<y​pavtv97lx:matrix.org> good morning

<y​pavtv97lx:matrix.org> So, I've seen many posts like this on reddit: reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/1h0z3a…ero_bannedgoing_to_be_banned_in_the

<y​pavtv97lx:matrix.org> and wanted to share easy solution: bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5511533

<y​pavtv97lx:matrix.org> I don't have enough Karma on reddit to post, if someone would like to share it there it would be great

<y​pavtv97lx:matrix.org> i know using DeX is the proper way but people should know Monero can't be really banned.

<y​pavtv97lx:matrix.org> and still can use CeX if they want, just with a proxy.

<m​onerobull:monero.social> no offense but cake takes some pretty steep fees

<m​onerobull:monero.social> and you arent moving more than 1-5 grand through centralized swap sites

<m​onerobull:monero.social> the few ones where you dont have to worry about getting frozen charge insane fees (exch goes as high as 5% and is still constantly empty)

<m​onerobull:monero.social> serai will completely revolutionize this

<m​onerobull:monero.social> god i am so bullish on serai

the fees for cakewallet can be adjusted on every release (via variables during the build process). sadly these are not transparent

by fees i mean, what cake puts on top of the swappers fees

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> interesting, i thought they just have ref-links and manage it through that

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> easier to deal with when you support a bunch of swappers i guess

for example: "StealthAdditionalFee" github.com/cake-tech/cake_wallet/bl…lows/pr_test_build_android.yml#L208

and "trocadorExchangeMarkup" github.com/cake-tech/cake_wallet/bl…lows/pr_test_build_android.yml#L177

these are secrets, and can be per-release specific

Evidently, they need to make money somehow, as they need to pay their staff etc.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> of course

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i just didnt know it was implemented like this

<d​etherminal:monero.social> Stack Wallet also has credentials like this for swap purposes, but you can build and use it locally without third party services

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> I can tell you from speaking to people who work directly with regulators firsthand (such as Coinbase compliance). Monero will never be banned, ever. It is more effective to quietly inform CEXs to delist and allow shady CEXs to continue operating with wash trading and fake volume, which in turn will dwindle demand. Banning it will only bring more attention than it already has.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> price attacks clearly work

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> every single "privacy" shitcoin pumped hard

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> monero was about to break out but whoopsie, 20k XMR open short interest appears

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> this is clearly meta.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> serai will show moneros true value

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you cant manipulate that

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Monero's getting banned sets a bad precedent for all cryptocurrencies, as it would be influenced by vested interests from large financial institutions such as Blackrock and Vanguard. However, it is unlikely to happen.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Monero getting banned sets a bad precedent for all cryptocurrencies, as it would be influenced by vested interests from large financial institutions such as Blackrock and Vanguard. However, it is unlikely to happen.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ban monero => get attention

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> let people say there is price manipulation => make xmr community look delusional

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> only works as long as you can manipulate the price though

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> so excited I wake up every morning with a photo of Serai discord server count

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I drink Serai, eat Serai, breath Serai

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I even renamed my kid Nerve

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> and I also put the entire Schnorr or not to Schnorr post on a t-shirt which i deposit on my parents tomb

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> grave*

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Liquidity is constrained. Buying XMR in large amounts requires significant risks. One whale is accumulating as much as possible on exch, but doesn't use CEXes due to lack of OTC support. There is no person or organization actively attacking the price.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> I can tell you from speaking to people who work directly with regulators firsthand (such as Coinbase compliance). Monero will never be banned, ever. It is more effective to quietly inform CEXes to delist and allow shady CEXes to continue operating with wash trading and fake volume, which in turn will dwindle demand. Banning it will only bring more attention than it already has.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> what about the 20k open short interest on perp markets?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> right when everything else pumps because good news for privacy

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> 20k XMR?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> yeah

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> I don't see any evidence suggesting manipulation on the futures market. It may be HFT bots hedging or something else entirely. An orchestrated attack is highly unlikely, as there are easier ways to take down Monero if that were the intention. This appears to be noise.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/jvIlpsqXxzNPzVdVJiWpoRkX

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> I won't deny that the volume on these CEXes is artificially inflated. It's clear they use wash trading bots, but no one is actively manipulating the price of Monero. The current state of the market is due to the fact that it's extremely difficult to easily acquire large amounts of Monero, while it is easy to get major cryptocurrencies like BTC, LTC, or others.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> it doesnt explain why monero bounces right back off but shit like ZEC doubles

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Monero is tracking really well in different indicators compared to other cryptocurrencies. You have to filter out the noise to get an accurate picture of its performance.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> I mean, you're close. At least, you recognize that Serai will help alleviate the liquidity restriction that Haveno and BSX were unable to fully address.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> people dont exactly help the decentralized options when they keep suggesting people to use centralized options

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> but serai is going to be so damn simple to use

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> its frustrating because downloading haveno is imo way easier than signing up to a kyc CEX where you have to deal with confirmation emails, holds on funds, etc

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i once completed a haveno trade start to finish, in 10 minutes

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> takes longer to withdraw funds from kraken than that

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> When current decentralized options require a default 0.15 XMR deposit or running multiple nodes and using an installation script on Windows, it's no surprise that people are opting for centralized alternatives. Many users use DEXes like Uniwap, Jupiter on Solana, and Thorchain have a significant number of users. What is common across all of them? Simple UX.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> its $15 deposit

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> 0.1 xmr

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> bsx is currently truly unusable for casuals but haveno has matured a lot

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> I'm not sure what the exact number is for the security deposit on Haveno. I may have misremembered it.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> if you can download monero gui, you can download haveno

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Monero DEXes still fall behind in terms of UX. Unfortunately, you can't run Haveno on mobile devices without having a dedicated desktop, for example. This is pricing out many cryptocurrency users who only rely on their phones. Also, there are no reviews like LocalMonero.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> yeah they should set up a forum for reviews

