<longtermwhale:matrix.org> Q2? Q3?

<wellnesscheck:matrix.org> ^ Q6 Q7 (o7) 24/25

<wellnesscheck:matrix.org> @sgp_:monero.social: <wen piconero level fee? monero-project/research-lab #152>

<wellnesscheck:matrix.org> some people seems to be pretty hyped about it:

<wellnesscheck:matrix.org> monero.forum/t/the-controversial-bl…ocksize-limit-proposal-from-sgp/396

<wellnesscheck:matrix.org> mrelay.p2pool.observer/m/matrix.org/smTkCbJVFcBrRvcZpOGJlqiA.png (image.png)

<wellnesscheck:matrix.org> ^ @sgp:magicgrants.org @sgp_:matrix.org @sgp_:monero.social

<elongated:matrix.org> Piconero fee ? Never > <@wellnesscheck:matrix.org> ^ Q6 Q7 (o7) 24/25

<wellnesscheck:matrix.org> @elongated:matrix.org: did i missinterpreted from the proposal what this meant then?:

<wellnesscheck:matrix.org> "Eliminate minimum fee (technically, it lowers it to the smallest XMR unit 1 piconero, or 0.000000000001 XMR)."

<sgp_> I think you're misinterpreting the impact. Transactions would only be free like that if there was no other demand for the block space. Like with Bitcoin

<sgp_> Monero already allows these transactions to be mined anyway. You can bypass any node relay rule

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> @sgp_:monero.social: ok i didnt understand anything u just said lol

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> but like, if today the tx fee on a single output is 0.00003 XMR, then what would be the number on that if it was merged as of today?

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> and then, cause actually wondering too, what would be the number on that if it was merged, but monero was at like 2 tx/s in average?

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> and if too lazy to make a proper calculation cause u too busy or somethin, would it at least be less that $0.01?

<sgp_> It's not a set number. It would be a market rate. There would be a permitted block space (supply), and demand for that space (transactions). Like with Bitcoin. There are differences in the actual space allowed but otherwise the proposal tried to match the dynamics of the fee market

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> @sgp_:monero.social: ok so i guess there is just no way to have an actual answer on that then, if monero could be used on that specific market or no

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> because if tx fee would be higher than $0.01 then there is no point in me keep trying to onboard a market that the monero technology wouldnt fit that usecase

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> thank you for your time anyways

<elongated:matrix.org> @illiilliillii:matrix.org: Which market can’t pay 2c fee ?

<sgp_> @elongated:matrix.org: It's probably worth paying attention to Coinbase's x402 efforts to see if they materialize into any real use-cases

<sgp_> @illiilliillii:matrix.org: Correct, no way to know. It could be basically free at some moments and costly in other moments (if a lot of people are using the chain at the same time)

<elongated:matrix.org> @sgp_: Ai friendly ? They lost me there itself, is that a pow chain ?

<elongated:matrix.org> Pos chain can bear boatload of txs

<sgp_> dune.com/hashed_official/x402-analytics

<sgp_> It's intended for USDC on Base

<sgp_> But the point is they are targeting low cost transactions. So it's worth seeing what actual economic value, if any, comes of the usage, or if it's basically just spam or whatever

<elongated:matrix.org> We need 2min finality layer before we can think about competing with pos chain with 2sec settlement

<sgp_> I'm not saying to compete, I'm just saying it's worth seeing if anything useful materializes

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> @elongated:matrix.org: "Which market can’t pay 2c fee ?"

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> i mean, am just being overdramatic there, most transactions are probably like $1, but it can range from $0.01 to like $100 for most transactions, some are in the thousands of $ but more rare

<sgp_> They're experimenting so we don't have to

<elongated:matrix.org> @illiilliillii:matrix.org: If the user can’t pay 2c tx fee for privacy, they don’t deserve it.

<elongated:matrix.org> Blockchain space isn’t free and infinite

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> @elongated:matrix.org: it's a criminal market that is breaking videogaming companies terms of services by selling their in-game items in a peer to peer manner, criminals do deserve privacy imo

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> @plowsof:matrix.org: 🖕👿🖕

<elongated:matrix.org> @illiilliillii:matrix.org: They need to pay for their tx to be saved forever

<elongated:matrix.org> They can use a L2 if it ever comes to xmr

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> @sgp_:monero.social: appreciating your inputs, thank you

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> yall have a nice week end of holiday season o/

<illiilliillii:matrix.org> o7

<articmine> Blockchain Surveillance companies engaging in dusting attacks > <@elongated:matrix.org> Which market can’t pay 2c fee ?

<articmine> The idea is to trick users into co-spend heuristics unless one uses careful coin control to avoid including the poisoned inputs

<articmine> If one is not careful one can end up overpaying fees because of including these economically un spendable outputs

<articmine> gemini.com/cryptopedia/crypto-dusting-attack-bitcoin

<bikrambiswas:matrix.org> reddit.com/r/Monero/s/jEO255iJia

<basses:matrix.org> slop? this is not news btw

<bikrambiswas:matrix.org> I just covered the paper..into a product marketing style. That's why I shared .

<bikrambiswas:matrix.org> FCMP++ Concept is not easy to explain..So much FUD going on regarding this.. because people read less..

Did you write the article yourself?

<bikrambiswas:matrix.org> @basses:matrix.org: Should I delete the link ?..I don't want to ruin the atmosphere here

<bikrambiswas:matrix.org> jpk68: I read..I can explain the concept in a better way than writing

<bikrambiswas:matrix.org> That's all that matters..in the area of innovation.

<jwinterm:matrix.org> Whut

21:03:23 <jpk68> Did you write the article yourself?

^ all their previous work is AI, including the description about the work

<bikrambiswas:matrix.org> DataHoarder: I do not speak your language..My language is not as popular as yours. You can't eliminate AI, if you do not use them ...You come into monero..knows the problem in Bitcoin.. because you used that cryptos...lose your privacy then you moved towards Privacy projects. Human bias is more dangerous than AI bias

<syntheticbird> ... ... ... .. .... ... . . .. .. .... .. ... .. . .. . . ..... . . .. .. .. .. .. .. .. .. .. . . ...... . . . ......

<321bob321> You need help ?

<syntheticbird> @321bob321: # ... . . .. . .. .. . .

<elongated:matrix.org> 2c x 40k txs is cheap imho for these actors , won’t be surprised if half of the current txs are originating from them > <@articmine> Blockchain Surveillance companies engaging in dusting attacks

DataHoarder: Yeah, I had a feeling

<basses:matrix.org> @321bob321: it is still in thinking phase