<l​eelee66:matrix.org> hi

<b​ufo:monero.social> Why does xmr cost $150 on bisq?

<b​ufo:monero.social> Also what is going on here?

<b​ufo:monero.social> repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/457

<b​ufo:monero.social> Is ofrnxmr really a scammer?

<b​ufo:monero.social> We need more DEXs so why is this proposal getting all the hate...

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Non, ofrn has been cancelled by some of the community members / feds

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Removing the best monero support person make no sense if what matter is monero

<b​ufo:monero.social> I feel like I'm missing something. Are all these comments fake then?

<b​ufo:monero.social> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…ero.social/wRQuLLWYjBIUJQPcGfPOxFeN

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> yeah

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> probably just one fedperson

<b​ufo:monero.social> Who decides if the proposal is successful? I imagine that these comments won't matter

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Someone who does not like ofrn

<b​ufo:monero.social> Only one person decides if the proposal is merged?

<b​ufo:monero.social> That isn't decentralized 😂

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> technically no, but one person have but mergebutton afaik

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> CSS are a joke

<b​ufo:monero.social> All those donations were given to the CCS?

<b​ufo:monero.social> Does that mean the whale donations were wasted?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Depend which one you ment

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> The "whale" sent them to the General Fund

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> With is also kind of centralized

<b​ufo:monero.social> Yes that's what I mean

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Anyway, have to leave for now

<b​ufo:monero.social> 👋

<y​asabi:matrix.org> anyone interested in Ofrn's most recent CCS on behalf of the Particl devs themselves would do well to look at the Particl devs' own development and delivery history

<y​asabi:matrix.org> they are notoriously bad at meeting timeframes, and totally uncommunicative about the specific reasons why their commitments get missed. it's not uncommon for them to commit to one thing then deliver something else months if not years after without clearly explaining what's going on in their private communication channels.

<y​asabi:matrix.org> i'm sure one of them will point to their blog about how "open" they are with their development status. anyone sympathetic to that should do themselves a favor and look at the desktop client reportbacks for the last year or so. six months will go by with no changes and every week is "a brief delay is impacting development progress"

<b​ufo:monero.social> You should make a reply on the CCS with this information

<y​asabi:matrix.org> BasicSwap Exchange is, for many unfortunate reasons, at this moment the only working properly defined DEX for Monero at the moment (ie no third party arbitrators required). i do very much and sincerely wish it was further along than it is, and believe me when i say that as i have watched its development for years

<y​asabi:matrix.org> but that this proposal is coming from a team that has an unreliable development history, on behalf of Ofrn who himself is a disruptive clout chaser, without a proven development record.

<y​asabi:matrix.org> i'm not saying it shouldn't be funded. as much as i don't like ofrn or the particl devs, BSX getting into usable shape asafp would be an enormous net benefit for the Monero community at this moment.

<y​asabi:matrix.org> but if it's to be considered i think it should have more well defined milestones and terms, and some measures to insulate the possibility it doesn't work out

<a​js_:matrix.org> Rushing to fund a proposal because they promise the moon and the stars is also not that great of an approach

<a​js_:matrix.org> Proposals that lack the bare minimum of addressing specific problems and offering solutions , having well defined milestones, with a break down of costs should be considered as spam.

<a​js_:matrix.org> The CCS guidelines are the for a reason

<a​js_:matrix.org> Just because some self-righteous, entitled ass thinks they are “special” doesn’t give them license to make a mockery of the CCS system

<a​js_:matrix.org> and waste people’s time in the process

<b​ufo:monero.social> Apparently the backend dev for particl doesn't even agree with the proposal?

<b​ufo:monero.social> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…ero.social/YqJcgsdiEOzEFBPsVwrKvNAj

<b​ufo:monero.social> All of this is confusing

<a​js_:matrix.org> This should put the matter to rest

<a​js_:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/JAoOVTkqhlWstYoEXkiiePpz

<b​ufo:monero.social> So ofrn is a scammer? 😂

<3​21bob321:monero.social> my issue is the clear troll accounts not being removed

<3​21bob321:monero.social> if thats what basicswap wants then up to them

<b​ufo:monero.social> They should be removed because I believed them for a second. I wonder what other readers would think

<3​21bob321:monero.social> clearly they are fake accounts

<3​21bob321:monero.social> blind freddy can see it

<b​ufo:monero.social> Even if the accounts are fake the comments they're saying looked legit. I didn't think it was a troll until I asked

<b​ufo:monero.social> Or maybe I'm just stupid...

