<b​asses:matrix.org> why Mailing List doesn't have external link besides it? like Stack Exchange, BitcoinTalk etc

<b​asses:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/TtCKMJVjSZvLBctfiVIbljVg

<3​21bob321:monero.social> So it can track your clicks

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> cuz its not external?

<c​hch3003:monero.social> As a warm up for tonight's meeting, youtube.com/watch?v=Ieq5sNEoc1E&ab_channel=AnswerinProgress

<r​eal_glitch:matrix.org> so we are going to get rid of the orange brand?

<r​eal_glitch:matrix.org> bounties.monero.social/posts/153/0-…-swiss-flag-inspired-color-branding

<c​hch3003:monero.social> This is a bounty, that nobody tried to get as of now.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Even if they do, theres no reason why we have to accept it

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> meeting in 30 minutes

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> meeting in 20 minutes

<b​asses:matrix.org> iirelevant

meeting in 0 minutes

<c​hch3003:monero.social> 🔔🔔🔔

meeting in -3 minutes

alright...

1. Greetings

hello

<b​asses:matrix.org> hello

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Hi

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Is there an agenda?

<b​asses:matrix.org> monero-project/meta #1073

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Ok, we are 3

<c​hch3003:monero.social> ?

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Ok, I have something to say

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> hi

<b​asses:matrix.org> what is even that agenda, very vague

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> apologies for my tardiness

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I can run the meeting, if monerobull isn't here

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Hey!

yay 4

go ahead diego as I'm afk

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Janaka, you said you had something to say. Go for it.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Ok

<c​hch3003:monero.social> After months of contemplating how a new Monero website should look, it became clear to me that it should be in light mode. Dark mode, while visually appealing, doesn’t convey the level of professionalism required. Light mode is the way forward.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Also, I would not support both; as maintaining both options is too much work for too little benefit.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> A few months ago, I began working on the Hammerman design because I was impressed by the overall design and wanted to contribute to the community, so I went ahead and implemented the design.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> However, I’ve since changed my mind. I initially got excited about dark mode, but now I don't think this design should represent the official Monero website. Dark mode is a trap.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> While we heard some voices in favor of dark mode, I think going light-mode only is aligned with a good portion of the community, as shown by this Reddit thread: reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/1felb8…f_getmoneroorg_looking_for_feedback

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Going forward, I believe we should commission one or more designers to create a light mode theme that is sober, clean, and professional—similar to the current design. Once that's in place, we can carefully curate the content for the website.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Only after that should we consider the technical implementation, which is a separate matter entirely.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Understood. Thank you Janaka

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> does anyone in attendance have thoughts or comments on that?

it's clear from the community feedback we've received that light mode is preferred

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Another point of the community feedback that is largely consistent is that a redesign isn't needed at all.

and since we already have light mode, this leads us to a more fundamental question -- what is this redesign hoping to achieve?

yes

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I can provide an answer to this question, although I'm not necessarily 100% gung ho on the answers I'd be giving.

<b​asses:matrix.org> I say support both dark and light theme

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I think one of the primary ones is moving to a new, modern framework would be beneficial. It would make things like translations and other stuff easier.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> And if we moved for the sake of framework, I think a lot of people thought it'd be a shame to not use the opportunity for a refresh.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> hello, sorry for being late to the meeting i announced myself

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> we've got a bunch of feedback on both reddit and monero.town

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> monero.town/post/4289749?scrollToComments=true

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/1felb8…f_getmoneroorg_looking_for_feedback

👋

<c​hch3003:monero.social> In my opnion, the main benefit is to renew the tech stack. We can have a new design, but nothing fancy, light mode only. The tech stack should allow easy contribution and translation.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Right, both of these links have people that are saying a refresh is probably not necessary.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the three top comments on reddit are "keep it the same"

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/RmwnpwMbueNpERRfwQLzvcOp

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Keep in mind, the same was said when I first redesigned the site by a ton of people.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> With the design before mine

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> About the design before mine

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Janaka what are your thoughts of remaking the current site with the new tech stack?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> obviously we use the opportunity to update content and images

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> but keep the general look and feel, the blocks, fonts, etc.

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Jekyll is a problem, which is why we were looking at hugo iirc

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Yes we can keep the design as is also. Just that it's nice to change a little sometimes

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> it is a static site, how bad can it really be?

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Jekyll is EOL or smthn

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> it's still static

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> this isn't wordpress

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> monero-project/monero-site #2140

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> ```

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> there is a problem that we have to deal with: jekyll-multiple-languages-plugin which we are using to make the website multilingual has been in maintainance mode for years. It was always a bit of a problem, but now things are getting worse, as incompatibilities are starting to pop up which force us to lock some specific versions in the dependencies.

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> This is a problem that will only get worse and that could only be solved by somebody taking over the plugin and maintain it again. This hasn't happened yet and i feel it won't ever happen. The result could be that we will find ourselves unable to update to newer Jekyll versions or we could find ourselves stuck in a dependency hell.

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> ```

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> we can also just remove moneropedia

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Brand new videos are being made which can replace the old ones

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> there's like ten actual illustrations on the site. All of them can be replaced. We can ask andres to do them all for a consistent feel

<c​hch3003:monero.social> We can use Hugo if you want but personally, I am much more familiar with Typescript than Go.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Someone else can implement the website though.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> The old illustrations were made by me to match the video at the bottom of this page?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> getmonero.org/get-started/what-is-monero

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Im not suggesting hugo

i fixed the jekyll language thing.. and some other small bugs preventing update to the latest ruby but uhm yeah some issues remain with po4a .. small bug in how we have key lists in our file ... what im saying is the current tech stack is fragile

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> i'm making note of jekyll issue

that plugin is abandonware* i merely made it run

<c​hch3003:monero.social> If we all agree that we should keep it light mode, more or less as it is now, we are making a big step forward

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I'm fine with all of that, sure.

its here, i have repressed the memories monero-project/monero-site #2237

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Thoughts on asking Andres to do the illustrations?

