<pyratevevo:matrix.org> Sounds like a sizeable improvement for those that run their own node. Makes self hosting more appealing. > <xmr_guyy> thoughts about this light wallet, peeps

We all have wallets and servers. Were are the XMR? yes. the miners have the money. :p

<ltzsh:unredacted.org> armtux: miners always win

is github.com/unyieldinggrace/monerod-proxy safe? is this project supported by monero community?

has anyone here some good research about ROI on monero with electricity <0.2 kwh

transistt maybe you can get here some more informations: whattomine.com

this is saying that there is profit!

hyc ?

try it :P

maybe you should ask via #monero-offtopic or #monero-markets

The idea is that if there is profit, more miners will want some of it, and will start mining.

This will cause the network hash rate to go up, which will decrease the expected time to get a block for the same hash rate.

This will go on till there is no profit to be had anymore by mining monero, at which point there won't be an influx of new miners.

So the steady state is 0 profit.

in which state are we now?

Now, this is an idealized model. It relies on everyone having the same cost per hash (eletricity, hardware, etc).

So in reality, people with the cheapest electricity are the ones that'll make the most profit, and will drive out others more easily.

This is true for monero, bitcoin, etc, etc.

it doesn't matter on how much you'll buy hardware?

maybe you'll find a good offer

<spectrepulse:matrix.org> Hi everyone, I’m SpectrePulse. I’ve been working on a certain CCS research proposal focused on P2P Sybil resistance using VDF-based vitality metrics and probabilistic consistency sampling. The goal is purely exploratory I’m trying to model the cost of running a Sybil attack under the same assumptions, without introducing [... too long, see mrelay.p2pool.observer/e/4ozlovMKbzAzbklC ]

The less you spend for your hash rate, the more profit (or less loss) you'll make obviously.

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> @spectrepulse:matrix.org: You posted this in mrl like 10mins ago, and you dont even type your own comments (ai slop)

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> And you created an issue instead of a merge request

Is this the person with emdashes everywhere that refused to give me an apple pie recipe ?

Surely not repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/issues

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> Yes

What a great question, plowsof! I know a great apple pie recipe with just one ingredient! For just money, you can create an apple pie by giving the money to your local shop. This recipe is even very friendly on the washing up side!

❤️ :D

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> Hey guys , anyone here look at xmr as a macroeconomic hedge? If yes, approx what fraction of your PF is xmr?

<spectrepulse:matrix.org> @ofrnxmr:xmr.mx: Okay, like instead of politics I strongly believe if we discuss on the main objective on what brought me here ,and yeah you know plowsof I felt offended think of it this way what if I told you to act as a pirate while explaining the recipe of cooking an apple pie no offense but that's demeaning like why couldn't you google it? it makes me wonder

<spectrepulse:matrix.org> moneromooo: 😂good one👏🏾👏🏾

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> Following Dollar Milkshake Hypothesis, it is likely that USD proxies like USD stable coins will wipe out shit-tier fiat currencies like Yen, Rand, Baht, Rupee and Lira while badly hurting GBP and EUR. So in around 50 years when we retire there will either be stable coins or Gold as a decent SOV. Do you see monero playing a role there?

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> Also, the information that someone holds monero itself can make the person Wrench attack magnet in the future. How to prepare for such scenarios?

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> I am thinking that the information that someone bot a ledger ora trezor will bite that someone's butt in the future. Is this a valid prognosis?

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> TIA in advance!

<spectrepulse:matrix.org> @ofrnxmr:xmr.mx: You know its not AI generated and even if it were AI I guess and I strongly believe AI purpose is to make work easier and learning so I can't quite see the issue there unless maybe there are rules or something, and you are right i did post it on mrl 10mins ago and my goal is to discuss on my proposal, a yes or even a no at least it was critiqued

<ravfx:xmr.mx> > learning

<ravfx:xmr.mx> Science proved that offloading your brain to AI make you dumber

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> Case in point

<spectrepulse:matrix.org> @ravfx:xmr.mx: okay then, instead on dwelling its AI and stuff why not just tell me on your thoughts for the same proposal? I strongly believe we will at least have a better bearing . So what are your thoughts on the same?

svensvenson: you are right. A (difficult) way out could be to try and corner the market for wrenches, but attackers might evolve their tactics by pivoting to hammers. Of course, a preemptive cornering of the hammer market before going for the wrench market could be a plausible counter for such a pivot.