A sight to be seen

<3​21bob321:monero.social> niave

<3​21bob321:monero.social> there should be a rule that people that can vote are members thats have been here min 3 months

<3​21bob321:monero.social> and you vote with that nick

<3​21bob321:monero.social> if you against something grow some balls and post under a nick people know you under

<n​ihilist:m.datura.network> That's what happens when moderation is lacking

<a​js_:matrix.org> It becomes a toxic, free for all circus

<a​js_:matrix.org> agree

<a​js_:matrix.org> plowsof: given the spam of fake accounts, ask the alleged dev to post a gist note from his GitHub profile disavowing the proposal

<p​lowsof:matrix.org> can gitlab 'defederate' certain email providers 🤔 or move to manual verification only, this can happen to anyone

<p​lowsof:matrix.org> docs.gitlab.com/ee/administration/s…gn-ups-using-specific-email-domains , the spam accounts share the same email servers as teconovert and yasabi strangely

321bob321: the three month rule is also easily gamed.

It's sad so much time is being spent on these proposals.

<b​ufo:monero.social> @yasabi:matrix.org Are you repo.getmonero.org/y2sabi?

<b​ufo:monero.social> So all the accounts are fake...

<4​rkal:monero.social> Has anyone used robosats.com ? P2P dex, built on lightning with Monero support.

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> does the account of the alleged dev comes from the same email server ?

<p​lowsof:matrix.org> tecnovert , yasabi, and Ban Ofrn From CCS share the same email server and the pattern of randomletters@*.same.homeserver

<b​ufo:monero.social> Can you see the ip address for each account?

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> you will only see the ip of the mail server, more interesting is to see WHOIS info of the domain name.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> please plowsof read your dm

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I beg you

the ips come from cloudflare so no (im not a sys admin though)

<b​ufo:monero.social> Can you share the domain/ip addresses?

<b​ufo:monero.social> Maybe I can have a look

we all originate from cloudflare so the ip is irrelevant (not a sys admin)

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> nvm my removed message, plowsof read your monero.social dm

<b​ufo:monero.social> Is this the ip for the mail servers or the ip from registration/login?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> alias email maybe ?

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/OsazyWqPtKHKsLjotgrlhpYP

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Well, looks like this CCS proposal will need one more correction...

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> Nothing proved yet

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> elaborate ?

<b​ufo:monero.social> I thought robosats was only for btc?

<b​ufo:monero.social> I can't sort by xmr as a currency. Where do you see monero support?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I think everyone has referred to kycnot.me/service/robosats

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> If it was a reference to the comment from the dev of basicswap, it seems probable that it is a fake account if it comes from the same email server than all the other fakes account

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I'm the one that contacted the devs. Their comment isn't fake

<b​ufo:monero.social> I'm so confused now. So this isn't fake?

<b​ufo:monero.social> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…ero.social/XcaCmwzZjgZBhdMNKYMhOHfr

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> ah I wasn't aware.

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> Well we will be clear once he proves it with a gist.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> this isn't. I obviously won't share the dm because they didn't allowed me but this isn't fake

<b​ufo:monero.social> How do you know? Plowsof proved that the email server is the same as the troll accounts...

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Because I talked to them? also I think plowsof was referring to an alias server. I wouldn't surprised if everyone used simplelogin mail servers

<b​ufo:monero.social> So they explicitly told you that was their comment?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> but you can reject my statement if you want. I have no proof, of what I'm saying. You'll have to wait for the gist

we can ignore the same email server for now, i just note it looked strange. and yes, probably the "easy" registration servers we can force manual verification on moving forward

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Hmm wtf is going on here

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> be careful with the word "proved". As you can see interpretation is more likely.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> No no. I made them aware. If I didn't contacted them they wouldn't even know about the CCS proposal. And yes, this comment is essentially saying the same thing I received

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> So a bunch of trolls spamming everywhere

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> And they have one thing in general

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Haveno lovers?