<c​hch3003:monero.social> I have nothing against it

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> not a 1-to-1 replacement of current images. First step would be to do adjustments on content.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> After that's done we can decide what images are needed and can ask him

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I ask because his style is unique and identifiable. And some people may want things a little simpler

removing moneropedia is more realistic now that there is a docs workgroup

<b​asses:matrix.org> if we are going to add new vids from vost, then dark theme makes sense 🤷

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> For those who don't know he did all the imagery for tailsOS

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> tails.net

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> and he's also the creator of the iconic Monero bricks community image at the bottom of the homepage

in vostos latest ccs , light and dark mode themed would be produced if funded ccs.getmonero.org/proposals/VOSTOEMISIO-FCMP-Animated-Explainer.html

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> we're ready to redirect rpc docs now

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> id bet money this is the same person that did the ringsig image

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Tails is light mode only btw...

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> as is tor

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> torproject.org

<c​hch3003:monero.social> I mean, they got it.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Or Bitcoin

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Lot things

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I've always been partial to light mode myself, yeah. Hence current live design.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Lot of things

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> and, if I may be blunt, since this meeting was broadcast ahead of time, by quite a ways. I'm inclined to care more about the opinions that are here

great to see a change of heart and a sudden embrace of light mode

ofrnxmr: where is that quote from?

<b​asses:matrix.org> u are sitting at night with lights off, you open your fav light only theme website, flashbanged

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oad/xmr.mx/jdEIfkvHaygZnxqnWxGjAdxm

<c​hch3003:monero.social> rando: Just don't watch screen at night

<c​hch3003:monero.social> rando: Just don't watch screens at night

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Geonic - from the github i linked

<b​asses:matrix.org> I'm talking practically

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Or turn on the light

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I think if some people want to make dark mode for the site on the new framework, they should be able to do so, obviously. It's a community project, after all.

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> monero-project/monero-site #2140 geonic

ah tx

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Janaka is just not going to add or upkeep it

<b​asses:matrix.org> yes, obviously there are also people that want dark theme, so why not support both?

<b​asses:matrix.org> give people the option to choose what they want?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> And having both will be much easier on a new framework

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Yes, I think that sometimes users are wrong

<b​asses:matrix.org> including you

<b​asses:matrix.org> this is a community project

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Yes yes haha It happens

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> It takes 0.1sec for my browser to do it. 0.1 sec for docs.getmonero.org

<b​asses:matrix.org> stop flexing docs for a min lol

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> well, janaka I can understand you saying you will not implement or upkeep it. But if you're saying it shouldn't be added by anyone else, I would disagree strongly.

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Docs has light + dark + autodetect

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> white mode as default, I agree btw

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> agreed

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> No

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Docs is an extension of site and should flow nicely

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Shouldnt get flashbanged when clicking through

<c​hch3003:monero.social> But, my opinion today is that light mode only is better for maintainability. Supporting dual theme without JS means compiling for both, and generating different urls, it's a mess

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Lot of work for very little benefit

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> then perhaps we make light mode only available to those with JS turned on?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> The site "degrades" nicely without JS in that literally all content is still available, just only in light mode :P

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> if we do darkmode by default that isnt great

there is a simple way of changing style sheets of course (in use circa 1999)

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> this is mostly psychology

<c​hch3003:monero.social> YES

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> darkmode by default we might as well get sponsorships by DNMs

tbh we’re lacking translations not because of a technical hurdle but because of an incoherent policy where we paid a “translations coordinator” instead of the people doing the work (QA issues aside)

<b​asses:matrix.org> developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/@media/prefers-color-scheme

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> We are sponsored by majestic and were sponsored by forked.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> "<g​eonic> tbh we’re lacking translations not because of a technical hurdle but because of an incoherent policy where we paid a “translations coordinator” instead of the people doing the work (QA issues aside)"

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> wrong..

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> and monerokon by exch

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> so what

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> getmonero.org is still looking friendly :D

<b​asses:matrix.org> literally exists

<b​asses:matrix.org> bruh

<c​hch3003:monero.social> It's a trap to think Monero == privacy == darknet == dark mode

<c​hch3003:monero.social> No! Any serious projects use light mode only.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Dark mode is suited for specific apps, or ICO websites, but not for serious projects

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Generalfubd has thousands of neros deposited by unknown whale. Pretty sure were sponsored why who knows

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> By* who knows

<b​asses:matrix.org> duckduckgo supports dark theme

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> agreed

are you suggesting wownero isnt a serious project because it has a darkish theme site wownero.org

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> darkmode is to raise VC funding

<b​asses:matrix.org> actually it is a trend for privacy products to support dark theme

<c​hch3003:monero.social> rando: Ok but also take into considerence the maintenance cost. It is not worth it

<c​hch3003:monero.social> rando: Ok but also take into consideration the maintenance cost. It is not worth it

<b​asses:matrix.org> how so? enlighten me

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> expressvpn.com

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Guys, this is all a bit silly. Having an non-default OPTION for dark mode doesn't make Monero look like a less serious project. It makes it look like a more accessible one.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Even repo.getmonero.org has dark theme

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> does this look like a shady site to you?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> "Dark mode" doesn't have to mean OLED black and hacker green text

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> We even have qr codes in dark and light.

