<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> x.com/cameronruggles/status/1779295608899268714

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> I would stay away from USDT if your to keep it for 5 minutes anyway.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> You are going to pay a premium to send that except if tradeogre now accept TRC20 USDT instead ERC20 USDT

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/JSUwDGoYzankNWPnlDkQivta

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> both avaliable

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> use TRC-20 to save good on fees

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> fees for sending BTC are high, especially small amounts, like regular weekly purchases

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> yes, good point, need to figure out what is the fee

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> BTC withdrawal fee probably around 14-16$ ERC 20, hmm maybe 6-8$ so TRC20 maybe 2$ something like this

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Or use usdt poly if available, even cheaper

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> screenshot only say erc-20 and trc-20

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> yes, two options only avaliable

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> but BTC and ETHER fees are ridiculous, more costly than mainstream banks, paypal etc in my country, just simply not suitable for frequent or low value transactions

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> TRX is the only good option for txing USDT imo

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/UWfCFibVGvrJbNvNBXYelAka

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/wAusSxqkozmNUqenADQFSvlh

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> kraken 3$ biance 1.2$

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> @martin.monero:matrix.org: you can use a low-fee coin like LTC or BCH as well

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> or just use RTX lol

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> thats what I did to try out tradeogre

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> TRX*

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> without le USDT

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> (it's a lot faster than LTC or BCH

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> like, *instant*

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> I lost a couple cents on their LTC->BTC->XMR on the exchange due to rounding

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> whats TRX though

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> it's an ETH like shitcoin. It's as fast as ETH without the massive fees

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> oh cool

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> if it's just to go from exchange A to exchange B, it's the best option imo

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> yeah i see there are a lot of centralized coins that just churn the block sizes and stuff up for low fees

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> I also use it as a payment buffer, like to buy crap on place that don't accept the XMR, they usually accept TRX so you pay for stuff almost as fast as LN

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/FDxTlZcmrmLDBbiXOfupTVld

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> only two pairs avaliable

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> yeah, you have to convert whatever you use for the transfer, into BTC

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> then buy the XMR

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> reminds me of cheapeth.org

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> damn they really need an XMR-LTC pait

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> *par

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> *PAIR

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> Dash is still a thing? LOL

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> also mimblewimblecoin?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Dash is accept at a few place

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> mimblewimblething arent accept anywhere afaik

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> XMR is a stable coin just chill(TM)

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> all I know is that litecoin has mimblewimble

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> isn't it like CTs

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> But no one accept the mimnblewimble flavor

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> really? is it a soft fork no one accepts?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> yeah, it's optional

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> it's like zcash, no one accept shielded ztrash

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> pretty sure the zcash tech is better than MWEB last I read

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> there is a coin called dero claiming they use homomorphic encryption

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> that can

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> that can't be efficient

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> YO LOOK AT THIS

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> github.com/deroproject/astrobwt/blob/master/miner/miner.go

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> this is supposed to be ASIC/GPU resistant in like 80 lines of go

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> lmao

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> oh wait nevermind

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> wait look they reimplemented randomX in go

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> no wait 502 bad gateway

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> git.dero.io/DERO_Foundation/RandomX

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Lol

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Dero feel like so scammy, it's like a xmr version of the scam facilitator

Dero is way newer than Monero, and yet their blockchain is twice the size already.

I just don't think smart contracts really works in currencies. I mean, does any fiat currency have smart contracts?

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> oh wait I just read up about how BWT works

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> its interesting, it's like for compression algorithms

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> I think i studied it before

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> but their claim is basicially just "if someone implements BWT as an ASIC then it's good for scientific progress so whatever"

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/PWheOmpDwuzVMzMHkntKyipo

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> it looks like that will be a war with China, all Chinese exchanges are not accepting folks from the UK

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> i reccomend kraken but whatever exchange you use will be limited by jurisdiction

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> I remember I used binance for a while but when I moved I had to use a vpn to get access to my account again

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> just to close it

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/IwaVHmZadJnCkhCoJdGAzmAu

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> waiting 9 days to withdraw crypto from Coinbase, absolutely piece of crap

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> so maybe Kraken will be better, no idea :(

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> yeah coinbase is bad

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> I think their buisness may actually be defunct

I don't think I would ever use a KYC exchange. The thought of your ID, maybe even selfies lying there in their databases, ready to be leaked to whatever wants to exploit it...