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> So its rejected for now

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> doesnt' remove the fact that all those accounts with same syntax for the name are probably fakes account.

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> even if fakes comment should just be ignored and not taken into a reason to accept the proposal.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Unfortunately devs tell themselves that in their comment that they are not willing to accomplish said milestones so yeah pretty much screwed up

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Bro they literally disliked untraceable's comment too

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Haveno gang going strong

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> Hell it could even be ofrnxmr making reverse psychology (I doubt it).

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I would hardly see the long-term benefits of destroying its own reputation but ig its a theory

<b​ufo:monero.social> There's a higher chance of it being LE than reverse psychology from him

<b​ufo:monero.social> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…ero.social/GDMYxWVKcVUUxXRIJtunjTkK

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> With an instant payout of 650 xmr, there's not much long-term thinking. Grab the bag and run

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> for real

<b​ufo:monero.social> That's why I asked for the ip addresses. We can find out the truth from them

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Make lots of spam noise to appear as the victim -> cry that you are being persecuted and that you're just a poor honest guy trying to help, but your haters are taking it too far

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I would be highly disappointed if plowsof gave out an ip address just for the sake of fighting trollers tbh

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> wait isn't it Trump career ?

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> So with your previous message you said "Haveno lovers maybe?" and it has now become "Haveno gang going strong". Are you blindly making assumptions and jumping the gun? Do you have a vested interest in this proposal, and dismissing criticism against it? Have they explicitly tokd you it's their comment? :)

127.0.0.1

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> epic fail

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> nvm epic ip

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> So, I see two possible outcomes right now:

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> - tecnovert posts a gist on their github account with the same reply of the ccs, confirming that ofrn is lying => the proposal is a confirmed scam, ofrn is a confirmed scammer, we shut it down and call it a day

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> - tecnovert *doesn't* confirm their reply/account in some other provable way => that means that so far we have a proposal from a problematic individual, with vague milestones asking for lots of money upfront, and so far no real contact from the real devs (supposedly) involved, plus a lot of suspicious spam/trolling and a potential impersonation attempt (i.e. that could still be te<clipped message>

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> cnovert, we just don't know for sure)

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Either way, it doesn't look like the premise of a successful proposal that will deliver a good result

<b​ufo:monero.social> ofrnxmr hasn't responded yet and that's suspicious in itself as he knows this potentially fake dev comment exists...

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I can't wait to see whats his response will be

<a​mnesia:bitcoinist.org> are you sure ? y do you assume hypocrite. after ofrn criticized haveno these troll comments appeared. basicswap works flawlessly with ofrn's installer (haveno jealous)

<a​mnesia:bitcoinist.org> And ofrn isnt even allowed here to respond.

<a​mnesia:bitcoinist.org> weirdo. are you a control freak?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> negative IQ

<a​js_:matrix.org> lol, “installer” raw.githubusercontent.com/nahuhh/basicswap-bash/beta/scriptinstall.sh

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> LMAO

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Hmm, another account (double account, in fact) coming here after my message just to reply against me, make baseless allegations in an attempt to dismiss criticism, and call me a weirdo and control freak. Any chance you're related to py.verse? 🤣

<a​js_:matrix.org> That is nob level script kiddie bashing skills

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Don't feed the troll

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> That is, in fact, ChatGPT level of bash scripting skills. Look at the style of the comments. This is basically what you get by asking it to make a script that downloads the latest release from a repo and unzip it

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Though, on the other hand, one could argue that a noob level script *that works* is better than no script at all

<a​mnesia:bitcoinist.org> weirdos with all ur assumptions

<a​mnesia:bitcoinist.org> phony endor is jealous his ccs doesnt get recognition

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…ero.social/deWJPEbXOGIooAsAYMQQLYqn

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> that is valid assumption tho

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Oh hi ofrn

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Guess you don't like it when you get the same treatment (hell, better even) you have reserved to others all these years

