Damn it, I saw someone mention Zcash and I wanted to ask opinions

<dcmeans7[m]> "Damn it, I saw someone mention..." <- Zcash is a good crypto

I'm not sure about the xmr community hate for it , it technically still better than most crypto out there

here is a quote from zooko of zcash, the tweet is around somewhere.....

"And by the way, I think we can successfully make Zcash too traceable for criminals like WannaCry, but still completely private & fungible."

so good lol

hahaha

man

nioc: Zcash has different privacy model than xmr

it still kept the privacy features but it can't be use for criminal activity

this is a good move for regulators

like tbh idc for xmr / zec , all i want is to have digital private payments

Pretty much like they don't understand.

But I am a criminal and so is Mochi101

mlcboss[m], just use fiat then

++ nioc

Mochi101: i used fiat , but i don't like that is being traceable

and the fact my transaction data is shared by payment companies

so XMR?

You can't have partial anonymity

Ask nioc, I heard he was the biggest arms dealer in Vatican City. So he needs his privacy.

Mochi101: xmr is a good choice , zec is a backup choice

if xmr may have been strictly banned , zcash might be an option

xmr is delisted in my country , so i preferred getting

* xmr is a good choice , zec is a backup choice

if xmr may have been strictly banned , zcash might be an option

xmr is delisted in my country , so i preferred getting sent via zec

Delisted in your country?

xmr is "delisted" where I am and I have no issues using it, buying it or selling it

Mochi101: my country only allowed buy / sell in local exchanges (cause taxes lol)

they decided to remove xmr & torn in all exchanges due to ties on money laundering

Pools got destroyed by soi

I can even pay taxes on xmr trading profits

Xmr is persecuted

nioc: if i need to be sent money anonymously , i had to ask the sender to sent me the money in zec instead of other crypto

and i can easily convert to other crypto

xmr has been delisted & will be hard for user to get one

I can't remember your country nioc

New North Korea

Usa?

Y

Oh NNK

Thought so

I'm paranoid by nature...

Well with good reason... but I'm ruined I imagine every single thing I do is under a microscope because it's true

United Spies of America 🇺🇸

mlcboss[m], which country?

nioc: Is the new Red Star OS based on Android now?

I liked Monero cause I thought fluffy was a witness... and I Hate spying

:D

<notdanimal> I'm pretty sure you're able and allowed to mine to subaddresses on hashvault for XMR, but figured I'd ask since I was here

Im in monero because of mcafee his words. Hope devs dont spoil the privacy😁

What was Elon all about.. confusing

where's the form to give fluffy p my info? that's how this works now, right?

Iza_menace yeah you gotta gib seed phrase and all personal documentifications with picture of you holding a picture of a picture of your state issued privacy passport and send to PrivatePonyFluffyPrivates⊙MPUCfc

<xfedex[m]> "my blockchain had corrupted..." <- ofrnxmr: AFAIK the only thing you need to do to avoid corruption is add `--db-sync-mode=safe:sync` to your monerod startup options.

I've been using this switch for over a year and no corruption even if I hard rebooted my node on several occasions. It should really be the default, but it isn't...

Nah

Safe will kill your storage faster

Performs more writes due to windows messy shutdowns (to avoid corruption), but on posix systems "safe" is worse for storage because mac, linux etc typically shut down gracefully

Fast:async:1000000bytes is what i was recommended not non windows systems, and i ran for > 1year on android like that

With plenty of force closes

on windows, without sync-mode=safe, thr blockchain would have corrupted from the force closes /OOM many months ago

My personal corruption was likely a result of regularly running prerelease code

I'm on linux... had corruptions before I added the safe mode. Maybe it wears down my SSD a bit more but from experience, SSDs die way before the Wear Leveling Count goes to zero ;)

I'm willing to risk it!

try changing the fast value

example db-sync-mode=fast:async:2500000bytes

example db-sync-mode=fast:async:100blocks

When the blockchain corrupts, it has snapshots

not sure why that helps. the docs say:

The fast:async:* can corrupt blockchain database in case of a system crash. It should not corrupt if just monerod crashes. If you are concerned with system crashes use safe:sync.