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Monero GUI is not a good example. Many people have reported issues with it, which is why alternative wallets like Cake Wallet, Feather, and others are more popular.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> You should see how dead simple it is to use other wallets, DEXes, and services on other chains. None of them are perfect, but they are still better than Monero. I know some of the reasons why UX is subpar is due to the trade-offs that need to be made for privacy, but this needs to gradually improve with additions like Serai.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> ive tried railgun and it was horrendous

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Sorry if my previous messages seemed dismissive of your opinions. I definitely agree that Monero is improving and their potential looks promising, but this is coming from someone who uses Ethereum/Solana almost daily. I know they are not perfectly decentralized, but the convenience often outweighs this drawback.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Sorry if my previous messages seemed dismissive of your opinions. I definitely agree that Monero is improving and the potential looks promising, but this is coming from someone who uses Ethereum/Solana almost daily. I know they are not perfectly decentralized, but the convenience often outweighs this drawback.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> every tx costs $20 to $40 and at one point it just didnt generate the stupid proofs and funds were frozen for a month

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Monero wins in terms of privacy, but when comparing other aspects, ETH L2s and Solana offer lower fees compared to Monero. Transaction times are essentially instant. Dex UX is almost perfect, with superior liquidity compared to Monero. All coins have their advantages/disadvantages.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Monero wins in terms of privacy, but when comparing other aspects, ETH L2s and Solana offer lower fees compared to Monero. Transaction times are essentially instant. DEX UX is almost perfect, with superior liquidity compared to Monero. All coins have their advantages/disadvantages.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> most of defi has no actual economic use

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> I am just noting one aspect Monero can improve.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> and serai is going to fix this

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> That's beside the point. I agree that other cryptocurrencies have largely become glorified ponzi schemes at this stage. However, that doesn't mean we can't still make a profit from them. We need to find a way to secure our returns, as stablecoins will eventually lose their value and CEXes will disappear. So, there must be an alternative.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Monero could potentially be the alternative, although it still has a long way to go.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> monero more stable than many stablecoins

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Articmine made an insightful comment about this. He compared the collapse of AOL and Bitcoin after the dot-com bubble to Amazon's later success. In our opinion, if Monero follows our current model, it won't suffer a downturn, but thrive instead.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Articmine made an insightful comment about this. He compared the collapse of AOL to Bitcoin after the dot-com bubble with Monero's potential trajectory likened to Amazon's later success. In our opinion, if Monero follows its current model, it won't suffer a downturn. Instead, it will thrive. Articmine has another prediction in mind we don't agree with.

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> For windows* casuals. For linux its dead simple

plowsof I tried cakewallet swap today, and the XMR amount I sent matched the amount on the swap website. I don't see any fee anywhere, except for the swap website's fee

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> If it wasn't clear here, Articmine suggested that Monero would eventually "flip" Bitcoin, but proposed a twist. It would happen at a price of $50, not $50,000. By then, he argued, Bitcoin's value would be almost negligible. However, our current models indicate that Monero's potential value might not reach this level if Bitcoin fails. More data is still needed though.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> BSX in its current state is amazing for OTC.

<r​4v3r23:monero.social> but you can manipulate localmonero when it existed?

<r​4v3r23:monero.social> or haveno?

<r​4v3r23:monero.social> people need to just stop follwing CEX pricing and start charging 0.1 BTC for 1 XMR

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you can manipulate p2p trading but that is usually very low volume

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> You are comparing a P2P DEX with an AMM DEX. The latter is easy to run arbitrage bots that can make money off anyone trying to manipulate prices. We will also be running one to ensure we're aware of such opportunities.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> so not setting the price

<r​4v3r23:monero.social> most volume will ove to p2p after delistings

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> nah

<r​4v3r23:monero.social> just have people refuse to sell under 0.1 btc

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> p2p is too involved

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> No, AMM. You are underestimating how much Serai can handle.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> as long as there is some cex, it will set the price

<r​4v3r23:monero.social> serai isnt p2p?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> no

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Assuming sufficient liquidity, Serai could potentially handle swapping $100m in BTC to $100m in XMR without low slippage and almost instantaneously. You can never do that on P2P or any CEX for that matter.

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> Assuming sufficient liquidity, Serai could potentially handle swapping $100m in BTC to $100m in XMR with low slippage and almost instantaneously. You can never do that on P2P or any CEX for that matter.

<r​4v3r23:monero.social> who are you swapping with

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> This is just a contrived example. The actual outcome will depend on several factors, including the amount of BTC/SRI and XMR/SRI staked, as well as the economic policies such as fees that come into effect when it launches.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the automated market maker

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you swap against the pool

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> @r4v3r23:monero.social It will look somewhat similar to this when swapping on Serai, although it will support more Monero and other coins:

<g​ooglemozilla:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/ydpGQUztjlqblzVKTDuoGFJf

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> it will look exactly like this:

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/HHZEDeXAgcrVPWeNxVyizLsF

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> bcs thorswap will definitely add support for it

<s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> Support for Monero?

<s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> Never mind I see the photo

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I love the design

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I need good design.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Everyone knows everyone needs good design over 1000+ little features

<d​etherminal:monero.social> Tell this to the apps in Monero community lol

<m​alori:xavi.lu> real

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<3​21bob321:monero.social> @monerobull

Revuo Monero Issue 219: November 21 - 28, 2024. revuo-xmr.com/weekly/issue-219

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Such a nice street price in today's issue, by the way.

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…/kernal.eu/qXwhWjhdLnQdPxjyYysXYXkl

<h​ahibo:nitro.chat> reply to my question?

<m​onerobull:monero.social> Nah that was for spam removal