<3​21bob321:monero.social> leak inbound

I wonder whether such people ever use banks, credit card companies, insurances, etc. You know, all these entities with tons of KYC info about you

And well, there is no non-KYC bank, or non-KYC insurance, right?

Anything related to earning money or spending money has KYC.

<b​asses:matrix.org> old.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/1c…o_network_attack_tor_network_attack

<b​asses:matrix.org> great post

rbrunner, and mobile carriers, et cetera. These are at least more or less unavoidable. This is also awful but not like you have an option.

remiliascarlet, at least a salary you can get in cash if you look for it. No idea about legality, just know it is happening.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Everything appears coordinated. Be sure not to overlook the obvious efforts at social engineering targeting Monero's online social groups, trying to split up the community.

what happen on monero price?

<o​miomi:monero.social> Reddit downvote bots in r/Monero do also come across as mighty shifty.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Price shows all market details. Currently, Monero is very exposed and vulnerable after the flood and community attacks on consensus, which impacts the price. In comparison to leading coins such as Bitcoin and Ethereum, Monero has dropped significantly because of this.

Ah, I get why it feels like such a "nope". Because it is not a government-related service at all, and quite the opposite of that. Using a KYC to buy crypto would be less akin to using one for banking/insurance and more akin to using one to register on social media, which is more clearly crossing the line.

"flood and community attacks on consensus"? can you explain more details? I haven’t paid much attention to monero lately

<b​asses:matrix.org> is it written by simplified privacy the FUDester? Cloudflare fud debunked discuss.privacyguides.net/t/you-re-…ps-not-3-simplified-privacy/16317/4

@price jpy

Oh, that bot is not here it seems.

irc price bot?

where can I use it

<o​miomi:monero.social> I will try my best to give a brief summary after reading the entire backlog since March for this Matrix chat. These are the notes I have taken offline.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Monero has faced various attacks including:

<o​miomi:monero.social> - Black Marble Spam Attack is causing significant problems for Monero by increasing transaction wait times and compromising privacy through shrinking effective ring signatures. Transactions may take longer to complete, especially if they have low fees attached.

<o​miomi:monero.social> - Delistings are occurring at various centralized exchanges worldwide, such as Kraken in specific countries like Ireland and Belgium. In my opinion, this trend is expected to continue.

<o​miomi:monero.social> - Popular members of the Monero community, such as users like ofrnxmr and gr8tful, are experiencing issues with bot-driven attacks in places like the Reddit forum. These attacks can be seen through massive downvotes on their posts or proposals for funding projects (CCS).

<o​miomi:monero.social> - Troll-driven social engineering has also disrupted communication within Monero's community by creating distractions focused on nonessential political issues. These actions seem aimed at weakening the community by dividing it and makes the developers focus on politics rather than real issues, much like what happened to Bitcoin.

<o​miomi:monero.social> All of this has happened recently and the attacks are only going to ramp up from here. Highly suspicious, especially before the release of Haveno and potentially Serai soon. Someone sees us as a significant threat.

<o​miomi:monero.social> I guess the price has declined because of these reasons. Donations to the GF have also increased to compensate.

thank you share these information, seems monero has been keep on some guy's eyes

<o​miomi:monero.social> No problem. Monero used to have some problems in the past, but now it has lots of issues in comparison. Before, there was just

<o​miomi:monero.social> one big issue or event but now it's many different attacks by the looks of things.

A1ice: #monero-offtopic

I regard monero as one of the few (or even the only on my mind) privacy-friendly and reliable trade method in modern society. I can accept a large degree of loss, but I am more worried about the sustainable operation of monero network :).

oh, thanks

I regard Monero as one of the few cryptocurrencies that aren't designed to be an exit scam.

Or rather a rug pull.

<o​miomi:monero.social> I wouldn't worry about the operation of Monero. It has a strong community who really care and stick together. Someone lately donated over $200,000 in USD from their own money to help improve Monero. This kind of thing doesn't happen with other kinds of cryptocurrencies.

<o​miomi:monero.social> nitter.poast.org/WatchFund

sounds awesome

<o​miomi:monero.social> Someone gave away 600 XMR today.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Almost $70,000.

A1ice, well, not the only because cash.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Cash is disputablely the best method.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Cash is undisputablely the best method.

