hello lol, i figured out the issue

my server's monero in the package manager was outdated

turns out databases are not backwards compatible

<a​yaansoni:monero.social> Hey guys, if you use Twitter, can you tell me which Monero related account is your favorite?

<p​aranoia_machinery:monero.social> There are lots

<a​yaansoni:monero.social> Well what are the names? :)

rip twitter

<p​aranoia_machinery:monero.social> Search monero and click the people tab, and it will have lots of accounts

<a​yaansoni:monero.social> Yeah but I was looking for some underrated and valuable accounts which are yet to be discovered by the mainstream monero users.

<c​omradeblin:matrix.org> Yep, when i was doing mtopia dev segments it was already off by then.

<c​omradeblin:matrix.org> I mean map

<c​omradeblin:matrix.org> Speaking of which. Does anyone know about a churner/consolidator for IOS?

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Flood is back, are we still pondering over ringsize and fee increase or nobody cares

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> no of txs: 1737, size: 60729.12 kB

It's not a flood. Someone is consolidating a lot of outputs, mempool will clear in ~6 hours

<a​remor:matrix.org> idc

<a​remor:matrix.org> It's a non issue. I wish it would stop getting up voted on reddit

rip reddit

<a​remor:matrix.org> The only interesting thing about this time is that there's reports that it's crashing nodes, which is actually a novel concern.

<a​remor:matrix.org> So I'd pose, how do we encourage users to run their own nodes?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Run monero gui

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Black marble attack is a non issue ? Why are you even using monero

<c​haserene:matrix.org> my full node (modern high-grade hardware) can't get past a certain block from 6 hours ago. it just sits there, and keeps changing its view on what's the chain head (half the time it thinks that it's the actual head, the other half, this block that it's stuck on). restarting doesn't help.

<c​haserene:matrix.org> this block and its neighboring blocks have 3-5 150-in transactions, but that's it. how can this knock out my full node? I'm reading similar reports on Reddit.

huh, xmrchain node rebooted 4 hrs ago. i guess it can't handle the load. hooray daemon management.

<g​ingeropolous:monero.social> chaser, try popping blocks. i thought the daemon auto popped in cases like this but i guess it doesn;t

P2Pool's node is working just fine

<a​remor:matrix.org> It's a huge non issue because it doesn't work

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Wrong, effective ringsize drops

<a​remor:matrix.org> Drops but doesn't drop enough

<a​remor:matrix.org> People are panicking for no reason

<a​remor:matrix.org> It's annoying

<a​remor:matrix.org> Plus the solution is in the works. People need to stop screaming chicken little

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> boohoo

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> we have a path to FCMPs within 12 months

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> How much do you wanna bet ? We won’t have that on mainnet in 12 months

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> this is spearheaded by kayaba

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> It drops enough for eae eabe

<3​21bob321:monero.social> I dont think it will be 12 months

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Needs 5 seperate audits?

when is anything at or before its estimated time?

meanwhile yesterday kataye said it is so far going quicker than he expected

and some auditors have already been contacted

so it will be ready soon™ lolol

bottom line is it will be ready as quickly as possible, assuming it works which I would bet it will

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> So ? Is he super human ?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> at best it drops enough to be supporting evidence, nothing you can build a case on :P

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> based on my observations they certainly have super human work ethic

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Still not doable in 12 months

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> kayaba estimated 6 months for the implementation

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Do you want to bet ? For a 12 month mainnet ?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> id bet that the implementation is ready and maybe even audited within 12 months but mainnet is a bit ambitious since forks have a minimum 6 month headsup

<a​remor:matrix.org> While the noobs scream their heads off

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> So 18 months? Let’s bet on that?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i dont gamble

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> So don’t give estimate time frame which you can’t predict

<a​remor:matrix.org> Yes

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> we still have a realistic path to FCMPs in a pretty short timeframe

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> And we should have a fork in the meantime and not keep users exposed

<a​remor:matrix.org> People must be very bored and looking for something to panic about

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the earliest we can have a fork is 6 months from now

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> That’s fine

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> forks are a much larger disruption than the spam

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> So you won’t fix it because there is a disruption?

well it will take anything 6 months to hardfork once implemented

anything

<a​remor:matrix.org> They don't care. They'd rather panic

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Sounds like bitcoin

<a​remor:matrix.org> If only there was something to fix

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> no, im saying if we wait a bit longer we fix ringsigs for good

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> indeed

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> 24

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> a winner's coin

<3​21bob321:monero.social> I wonder what serai gets out of fcmp research

a better monero?

I had that thought as well but ....