Running db-salvage attempts to roll back to the last snapshot

Those docs are monerodocs

Third party interpretation

I had zero luck with db-salvage in the past... I had to re-sync so many times. now I'm playing it safe haha

Hyc knows bettrr

ofrnxmr[m]: I think?

I think dbsalvage might need to be run on the first launch after it corrupted

it's indeed from monerodcs

I'm interested in a definite answer on this

but am not willing to test it on my node instance 😅

One reason i avoid safe mode is because on android, termux node can uses SD cards

And those wear a lot faster

yeah, sure

but 99% of people are not running a node on Android....

skeptdev[m]: > <@skeptdev:matrix.org> it's indeed from monerodcs

> I'm interested in a definite answer on this

> but am not willing to test it on my node instance 😅

I got fast:async:largenumber from hyc as ideal for all but windows

Flash storage is flash storage

Ssd has >10x the write cycles, but 3 years on an sd card at current vokume = 3 years on an ssd at 10x the volume

A modern SSD of decent quality can take quite a lot of writes...

Safe does quite a lot of writes

Safe rewrites stuff

morre

honestly I would never think of running a node on a SD card. this is crazy!

external ssd, sd card, same thing different amount of wear tolerance

A lot of devices dont support sd cards these days. Also works with external ssd or internal storage

speed is the biggest problem with sd cards. I run on internal now

<ofrnxmr[m]> "external ssd, sd card, same..." <- indeed. I looked up my stats. I have a Samsung SSD 860 EVO 1 TB.

Wear leveling count is at 92%. I have 88.46 TB written...

I think I'm still OK for a few more writes!

but really, I sure hope running a Monero node on a smartphone is not the main scenario... !

Why not?!

Lol

because once synced, it costs literally no resources to keep running on a regular laptop or computer...

My android is much faster than most any computer "older computer" that others use for nodes

And much, much, much lower energy

a laptop uses signigicantly mlre power than a smartphone or tvbox

you can have an idle laptop, doing nothing

but sure. if you run your node on a phone, use the aync:fast mode, it'll probably save its life ;)

It uses much much mkre power than an android that is actively syncing

but if I had no desktop on 24/7 I would use a raspberry pi with a small external USB-connected SSD. very low-power too!

People run modes on pi's lacking hardware aes

^ that is crazy

jinx

why does it matter?

Pis are a terrible choice

Same power drain as android, 100h/s efficiency

Hardware aes is needed for effienct syncing

I'm talking about running a node, not mining...

pi's are terrible bottlenecmed.

rockpro etc have aes

skeptdev[m]: Same thing

You need to verify everything

Pi's cannot verify anything quickly due to lack of hardware instructions / forced software emulation

And at the price of the newer ones, you can get a much faster android + a 1tb ssd

And get a backup phone for free

seems like you're splitting hairs. they still have a lot of room processing power wise

in the end, it depends on what you have on hand...

no

it takes weeks to sync a node on pi

they will RIP with volume

No aes = DOA aka hobby nonsense

well of course I would not sync a node on PI, I would sync on my laptop/desktop then copy it on the PI

It has to keep up

And it can right now

Barely

same thing with any low processing power device

I've run a node on a PI for a while without any issue. CPU was below 10%... Barely? IDK what you're talking about honestly...

I could probably find some numbers, but its probably doing like 1 block in 30 seconds

Aes ma:

Man*

Ask why is my pi at 10% and syncing over 2 weeks

Because its struggling and cant make use of the hardware

Monero rewuires hardware aes

just sync it on a faster AES-enabled machine then copy the chain onto it.

I had it running on a PI 4 model B (8 GB) BTW

right

And im saying they can barely keep up with current volume

time to sync 1 block at 300kb = way too long

falling behind 1 block all the time

If volume increases fro' 0.24 tx/sec to 7 tx/sec = rip all pi's that dont have aes

maybe you're right. I didn't monitor block sync time closely nor did I really care TBH.