<a​mnesia:bitcoinist.org> 😂😂😂

<a​mnesia:bitcoinist.org> I tell ya ur clueless. always criticizing when ofrn isnt allowed to speak and allowing sockpuppets to run loose against him

<a​mnesia:bitcoinist.org> no one remembers u

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> He's allowed to speak on the ccs repo. Yet the proposal is still in a terrible state, and we're waiting for confirmation from one of the devs involved to see if it's a 100% scam or still "just" a terrible proposal

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> lmao he left

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Don't forget your other alt amnesia:

<n​ihilist:m.datura.network> u can do fiat -> btc -> xmr apparently, no apparent fiat -> xmr sadl

<n​ihilist:m.datura.network> u can do fiat -> btc -> xmr apparently, no apparent fiat -> xmr sadly

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> well mission accomplished. We can call it a day. let's go back to our scheduled trading discussions and other CCS proposal

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> os it's like Bisq

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> so it's like Bisq

<n​ihilist:m.datura.network> yep, so i recommend just buying a ton of xmr for fiat on localmonero while you still can, make sure you still keep in touch with a trusted xmr vendor, and hold your breath until haveno comes out

the install script(s) are in the zip file. as a result of this, 0xfff added something to monero-core ( add proxy to wallet-rpc set_daemon )

<n​ihilist:m.datura.network> imo having to buy btc to get some XMR is a heresy, and you're loosing value when buying it. not acceptable imo

<n​ihilist:m.datura.network> having to buy btc to get some XMR is a heresy, and you're loosing value when buying it. not acceptable imo

LMAO'ing at a series of install scripts that uncovered a useful feature for monero-core monero-project/monero #9160#issuecomment-1937087155

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> fair enough

<b​ufo:monero.social> You're being unfair. Why are you accusing ofrnxmr of using chatgpt without proof? It's clear he doesn't use it with all his commits that contain mistakes. After reading the backlogs, despite his extravagant behavior, it doesn't seem fair to abuse ofrnxmr who once received a death threat by another community member (mj) that you allowed to make threats as a moderator.

<b​ufo:monero.social> As I dig deeper into the history of monero and ofrnxmr, the responses against his ccs don't make any sense and are clearly designed to discredit him for ulterior motives. We should stick together as a community, especially after everything that is happening in the privacy space with localmonero, samurai, wasabi, and other projects shutting down. If the ccs is not perfect, we shoul<clipped message>

<b​ufo:monero.social> d offer suggestions instead of jumping to conclusions and accusing community members as potential exit scammers. I find it suspicious that you, midipoet the movie scammer sympathizer (repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/371), and the crackhead syn who abandoned cuprate are abusing ofrnxmr for no reason.

<b​ufo:monero.social> Ofrnxmr may not have a voice, but there are people who will dig deep through as many logs as they can to find the truth. I wonder what else exists...

<3​21bob321:monero.social> This childish shit needs stop. Its making monero and monero ccs look like its a pre school.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> First time I'm called a crackhead

<b​ufo:monero.social> I did my research and the people who have been accusing ofrnxmr for no reason are far from innocent

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> lmao enlight me what am I guilty of

<b​ufo:monero.social> When it turns out that tecnovert is fake, there will be ample evidence stacked against you :) I'm not going to argue back and forth as that will make this chat worse than it already is. I just wanted to make it known that ofrnxmr is no scammer to any readers who care to listen

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Alright ladies and gentlemen. This is 4D chess game we're assisting since yesterday. the tecnovert account is fake

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ig that's why bufowas so confident about preparing bullshit allegations against some of us

ccs in the news

It's a scam!

Why didn't they say that!!

Can't trust the media these days!!!

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Puff piece

(:

"while just this month, the UK government singled out privacy coins as "not conducive to the public good.""

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> people told me Watchdogs Legion was a video game...

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> Can we have the real devs of basicswap commenting on the issue ?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> you asked it, here it is : gist.github.com/gerlofvanek/897c80c69c1ddba8b1ef09d66172e353

<l​m:matrix.baermail.fr> good, but that's not enough. We need to ask them if ofrxmr contacted them for this proposal.

