Holy shit, Ubuntu turned 20 years today!

I remember starting my ubuntu journey using 4.10. Almost none of my hardware worked with it and I was still quite new to Linux at that time

boy how things have changed

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Hold offtopic batman

and yet remained the same

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Holy*

shutting up :)

debianz: you must be very young!

Some people say I am

others say I am quite old

The world is your oyster.

<p​lowsof:matrix.org> vthors proposal has undergone some extensive changes repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/495

<p​lowsof:matrix.org> next meeting this Saturday monero-project/meta #1095

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> luigi1111 can Librejo have a getmonero.org subdomain pretty please?

<k​ayabanerve:monero.social> plowsof: Can I get my CCS draft on the agenda with a link to said draft in-agenda please?

<k​ayabanerve:monero.social> It was discussed at the prior MRL and I'll bring it up again at the next one too.

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> But there is repo.getmoner It will confuse people

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> probably. I say we replace gitlab with librejo and call it a day

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> I dont see the major confusion, the bigger issue would be transferring ownership of monero-project org

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Ccs is integrated with gitlab

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> It’s not confusing for you because you’re here all the time, whatever the average guy

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> It’s not confusing for you because you’re here all the time, what about the average guy

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> nothing's impossible to migrate (expect systemd)

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Nobody uses repo as a git repo

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> except*

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Except/expect, same difference

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> I was looking as forgeju it’s pretty cool but I really doubt it compares to gitlab in terms of dev ops capabilities

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> lmao brother what dev ops capabilities, gitlab have nothing in free tier

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> The commenting and thumb up/down ux of gitlab > forgejo for ccs imk

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> thats the wole reason no one use it

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> We use enterprise edition

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> no we don't. Otherwise we would have pull mirror repository

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> We do

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Oh I don’t use free tier my customers just pay for enterprise so I guess I forgot what the difference is now

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Its right there on the login page

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> I like that it’s non JavaScript if you want it to be

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> then someone lied to me

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> but anyway if by dev ops you mean CI/CD its possible yet not easy on Forgejo

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…ero.social/ZTiDqOItonmCCECWKCpvYcDF

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> mamma mia

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> It would tragic if someone had to reinvent the CCS workflow / proposal system if we switched

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> It would be tragic if someone had to reinvent the CCS workflow / proposal system if we switched

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> ;)

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> I think forjego focuses on building docker containers out of everything (which I am a fan of actually)

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I hate docker. I hate containers. I love VM

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> But the project is quite young

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Yeah I’m not surprised you hate u psychopath

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> VMs are inefficient tho

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Unless you’re talking vagrant

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> ?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> what

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> oh no mb nevermind

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> maybe on the memory consumption part but tbh i prefer that to the pseudo-isolation of the linux namespaces

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Last I heard from a colleague is doing everything in vagrant and docker rather than just docker

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> I literally haven’t touched vagrant in my life I just understand it to be an efficient kind of VM

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> But you can use app armour and just restrict most kernel functions

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> it enters the paradigm of MicroVMs which I think is an excellent thing. I made a blog post about that: syntheticbird45.github.io/monerodmicrovm.html

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Apparmor is a joke of an LSM and and do not achieve a quarter of what SELinux is capable in terms of filtering. But that's not surprising knowing its Canonical behind it.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> neither less I see your point being that docker is efficient and actually suited for the work. I just dont' believe in linux stack security nowaday thats entirely ideological

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> so i don't blame you for loving docker.

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> I’m not putting it forward as the best solution, if you were to ask me the best solution I would say, hardware compatible qubes-whonix every time

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Would be good idea they produced that as a server

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> When I see Xen i kneel 🧎‍♂️

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> xenserver.com

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> More secure then qemu kvm

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> its debatable but from an architectural point of view yes

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> KVM is the linux kernel. Xen is a microkernel virtualizating the administration linux (dom0)

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> But that’s hardware isolatable

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> you have less likely to get breakage/bug/vulnerabilities with Xen

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ?