Also Pis are overpriced af when it comes to processing power

A mobile phone will have more processing power for much less money

* A consumer phone nowadays will have more processing power for much less money

Again, rockpro etc are more viable, but we also have a bunch of issue reports for them not having proper power management

Right now, android makes some of the most powerful aarch64 devices, and because they have batteries you dont ever have to worry about power failures

<k4r4b3y[m]1> "I think the question should be..." <- You perceive community as a group of people tired to a common physical location. In that case you would need to have enough privacy/security/anonymity aware people concentrated in that area that would opt-out from the traditional system to Monero. That won't happen in this stage.

If you but perceive community without being tied to physical location you have tons of communities using Monero already.

Take for example darknet markets and try to abstain from the judgement of what is sold there (the same what is sold for fiat already). These are large communities ready to take role in delivering goods and services traded today in clearnet for fiat like food, groceries, clothes or electronics.

These communities can be game changing life savers once shit hits the fan.

<ofrnxmr[m]> "Right now, android makes some of..." <- interesting. If I had no desktop server available I would definitely explore this!

thats why i did it :). No regrets

its fast too

Youd never know she wasnt a desktop

ofrnxmr[m]: OK, it can sync a node, but don't compare it to a decent desktop with an AMD Ryzen

Not a newer one

900h/s on the high end

More than comparible to a lot of intels

And laptops

this is a pointless comparison... a barely optimized Ryzen 3900 does 12K H/s....

My phone is from 2019? A p30

im sure newer devices kick more ass than mine

At 100+w

A p30 does 900h at sub 1w

probably closer to 10w

you should charge it to 100% and leave charged plugged to watt-meter, then try mining

*charger plugged

i havent measures at wall, but i dont use any chargers above 5w/1amp

i mistaked and said 1w instead if 1a

phones can get above 100 h/s/watt, but not much above that

so 900 h/s means 7-9 watts

Of course not top tier, but far from bottom

I mean.. it's above zero but I make about 1$ a day with 25-30K H/s.

I'd call 100H/s non-significant but it's all a matter of perspective I guess

100h/s/watt

Those are effiency numbers, not hashrates

sech1 what are the best numbers you know of right now? ~130h/s/w?

you have to take into account the cost of the device too

which is usually free for android

Yes, my 7950X did 130 h/s/w when I first tested undervolt. But it was with unoptimized memory timings and with GPU plugged in

Since its literally my old broken phone

it can go over 140 h/s/w without GPU and with optimized memory

I'm too lazy to test again, since it's running slightly overclocked now, so no undervolt

Yeah, np thanks

btw I measured at the wall

[2022-09-30T18:32:49.453Z] <@sech1> Ryzen 7950X running at 0.85V, 4.3 GHz all core: 18143 h/s, 140 watts at the wall = 129.6 h/J

this was when I just bought it, so it was even stock RAM and unoptimized xmrig

I added Zen4 optimizations later

sech1: my numbers are about 135W for 1900 h/s with my 5950x

optimized to the best of my abilities

19k*h/s?

s/1900/19K/

so yes, 140 h/J is close to the limit of Ryzens

maybe 150 h/J if it's running without GPU

2x64 core AMD EPYC system can get more probably

my GPU added 15 watts

I did some numbers on epyc 7763 a few months ago

yeep

needs substation

for a prohibitive upfront cost 😬 gotta need it for something else already I guess

Dont remember them :)

<guruji[m]> "You perceive community as a..." <- > <@vergio:matrix.org>... (full message at <libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/do…24bb20d28c0a801ccf2f277b614e5062401>)

Having said that, I would expect from that geographically-concentrated community have the willingness to get out of their government controlled economy/monetary systme.

If even simply for the fact that they save money

yeah

And NGU.. adoption of scarce money means their money wont be losing value

I would like to see monero communities around the world, similar to how btc'ers try to foster such with bitcoin ekasi, bitcoin-this/-that , etc.