<r​brunner7:monero.social> Well, "good" is relative. I am starting to get really pissed about that whole thing, something that happens quite rarely. That impersonating and social engineering was like crossing a limit to me.

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> It's a pre school when pre school kids are making critical decisions

<r​brunner7:monero.social> And wouldn't you think that if those devs were really happy about that CCS they would make contact and comment on their own? Common sense?

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> SyntheticBird:

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> I guess it's time for you and your little gang to man up and apologize for all of the false accusations right?

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> And we should consider cleaning up the main discussion group from trolls accounts like endor00:

I call to apologize for false accusations followed by a false accusation

brilliant

*A call

rbrunner7 yes, the must have known about this proposal for quite some time now

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> You can say the same thing in other way, if devs were unhappy they could comment on their own

<a​ndrea_togni:matrix.org> mises.org/mises-wire/arrest-samoura…overnment-hates-privacy-and-freedom

<a​ndrea_togni:matrix.org> Hello, here is a little article of mine on the Samourai issue. It also mentions Monero delistings.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> very opinionated conclusion but overall good explanations at each point. From the little I've read

if they know about it

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> is IRC bridge delayed?

as you know matrix dot org has issues with other servers and the relay to IRC is on monero social

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> yes but I'm on monero.social. "if they know about it" appeared 10 minutes after you message ro rbrunner. that's why i was asking

oh, then maybe you are missing the response from pyverse on matrix

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> You can say the same thing in other way, if devs were unhappy they could comment on their own

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> no no I see it

if they were told then they must know about it is the point

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> get it

if they were included

so much speculation :)

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I mean. I claim to have talked with them in dm and they weren't aware. tho I can't share screenshots so I've no hard proof.

here is something to keep uncontroversial that will keep monero functioning smoothly .............

I need to reread after editing lol

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I didn't see it being merged congrats to selsta ig

<y​asabi:matrix.org> no i am not, i am github.com/yasabi

<y​asabi:matrix.org> thanks for letting me know ofrn is impersonating me with a sockpuppet, the slimy piece of shit

<y​asabi:matrix.org> I'm happy to validate myself via a sidechannel such as keybase or reddit if anyone cares

<y​asabi:matrix.org> this shits' becoming indistinguishable from an attack on the community

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> at the look at it, it's someone imperonation you to put you agains ofrn, so probably not ofrn.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> But yeah, it's an attack on monero and on the community.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Frequent attack, now DDOS 150/2 type that seam to hit the nodes the harders.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> And feds peoples impersonating people to break the community apart.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> And afaik, the community attack work way better than attacking monero

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> And afaik, the community attack work way better than attacking monero (the coin)

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> They don't want ofrn because he actually know the coin really well and was the person that helped randoms the most.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> So they indeed knoed down main monero support on Matrix

<p​reland:matrix.org> Oh wait is it dog on ofrn hour?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> They don't want ofrn because he actually know the coin really well and was the person that helped randoms the most.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> So they indeed knocked down main monero support on Matrix

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> dog on ofrn hour, wtf that mean lol

<p​reland:matrix.org> Yk I usually don’t pay him mine, except for that one time 3 days ago that he basically blasted the I2P CCS

<p​reland:matrix.org> Admittedly deserved, but still kinda hurt

<y​asabi:matrix.org> how does ofrn "really know the coin" when his contribition history shows he can barely write a shell script?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> people asking question on matrix about how to do X or Y usually did get an answer from ofrn

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> yasabi don't mind. They are convinced ideology is better suited than skills

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> now people usually get no answer and have to ask 10 times or something

<p​reland:matrix.org> One in 30 times that I check a Monero channel it’s people either 1. Arguning with ofrn, 2. Actively banned ofrn, or 3. Discussing how to actually ban ofrn

<y​asabi:matrix.org> how is rallying brigaders for weeks, months on end to disrupt comms channels "helping randoms the most"?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> code is not everything

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> code is just one part of the thing

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> sorry not my sentiment

<p​reland:matrix.org> Anyways gotta build a house bye 👋

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> have fun!