If crypto was the only one left, that would also be dystopian AF - you would need to be carrying a smartphone wherever you go just for actions as basic as payment.

Although I wonder if there are hardware devices just for payment like that... Would still not want to use it for things as basic as buying groceries.

instead you carry a smart card and every place you want to pay at needs to be connected to a global system and have terminals to talk to your card ...

<o​miomi:monero.social> I sometimes wonder if Monero will be considered as money when there are such big value drops in just one day. It makes me curious about possible methods to maintain its value, like the stability of a stable coin.

<z​ib:xmr.se> You could ofc just carry around a signing card and just tap a shops terminal to pay. No smartphone needed. Just that one side is connected.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Has there ever been discussion about implementing price stability in Monero?

<o​miomi:monero.social> I don't know if it can happen, but I would like to learn about it if people ever talked about this before.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> if by price stability, you mean stablecoin

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> yes, This is has been discussed

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> and conclusion is that no real stablecoin exist

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> and no one have any interest into trying such

<o​miomi:monero.social> Trustworthy stablecoins are real, but they need rules, auditing, and centralization - kind of the opposite of what Monero offers. It's a tricky problem as Monero can't become money in my opinion if it continues to be this volatile.

have you been to, for example, Argentina or Zimbabwe ?

maybe Lebanon

<o​miomi:monero.social> Monero isn't connected to bad governments. They have money problems, but just changing money won't help. If places like Argentina, Zimbabwe, or Lebanon used Monero, their troubles wouldn't go away. Fixing politics is more than just changing money. Even if they used Monero, there would still be other problems not linked to money. I talked about this partly in the #monero-offtopic:m<clipped message>

<o​miomi:monero.social> onero.social. Using unrealistic hypothetical scenarios does not justify using Monero, especially in the first world.

<o​miomi:monero.social> This idea supposes that Monero always stays stable and doesn't have ups and downs. But if Monero isn't always steady, it won't be any different from other troublesome money in places with lots of inflation.

<o​miomi:monero.social> In most situations where people normally spend cash, Monero doesn't seem helpful except for niche things like buying VPNs/VPS/etc. or illegal activity. Even though Monero is cool and should keep getting better, it has similar issues Bitcoin, even if Monero is technically superior.

<o​miomi:monero.social> I understand that @rucknium:monero.social is a microeconomist so perhaps they could contribute their knowledge, potentially enhancing or disagreeing with my claims around Monero "adoption".

TIL monero is not on the scale of huge economies nor is it a world reserve currency

<d​etherminal:monero.social> it is reserve currency of pirates

<o​miomi:monero.social> According to the website, "GetMonero.org", their slogan claims that Monero represents money; nevertheless, it faces issues regarding its consistency and potential as a store of value because of its volatility. "GetMonero.org" also claims that Monero is a cryptocurrency, which by Satoshi's definition attempts to rival world reserve currencies by being "P2P Electronic Cash".

monero also can provide something "sable" currency can't

that is it's reason for being

*stable

<o​miomi:monero.social> I also discussed this idea within the #monero-offtopic:monero.social channel, pointing out that US Dollars and other established first-world currencies in physical form (cash) remain more advantageous than Monero, despite their flaws.

countries are getting rid of physical cash

<r​ucknium:monero.social> omiomi: I don't disagree with your general opinion. Monero and other forms of peer-to-peer electronic cash are niche and probably will stay niche for the foreseeable future. But Monero (and other p2p electronic cash) is very important for people who need it. I analyzed 2021 USA survey data: rucknium.me/posts/financial-margina…ization-and-cryptocurrency-payments

<r​ucknium:monero.social> "According to my analysis, people who lack a bank account have 80% higher odds of using cryptocurrency as a means of payment."

<r​ucknium:monero.social> USA has released more detailed data for 2022. And EU has similar data now. My 2024 MoneroKon talk is an expansion of this analysis (but frankly that could change if it is more important to switch my talk to the suspected black marble flooding).

<o​miomi:monero.social> Thank you for providing this data and article. When you say "as payment", does this mean direct purchases for goods and services, or does it count exchanging cryptocurrency into USD, and then using cash?

<r​ucknium:monero.social> My preliminary analysis of EU data show the same pattern as USA data. And the new 2022 SHEDUSA data has this question: "What was the main reason you used cryptocurrency to buy something, make a payment, or send money?"