So the idea of vokitility is only reallt a problem when xmr is trader more than used

I actually have a community trying to convert

k4r4b3y[m]1: > <@k4r4b3y:karapara.net> I would like to see monero communities around the world, similar to how btc'ers try to foster such with bitcoin ekasi, bitcoin-this/-that , etc.

>

if only btc wasn't such a shitcoin... all these efforts at getting the people to use it would be fruitful.

A lot of maxis by accident

Leaders gott them on btc but after talking to me realize they are making a mistake long term

And now they need to move ppl to xmr without losing confidence

"but... you said btc was the answer for years?"

the thing with btc'ers is that they have the story to shill: "number go up, hodl, and low time preference betterment of the society." however, simplistic this is, this sort of a story gets the ball rolling with local communities believing in that story and trying to adopt btc.

we need some monero-analog of that.

Then bam, youre using wallet of satoshi

<skeptdev[m]> "I mean.. it's above zero but I..." <- > <@skeptdev:matrix.org> I mean.. it's above zero but I make about 1$ a day with 25-30K H/s.

> I'd call 100H/s non-significant but it's all a matter of perspective I guess

70 H/s :)

Haha

now post that on kucoin

Sell it

And call it dero2

Dw. They can always do chain swaps when mainnet releases 🥳

I would suggest such a story for monero to be focused on freedom from government coercion, democratic self-governance of local communities, and ant-fragility to the govt-authoritarian measures (govt banning or payment processors banning firearms sales, or govt confiscating the canadian truckers' protestors, etc. etc.)

that sort of a story can fuel the many small communities (cities, neighborhoods, villages) under govt oppression, think Turkey, Iran, Afghanistan, or heck, even EU and USA.

i dont even push any of that. Just "why do you use xyz. Ok well this is better"

"and cheaper"

once we got such a raison d'etre on the forefront, monero would attract more people's attention, and it would have more chance at getting adopted by local, meatspace communities.

currently many people know monero's story as the drug money.

which is fine by me, I am not doing a moral judgment, but I would like to see monero being adopted on the ground by the communities, too.

they only need to know monero as cost savings on money you dont have to dump

that's fine by me, too

whatever gets it going---so far as we don't pander to the governments' wish to trace monero

Like.. you need to constantly raise prices in fiat

so far as we don't give up the cypherpunk ideals

As a merchsnt

You can keep prices static or even lower them as adoption grows

What js 1xmr today at wally world, wont be 20xmr in 5 years if wally world stays using xmr

How do you keep a price static when cost of production varies?

hey hows it going lads

what is the most private way to get monero with fiat so no kyc

also low fees please, i dont wanna use localmonero

Localmonero

DAYM

Find a low fee merchant

ive been waiting for months

Millions must buy

these people are greedy

Other than localmonero, you should check if you have monero atms near your area

LOL

But they generally have some fees

monero atms?

never heard of that

The point is, buying monero in a completely anonymous way always going to cost more than buying on a CEX with KYC.

That doesn't mean you should use KYC CEX.

k4r4b3y[m]1: yeah i know this

But it does mean you should be understanding and patient with the anon xmr acquire fees.

rickandmortyisno: Check local bitcoin atms website

Google it

And pick the xmr atms option

right

rickandmortyisno: Other than that, mining is also the most private way to acquire monero, but it requires heavy up-front capital costs.

Depending on if you have a gaming pc or not

i dont

Me neithet

Neither*

is there not a way to buy another crypto with no kyc and change it for monero? is that road even worth exploring?

You can try to get btc or lts without kyc

And exchange them into xmr uaing trocador.app or orangefren.com

i heard the bitcoin fees are really bad though

Btc is shit with its tx fees btw

so is it even worth it

Probably not worth it with btc

Try ltc ?

I dunno. I buy from my localmonero dealer

No kyc. Acceptable fees.

yeah thats what i thought too, maybe another crypto would be better but which one lmao

k4r4b3y[m]1: fair

.scam

that's best coin

Yes monero

?