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Are you saying that the random from bitcoinints mostly where XMR?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Are you saying that the random from bitcoinints mostly where ofrnxmr?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> were*

<y​asabi:matrix.org> I'm not interested in discussing the charlatan further, its a waste of clock cycles

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> were not... ofrn

<y​asabi:matrix.org> you do you but its a bad look to anyone with a brain

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> No I didn't stated, just corrected

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> yeah, Me nether

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> I'm leavning that community anyway, it's mostly time stealing cancer owned by feds

ofrn, the modern Rorschach test

<c​trej:matrix.org> given the current state of crypto and the targeting of privacy preserving tools, it is guaranteed that feds are reading along

ofc they are

here is something for them to consider

<c​trej:matrix.org> always keep this in mind guys

<c​trej:matrix.org> Even the person you hate the most in the community is more on your side the fes

<s​iren:kernal.eu> Do you think that the feds are not only passively monitoring but also stirring up drama/being disruptive here?

<c​trej:matrix.org> Even the person you hate the most in the community is more on your side the feds

<c​trej:matrix.org> I would not be surprised

<c​trej:matrix.org> Its months since I first got suspicious, and the likelihood only grew

<s​iren:kernal.eu> It's a bit weird that the feds would target ofrn. There's little value in sabotaging him or most of us even, including me.

<s​iren:kernal.eu> It would make more sense to bully a core dev.

<c​trej:matrix.org> you dont understand

<c​trej:matrix.org> they dont target ofrn

<c​trej:matrix.org> He's just a good opportunity because he sparks outrage wherever he goes

We should rename this channel to #monero-ofrn, it's all we talk about these days.

<c​trej:matrix.org> Easy to pour more fuel into the fire and make everyone emotional

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I see your point but tbh I agree with Siren. We're just here loosing time arguing about useless things. core devs (which are the core of monero) are ignoring this channel entirely

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> and they are right to do so

if he sparks outrage wherever he goes then it doesn't seem like much needs to be added to that

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> edit on what I said. There is a point at criticizing ofrnxmr's proposal, avoid a scam situation for the community. Tho most of the discussion is about pointless arguments.

<y​asabi:matrix.org> > Even the person you hate the most in the community is more on your side the feds

<y​asabi:matrix.org> what if the person in the community is consistently trying to disrupt development for their own clout and monetary gain?

<y​asabi:matrix.org> disrupting internal organization exactly what the state and tradfi want

<c​trej:matrix.org> do you think ofrn is a fed?

<y​asabi:matrix.org> i don't think it's useful to speculate on individual people being part of any specific agencies. there's obviously no way to verify such a thing, and speculations of it can easily spiral out of control and destroy communities

<y​asabi:matrix.org> destroying the community and social fabric of oppositional projects is a long running tactic of the intelligence community though, anyone who's interested can find decades worth of documents detailing how they go about it

<y​asabi:matrix.org> what's useful then is analyzing behavioral trends with their results in mind

<c​trej:matrix.org> yeah thats my gist a few messages before

<y​asabi:matrix.org> whether or not any one person is a fed is beside the point. the point is that the feds want monero's internal communication channels to be useless to monero's development

<y​asabi:matrix.org> the longer all channels are only talking about one bad actor, the less useful they are to the development of the monero project

<e​ndor00:matrix.org> Doesn't matter who or what they are. Are they helping the community/project, or are they causing trouble? And remember: doing some good in the past doesn't give you a free pass to do some bad later. This is not a zero sum game.

> Doesn't matter who or what they are. Are they helping the community/project, or are they causing trouble?

^^ the correct perspective

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Feel free to leave buddy

<y​asabi:matrix.org> thanks for the permission bud

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> The main point was development of basicswap

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Now its switched to kids talking about illuminati taking over the monero community and so on

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> I should make a proposal for age restricting monero channels

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> You should just go fuck yourself.

<y​asabi:matrix.org> i agree, we should require ID verification for every single user

<y​asabi:matrix.org> perhaps they could be tracked and validated on some sort of transparent, public ledger :upsid

<y​asabi:matrix.org> 🙃

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> coc cops are gonna get you in jail rotten 👮

<y​asabi:matrix.org> if ofrn's most recent proposal was in good faith, why are there no specifics. it's claimed by his fanboys he really knows these coins? why doesn't he mention that Particl's SMSG network doesn't even have the throughput capacity for moderate scale adoption by Monero users? what's the plan to deal with that?