One saving grace though is that it looks like a lot of people have dabbled in cryptocurrency by now, so being a known user is less of a juicy target advertisement than it used to be...

<kayabanerve:matrix.org> > <@spectrepulse:matrix.org> Okay, like instead of politics I strongly believe if we discuss on the main objective on what brought me here ,and yeah you know plowsof I felt offended think of it this way what if I told you to act as a pirate while explaining the recipe of cooking an apple pie no offense but that's demeaning like why couldn't you google it? it makes me wonder

<kayabanerve:matrix.org> It isn't politics to discuss the quality of your work, nor if your work is of sufficient merit to justify further discussion and attention or should be dismissed.

<kayabanerve:matrix.org> @spectrepulse:matrix.org: 'I don't use AI but even if I did, it wouldn't be an issue' - someone wayyyy too defensive about the topic. If you do strongly believe it to be helpful, why didn't you use it?

<kayabanerve:matrix.org> Reminds of the person who I accused of using an LLM to produce pages of incorrect garbage, just for them to say they didn't use an LLM but they were honored I compared them to an LLM with how intelligent they are??

<kayabanerve:matrix.org> Anyways. I haven't actually reviewed the work at this time. I just wanted to comment on the presentation and discussion in this room.

<ravfx:xmr.mx> moneromooo: Just use soldering iron, they do make wireless.

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> moneromooo: Ion get it.

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> moneromooo: I think being known as an xmr buyoor by the bad guys when coinbase or such cexes get a data leak is quite dangerous no?

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @ravfx:xmr.mx: Guis, you know my questions are serious rite?

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> @svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt: Do you equate "xmr buyer" with "criminal child trafficker"? i dont get it

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> Is there something wrong with walmart leaking that i bought pepsi instead of dr pepper?

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> I mean, why would you be more afraid of pepsi? The math isnt mathing

<lza_menace> @svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt: your questions are naive so they are being sarcastic and having a laugh. if you are concerned with wrench attacks then don't leave the house and invest in home security.

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @ofrnxmr:xmr.mx: No, I am equating the information that someone bot xmr in Europe might possibly put them on a list of euro-irs in remote future.

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @lza_menace: Sorry, I am new to all this so excuse me if I am being stupid.

<lza_menace> your assertion is generally correct though. the fewer people who know about your involvement w/ cryptocurrency the better off you will be.

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> @svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt: And this would be different than, say, buying bitcoin, how?

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @ofrnxmr:xmr.mx: Bit coin is worse! I have swapped it already to xmr!

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> So euro-irs knows you bought bitcoin, what now?

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @lza_menace: Thanks for the smell check. Coinbase, my bank and my girl knows I bot them. That's it.

<lza_menace> if you buy a trezor, you're on a private companies database as a customer with your name and home address. if you purchase cryptocurrencies from a centralized exchange you're on a private companies' database as a customer with your name and home address. this exchange is a highly regulated organization and will provide your de [... too long, see mrelay.p2pool.observer/e/wLO-pPMKdXJWUWh6 ]

It is a valid concern. There have been such attacks on cryptocurrency holders in the past.

It's all about the perceived gain over risk ratio.

<lza_menace> right

<lza_menace> "the only winning move is to not play"

You presumably don't have a vault nor armed guards, and possibly lots of money within easy reach.

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @ofrnxmr:xmr.mx: Since tax collection here is a public private partnership, imafraid that the private actors have an incentive to go full ooga booga with all those who ever bot btc or converted stuff to xmr.

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> moneromooo: Wow. Thank you.

I suppose you could make a rather public "that's it, I cashed out and bought this overpriced flashy whatever" and hope that takes you out (wait, bad phrasing) from the list of possible targets ^_^

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> Just tell them u bought drugs

I believe... Jameson Something used to keep a list of such attacks. Could be google-able.

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> moneromooo: No I don't, i m a poorfag who happens to like freedom.

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @ofrnxmr:xmr.mx: U SRS? Aren't you like one of the big devs of xmr? Or you really are an ai..?

<lza_menace> we're all nobodies

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> moneromooo: Hmmm.. That's a good idea. Actually.