<b​asses:matrix.org> doesn't load without JS, not a serious project

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I thought we agreed to use the hacker/matrix scrolling txt?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> It seems pretty obvious to me that what should happen going forward is that Janaka will remake the current site (with content changes) in a new framework. Janaka will be doing light mode only. After the site is done, people that are NOT Janaka can utilize their skills to give the website a dark theme as well.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Scroll down. It loads the footer 💯💯

<u​ntraceable:monero.social> How about a dark theme that isn't black, but dark gray like ivpn.net/en

<b​asses:matrix.org> like guys cmon lmao, you are making supporting dark theme a crime, ignoring all accessibility and user's choice

<c​hch3003:monero.social> We don't want two themes because it is not necessary.

who’s we lol

<b​asses:matrix.org> perfecto

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> no offense but what a bad website. wall of text with "hacker" font

<u​ntraceable:monero.social> I think it should definitely be an option, but not the default

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Repo.getmonero and docs.getmonero

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i like the expressvpn one a lot more

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Penpot.getmonero.org is also not "light"

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Ban

<u​ntraceable:monero.social> I'm only talking about the color, not design

<b​asses:matrix.org> says the guy that like cypherpunk theme websites

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i like retrowave neon stuff

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> avax website: terrible

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> actually depressing

<b​asses:matrix.org> everyone have their taste

<b​asses:matrix.org> but we are talking about accessbility here

<c​hch3003:monero.social> It has a dev/design cost. And we lose the brand.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> A website is not an app.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> An application can have dual mode.

<c​hch3003:monero.social> A website needs an identity, and just one.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> We're starting to derail a bit here.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Still no consensus after 3 meetings …lol

<b​asses:matrix.org> so google lost their brand for supporting dark them for most if not all their services?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> github has dark theme

Agreed. Most people are perfectly happy with the design. If the translations are the reason we’re considering switching platforms let’s talk about that.

<b​asses:matrix.org> I give up lol

<c​hch3003:monero.social> But this is more like apps

<u​ntraceable:monero.social> How about a vote to settle it

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> This is 4, iirc

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> it'd be funny if it wasn't so frustrating :P

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Well, anyone who disagree with me. It's fine, but take the time to really think about it please.

<b​asses:matrix.org> vscode, literally all 90% of programmers use, because it helps programmers not going blind by staring at sun looking screen 12h avg

no need to vote on something when community consensus is pretty clear

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> geonic what's your take on what the consensus is?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Github, google, bing, ddg, repo.getmonero, docs.getmonero, penpot.getmonero, all have dark choice

unless we’re somehow more special than the masses

<b​asses:matrix.org> no one is maintaining Weblate, another problem for another dimension

that people like the current design. don’t fix what’s not broken, etc

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> and devices like phones even _auto switch_ depending on time of day

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Yes, those are APPLICATIONS

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> (asking about the dark thing btw)

<c​hch3003:monero.social> NOT WEBSITES

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Is this about having a dark theme

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Those are websites bro

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Github.com is a website and an app (both have dark theme)

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> alright everyone. The dark theme is a bit of a moot point at the moment anyways. Once again, it can be added rather easily, after the fact, since we'd be on a new, more modern framework.

<b​asses:matrix.org> nah war lol

<c​hch3003:monero.social> I mean, github.com is more an app than a website

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Is this not a small thing to argue about. Dark and light mode welcome to the 21st century

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oad/xmr.mx/gXlnVGROZbrTikfEKWNKrrKx

<b​asses:matrix.org> wikis are apps now?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> What is clear from this meeting (to me) is the following:

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> 1. Keep current design

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> 2. Update to new framework

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> 3. Tweak existing content, illustrations, and replace videos

<3​21bob321:monero.social> I will send pagers!

<b​asses:matrix.org> because wikipedia started supproting dark theme recently, also arch linux wiki

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Update content and strings

2. was never discussed in any detail

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> 4. Janaka can do the above, but will only be doing light theme

<b​asses:matrix.org> can we talk about the actual website for real now?

diego making up action items again

<u​ntraceable:monero.social> Wait, I arrived a bit late. There's still going to have a redesign, right? Just a light default theme instead of dark as proposed?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> To me janka has the only demo site currently

<b​asses:matrix.org> how many videos will be replaced, all?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> Community seems to be against it

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> wait, geonic, but you just said that the consensus as you saw it was that a new design wasn't needed?

<u​ntraceable:monero.social> Ah whaaat I was excited for a redesign.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Can diego convert his design into demo site?

right. no discussion has been had on the framework though

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> geonic, we have discussed the framework for many, many meetings

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> astro for same design revamp?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> and if you can please disagree with me in a way that is not the most obnoxious possible, that would be appreciated

are we back to “consensus was already achieved” lol

<c​hch3003:monero.social> We will refresh the tech stack, fix translation, light mode only, stop crying it's ok, make Monero great again!!

<b​asses:matrix.org> and they gave bad reasonings, dark = bad = crime. Worst conclusion

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Racists

framework is not even on the agenda for today

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> We should make it bright pink

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Like cake wallet

did we decide Hugo is best because ErC said so?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> it's not just me that seems to think so geonic? janaka and ofrn seem to think so too?>

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> No the main criticism was if it ain't broke don't fix it

<b​asses:matrix.org> yeah this not kindergarden

Janaka is looking for a job so he’s not exactly unbiased here

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> no geonic. We would be using Astro. Once again, previous meetings.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Geonic - no, i just pointed out that jekyll was not a good option

<3​21bob321:monero.social> You know sometimes a dictator is good. Shit gets done…..

