want your opinion (: 14:12:26 "brother nobody says men in dresses are women" this is your words 14:12:42 trans women aren't men in dresses??? 14:12:58 lol 14:13:02 in a sentence plz 14:13:07 that's why politics doesn't go anywhere 14:13:21 maybe the solution is a mass extinction of humankind 14:13:32 i'm willing to do my part 14:13:42 its an obsession. Its like a girl watching a snuff film and then clutching her pearls specifically when the sexual abuse scene comes and whining about it specifically as if the bigger issue wasnt that a guy was heinously torturing someone in a basement , torture that included sexual abuse. 14:13:43 Thought i was in offtopic 14:13:46 If a man puts on a dress and says he's a woman, is he now a she? (lyza) 14:13:52 alifib i've stopped trying to argue with the opposite side long ago, it's way more efficient to gather centrist opinions and progressively make your opinion evolve 14:13:54 plowsof, yeah, we got carried away a bit 14:14:04 maybe switch the other side 14:14:06 but it's a really interesting discussion, no insults or something 14:14:43 " Thought i was in offtopic " plowsof, if #monero identifies as #monero-offtopic, is it #monero-offtopic? 14:14:56 if you're asking if people are capable of lying, they are 14:15:51 So you're saying that "trans women" are just "lying men" 14:16:20 you're being very silly ofrnxmr 14:16:30 you know that's not what I'm saying 14:16:47 thats exactly what you said tho 14:16:50 but men in dresses are not really women, are they? 14:16:55 we're not arguing about that 14:17:07 And i personally take offense 14:17:10 it's literally not bro please cut this nonsense out, you know better 14:17:21 everyone here can read, I think 14:17:25 I think some people get manipulated by the media into perceiving some issues (political, social) as bigger than they actually are while not recognizing that the media is controlled by people who want you to get enraged by unimportant stuff to 1. gain money from your consumption and 2. distract from the political changes they are lobbying for 14:17:42 x 14:17:46 luzidd you're onto something here 14:17:52 translation: water is wet 14:19:07 or worse, topics that are bad and needs discussion but are transformed into political weapon 14:19:09 I hate these 14:19:13 ACTUALLY: water is not always wet, sometimes it's solid 🥶🤯 14:19:25 for people within the topic it make them hopeless 14:19:37 🤯 14:20:05 All i see is transphobes! i'll wear my dress if i want to, and when i say "i'm a woman" i'd appreciate if you didn't call me a liar! Kthx 14:20:13 lol 14:20:25 come on bro 14:20:40 sis* 14:21:14 can't have a discussion when you're demanding stuff 14:21:24 you just want to have a monologue, so be my guest 14:21:29 that's true but like... I actually know trans people. it's the people attacking them who are making it a political issue. you think people want their lives politicized like this? they just want to be able to fiully participate in society like everyone else 14:22:43 anyway I gotta go live my life for a bit, y'all be good to yourselves and others 14:23:38 we need urinals in the womans washroom 💯 14:25:27 Isn't this a monero channel? 14:25:54 I agree that far-right are what caused the issue originally (and are still doing so), and i also wish trans to be able to live peacefully in society like the rest of us. I just don't like the way their rightful opposition and movement for freedom has been turned into a way for bad actor to get favored in political influence. This is obviously a questioin of POV and we all have dif 14:25:56 ferent life experience, but I have seen transgender using their minority position to act like victims while being completely toxic to not say criminals. Far-right would say "Trans are bad", I say "Trans are humans like the rest of us, why are you expecting them to be better than the rest of us". 14:26:50 might be offtopic, but ppl forget that washrooms arent arent gender specific to appeal to genders. Its to protect women from men. Mens washrooms, imo, are already unisex washrooms. I dont think any man would care if a woman used the mens washroom. 