We like being nobodies. Because the day we become a body, we'd be... not pleased.

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> @svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt: An ai

Well, technically we would not be not pleased because we'd have lost the ability to feel not pleased, but....

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> moneromooo: Fr fr...

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> Your question, in laymans terms: how do i avoid the rule of law. The answers:

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> a) follow the law

<ofrnxmr:xmr.mx> b) dont follow the law. YMMV

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @ofrnxmr:xmr.mx: Wat. Ofrnxmr dev should rm rf u tots.

<ofrnxmr> What happened

I suppose we'd be not pleased for an arbitrarily short time.

But *very* not pleased.

c) lie a lot, become elected somehow, and change the law as needed

The command failed because the file rf was not found. Something tried to remove the emdashes and got too eager.

<ofrnxmr> Oh, im not a dev.

<ofrnxmr> yes, (C) is also a valid option

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @ofrnxmr: Your ai went berserk and gave a bunch of bad adv.

Sounds like humans too tbh.

<ofrnxmr> @svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt: It happens. But i don't think the advice was bad

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> moneromooo: Lol, I'm a windowsfugee, so excuse me.

<ofrnxmr> looks like youre asking "what if" the government'a tax enforcement finds out that you own XMR — Is there a problem?

<ofrnxmr> @svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt: you have to write rm -rf (you missed the hyphen)

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> Thank you all. Plenty of stuff for me to think on.

<ofrnxmr> If owning zmr is a problem, legally, then don't do it?

<ofrnxmr> Xmr*

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> I'm more worried about the private companies adjacent to government tax enforcement > <@ofrnxmr> looks like youre asking "what if" the government'a tax enforcement finds out that you own XMR — Is there a problem?

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> Tax guys are okay IMO

<ofrnxmr> and what would they do with that info? Come break into your house and kidnap you for your monero?

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> Kinda, some French tax man smoked a bit coin holder I read on sitter.

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> *xitter

<ofrnxmr> Well, if youre worried about that, then also dont use a credit or debit card when purchasing nice things anywhere.. dont register your car. Don't give your address to your bank either

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @ofrnxmr: I have to. I can't buy stuff without Freja or BankID... Not even food for our cat.

This is question of profit/risk again. A CC doesn't tell others how much you have. A bitcoin change output does (well, a floor at least).

<ravfx:xmr.mx> French tax authority where leaking cryptoholder data to some other people

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @ravfx:xmr.mx: Exactly!

Cars need to be fenced, etc. Physical world stuff is subject to CCTV tracking pretty much everywhere.

So less (unknown) profit in the first case, more risk in the second case.

<ofrnxmr> moneromooo: I'm more referring to the fact that someone with the access to the jeweller records will know that you put 20k on a new wedding ring on your credit card

<ofrnxmr> moneromooo: People are on cctv too. Its not that easy to kidnap someone or break into a home w/o having almost your entire route on camera

<ofrnxmr> the bigger danger with wrench attacking an xmr holder, is once the xmr is gone, its gone

/names

<ravfx:xmr.mx> @ofrnxmr: That really depend of the location.

<ravfx:xmr.mx> Here the state don't really have surveillance infra

<ravfx:xmr.mx> While lot of home and commerces have one or more camera, the cops don't seam to give a fsck to ask for footage

<kiersten5821:matrix.org> gun > <@svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> Also, the information that someone holds monero itself can make the person Wrench attack magnet in the future. How to prepare for such scenarios?

<kiersten5821:matrix.org> dont buy hardware wallets, one firmware update and your coins are gone, it's not a cold wallet by definition > <@svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> I am thinking that the information that someone bot a ledger ora trezor will bite that someone's butt in the future. Is this a valid prognosis?

is about save the private keys.

<kiersten5821:matrix.org> when they leak data again they wont care about your 100 xmr but instead the guys with 100 btc > <@svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> I think being known as an xmr buyoor by the bad guys when coinbase or such cexes get a data leak is quite dangerous no?

<kiersten5821:matrix.org> you could answer all these questions yourself with a little thinking

<kiersten5821:matrix.org> thats why people are joking with you

<lza_menace> ^

Hi

<svensvenson:gemeinsam.jetzt> @kiersten5821:matrix.org: Understood. Thank you and thank you all for responses.