<b​asses:matrix.org> it is actually broken, they are just seeing the surface

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I don't know anyone who actually works on the site who really wants to see Jekyll stay?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Plowsof

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> No

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Anything but rust

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I mean, i think were all ok with dumping jekyll

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> someone else must take the reins there sir

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> no, no. geonic wasn't there for the many conversations where it happened, so it doesn't count

<c​hch3003:monero.social> I will if you don't

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> and any attempt to point back to those conversations is railroading

<b​asses:matrix.org> no

<3​21bob321:monero.social> But i dont get paid to whip people

There’s only one comment on ErC’s github issue about the framework. This was never the long-standing issue you’re making it out to be

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I can't or geonic will bitch, so please do

<b​asses:matrix.org> agenda is vague, and technically doesn't exist

I get that you’re looking for something to do tho

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> we have had IRC meetings

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> ok guys we are coming up on the one hour mark

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Well then i say light and dark, implement diego's design with some tweaks and keep old site around at old.getmonero.org

<b​asses:matrix.org> +1

<3​21bob321:monero.social> I have a homelab there is always something else to do.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i think we can all agree that a default light + optional dark mode is the goal

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> +1 with rando and dan

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Consensus meet

<c​hch3003:monero.social> So ok, Diego Salazar you can work on a light mode design close to the current one, just make it even better. Then we will talk about implementation

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> untraceable

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> uh wait. Sorry if I'm being an idiot. Are you talking about my most recent design that I put forth a couple weeks back?>

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Is this how pow works?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> cuz if so, that one is out

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Yes

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> early bird gets the 🪱

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Out where

<b​asses:matrix.org> not it in hurry, just need to make sure at least we are one step forward or there is a progress

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Once again, sorry for being a moron. But I'm so confused. Why would I do that? I thought the consensus here was that we stick close to the current, live design? lol

ofrn: community voted no on the proposed designs

i have worked with jekyll, i couldnt tell you what it is.. sometimes i use/see liquid scripting.. ruby is a PITA to set up a local dev environment.. as a contributor im not too worried about the backend getting in the way

a new backend getting in the way*

thanks plowsof

<3​21bob321:monero.social> I8n plowsof?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Reddit voted no with fake bot votes

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> And reddit blocks tor, as does monero,town

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Majestic?

I’m against paid contractors creating busywork for themselves without clearly articulated reasons

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Hmm because It would be nice to have a Figma to implement it..

if you want to change the backend, comment on the github issue that’s been open for a year

translations , even with a new fancy end still rely on >weblate< (the thing that we are unable to keep online or gets neglected and falls out of sync with whats on site)

<b​asses:matrix.org> anyway, for at least the homepage dark theme + new vids will look a bit like a redesign

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> dont act like a significant number of people were oppressed. reddit audience are the same exact normies that getmonero.org is supposed to reach

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> plowsof, and all new content

<b​asses:matrix.org> if we are not going to do any actual redesings and just switching frameworks

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> No like I'm happy to make a figma design of the current, live, design that we can edit with content changes

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> it doesnt need to target hardcore tor & monero users

<b​asses:matrix.org> repost on Dread? lol

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> More than significant. Youre biased cuz u block everybody on tor

basses: the new vids that are currently available are not up to standards. plus dark mode only.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> the confusion came because it seemed they were asking me to make a light mode of my design I pitched a couple of weeks ago

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Worse than reddit

<3​21bob321:monero.social> github.com/monero-project/monero-site/discussions/2372

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Cant even view .town

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> yes i hate tor users with a burning passion /s

new content overwrites the current stuff, and we await for the team of translators to adjust.. review.. and push 💪 or things dont get updated

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Clearly

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Diego Salazar: Yes that's fine.

<b​asses:matrix.org> up to standard?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> if you pay for the CDN ill take any ddos head on ofrn

i.e. they’re worse than the current ones

<3​21bob321:monero.social> We have standards??

the current backend doesnt get in the way either*

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> alright. I'll work on that then.

just figure it out and forget the pain

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I'll do it in PenPot also.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Who needs a cdn when 700tb is like 100$?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> so it will be easy for people to tweak content stuff

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> do you think monero.town generates $100

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Kuno

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> And servers.guru offered to cover the bill

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Sponsorship

monero town was flooded with resources totalling over 100kusd , ofcourse it generates more than $100

how hard is it to add dark mode in Jekyll?

adding dark mode would be a"change style" button

click , and the url remains the same

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> monerica was flooded with what would make it the second most popular website after google.com lol

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Sounds clunky

do that then?

<b​asses:matrix.org> monerobull you can turn off CF captcha when there's no attacks

maybe janaka is talking about a more compreensive redeisng for dark/light?

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Diego Salazar: I didn't review each piece of text carefully. But when I worked on the demo I noticed lot of content that I would like to change. But I don't have everything in mind now.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Neva

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> rando but the attack is constant

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Its not captcha, its straight up blocked

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> correct

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> known tor exit nodes are blocked

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Ray id?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> because that is where the ddos is coming from

<b​asses:matrix.org> call it bitcoin.town?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Ok. I can't summarize what consensus is here necessarily. But I will say my personal, current, action plan based off of what I take from this meeting.

<b​asses:matrix.org> thought Tor users like Monero

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I will be making a Figma / PenPot file of the CURRENT, LIVE site. Really just a 1 to 1 recreation.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> At which point, we as a community can play around with content and illustration changes.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> in an easy and non-committal way

diego: that was my proposals to you at the last meeting

tx

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Only crimes use it

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Diego Salazar: Yes perfect

and again, whoever wants to change the backend, please articulate your reasons on Github monero-project/monero-site #2140

<b​asses:matrix.org> so can someone summarize on what decesions were made so we wont discuss it again in the next meeting?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> the general plan moving forward is that this site will be redone in Astro

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Id like to see what your design prospect looks like in light mode

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> instead of Jekyll

it’s not a general plan Diego

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> it is geonic

cool it

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> no u

<c​hch3003:monero.social> A nice Figma, properly organized, that the community can review.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Plowsof, thought on moving to astro?