Best coin

lol alright

Take care chuddie 😉

also the problem is that alot of the people selling want to use a payment option that requires KYC

I see that. And I avoid them. I support the no-kyc merchants.

right same

* right, same

god daym bro, how many more months, ive been looking at people prices in localmonero every day since November 2022

I guess the price is the price tben

Tyranny of the free market..

alr thanks for the info

<rickandmortyisno> "god daym bro, how many more..." <- Problem?

<TrasherDK[m]> "How do you keep a price static..." <- Battery died, ill follow up on this later on. A longer answer

<rickandmortyisno> "god daym bro, how many more..." <- If you can find a way that you can buy anonymously and low fee, then let me know

But yeah, i agree with you. Localmonero is too much

<rickandmortyisno> "also the problem is that alot of..." <- that's also because most payment options require kyc of some kind

hard to find ways to transfer cash outside of in person or mail that don't require identity verification

Localmonero is barely 2% off real price, not a big deal

if it's worst % than then then you need to onboard more people on localmonero

* on localmonero in you're location

Or

Binance price is bs

Id be super retarded to sell at binance prices

Just cuz binance decided to tell me "let us buy you out at 150". Yeah right

All market that have not enough volume have prices like that, to fix it, people have to use it more, more competition between makers close the gap, easy

But yeah, Binance do price supression too

You cant arb with binan<e

Thry close withdrawals

so its impossible to properly stabalize

As soon as it gers "going" you can no longer arb

<RavFX[m]> "Localmonero is barely 2% off..." <- yeah i was about to say

localmonero fees really aren't that bad compared to what i've seen on other p2p exchanges

It really depend of you're location

as it depend of the amount of makers competing

More makers close the spread, easy.

Best time to pump amount of makers in Localmonero was to lobby for it in localbitcoins (specially after the anounce that they will close).

I saw someone charging about $320/XMR on localmonero, that person had 3 trades, I guess that means there is not much competition around in my 'local' area

Means you ahould get on there and sell for 320 too

ofrnxmr[m]: how would i even set up selling on localmonero

Just open an account and deposit at least 0.35xmr

Pretty much the same as setting up a craistlist ad

s/craistlist/craigslist/

<Guest69> "I saw someone charging about $32..." <- I can assure you that if you set close to market price you'll get a ton of clients

A seller can quickly get hundreds of trades starting from nothing as long as they are able to set a great price.

thats the only seller in their area

320 is market :D haha lolol

but yeah, if they sold at 250 theyd probably have 10x the sales

If they sold at 150 theyd be making no money but a ton of sales

and as a buyer, its super easy to buy at market. Anyone selling on cex has to take a hit. Not if they sell to me. I take the "hit" (which is a wash when i resell anyway)

<ofrnxmr[m]> "A p30 does 900h at sub 1w" <- my s10 does about 800H/s at 7W, or about 8W from the wall

I remember the huawei devices kicking ass and said "usa is just mad at those hashrates"

What sort of charger are you using? The stock one?

Try using a low power charger. Seems to work just fine and waste less energy and cause less heat

A 5v 1a charger

I have multiple. The most efficient is a 65W xiaomi one. The 7W where measured with a good USB power meter. Numbers are of the top of my head, +-10% tolerance

* my head, therefore assume +-10% tolerance

I'm having an issue with monero. Basically i'm developing a mining pool from scratch. I take the blocktemplate_blob and add the extra_nonce to it. When a miner finds a share, I also add the nonce. But when I try to submit it to daemon, it says that block doesn't have enough difficulty, because the hash computed by daemon is different from the xmrig-computed hash (which I check to be valid with calc_pow RPC method). Do you have any idea

what's the cause? I've controlled all the code many, many times but can't find the issue.

It's just weird that both the calc_pow RPC method and xmrig give one hash, while the daemon during verification gives another one.

jtgrassie: perhaps

blocktemplate_blob is what I need to give to xmrig as the blob, right?