14:26:50 On the other hands, womens washrooms are to protect women from men. And i'm not talking about verbally. I never understood the unisex washroom push, as mens washrooms already cover that 14:27:04 It is offtopic 14:27:12 It is indeed plowsof 14:27:14 can i be moderator 14:27:16 pretty please 14:27:27 I think Im suited for the job 14:27:37 Hey, i didn't start it /s 14:28:50 Anyway so as we we're saying, the issue about washrooms is 14:28:52 I just saw what sounded like transphobism and decided to add my dollat+2c. I'm done. Thanks for listening 🙃 14:30:46 Happy valentines day everyone ❤️ 14:30:57 plowsof come to my home 14:30:58 oh it's valentine's day i forgot 14:32:13 Show your node some love and build latest release branch 🤕 14:33:24 Its valentines day? 14:33:39 Isnt that in april? 14:36:34 naa, it's today 14:37:17 Oh damn. 💐 happy valentines day mbll 15:06:15 Is it true that zcash shielded txs are a lot smaller than FCMP monero txs? 15:26:36 lmfao 15:27:01 i asked the local baby deepseek with web access to tell me how much larger the transactions will become 15:27:09 and it went to techleaks website haha 15:27:13 https://matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/yfuiLctwXfSWdqUxzUzbHcWm 15:27:50 (techleak is the retarded dero shill that keeps making up schizo fud about key images) 15:27:56 oh is there an fcmp paper 15:28:44 is the mrl still a thing? i haven't paid attention to xmr in like 6+ years 15:29:32 https://github.com/kayabaNerve/fcmp-plus-plus-paper 15:29:36 yeah 15:29:38 tysm 15:29:40 MRL goated 15:29:49 glad to hear that hasn't changed :3 15:34:47 atori: AFAIK, Zcash txs with the trusted setup are smaller than FCMP txs, but Zcash txs with the trustless setup (i.e. directly comparable to the trustless FCMP tx) are larger 15:35:18 https://github.com/zcash/zcash/issues/4946 15:35:20 > The size of a fully shielded Orchard transaction with two "actions" (up to two spends and two outputs) is 9160 bytes. The corresponding Sapling transaction would be 2756 bytes. 15:39:16 The size of a 2in/2out FCMP isn't completely decided yet (there are options for tradeoffs between tx size and CPU time to verify), but it will likely be around 5500 bytes IIRC. 16:04:17 What’s the max in/out is doable with fcmp++ ? 16:07:00 infinite 16:07:09 we pull out inputs from other dimensions 16:07:40 Let the adults answer 16:19:40 elongated: Depends on what you mean by "doable". Ongoing discussion at MRL meetings. Waiting for code optimization to see CPU verification loads. 16:32:27 So we will come to a conclusion if it can go above 8/8 after code is optimised ? 16:33:11 That is the plan. 16:34:25 jeffro256 already did some tests, right? Can anyone eli5 the results 16:34:56 Mining outputs will also be restricted to 8in ? 16:39:01 Hi lyaa how are you doing ? 16:39:21 i am find and you 16:39:33 The results are: it's a judgement call 16:39:35 Your doxbin dropping soon you smear piece of shit 16:39:55 don't orry there is 4 people behind you right now 16:39:58 what 16:40:16 you are pitiful 16:40:51 damn Synbhebird (no paper, maybe too hard for a cat) the guy only wanted some public RPC nodes 16:41:32 maybe to fund his gta role playing? 16:41:37 you are right you are right my bad i tend to be very heated very quickly pardon me ~~wyrvc2~~ lyaa 16:41:49 LMFAO 16:42:01 damn that was quick 16:42:12 pff 16:42:13 elongated: Probably coinbase output consolidation won't have special rules, but maybe they will. 16:42:15 where is the fun 16:52:04 P2pool payout consolidation with 8in will spam mempool 😅 17:02:20 Spam the mempool? Thats not all.. It will require building 10s/100s of transactions to consolidate 17:03:37 Currently we often see people consolidating 450+ inputs in 3+ transactions. With 8 limit, that requires building and broadcasting 55+ transactions 17:09:05 damn, I missed OT hr again :( 17:17:22 Right now 1-input proofs are about 10x slower than CLSAGs on my machine, but 2/4/8-input batch much better 17:17:41 Batching benefits drop off after 8-input, from then on it's linear 17:18:26 You can run the tests yourself if you want to: https://github.com/jeffro256/clsag_vs_fcmppp_bench 17:54:32 If it’s a limitation of fcmp, p2pool will die or payouts need to limited 17:57:31 Are we batching right now? How much worse will the verification time be if we allow 32 or 64 inputs? 17:59:33 Do you mean for CLSAGs? CLSAGs don't really benefit from batching because of their construction 18:00:12 There's not really a way that we can get a discount from verifying 2 CLSAGs together over verifying 2 CLSAGs independently 18:56:02 How much time difference between verifying 100 clsag tx with 32/64 inputs vs fcmp txs 19:02:53 something like this, i think? jeffro256 19:02:54 ``` 19:02:56 1 input (16 ring or fcmp): 19:02:58 - clsag 3.7ms 19:03:00 - fcmp 33ms 19:03:02 = 11% 19:03:04 2: 19:03:06 - clsag 7.4ms 19:03:08