<b​asses:matrix.org> decisions*

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> ok guys please leave now

<b​asses:matrix.org> ???

monerobull: say “meeting adjourned”

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Meeting summary

<b​asses:matrix.org> .

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Stop talking about implementation, we are not there yet

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i say: "<g​eonic> monerobull: say “meeting adjourned”"

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 1. Diego to convert to astro

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 2. Mbll hates tor

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> you literally don't just get to come in here after several meetings and say "no actually we're not doing that because I wasn't there and I said so"

but muh job security!!

bro I was right about light mode, wasn’t I

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I'm not even the one implementing it.

<b​asses:matrix.org> what

<b​asses:matrix.org> again?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Just need majority to be voted in

<b​asses:matrix.org> are we moving backwards?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Not 100%

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> diego how long will if take u to do your redesign in light mode

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Neva

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Some guys here are you just trolling right?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Sideways

<3​21bob321:monero.social> We are like emus

ofrn: he’s not doing his redesign in light mode

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Im not

<c​hch3003:monero.social> No not you

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> He's free to do whatever he wants ...

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Trolls are left under the bridge

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I won't be using my CCS hours to do that redesign. I can see about doing it in my free time, or if someone else pays, sure.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Lol

<c​hch3003:monero.social> I am free to distribute slaps also

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I asked how long, bcuz really, it might be 20mins for a quick and dirty recoloribg

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Not part of community?

yes. and he said he’s mocking up the current design in Figma to see what if anything needs to be refreshed

the two proposed designs are out

<3​21bob321:monero.social> On the bum?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Based on?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Real people?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Or bots

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> redditooorrs

<b​asses:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/yHUXMmypQSCDzqXPgecxfWkK

<b​asses:matrix.org> looks clean

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Fck reddit

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> if nothing else, based on the fact that I am currently will not continue working on my design. And there's no other designers here :P

read the beginning of this meeting

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> was I too easily swayed? maybe.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> IT LOOKS LIKE DIEGOS NEW DESIGN

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> but I am swayed nonetheless.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Except without the hero *wink*

<b​asses:matrix.org> just need new graphics because looks childish and outdated

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Which is why i asked for new design in light mode. Bet it looks like the current one but modernized

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> anyways, I have my next steps, and we have a general plan for the future.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> so I'm off

<b​asses:matrix.org> no offense

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> And diego needs to lose the circle buttons

a general plan based on finger on the pulse technology

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Lose the circle buttons, lose the hero, and we have a modernized version if the current website

<3​21bob321:monero.social> How about if you dont attend meetings or post you opinion on the github stiff shit.

<b​asses:matrix.org> we can just make it rectangle instead

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oad/xmr.mx/thrjzfXdqQOwqqZSvyUefsyV

alright, since I opened this meeting, might as well close it

meeting adjourned everyone

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Its not over until diego sings

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Isnt mbll ceo here?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> LA LA LA LA LA

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I sang

no, they were both late (:

<b​asses:matrix.org> loool

<3​21bob321:monero.social> So summariez

<3​21bob321:monero.social> To there own jobz

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Has to be "happy birthday" in your best marilyn monroe voice

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Alright see you guys!!

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Bue

<c​hch3003:monero.social> Was a pleasure

tx Janaka

<c​hch3003:monero.social> 👋

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Thanks folks

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Thanks post malone

<b​asses:matrix.org> cya

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Almost forgot

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/502

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Contribute to current website is welcome

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Need more indians

<3​21bob321:monero.social> With feathers

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> See link for indian ^^

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Worker node

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Up to standards he says. Smfh. 😂

<3​21bob321:monero.social> I still dont know what was achieved in that “meeting”

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Maybe it was a decoy meeting?

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Wrong. Fuck this guy.

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> That's current, split in halves and in dark mode? 🤔

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Bah...

<b​asses:matrix.org> current design works if changes framework, graphics and add dark theme

<b​asses:matrix.org> no need for a whole redesign

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Ban tor

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Moving from Jekyll should be a must imho.

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Nobody likes Ruby, Jekyll is from like the eighties...

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Astro, hugo, ghost even lol, just not more Jekyll. Port current Jekyll theme to Hugo?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> I thought it was astro. Do the current contributors know how to use it?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> no guys, every step we've made forward and agreed on as a group in our actual meetings over the past two months is out he window

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> no guys, every step we've made forward and agreed on as a group in our actual meetings over the past two months is out the window

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> this isn't even me being pissy. I'm serious. (Although I am also pissy)

<b​asses:matrix.org> ghost is not a static site generator, it is more like wordpress

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Mkdocs🚀

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Will there be an after action report on this meeting?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Gl to the two newsletters!

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> I was being sarcastic at that point.

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> If you don't change the backend as part of your role in the community I'll be severely disappointed and invite plowsof to take over.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> ouch

<b​asses:matrix.org> oh the sysadministration course that I didn't start yet lol

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> rottenwheel: I agree with you btw

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I try to make something happen with the workgroup support. Seems like a no-brainer, yeah?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> nope. one guy wasn't there for it. Now I'm "making stuff up" and railroading things so I can make work for myself.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> but nah, you're right. I'm not going to be a pushover. All of the work over the past couple of months is not undone.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I was never even trying to railroad my design. I was trying to make it to present for the community. Community said nah. Janaka flipped also and wanted light mode. Great. We have a new direction. That's not an issue.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> (Ever since last meeting I have also not been wasting hours working on the design the community didn't care for btw. Not trying to take advantage here).