Perhaps I somehow need to convert the blocktemplate_blob into the blockhashing_blob?

Jt, sech1: or xmrvsbeast perhaps

yes

and this "somehow" is not easy

you need to calculate merkle hash of all transactions

you can check p2pool source code

Thank you sech1

i have to rewrite a fat chunk of cryptonote protocol just to convert blocktemplate_blob into blockhashing_blob :(

<Alex|LocalMonero> "A seller can quickly get..." <- Even if he doesn't.. In my country is annoying to buy at localmonero ..there are like 6 sellers and even when I agree paying up to 10% over the marker price they just cancel the trade after hours waiting even though they appear online in the ads! Annoying!

fernandu00[m]: What region is it, if you don't mind me asking? Have you posted buy offers or just responded to sellers' offers?

<Alex|LocalMonero> "What region is it, if you don'..." <- Brazil..I have buying ads too but no luck with that

fernandu00[m]: Are you a member of the MoneroBR group?

Alex|LocalMonero: I'm in a monero group ..don't know if it's The group

fernandu00[m]: Ah, yes, I see your message there.

Brazil is still a developing market for us and XMR awareness in general.

Alex|LocalMonero: Sent just in case ..lots of politics there ..I don't participate much

Alex|LocalMonero: Yeah I've started learning about XMR recently.. Not many people here know about monero but I have the feeling we might need it in the next couple years.. So localmonero is gonna be a great deal for us ..IMHO

Localmonero have only one issue, they obey western bullies.

We need something similar that live in some non aligned countries that can support customer from all countries.

* all countries, Without exception.

Right now, the people who need Monero the most, kinda, can't use the best p2p exchange, localmonero.

The Russian XMR sector is quite self-sufficient, actually. It's one of the most mature local communities.

What if big bullies put sanctions on latin america, say, if they join the BRICS or something?

It's Russia today but whatif??

Well, all I can say without potential legal issues is that we will always do whatever we legally can to serve as many folks as possible without compromising privacy/security.

I totally agree that Haveno and other alternatives also need to exist at the same time.

What if we do it not so legally?

The unfortunate reality is that even with Haveno, if a government is really determined to shut it down it will go after the devs and users as well.

But, personally, I don't think they can ever win. It's only a matter of time before the fiat system is replaced, whether they like it or not (they don't).

What if we don't care about what big bullies want.

We need Haveno asap. But Haveno is the the easiest option, really. Lot of people just want to use there phone and change devices, things like Bisq are a pain to use in that regard.

On the other side, sites like localmonero are great for that, just need to use the site and/or the app

Best solution would be to have one that operate in similar way but on i2p/tor

Alex|LocalMonero: Yes but how does one government go after Devs in another country?

And users too. If they use Tor and other tools it's difficult

Iwjsks[m]: There are governments that have global reach. Particularly the one government that stands to lose the most from maintaining its status as the world reserve currency.

Devs need to be anon, with is not the case I think, with Localmonero.

Plus they need to be, if possible, in a free and non-aligned country if possible (in the case they get de-anonymized, they are still protected)

Alex|LocalMonero: True but that government has not yet banned Monero

True.

The US gouv did not ban monero yet.

Some other did as I remember

Yes but those others don't have global reach

The problem with the US gouv is that they want to prevent you from offering services to country they don't like

Who cares if I am wanted in Afghanistan. Not planning to go ever there

Afghanistan don't have the power to get you extradited

RavFX[m]: But can they? I don't think so.

US have the power to get people extradited from most countries AFAK, as long as they keep the big bully status

Otherwise you would not have all those dark net marketplaces they're after and can't get

They get one and think they have accomplished a Herculean act

If you want to be protected from the US, you have to be in a non aligned country that don't obey US or you have to be in some BRICS nation

Don't we have any Russians here?

They could take the blame and good luck extraditing them 🤣

Localmonero could be hosted in Russia and that would fix all these issue. Except that the DEV/Owner are know so they would also need to move to Russia

Then localmonero would be allow to offer service to all country except, they could be asked to not offer the service to Russian by Russian authority

Yes but the DEV is not necessarily at fault no?