<r​ucknium:monero.social> About 20 percent of cryptocurrency users said that "privacy" was the main reason. The other top reasons were "Person or business receiving the money preferred cryptocurrency" (25%), "To send the money faster" (20%), and "Cheaper" (12%).

<r​ucknium:monero.social> omiomi: It would be how the person being surveyed interpreted the question.

<r​ucknium:monero.social> Sometimes in these surveys there is an extended set of instructions given to the surveyors that would help with questions if the survey respondent asks for clarification. I don't know if this survey had that.

<o​miomi:monero.social> I see. How do you, as an economist, view the volatility of Monero? Monero does break one of the properties of money (store of value), and this I have an issue with since it contradicts what the "GetMonero.org" states.

<r​ucknium:monero.social> surveyor = person asking the survey questions. respondent = person who is answer the survey questions.

<r​ucknium:monero.social> Monero and other cryptocurrencies are handled as a speculative asset. I am not surprised that there is high volatility in its purchasing power over time.

<r​ucknium:monero.social> The high volatility makes it harder to adopt as a means of payment

<o​miomi:monero.social> However, store of value is confusing as it is often compared to another currency (USD). In real terms, just in Monero, there would be store of value that is only dwindled by tail emission from what I understand.

<d​etherminal:monero.social> actually monero is the least volatile currency among cryptos. it always goes between 120-170

<r​ucknium:monero.social> BCH has AnyHedge/BCHBull that has on-chain futures contracts (AFAIK) that can reduce the effect of BCH purchasing power volatility for people who use the contracts. That is maybe something that can help. Or just traditional future contracts like fiat foreign exchange futures could be used.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Unfortunately, today saw Monero's value decrease significantly, causing it to drop down to approximately $107 per unit, breaking this trend.

<d​etherminal:monero.social> it was instant, it went back in 10 minutes

so gold is not a store of value because it's supply keeps increasing wow

<d​etherminal:monero.social> like any other currency :D

imma beginning to think that you are trolling

<d​etherminal:monero.social> me?

no lol

<d​etherminal:monero.social> i was actually supporting you

<d​etherminal:monero.social> oh ok

<r​ucknium:monero.social> If you want the survey questions and basic tables for the two years (2021 & 2022) of SHED data that have cryptocurrency questions, click the Codebooks here (this is a .gov site): federalreserve.gov/consumerscommunities/shed_data.htm

<o​miomi:monero.social> This sounds intriguing. Got a link maybe? Been thinking about bringing some type stability to Monero. Just wasn't sure how it could be pulled off.

the guy with "concerns"

<d​etherminal:monero.social> if you are into shitcoins, take a look at zephyr, it is a useful stable shitcoin

<o​miomi:monero.social> Increasing supply doesn't make something worthless, value still exists.

and stating them in multiple channels

<r​ucknium:monero.social> omiomi: bchbull.com . Monero does not have any smart contracts, so it would be harder or impossible to do this on Monero AFAIK.

you didn't say worthless, you said store of value

<o​miomi:monero.social> If you find my concerns heinous, I can delete my messages and leave. I was recommended this channel after trying to discuss this on r/Monero as I was told many active contributors could respond on Matrix.

<d​etherminal:monero.social> nah

<d​etherminal:monero.social> we have seen much worse lol

I am on IRC, your messages remain forever as it should be :)

<o​miomi:monero.social> Tried learning lots from last month's discussions here, and even at r/Monero. But perhaps I messed up somehow.

keep learning :)

economics takes a while

<o​miomi:monero.social> Thank you. Previous discussion about L2 was met with negativity. It's a hard problem to solve.

<r​ucknium:monero.social> BCHBull isn't an L2 by the way.

you have found a gem in rucknium

<o​miomi:monero.social> I said Monero relative to USD does not guarantee a SoV as proven today with the value plummeting. However, if we consider Monero by itself it does have SoV that is only affected by the minor inflation rate of coins (tail emission). Having an SoV only in XMR terms assumes Monero is used in a circular economy, which is far from being the case.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Sorry if my position wasn't clear earlier.

<o​miomi:monero.social> I understand that but for Monero to implement something similar it would need a L2?