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> But yes, pretty much all of us present at meetings have decided we should do away with jekyll

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Tbh why listen to one person when the rest want to change

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Didnt know we needed 100% of the vote

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Given Janaka has already been funded for the CCS, the 95% most likely candidate for the backend will be Astro. That other 5% is:

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> 1. Janaka disappears and we gotta figure out who will code this thing, at which point discussion can reopen.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> 2. Someone takes it upon themselves (probably with no funding) to make it in something different, presents it, and everyone agrees that it's better.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> ^

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Still stands

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Imma be blunt. Geonic has taken it upon himself to make sure I can't ever decide anything without challenge. I'm sure he thinks that it's a thankless job, but someone's gotta do it. Great. Good for him.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Currently there is 3 admins contributing

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> I mean, I'll speak for myself and speak quite bluntly here, both ofrn and geonic can go fuck themselves for all I care. Both blocked and ignored everywhere, except the edge case when they're talking across the bridge through m-relay, can't do anything about that, or block them from participating in community, public repositories, discussions and issues. That's about the closest th<clipped message>

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> ey got to my attention span, but, if a single opinion will sway you away from your proposal or a brand-new site backend, which gm has been needing for years, gets vetoed, I frankly do not want to hold any hopes for the CCS, core team, or any workgroup for that matter.

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> It is a single person shitting on broad workgroup consensus. Absolute, utter bullshit, if you ask me. At that point I might as well go live in caves and just write up Revuo without giving two fucks about community 'consensus' because at the end of the day it is what lever and when luigi pulls and whatever current 3 angry ants geonic has up his ass so he's holding such "something" <clipped message>

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> or person accountable to *his* standards.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Holy shit batman

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Tldr?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Rotten can such me 🍆

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Call me if that's the case and I'll rent a cave for myself, spare me all the wasted time.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Has had be blocked for months so should stfu

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Has no idea what ive said

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> You're generally correct. I've decided to grow a backbone again.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Bout go fuck myself, how about you go fuck a cactus ya fuck tool

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> ;)

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I jest. Not about the backbone. You'll noitice in the meeting logs, towards the end, I held to the notion that we have a general path forward with regards to the new backend.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Everyone who was present at the meeting agreed, maintainers either don't care, or agree wholeheartedly

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Was there an agenda?

<b​asses:matrix.org> yes, no

<3​21bob321:monero.social> I can in and there was pager wars over dark mode

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Came*

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> If me merely summarizing a consensus is railroading, then geonic is delusional.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Darkmode/light mode use toggle - down

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Meanwhile docs has triple toggle!

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Literally every person is fine with it except the guy who insists that if he wasn't there to see it, it didn't happen.

bs

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> no u

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Hi bestie

plow just said there’s basically no good reason to change the backend

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> try not to be lazy and scroll up to see the chat logs

and he works with the website more than you do

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> plowsof, youre in trouble

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Plowsof whinged about i8n

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Plowsof said the plugin is abandonware and the website is duct taped together

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Hence why it was decided to change to something else

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> And that he _made_ it work, and that it wasnt fun

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I said everyone present either didn't care, or agreed a change is necessary. Plowsof was of the first category (and has a few misgivings on the current way that would be solved with a change)

<b​asses:matrix.org> rip plow

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Bluetack is better

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Stretches

so the 2 contractors get to decide what’s being worked on and how? lol

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> he also LITERALLY said that the current backend is fragile

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Plowsof has been on board with rm -rf and start from scratch

last meeting there consensus had already been reached about dark mode. remember that?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> He's even told hardenedsteel to stop upgrading the current site bcuz it's a waste of resources

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Was that in the last meeting minutes?

now you’re saying consensus had been reached about the backend

I’m asking where

so yes you are railroading

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> the backend was in the first meetinf

just like dark mode was

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> remember when I scrolled up to the place in the meeting and literally copy/pasted where, and replied in Matrix so others can see

and diego’s design was

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> and you said "I can see it"

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Backend was like months ago pre group

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Hugo is i8n compatible, ffs.

no. can you comment on the github issue that’s been open for a year+?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I was never pushing my design, you doofus. It was always the intention to make it and present it to the community for consideration.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> This is why i created a discussion

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Going in circles again

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> but i dont think we agreed wholeheartedly to use the current site. We agreed that a new design is beinf contentious and the current design is good enough

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> holy shit! This literally happened. You literally said that you could see it when I copy/pasted

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I still want to see diego's design in light mode

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Fakenews

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Make demo site!!!!!!!!

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Nobody gives a shit about you shitty github discussion, or the issue for that matter.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Does rotten ever add anything to any discussion?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Clearly , cause people like talkimg shit and going in circles

no

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Simply don't read or listen to geonic. We'd already have a first preview in Astro if it weren't because Diego is masochist and keeps engaging with the famous community film "director", pristine "standards". 😂

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> I believe it is worse than current clips, hence it doesn't meet "standards" because dark mode is darknet. 💅

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> rotten is a fkn cheerleading bootlocker. S tha front door

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Tell this director gnome to go fuck himself for a few months. Thanks.

if you don’t like erc’s issue, open a new one. but this needs to be a broader discussion than 5 people in a room

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I disagree

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Out of the 5ppl discussing, 1.1 of them actually contributes

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> drama? 🍿

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Way more than 5 people in a room. The meeting issue has been live every time, it gets shared in Revuo and observer every time.