Vitalik is the founder of Ethereum he won't go to prison if I buy drugs with ETH and get caught

What I ment is that if localmonero where to move to russia, including the dev so they are protected from the USA. Then by being in russia, they could get asked by russia to not offer service to russians.

Yes I see

Can't we have two devs, one in the US offering services to Russians and one in Russia offering to Americans?

RavFX[m]: I highly doubt that they will be able to do anything related to privacy coins while in Russia

Iwjsks[m]: The problem here is that if Localmonero disobey big bully, devs could be extradited to US because they allowed people to circumvent the bullying.

Yes I understand

Dev is know, if dev move to russia, they will be happy to let them provide localmonero to the world but they might ask them to not offer it to russia.

Like if you look, Russia allow anyone to use there infrastructure to launch attacks, as long as you are not targeting russia

But like Alex said, Russian have enough brainz to take care of there Monero exchange themself, biggest problem is if big bully want to hard bully other countries

ZhenyaPav[m]: They can't do a thing about privacy coin, nobody can.

The easiest part to break, are the on/off ramp

I think the best solution would be an opensource frontend & backend anyone can download and install.... (full message at <libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/do…462b683cc1cf9059b907fcbc53ef287d268>)

And prevent scammers to seize and kill the service

how can i reset my password?

when i open the email it just say this

i don't finded any "reset password" button in element

Its mobile? Its there

ofrnxmr[m]: desktop

using in firefox

Settings>change password

Oh webapp

DanIsnotthemanBr: but i need to know the current password to change it

So your email is in the account and thats the email you got when you went to reset password?

DanIsnotthemanBr: yes

<RavFX[m]> "Localmonero could be hosted in..." <- Given Russia's (poorly executed) attempts at isolating their own internet from the rest of the world (before the war in Ukraine), I don't think that hosting any globally-available service under their umbrella would be a good idea, even from a purely business-oriented pov

merope: Hence my last solution, a federated service

And the events of the last year should be enough for anyone to understand why relying on Russian "protection" is a **very** unwise idea

You know there test, was probably more of a test of what append if the west cut russia from the Internet

And Ukraine try to get the west to do it 😂

s/try/tried/

But ICANN said no

Nah, authoritarian countries love their censorship. If the west isolated Russia, that would make the job easier for them

(Anyway, straying deeply off-topic here - sorry)

If russia want to cut the western-net for most russia, they only need good firewall hardware and make some whitelist system to allow specific ressource, very easy to implement

I'm sure China could provide them for almost free

RavFX[m]: Haveno can't come soon enough 🥲

Haveno will be out in March 2023

oh wait...

Haveno have a too high of a barrier for entry.

Have fun to install it on a phone

And the way I dump XMR p2p way to get cash, using haveno will just annoy my contacts (add 20-30 minutes of lag to free the escrow)

<RavFX[m]> "Haveno will be out in March 2023" <- > <@gfdshygti53:monero.social> Haveno will be out in March 2023

two moar weeks!

When --sync-pruned-blocks is used, are the pruned transactions received from a peer "assumed" to be valid during initial sync? I don't understand how checks could be performed on pruned blocks.

And when syncing and receiving a block, is all of the data associated with the block received from the same peer? For example with block 2500000 would all of the transactions be received from the same peer? If so then the pruned transactions in that block would be identical to the peers?

Indentical in that batch of blocks

You can do some checks on the txs, you can check the inputs and outputs balance (Although you can't verify the range proofs) and for v2 txs you can check hashes.

During initial sync, a peer will send 20-100 blocks. If you sync pruned blockes, youll get the batch from another peer

To have a truly unique pruned node, youd need to prune yoursself. Otherwise youll have chunks of pruned data that are identical to the peer who sent

> For example with block 2500000 would all of the transactions be received from the same peer?

yes

> If so then the pruned transactions in that block would be identical to the peers?