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> more delays

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> fcmp is a big job. kayaba will have to choose one or the other

oh look who's back

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Back again

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Shady’s back tell a friend

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> twitter got boring no one was replying to my posts

lol

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Speaking into the void linux

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> speaking into dev null

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> kayaba works on a ton of shit simultaneously

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oinist.org/HRokeKGeUJOcWDmaodNYTwgM

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> keep coping

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> not being targeted by monero community

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> kayaba is human not a robot. if he tries to work simultaneously he will look like the xmr/btc chart

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> bitcoin had a tiny bit of privacy tech when that chart was a thing

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/nvxRntPeNEIKKPAZUfQmjHEW

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> this is what the chart looks like ever since samourai was knocked down

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> monero has failed its economic purpose

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> this might very well be the point of reversal

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> serves a good experiment for applying cryptography, that is all

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> don't view monero as an investment. there's no "reversal"

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> sure thing buddy

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> we will see about that

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> and don't be surprised if xmr goes to 0 and bitcoin keeps trending higher

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> maxis were right

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> kek

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> to ZERO

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> seethe

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> almost there in btc terms ;)

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> literally no

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/fXQmyBdqHDlkmubORUNdkOgs

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/mlciCrgPJJFoEAizmZwXSIbg

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/JMvGnCbCJEZWfLgNMjvlUeUf

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/NZsXGxSARmYsizyiRhluZFff

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> lets move this to offtopic

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> CHART

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> LOOK

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> CHART GO UP

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> ALL YOUR ARGUMENTS MOOT

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> HAHAH

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> click max

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> click max and send the screenshot

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> bagholder syndrome at its finest

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> stop being emotionally connected to what is meant to be an experiment for digital cash, nothing more

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/QpldwBZXJLjYhLuKqLXbOigq

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i'm biased? of the 10 years xmr has existed, you choose to show price history for a week

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> oh the irony. don't bully maxis

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i choose to show the timeframe in which bitcoin has no real privacy anymore

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> you don't even see yourself being one

Bitcoin has real privacy?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i don't care about btc. i'm just giving you some realism from your monero echochamber

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> it had "real" privacy when samourai was still among us

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> all cryptocurrency has failed

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> and will never succeed economically

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> monero works exactly as intented

Idk how it has failed, I pay for some goods in it that I cannot pay for otherwise without fees and a fear of being scammed.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> bitcoin is no exception

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> p2p digital cash

ye

Not without flaw, but it is the closest we got.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> don't take what you have now for granted

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> xmr will be regulated to oblivion, for good reasons

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> blah balh

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> xmr needs to be regulated

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> blah blah

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> and the whole cryptocurrency market too

You just cannot regulate its use fully.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> come and try regulate

You would not be able to prohibit people from using it)

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i'm not a regulator, just someone in the know within that space

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> they will come slowly

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> keep living in your pipedreams, we can't allow an attack on freedom to run freely. cryptocurrency is a sham

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> and people will willingly accept cbdcs

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> other than bitcoin, monero is actually designed to be as resistant as possible

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> no one is going to use monero. it's just a nerd's project, a hobby on the side with interesting tech. don't get overinvested

They can't even shut down huge drug markets, how would they do that to a whole currency?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> We have bigger issues

Lol

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> im already getting rekt by the feds ponzi

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> there is no "fed" ponzi

2008soon, hobby project that pays for digital things I use daily.

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Make mattix.org and monero.social work

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> there is and it's the retirement scheme im paying 45% of my wages

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> there is and it's the retirement scheme im paying 45% of my wages into

<a​remor:matrix.org> A wild troll has appeared

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> it by definition a pyramid scheme

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> how will monero help you in this scenario? if you live in a democracy, go out and protest or argue for change

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the democracy is fucked

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> investing into a nerd's project won't do anything

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Makes you feel warm and fuzzy

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you cant protest a retirement pyramid scheme via democratic process if the majority of people are retired

YOU live in a democracym

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i'm not sure what propaganda is being funneled into you

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> but democracy is not fucked, it still works

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> im not in the US

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> where i am, democracy is very much fucked. at least from this angle

<a​remor:matrix.org> Who is that person?

I am not either, and democracy does not exist here. Monero is pretty much my freedom, exactly like cash.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> if you live in europe, by the time this "system" implodes there will be revolution or something similar

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> monero won't do anything

Revuo Monero Issue 194: April 18 - 25, 2024. revuo-xmr.com/issue-194.html

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the only revolution that happens here is the introduction of sharia law

<a​remor:matrix.org> Wasabi is bigger actually

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> wasabi also works together with chainalysis

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> get off whatever propaganda you're listening to. it's harmfu

2008soon, Monero might be helpful as long as there is internet connection.