<y​asabi:matrix.org> the Particl devs have known about it for years, i would think if he was working for him that would be noted in the proposal.

<y​asabi:matrix.org> *working for them

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Aside from these trolls

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> The main point to consider is:

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> 1: devs should make a separate proposal themselves and im sure haveno army will attack and spam them as well

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> 2: change the current proposal to reach a middleground between ofrnxmr which he claims to be a developer himself, and the qualified opposition group(excluding trolls), in this scenario, devs are okay with ofrnxmr managing and coordinating the project, so main focus of the discussion is about the pay and improving the milestone and target discription

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Yes this is a pretty neutral and good description. We'll have to wait for saturday meeting to discuss those

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> For people who agree with the second method

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Untraceable made a good suggestion, check it on gitlab and see if you're okay with it

<y​asabi:matrix.org> another question, BasicSwap is intrinsically reliant on particl-core, which is what handles the SMSG network and its required onchain timestamping. The Particl devs already receive over 50% of the coin emission from the Particl network. Why then would the Particl devs need to raise more money from the Monero community?

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> For the first method support, SyntheticBird: contacted the devs based on his/her claims, ask him/her it

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> For the first method supporters.

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> SyntheticBird: contacted the devs based on his/her claims, ask him/her it

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I already did. I've nothing to share at the moment

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> They talked about this in the gitlab

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Instead of spamming, read the comments

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> > <@yasabi:matrix.org> another question, BasicSwap is intrinsically reliant on particl-core, which is what handles the SMSG network and its required onchain timestamping. The Particl devs already receive over 50% of the coin emission from the Particl network. Why then would the Particl devs need to raise more money from the Monero community?

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> They talked about this on the gitlab

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Instead of spamming, read the comments

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> _I already did. I've nothing to share at the moment_ mb I didn't understood the sentence

<y​asabi:matrix.org> i don't read the gitlab because it's overwhelmed with sockpuppets 🤷

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Well the core team uses gitlab to interact with us, if you prefer her instead of gitlab, that answers a lot of questions about you

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> > <@yasabi:matrix.org> i don't read the gitlab because it's overwhelmed with sockpuppets 🤷

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> Well the core team uses gitlab to interact with us, if you prefer here instead of gitlab, that answers a lot of questions about you

<y​asabi:matrix.org> cool story bruh

<p​y.verse:matrix.org> 1: devs should make a separate proposal themselves and im sure haveno army will attack and spam them as well <<>> you keep saying this. Meanwhile swaps are of no use to me while haveno would be. They are different use cases more than they are competitors

<y​asabi:matrix.org> just read the CCS, it mentions SMSG but not the scalability of it specific. jw's point about SMSG is still a valid concern however, if it's feeless why does it need to be run via the particl daemon?

<y​asabi:matrix.org> but also, my point was scalability. the Particl devs themselves have been talking about "SMSG 2.0" for literally five years

<y​asabi:matrix.org> they themselves said years ago it was not performant enough for moderate adoption of their marketplace dapp, let alone a second dapp like BSX

<y​asabi:matrix.org> do they not want moderate adoption of their coin? if they do want adoption, why has this been discussed for years, and isn't specifically mentioned in the CCS?

<p​epe86frog:matrix.org> what makes you think he was targeted? sorry for being out of the loop

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> he was referring to the disruption caused by any CCS attempt of ofrn. Someone said it might be the fed behind it. Siren just expressed confusion about why the feds would use ofrn to cause disruption in the community

Do we even know of ofrnxmr made these proposals at this point lol

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> plowsof read your dm

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> pretty please

<y​asabi:matrix.org> lol you disparage me for not reading gitlab when by your admission on the CCS thread you signed up yesterday

<y​asabi:matrix.org> big brain right there

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> whats a brain anyway

mine is in a jar

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> so you can move with it, like a laptop?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Seems like it doesn’t take much for the sheep to fall for it.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Red mist takes over and they pile on