Monero nodes have 8 possible pruning "groups" a pruned node will be in one of the groups and every peer in a group prune the same blocks

8 groups across the entire network? As the database grows and pruning becomes more likely (an assumption), is there concern that if most people were using --sync-pruned-blocks the network would converge to a single or predominant "group"?

no, since we use a high quality RNG to pick groups

you only sync pruned blocks from peers in your group

If I understand correctly then when a node starts syncing, if pruning is enabled, it randomly assigns itself a number [0,7] and then accepts blocks from full nodes and nodes with the same "group" number? A node in "group" 1 wouldn't accept blocks from a node in "group" 2?

yes the node just wont request any blocks from that node in the first place

```

There is a typo here it should be block_pruning_stripe, think of this as foreshadowing what we are about to do

```

is this an open issue?

no ....

boog900[m]: TIL

By "open" i mean, existing

oh yeah its still in the codebase

Interesting. So the effective network size for a pruned node could be far smaller than the entire network size. Suppose in the future the network was 10% full nodes and 90% pruned nodes. If I understand correctly, a new pruned node would only be able to utilize 10% + 1/8 (90%) of the network = 21.25% of the network for syncing.

wait no im wrong

lets say node 1 prunes every even block and node 2 prunes every odd block.

node 3 joins the network and also wants to prune every even block. To do this (while verifying the blockchain) they will need to alternate who they ask for blocks between node 1 and 2 although they are in the same group as 1.

so for us its only true that nodes wont request blocks from other groups if that group does dose not keep a full version of that block.

and for every block 7/8 of the pruned nodes wont keep that block but its a different 7/8 depending on the block

* keep that (full) block but

Supposing --sync-pruned-blocks is off, at a block level is that the same result my prior example? If 10% of the network are full nodes and have a full copy of block 2500000 and 90% of the network are pruned nodes where only 1/8 have block 2500000 then for that block a new node syncing has an effective network 21.25% of the full network size.

yep it's just the peers that have the blocks you want isn't constant for every block

monerod, even with sync-pruned-blocks wont sync the pruned version of every block

This is very interesting! Thank you! Was any of the "syncing from only that group" valid? In general I'm trying to think through network health over time as more people prune, or even the decision to set the number at 1/8.

the number has to be a power of 2 because of the way we have implemented pruning

> Was any of the "syncing from only that group" valid?

If syncing full blocks from pruned peers you can only sync from 1/8 of the peers but the 1/8 is different for different blocks

And if syncing pruned blocks from pruned peers (--sync-pruned-blocks) you have access to 7/8 or only the 1/8 in your "group"?

in theory you have access to all of them, in practice not really

because of this:

wait no 7/8

* access to ~~all of, * of them~~ 7/8, in

* access to ~all of, * of them~ 7/8, in

Im wrong again : )

for 7/8 of the blocks you have access to them all.

for 1/8 you only have access to 1/8

I'm a little confused. Is this right?... (full message at <libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/do…ce4ffeb825f76b641731ff81ed8fcaddb4a>)

> Syncing a block it will keep as full: uses full nodes and 1/8 of pruned nodes (the 1/8 differs with each block because the 1/8 pruned nodes with a full copy differs at each block)

the 1/8 will be in the same group as your node but otherwise correct

*for blocks you have to keep

the amount of blocks for each group before switching to another group is 4096 btw

* I'm a little confused. Is this right?... (full message at <libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/do…f6ba2dfd9266587657e4ca6cb30481aba90>)

^ edited above

> Syncing a block it will prune: uses full nodes and 1/8 of pruned nodes (the 1/8 is the same each time because they have to be in your "group")

the 1/8 will be different for different blocks

*when you will prune them

as the ones in your group would have already pruned these ones

Im sorry for being bad at explaining im so tired

No you're great. This is complicated

Pruning node with --sync-pruned-blocks:... (full message at <libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/do…bb6f3405cbffdd8377c30526e386502bb21>)