<b​asses:matrix.org> 2008soon fuckoff

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Did wasabi leave merica too?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> my propaganda comes from the federal bureau of statistics

2008soon, what propaganda? Wat?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> sharia law in europe?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> sounds like propaganda to me

<3​21bob321:monero.social> And hawalla network

guys, what are you doing? lol

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Monero intergration

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you talked about revolution

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> its the most likely revolution if there will be any

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Talking shit

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> religion is not as powerful as you think

No revolt is ever happening here either...

<o​cean:matrix.thisisjoes.site> plz do not feed the troll

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> revolution isnt the point

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the point is that theres a massive pyramid scheme

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> money reigns superior. if people and their pockets are hurting to the point where your income is 45% taxed for a long time, there will be revolution against that

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Mini mod !

People have tolerated worse things.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> lol no

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> most people are too retarded to even realize how much they are taxed

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> not in the us. read on the boston tea party

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> because they made up this great concept of "employer contribution"

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> alright lets get back to monero

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> "oh yeah your employer pays half of that tax, not you"

Idk how it happens, it is some sort of social science which is even more boring than biology, so not even going near it.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> how will it help in this situation?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> it can and will only get worse here

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i can guarantee you they will squeeze everything as hard as possible

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> you do realize that if everyone moves to monero, this will be regulated and then a revolution would have to take place in response?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i'm not sure where monero is relevant in all this

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> "oh, you have 10k in the bank? sorry, the retirement scheme you paid 1/4 of your money into for the last 40 years is imploding and you wont get anything back unless your networth is literally zero"

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> once again, how is monero relevant?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you tell me genius

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> truth is, it isn't

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i enjoy mindless banter but if youre going to completely ignore my points then its not fun

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i can tell you've been active here for a long time, probably too caught up into it. but from what you're telling me, don't invest into monero. don't view it as cash or an investment. it's just applied cryptography, a fun project that attempts to follow cypherpunk ideology. it will not help you in your scenario because you're not giving me an answer

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> and that's telling

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> what

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> ?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> how did you get that 10k into monero?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> either cex or p2p. if p2p, then that person would have to log the transaction and pay taxes on it. then the government has a reference point. it still can be tracked regardless

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> currently? sepa instant deposit to kraken. in the future? haveno/serai

<b​asses:matrix.org> yes

<p​cre:monero.social> Monero is relevant precisely because it addresses significant concerns with privacy and fungibility in cryptocurrency.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> kraken takes logs and sends it all to your country's taxation office. they will still come for your monero

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you see

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the nice thing about monero

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you dont know if i spend all of it on cocaine or save it

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i agree with this relevant case, but I don't think monero is relevant as cash in practice or an investment as a safe haven. it's just a fun project to me

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> so you can only spend it on drugs or save it for more drugs later? how is that useful? you need a circular economy to develop, if this gets big enough, guess who steps in?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> ah yes because you can only spend monero on drugs

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> moneromarket, monerica, i've seen it all

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> it's nothing big

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Sex,drugs and rock n roll

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> then you know i could go to my local supermarket and buy stuff with a giftcard, bought with monero, right?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> and places like moneromarket are subject to regulation like ebay

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> this is temporary. these types of services are classified as money transmitters and WILL be regulated

<p​cre:monero.social> While Monero may not have achieved the same level of mainstream adoption as more established cryptocurrencies, it does have real-world use cases beyond just being a "fun project." Monero is actively used by individuals and organizations who prioritize privacy in their transactions, including activists, journalists, businesses, and individuals living under oppressive regimes. For t<clipped message>

<p​cre:monero.social> hese users, Monero isn't just a novelty; it's a tool for preserving freedom and autonomy.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> yeah because the regulatooors will some for the giftcard shop registered in the virgin islands

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> yeah because the regulatooors will come for the giftcard shop registered in the virgin islands

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> or the one hosted on tor

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> look at bitrefill as an example. once it got popular with btc, it was regulated with kyc

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> and yet we have coinsbee

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> or coincards

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> or all the other sites

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> all temporary. those who manage these projects will face jail time if they don't comply, you can't profit off avoiding the law

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> bro they cant even reliably take down CSAM vendors which are arguably the worst people around

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> from my research, all other "established" cryptocurrencies have laughable rates of "adoption". monero may be useful in these niche cases you list with activists, but for individuals under oppressive regimes, it can still be vulnerable to compliance

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> archetype has 420k users

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> ^

<c​haser:monero.social> thank you. should I submit an issue or is this a known problem?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> all i'm hearing are ILLEGAL examples. either money transmitters operating outside appropriate AML/KYC laws, darknet marketplaces or avoiding taxes

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i credit pcre for mentioning the activist example, monero can also be useful for niche cases like donations

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i missed that with what i was saying before

Also when you're under blanket sanctions.