<b​asses:matrix.org> I admit that I was wrong when I suggested asking for opnions on reddit/town

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I think backend should be plowsof and hardenedsteels call. If they ok it, fuck what reddit says

<b​asses:matrix.org> dark theme = crime was the dumbest thing I have ever read

especially when 2 of the 5 literally stand to gain from any work, whether it’s necessary or not

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> The hilarious thing is, before I came in and helped settle things in that meeting, this was being discussed to death for quite some time

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> The fact that you fail to be present when consensus and meetings take place doesn't entitle you to walk in here every time your dwarf ass chooses to to keep us stuck in a loop where Diego or whoever it is has to please your every demand.

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Not only are you failing to come to meetings and swim with the general consensus reached in called for meetings, you also disrupt the dialogue in here.

just like you settled it during this meeting with a summary out of a hat?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> The 1.1 im referring to of 0.55 plowsof and 0.55 hardenedsteel

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> You have the balls to call it "standards", when it's only you and your bullshit bias.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> This guy really has an issue with short ppl

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Fucking gnome...

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> weird metrics not gonna lie

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> That's all geonic. 🤣

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Thats MB, dumbass

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Both work part time

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ah ok make more sense

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I do not stand to benefit from switching backends

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Hardendsteel and plowsof, afaict, are both ok with anything, as long as it works and doesn't cause major headaches, and fixes current issues

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> if we want to breakdown where I benefit and exclude me from those discussions, that can be discussed. That would be the content editing? Maybe illustration help?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> no

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Given I'm making the Figma and PenPot of the current design, I'm benefiting regardless by having to make that and counting that as hours

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> but the backend thing doesn't affect me one way or the other

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Lets not go into needless discussions.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> me and dan wanna see demo of your design in light mode

<b​asses:matrix.org> on your portoflio

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Astro unless veto by hardened or plowsof

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Syntheticbird said astro is fine too, i think

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Cuprate uses it?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I completely biased, Astro is my first framework Ive ever used and loved it

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Yes

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Rotten is the one who had a problem with choosing astro over hugo

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Stick in the mud

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Do recall I also did a deep dive into Astro, Jekyll, Zola, and Hugo.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Use one that people can easily contribute and has no js

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> So idk why hes yapping his mouth now. He just wanted an opportunity to act like a shitbag. Guy hasnt contributed anything since mbll was chosen over hin

<b​asses:matrix.org> and what were that statistics?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Wooowoo Ecmascript syntax. so terrifying

<b​asses:matrix.org> and what were the statistics?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> And came to the conclusion that both Astro and Hugo (and even Zola to an extent) would fit our needs. What matters the most then is the people would be making and maintaining.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Written in ascii

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> monero-website --armor

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Lets just make the website like debian.net

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Vintage

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Debian.org

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> like? incorrect https certificate?

<b​asses:matrix.org> Astro 🧑‍🚀, Hugo 🐇, Zola 🦀

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Getmonero does that

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Zola's primary benefit was being much faster than the others. Written in Rust. But it has the smallest community of the three, and so less support. Not real plugin stuff either.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> LIAR

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Expired cert party in dec btw

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> But we do have Rust people here, so if something needed to be made, we could probably do it.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Plowsof is anti rust

<b​asses:matrix.org> heck, Java got a website redesign like 2 years ago

<3​21bob321:monero.social> He/she/google will use WD40 on it

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> mhm. I'm not very hyped about that not gonna lie

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Astro has easier templating, is much better documented, and has a huge community (because it's JS, and there's a million of those JS devs)

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I installed each on my machine, made a simple website in each, and looked through community resources and plugins for each

<b​asses:matrix.org> nah, we are not that inclusive to accept Rust

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> It seemed to me that:

<b​asses:matrix.org> stick to Astro seems like the only option

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Astro >= Hugo >>>> Zola >>>>>>>> Jekyll

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> So were using jekyll?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 1. Needs to be simple to do a change

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 2. Translations work

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 3. No js

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 4 . Tor and i2p workable

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Truth has been said (I unironically agree with that)

<b​asses:matrix.org> js4?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 1. Needs to be simple to do a change

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 2. Translations work

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 3. No js

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 4. Tor and i2p workable

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Astro fits perfectly

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Md error

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Now ask plowsof and hardensteel will that work with astro

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Given this (which was presented at that meeting), coupled with the fact that the dev that would be making the is most familiar with Astro, it seemed a no brainer to all attending that Astro was the best option.

<b​asses:matrix.org> how to necro Weblate?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Ye. So why are we spending another 45mins on this

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> And that sticking with Jekyll wasn't one. What we have with it is fragile (ala Plowsof), i18n is sucks, not supported much (if at all, once again ala plowsof), isn't actively maintained as project, and can't do things like dark modes easily.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> You know all of this. I know all of this. But when geonic goes and bitches on twitter and/or reddit, I need receipts.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Diego is being professional and reexplain why Astro has been chosen since geonic is complaining

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 1. Make your design in light mode - its close enough to currenr design. (just get rid of hero and circles)

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 2. .. profit?

<j​effro256:monero.social> I'm a big fan of the new minimalist Java website redesign

<j​effro256:monero.social> Screenshot from 2024-09-22 17-15-54.png

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I post on twitter, i don't read ppls posts

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> LMFAO

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Lmfo

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Think of the past twenty minutes of messages as me being able to point to messages, recent and older, in the event geonic continues to derail and make a stink. Sorry you all have to sift through.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I dont accept apologies

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> whats an apology?

<b​asses:matrix.org> if you trust Java's Javascript and load the website, it looks like it took a lot of inspiration from Microsoft desing, very corporate

diego: post on github

<b​asses:matrix.org> design*

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> The backend issue isnt one for discussion. If contributors say no, its no

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> *le Oracle.*

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I'm not your monkey

irc chat logs in a room with 5 ppl isn’t proof of anything

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 🐒

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> there is an active workgroup here

yes you are. you work for us now, remember?