<d​etherminal:monero.social> we can't actually do about it, supply-demand 🤷‍♂️

<d​etherminal:monero.social> bitcoin is going lower and lower inflation but it is still one of the most volatile assets

<d​etherminal:monero.social> bitcoin is going lower and lower inflation but it is still one of the most volatile asset

<d​etherminal:monero.social> we can't actually do anything about it, supply-demand 🤷‍♂️

<o​miomi:monero.social> I did mention this earlier. Unless Monero implements something similar to a centralized stablecoin (never happening), then the price relative to USD will always be volatile, making it inferior to cash.

<r​ucknium:monero.social> I don't know. You could put smart contracts/programmbility in Monero with a hard fork, but the contracts would not be private. That is basically what Townforge has done (just noticed townforge.net's SSL cert expired April 11).

moneromooo^

<d​etherminal:monero.social> we can make the contracts private but do we actually need sc's

<o​miomi:monero.social> I guess the solution to this problem is a circular economy, but this seems unrealistic at a large scale.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Then users of Monero would not have to worry about parity with USD or other currencies.

<o​miomi:monero.social> I believe smart contracts would introduce bloat into the blockchain? It's size would grow at an unsustainable rate, which would worsen sync times.

<d​etherminal:monero.social> yes, you can take ethereum as an example.

<o​miomi:monero.social> In that case, Monero would have to switch to PoS, which is against everything Monero stands for.

<o​miomi:monero.social> If Monero follows the same trajectory as Ethereum.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Thanks, everyone, for the talk. I finally have an answer to my concern.

<d​etherminal:monero.social> you are welcome, we are always ready to discuss downsides of monero

<o​miomi:monero.social> For anyone wanting to know my final conclusion, Monero has a Store of Value (SoV) potential under these assumptions:

<o​miomi:monero.social> 1) The Monero team maintains it without any issues or bugs that affect its worth in the long run

<o​miomi:monero.social> 2) Monero is used in a circular economy where people buy and sell goods using it as their money.

<o​miomi:monero.social> When comparing Monero to other currencies, remember that the volatility of exchange rates doesn't represent SoV. For example, comparing XMR/USD to USD/EUR does not show which one has better value stability, and it can be argued that USD/EUR is as volatile as XMR/USD. The use of Monero for solving tyrannical or corrupt governments shouldn't be considered either; it should only help<clipped message>

<o​miomi:monero.social> people avoid oppression in these extreme situations.

<o​miomi:monero.social> While I acknowledge that US Dollars (in physical cash) are superior to Monero, the usefulness of Monero is about the freedom and privacy it provides in niche situations that may not remain niche in the future.

<s​hkeezy:matrix.org> how difficult would it be to transfer 6 figures usd into monero quickly

<o​miomi:monero.social> USD in cash?

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Not much, buy any crypto available in your local otc and then use instant exchanges like trocador to convert it in batches of 5-10k

<o​miomi:monero.social> With a DEX like Serai, exchanging in crypto should be easier?

<o​miomi:monero.social> You wouldn't have to do batches, right?

zib | You could ofc just carry around a signing card and just tap a shops terminal to pay. No smartphone needed. Just that one side is connected. <- this already exists for Monero? Didn't know.

omiomi, I would do in batches separated by noticeable time anyway, just as a safer bet.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Imagine I exchanged 10 BTC to XMR. You would recommend doing 1 BTC batches separated by noticeable time, for example. Why?

Where did you buy btc then? Buying btc for a large sum in one place would be attracting attention.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Assume I mined the BTC.

Is that really the case you'd assume for a question like this?

<o​miomi:monero.social> I don't understand why I need to batch swap for crypto to crypto.

Idk about from crypto to crypto, but the question was "how difficult would it be to transfer 6 figures usd into monero quickly". Not "I have one crypto already". But even in this case, a giant transfer being public is sus.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Alright, for USD to crypto I would agree doing so in batches is ideal.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Moving a lot of money by using Bitcoin directly is quite normal. Some people move much more, even tens of millions, when they use it.

Aren't LE monitoring the blockchaim? Also there is always a chance that whoever is used to exchange BTC to XMR could be a honeypot and take suspicion.

Also, to be honest... I would rather not assume Monero would always remain untraceable. So I would at least not do moves that are too bold like this. Just in case.

<o​miomi:monero.social> If you use an AMM like Serai, there are no counter party risks.

<t​ermox:matrix.org> Do you even stay updated with general news in the world? Even legacy markets dumped on Friday and Monday will probably see more red.