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> So for example on Qubes you can physically isolate two apps VMs hardware level with qemu-kvm is my understanding and why it’s all the hype

<r​ucknium:monero.social> #monero-offtopic:monero.social , please :)

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ah yes sorry rucknium

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Soz

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> kewbit join offtopic

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> How

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> sent link in dm

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> You are not invited to this room

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> oh my f*cking god

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> i blame every devs involved in writing synapse

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> And it literally says freedom of fucking speech in the the title of it

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> idk why rooms are all blocked off, going on what, a month now?

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> I sent you an invite kewbit:

TIL temporary is >= 1 month

what is librejo for?

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> It’s a FOSS git repo

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Similar to Gitlab but shittrr

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> For now at least

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> They pulled off quite a lot since inception

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Quite a lot of contributors

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> shittrr?

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Shitter* sorry

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> luigi1111 This is Forgejo instance that keep up-to-date pull mirror of main and ecosystem repositories. It can also be used by other users for their monero related projects.

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> In terms of functionality all the basics are there

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> It's not shitter.

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> That’s just my opinion

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> thx for pointing it

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> Others can have their s

I'm not opposed to it. Need to bring binaryFate into the convo tho. I don't run the servers.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> thx i'll wait on his response

Re: librejo. We can add a dns record for a getmonero subdomain if doing so would add value vs. an external domain, and if that doesn't bring significant security risks for users.

Who would run and maintain that server?

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Syntheticbird does

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Its currently on librejo.monerodevs.org

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> i think the server has a good amount of storage and has a mirror of some repos/orgs. one plus-side is that its faster than github. Idk whether it supports runners in it current config, bur forgejo should support them

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> binaryFate I'm the sysadmin and maintainer of the instance. I'm fully aware of the security of my server stack, which I have consequently hardened.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> It has been operating for several months without any runtime issue. One maintenance have led to some problem at system update which have been extensively described in a report that i think ofrnxmr remember very well. It has been resolved in under 8 hours.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Regarding Actions, Forgejo does supports it and i'm experimenting with it locally until I find a good configuratio for production.

<k​ewbit:matrix.org> It looks like they are working on alpha builds of CI CD runners at the moment

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> The situation is complicated. They are alpha yet used in production. last news is that they have purchased an audit of their current branch

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Woodpecker CI is also an option

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Max version of ubuntu has to be 16.04 used

<w​oodser:monero.social> I have a question regarding the CCS rules, specifically rule 4 which states:

<w​oodser:monero.social> All work must be licensed permissively at all stages of the proposal. There is no time where your work can be licensed under a restrictive license (even as you're working on it). Your proposal will be terminated if this is not remedied.

<w​oodser:monero.social> Can developers develop the code in private, while it’s a work in progress, and then open source it (under permissive license) when they’re done and ready to request payment?

<w​oodser:monero.social> Or must the code be publicly published at every moment?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Not the CCS coordinator but the `There is no time where your work can be licensed under a restrictive license` makes its clear you can't keep it private. Which I find a little extreme

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> keep it private even temporarily

that sentence says "licensed". nothing about where the code is stored.

<w​oodser:monero.social> if they have written a line of code on their computer which is a WIP, it’s not licensed restrictively

<w​oodser:monero.social> so should not be in violation of rule 4 if I understand correctly

exactly. it's not followable. every written line must be a commit and pushed?

no one works like that

<w​oodser:monero.social> otherwise it would be impossible to comply with rule 4 as each character is written and WIP, before pushing

<w​oodser:monero.social> looking for clarification plowsofDiego Salazar

plowsof

binaryFate, ArticMine

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Does say “even when your working on it”

"licensed"

woodser please clarify your question. are you talking about licensing or pushing code? your question refers to both as if they're the same thing.

<w​oodser:monero.social> my question is about development of code before it’s published. all published code must be licensed under a permissive license. that much is clear

ok, what about it before it's published? @woodser

<w​oodser:monero.social> must the code always be published, or is the developer allowed to develop the code until they’re ready to publish it?

yeah, see that question says nothing about licensing. so i don't see how the given CCS rule is prohibiting it at all.

and as already stated, that's already what literally everyone does.

no one is comitting and pushing after every line is written.

<w​oodser:monero.social> I agree, but I’m looking for clarification from those in charge of enforcing the CCS rules

👍

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> I think that would depend on the milestone being claimed

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> And the specific license its under

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> If no product/binary etc is released, the available source code should match the milestone