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> the meeting today was posted on reddit and github

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> the people who cared to come showed up

<b​asses:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/oQcDGONhaVmJGDEEeOBMVrsE

<b​asses:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/BtufWrgedVfeKekiZiPPshWf

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I'm not YOUR monkey boyo

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> stroll down

yes and we’re not in a meeting atm

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Goated

<b​asses:matrix.org> infinite void

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Diego Salazar

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 1. Make your design in light mode - its close enough to currenr design. (just get rid of hero and circles)

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 2. .. profit?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Y/N

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> if you think me being on CCS means that you personally get to give me direct orders that I must follow, then you can go be a bitch elsewhere

<b​asses:matrix.org> except footer

no one wants diego’s design, even diego

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> You foubbddd it

except ofrn

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ok geonic cope with it

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I want diego's design

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Diegos design it the same shit as the current one

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I still like my design. :)

<b​asses:matrix.org> Monero need a CEO

<b​asses:matrix.org> hire vik?

<b​asses:matrix.org> lol

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Except its not spaghetti stigs with 20 outdates pages

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> none of that would have happened with a proper Human resource department

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Stringa

ok but he doesn’t? or at least he said he had been swayed

whatever

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I dont lije the hero, didnt like colors. Dont like circles

<b​asses:matrix.org> freedom has always been a problem

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> my deepest conspiracy theory is that genoic actually really cares about my well-being. He stirs this stuff to make sure I hit my hours and there's enough to do.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Remember he even opened a ccs nexr to yours to make sure youd have all the help you need

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> conspiracy but its only one person behind it

I’d hate to see you starve, yes

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> I'm nowhere close to hours on month 2 btw, since I put the design thing on pause for two weeks while we awaited this meeting. Obviously not claiming until I hit hours.

in the beginning of the meeting I asked what the purpose of the redesign is. your best response was that the translation plugin is broken, which is why we need to change backends, and while we’re at it why not refresh the design

is this correct?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> rofl

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> ppl who work on the site should comment

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 1. The content on the site needs to be largely stripped and redone

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> Almost. The response was that people wanted to change backends for several reasons, and thought if we're going to be redoing everything in a new backend anyways, we can do the refresh.

plowsof then said that we’d still be stuck with weblate for translations, so a new backend doesn’t do much to address that

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> 2. The backend change helps with translation

not according to plowsof?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> The current site needs to be rm -rf and tl strings need to be redone

13:02 <@plowsof> translations , even with a new fancy end still rely on >weblate< (the thing that we are unable to keep online or gets neglected and falls out of sync with whats on site)

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> weblate is broken right now

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> speaking of SyntheticBird you get a chance to look?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> New site would use weblate, and would have a fresh start

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> no

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> please send

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> link or screen whatever

<b​asses:matrix.org> ssh

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> what

<b​asses:matrix.org> who will fix and maintain Weblate?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> new website hosted over ssh

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> the current _content_ does not need to be fixed

If anyone is eager to move this forward, why not provide the reasons we need to change backends first, preferably in a github issue, and list the different options with pros and cons for each. Too much work?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> A lot of it is total ass

<b​asses:matrix.org> u said u will take a look at hosting Weblate like a month ago?

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Needs to be rewritten and retranslated

<b​asses:matrix.org> test it out

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Syn did look at it but wasnt able to get it to import iirc. Syn?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I received a dump of the SQL database but then I needed to know what was the major version of Weblate since major versions do not support automatic database migrations. I asked Dan about it, never received an answer to that question + I had other things to do in the grass world.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> got it. Will have Dan respond soon.

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Lots of work. Make it to all meetings and participate next time. Consensus was reached ages ago!

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> But basically there was probably 3 major versions

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> impossible to migrate

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> See? rotten never has anything to add

never

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Diego Salazar: at this point restarting the weblate since like the only option.

<d​iego:cypherstack.com> ye

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Migrating and redoing the content is easier than hoarding the trash and trying to make it work

<b​asses:matrix.org> rm -rf weblate and spin a new instance?

<b​asses:matrix.org> at least export translated files

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> translating garbage english is a bad idea.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> New languag unlocked: Garbage english

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> New language unlocked: Garbage english

lol

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> its been unlocked for yrs

rotten can translate that one

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> OOF

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> cheap shot

<b​asses:matrix.org> whatever William Shakespeare approves

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Siren: quick quick say you like Astro in the chat.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Nono, say you like jekyll /s

I like rust. Can we rewrite wallet2?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> geonic obv this is monero next step

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> translate 1:1 wallet2.cpp 10k spagetthi into rust

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> rust should also be spagetthi

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> in migration we're allergic to improvements

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Syn understands

it’s not monero if it’s not spaghetti

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ofrnxmr next time you call me Syn I'll find you and make you eat your bones pieces by pieces until you have only your head and chest left.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Why's syn so mad

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> idk

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> idk either

actually can we rewrite in python instead? Fcmp’s are easier in python (source: finger on the pulse)

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> i love the source

☝️

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> All these pulses, but when do we get to do mouth to mouth resuscitation

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> I got the paddles

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> r/brandnewsentence

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Sy……..n

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Pulse is getting weaker

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> He's always been like that. 😂

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Moooods!!

<s​iren:kernal.eu> Erm sars it does not matter what framework/lib, just make it easy for our C++ boomer devs to write posts in markdown 🙏

<s​iren:kernal.eu> It's not that hard to code this up, we can do this.

<o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> Siren will take 2-3 more meetings before we can decide. When you say "we", do you mean digilol?