<o​miomi:monero.social> ^

<o​miomi:monero.social> Also, USD and other currency exchange rates did not fall as badly as traditional markets.

<o​miomi:monero.social> Hi @plowsof:matrix.org! Just checking if this conversation is not related to the main topic. If it is, we can transfer everything to #monero-offtopic:monero.social chat to ensure no issues with unwanted messages happening recently in these Matrix channels.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> omiomi, #monero-offtopic and #monero are just a dual-threaded offtopic channel

<b​asses:matrix.org> Anyone here used Kodachi Linux?

<b​asses:matrix.org> You better stop bitsex.net/english/2021/kodachi-linux-is-probably-not-secure

<b​ruvton:matrix.org> I use Manjaro. I hope that's at least secure

<b​ruvton:matrix.org> I kinda want the Orange Pi when it comes out

<b​ruvton:matrix.org> what's the reason for this? Are people pricing in a war or smthn?

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> Tails, Whonix were popular in last 10-15 years

<b​asses:matrix.org> >Manjaro: This distribution holds packages back for 2 weeks to make sure that their own changes don’t break, not to make sure that upstream is stable. When AUR packages are used, they are often built against the latest libraries from Arch’s repositories.

<b​asses:matrix.org> pretty sure kodachi was shared in haxxor communities

<s​hkeezy:matrix.org> Maybe you should read this manjarno.pages.dev I don't know how long you've been using manjaro but in the last couple of years arch has gotten a lot easier to install so if you've become a fan of pacman and the aur I'd consider hopping

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I use Arch btw

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/WAjKuzfcVRumpiJpYAVJXRon

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> i'm not a big fun of products from post-nazi countries/societies

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> lol

<b​ruvton:matrix.org> I'll do that. My brother made sure I learned Manjaro in a way that'll make switching to Arch easier, so I might do that after I'm done my thesis

<d​etherminal:monero.social> linus torvalds use fedora btw

<d​etherminal:monero.social> lol

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> the only serious security focused distributions right now are kicksecure (base of Whonix) and secureblue (based on Fedora immutable)

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> What makes them more secure than qubesOS, tails or hardened gentoo ?

Doesn't seem exactly "more secure" per se, just different. Tails is explicitly a live distro with limited specific use in mind, while Qubes apparently is picky to hardware, so I guess it's something in the middle.

<m​artin.monero:matrix.org> if you are political activist fighting with your local government, there is no secure OS or encryption

<b​asses:matrix.org> thanks for the conspiracy

<d​etherminal:monero.social> tell this to my 4096 iteration aes256 lol

<d​etherminal:monero.social> should write our own os like terry davis

<b​ruvton:matrix.org> I mean there is the Intel Management Engine that I know of for sure, and other processors likely have their own versions of it

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> i'm making a linux distro (based on alpine linux) with everything outside of the base (alpine) system being optional

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> It's still WIP though

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> The goal is to be able to uncheck every feature to unbloat your system. I guess this reduces attack surface ?

<d​etherminal:monero.social> what will happen if linux has a backdoor

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> The goal is to be able to uncheck every feature to unbloat one's system. I guess this reduces attack surface ?

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> in theory, alpine is just the "backend".

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> I initially wanted to use guix as the main package manager but i'm still fixing more urgent things

<b​ruvton:matrix.org> The IME essentially is a backdoor, regardless of which OS you use

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Every government will be pwned

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> i'm trying to imagine a world were every server is ransomwared except microsoft windows servers

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> It's so funny i can't laugh

<o​verlord:realm.bz> Even Microsoft is using Linux on servers now, so not even that

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> > <@dave.jp:matrix.org> Every government will be pwned

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> i'm trying to imagine a world where every server is ransomwared except microsoft windows servers

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> It's so funny i can't laugh

Microsoft has been using Linux on servers since forever.

Or FreeBSD on some.

Their MSN servers ran on FreeBSD, then this became public knowledge, and quickly changed to Windows Server, and MSN servers immediately started to crash so embarassingly lot, they were forced to switch back to FreeBSD.

They only reason why they admit to it now is because Steve Ballmer didn't like Linux. He's gone, and now it's suddenly "yeah, we love Lunix, trust me brah".

<s​tarlord:starlord.zip> ppl still use reddit?

