00:43:41 Only way I would ever own a Mac is if it was running Linux. 00:50:01 Hey, they're not that bad 00:50:52 Of course, there are other reasons besides privacy, but you can harden them to the extent that they're effectively as good as something like Fedora, if not better. 00:52:14 Such a setup is even recommended by IntelTechniques books and whatever 01:51:35 better than winglows 01:51:50 that being said, fagOS is also just shitty software now with all the indians ai coding it to shit 01:52:03 about as buggy 02:26:30 <321bob321> Isnt macos based on Unix or Linux ? 02:29:11 based on freebsd 02:36:38 it is a unix like but they only kept the posix tools 02:36:50 rest is a frankenstein monster 02:36:57 A Mac on Linux is basically a joke. 02:36:57 I think latest Linux kernel barely got M3 support. Its overpriced and probably the most closed PC hardware in existance. 02:36:57 PC as personal Computer, not as amd64 02:46:18 @malcolmz:matrix.thisisjoes.site: Not really, Apple platforms are based on Darwin, which is derived from various UNIX/BSD things 02:47:12 @ravfx:xmr.mx: It's not bad at all if you're using an Intel one 02:48:24 Second-hand Apple hardware is very affordable in first-world countries, and is arguably quite good value 02:48:42 @jpk68:matrix.org: Yeah, that's also old by current standard 02:48:46 I don't even own a Mac right now, but I feel like most people who always dunk on them have never even tried one 02:48:54 about to be dropped officially as for support go, if its not already the case 02:49:15 Newest macOS release drops support for Intel, yeah. 02:49:37 x86 machines will still receive security updates 02:49:59 I still have a //c somewhere, does that count ? 02:50:00 Next mac I have is a amd64 powerbook with an undercooled GPU 02:50:34 The model that all failed like, GPU desoldered itself thanks to the lack of cooling 02:50:35 What is "//c"? Apple 2c? 02:50:50 Yeah, it's a relic 02:52:16 <321bob321> They must rely on people committed to the brand 02:52:20 Recent mac are ok if you like MacOS and closed platform but I just find it rediculous to get them to install Linux simply for the very laggy hardware support they get 02:52:33 <321bob321> The apple fold price is stupid 02:53:12 Actual Amd64 platform, with say, a Radeon card, get hardware support day 1 at least, might be full of bugs and quirk but it's at least supported 02:55:24 https://mrelay.p2pool.observer/m/xmr.mx/WIFSzNMhaYsqZJhzCJLedGjr.png (clipboard.png) 02:56:00 https://mrelay.p2pool.observer/m/xmr.mx/lgQsWPRGoiOMtTjxudgVdUsc.png (clipboard.png) 02:56:45 So M3, almost 3 years old machine can boot linux since last month, but forget about the GPU 02:56:45 win-win! 02:58:42 Mac M1+ got USB4 and thunderbolt support last firt september too, also winner considering the M1 date from 2020 03:00:42 So maybe they will be fully supported in 12 years or so, at that time the maintainer will begin removing support because too much AI patches 03:10:29 @321bob321: Very true 03:10:43 @ravfx:xmr.mx: On the bright side, AI might make reverse-engineering it much easier 03:11:17 Might 03:26:47 Apple stopped paying there Unix licencing fee a few version ago, don't remember which one 03:26:56

Wouldn't AI also make it harder? I mean big tech haves the best AI because they are not going to release it 03:26:56 It was just for marketting ino 03:29:02 @haumea:matrix.haumea-sh.org: I expect AI to make reverse engineering easier, assuming they can afford it and they can make sense of it (It's not reverse engineering software, it's reverse engineering hardware (but I guess they can do it by taking apart MacOS software...) 03:29:02 Can't say really more, I don't reverse engineer hardware newer than 25 years 03:30:03 But considering it's been available (clankers) since more than a years, and that reverse engineering of Mac stuff seam to take longer and longer, I think we might be able to rule out "AI" as "turbo mode" 03:30:52 Anyway, who care, just buy parts that work on the OS you want to use (except if you buy it only to reverse engineering it, of course) 05:32:51 I've heard reversers say clankers are a big help, but didn't get an impression this was a fundamental one. Like, it'd still take long but wouldn't even closely to carry you. 05:37:53 By the way, what's even the appeal of a Mac if it's not M? Like, if it's Intel anyway, why not get something more upgradable, repairable and friendlier to Linux from that time period anyway>? 05:38:39 I don't even own a Mac right now, but I feel like most people who always dunk on them have never even tried one <- TBH I feel like this is justified given how basic things, including quality-of-life ones, are just not there. 18:15:53 Just noticed now in the MRL meeting: The IRC-Matrix bridge seems to produce wrong https://mrelay.p2pool.observer links for long stuff, or that server has a problem and does not serve the linked content as it should 18:16:28 At least it does that right now