<b​az:monero.social> Theo is my hero

<b​az:monero.social> marc.info/?l=openbsd-tech&m=170742832804260&w=1

<d​etherminal:monero.social> lol

<d​etherminal:monero.social> good one

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> For 60% of consumer cores apparently

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> They even have their own linux distro en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azure_Linux

<h​elasse:linarphy.net> i'll be waiting for the day windows runs on a linux kernel, and normies still use their loved and trusted adware from microsoft

<b​asses:matrix.org> uhh how?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Funny. For me that's actually the opposite. I'm waiting for the day GNU/Linux manage to run on OneCore (windows kernel), then I'll be happy to ditch Windows

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> There has been some insiders build of windows running on the Linux kernel

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> GNU/OneCore then?

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> afaik you can already do that if you sign yourself up as slave developer for M$

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> link? where?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I tried to search for you the link. Ended up understanding I got pranked by the few medias I've been following 💀

Windows running on Linux kernel... That would mean rebuilding all the base libraries and also changing the whole windows driver model, at minimum.

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> lol

it's been theorized back when crosoft made WSL, that it could use it to port windows to use the Linux kernel, but did not append

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Yes. The entirety of Windows is based on the subsystem librairies. Once recompiled for GNU/Linux, only the driver for DirectX and other graphical stuff would be a problem

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> If we ignore of course, recompiling the processes

There is also the executable format. Windows application use PE mostly afaik, not ELF. So they need to add PE support into linux kernel too

<c​hoise:matrix.org> Plowsof is the goat

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> that is true

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> that is also true.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> *bloat

<b​asses:matrix.org> april fools?

so its over?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> nah (september 2019), just good old medias with bold titles claiming windows insider ship with the linux kernel. (it was for WSL2)

meh yeah, it was for wsl2 lol

btw, you have access to all the source, can patch it, change the build-in/modules/off options and compile it

(Running a custom kernel on my WSL2 shenanigans)

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> anyway all these debates will be over when RedoxOS take over the world

RedoxOS, like in 2177 or something like that?

Once they manage to recode everything without using 47563 crates

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> its gonna be a little hard with only 30000 crates online. (143000 but 80% are taken for the name)

It was just a made up number but you know what I mean. Supply chain attack are really popular on Node-js and python, its a matter if time until it catchup for Rust (once it get more popular than node or python, watchout)

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Everyone is aware of the problem. The fact is that most serious project in Rust are using so called *blessed* crates, that are crates that themselves checkout their maintainers and dependencies. So a normal, serious rust project shouldn't go over the 250 crates with most being small algorithms librairies. This isn't comparable to node that can go to 1000 packages for the biggest project

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Also consider that unlike node-js and python, there are crates used only in debugging mode. Compiling for release mode usually cut 30% of the imported crates

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> This isn't ideal of course, but it's not comparable to node imho

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Wd40 will stop rust

<b​asses:matrix.org> never

<b​asses:matrix.org> dev busy on working on 100s different things

<b​asses:matrix.org> popos

<b​asses:matrix.org> their own rust desktop environment

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> cosmic?

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> Hi, I destroyed my home directory accidentally and I did not have a backup. I recovered everything thankfully because of ext4magic. I had a Monero wallet, but it is in the slew of all of the files without filenames, and running `file` does not give me anything useful. Is there a resource that can detect a Monero `.keys` file?

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> Hi, I destroyed my home directory accidentally and I did not have a backup. I recovered everything thankfully because of ext4magic. I had a testing Monero wallet with some funds, but it is in the slew of all of the files without filenames, and running `file` does not give me anything useful. Is there a resource that can detect a Monero `.keys` file?

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> idk but remember to backup the whole disk with dd

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> @recanman:agoradesk.com: idk but all my keyfiles are like 1.6kb so just sort the files by size you might find it

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> Yeah, I got everything, thanks. Just a stupid mistake

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> I'll try this

<j​effro256:monero.social> ```import os

<j​effro256:monero.social> import sys

<j​effro256:monero.social> def stream_read_varint(f):

<j​effro256:monero.social> res = 0

<j​effro256:monero.social> shift = 0

<j​effro256:monero.social> while (True):

<j​effro256:monero.social> byte = f.read(1)

<j​effro256:monero.social> if not byte:

<j​effro256:monero.social> raise stream_read_varint('stream_read_varint: EOF reached')

<j​effro256:monero.social> elif byte == 0 and shift != 0:

<j​effro256:monero.social> raise stream_read_varint('stream_read_varint: bad varint encoding')

<j​effro256:monero.social> byte = byte[0]

<j​effro256:monero.social> res |= (byte & 0x7f) << shift

<j​effro256:monero.social> if byte & 0x80 == 0:

<j​effro256:monero.social> break

<j​effro256:monero.social> shift += 7

<j​effro256:monero.social> return res

<j​effro256:monero.social> if len(sys.argv) > 1:

<j​effro256:monero.social> search_dir = sys.argv[1]

<j​effro256:monero.social> else:

<j​effro256:monero.social> print("No search directory provided. Defaulting to '.'...")

<j​effro256:monero.social> search_dir = '.'

<j​effro256:monero.social> CHACHA_IV_SIZE = 8

<j​effro256:monero.social> print("Searching '{}' for Monero wallet '.keys' file...".format(search_dir))

<j​effro256:monero.social> for (root, _, fnames) in os.walk(search_dir):

<j​effro256:monero.social> for fname in fnames:

<j​effro256:monero.social> try:

<j​effro256:monero.social> with open(fname, 'rb') as f:

<j​effro256:monero.social> f.seek(0, os.SEEK_END)

<j​effro256:monero.social> flen = f.tell()

<j​effro256:monero.social> if flen >= CHACHA_IV_SIZE + 2:

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> Thank you very much

<j​effro256:monero.social> missing `import os` at the top

<j​effro256:monero.social> copy&paste error

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> Thought so, I'll add it

<j​effro256:monero.social> i tested it locally and it finds both wallet cache & .keys files

<j​effro256:monero.social> since they both use the same format encryption wrapper format

<j​effro256:monero.social> Run it as `python3 main.py <search directory>`

<j​effro256:monero.social> Oops there's a bug with file name resolution, just run it from the current directory you want to search

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…radesk.com/RpzMlsUFjjFnFRgYQRjGsGdT

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> I'll try these now, thanks

<j​effro256:monero.social> lmk if any of them work. some will be wallet cache files

<j​effro256:monero.social> ```import os

<j​effro256:monero.social> import sys

<j​effro256:monero.social> def stream_read_varint(f):

<j​effro256:monero.social> res = 0

<j​effro256:monero.social> shift = 0

<j​effro256:monero.social> while (True):

<j​effro256:monero.social> byte = f.read(1)

<j​effro256:monero.social> if not byte:

<j​effro256:monero.social> raise stream_read_varint('stream_read_varint: EOF reached')

<j​effro256:monero.social> elif byte == 0 and shift != 0:

<j​effro256:monero.social> raise stream_read_varint('stream_read_varint: bad varint encoding')

<j​effro256:monero.social> byte = byte[0]

<j​effro256:monero.social> res |= (byte & 0x7f) << shift

<j​effro256:monero.social> if byte & 0x80 == 0:

<j​effro256:monero.social> break

<j​effro256:monero.social> shift += 7

<j​effro256:monero.social> return res

<j​effro256:monero.social> if len(sys.argv) > 1:

<j​effro256:monero.social> search_dir = sys.argv[1]

<j​effro256:monero.social> else:

<j​effro256:monero.social> print("No search directory provided. Defaulting to '.'...")

<j​effro256:monero.social> search_dir = '.'

<j​effro256:monero.social> CHACHA_IV_SIZE = 8

<j​effro256:monero.social> print("Searching '{}' for Monero wallet '.keys' file...".format(search_dir))

<j​effro256:monero.social> for (root, _, fnames) in os.walk(search_dir):

<j​effro256:monero.social> for fname in fnames:

<j​effro256:monero.social> full_path = os.path.join(root, fname)

<j​effro256:monero.social> try:

<j​effro256:monero.social> with open(full_path, 'rb') as f:

<j​effro256:monero.social> f.seek(0, os.SEEK_END)

<j​effro256:monero.social> flen = f.tell()

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> Tried the first one and it worked

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> A lot of them are wallets I created temporarily while developing so, but one has funds that I would like to get back. Going to take a while to sync them

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> A lot of them are wallets I created temporarily while developing, but one has funds that I would like to get back. Going to take a while to sync them

<r​ecanman:agoradesk.com> This is pretty helpful, you should post it to github or something