The things I spend on are fully legal, for example.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> illegal examples surviving under scrutiny shows that you are safe when using it for regular transfers

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> example: meat gets banned

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> for regular transfers, I can use a credit card or normal ways of paying

monerobull, true)

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you can use monero to buy meat and assume you are safe if the crack dealer can use it to stay safe

<p​cre:monero.social> I recently ordered a special vodka from Russia and paid with Monero to avoid the sanctions. Shipping is a bit more expensive because it's delivered via Romania, but it works.

Or also doing things that are legal today but might be illegal tomorrow - abortion-related things in some places come to mind.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> yes this is so realistic. come up with contrived examples like bitcoiners. oh but we're saving third world countries who use cryptocurrency! you're not here for these reasons

2008soon, unless said card is not working from your country.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i am very much here because the old system is a fucking joke

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> wait for cbdcs, there was a recent survey by a european bank and the acceptance rate was 87% iirc

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> i learned that when they turned off they buy button on stocks

I am here because the system, while working for most cases, failed some people - me included.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> this will be the new system and it's not as bad as you think. cbdcs are the future

2008soon, a lot depends on how a poll was conducted tho

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> those numbers were misrepresented

Oh, you're a troll. Lol.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the EU also did a study where 90% of people ranked privacy of a cbdc as #1 priority

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> they then proceeded to ignore that study

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> a cbdc WILL be private

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> this information is already available if you look hard enough

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> yeah yeah

<p​cre:monero.social> It will be interesting when the adult industry discovers Monero. Porn, webcams and hookers.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> it already has and was not successful

<t​ermox:matrix.org> Isn't taxation without representation illegal? Or is it okay now.

pcre, haven't they already? I would be surprised if they didn't. Don't watch this shit tbh.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> pornhub already accepts it but nobody actually pays for that unless they are too far gone already

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> 1/3 of my taxes go to the retirement pyramid that already takes 1/4 of my wages

Why would you pay for Pornhub? I understnd paying models for "commissions", but for mass-produced content?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> with predictions that this rises to 50% by 2035

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> seriously this propaganda is getting out of hand. who do you think works for building cbdcs? it's not an evil monster. banks will have our best interest in mind because it will be profitable. if users want privacy, central banks will give privacy in exchange for higher adoption rates, better implementation of mt and tracking economic stats anonymously in aggregate. cbdcs will be extremely useful

I honestly don't care about the taxation thing, I just want to pay for some things fter the bank system has failed me.

We should stop feeding the troll btw.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> lol

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i'm just sick of this misinformation about cbdcs

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the central bank doesnt give a shit about you, it can just force cbdcs on you

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> none of you even know how they work

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> yet you speak so highly and confidently

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> no, the central bank is independent of the government. they can't force anything

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> stop printing cash, only print cbdcs

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> its literally that easy

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> once again a commonality between monero delusionals and bitcoiners is a lack of understanding economics

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you trying to say that the central bank cant let cash die out if they want to?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> they won't need to let cash die out. people will love cbdcs

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> except a minority of paranoid people like you

<r​ucknium:monero.social> 2008soon: AFAIK no CBDC design is dominant. So there is no universal way that they work. I am interested in any sources for your claim of 87% CBDC acceptance.

<b​asses:matrix.org> stop

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i will now

<r​ucknium:monero.social> I am interested in any CBDC data.

<b​asses:matrix.org> monero.town/post/3010283

<b​asses:matrix.org> >This may be a historical moment, Monero TX fee is higher than BTC

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> thats not the cost of getting into the next block though, right?

<r​ucknium:monero.social> rando: Probably that's not the fee for a normal tx. That is the fee for a 150 input transaction of about 100 KB

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> only the median of all fees paid which is distorted by the 140 in transactions

<r​ucknium:monero.social> since those txs are filling the mempool now

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Morning!

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Look like the usual asshole having fun again!

<p​cre:monero.social> "Some say this sudden increase in transaction volume is the result of Bitcoiners fleeing into Monero after the recent publicity proving that No-KYC Bitcoin use is de-facto illegal.

<p​cre:monero.social> I choose to believe this regardless of whether it’s true or not. 😁" LOL

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> i appreciate the responses

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> That was directed about the pile of 146+/2 in the mempool, not you

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> That was directed agains the pile of 146+/2 in the mempool, not you

pcre, this would've been hilarious

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Yeah, if only it was a mix of 1/2 and 2/2 or things like 1/123 (exchange sending)

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> But it's 146+/2 so just usual asshole :(

<t​ermox:matrix.org> Cope-nero.

<a​r-:abga.be> Does that mean that someone is spamming the blockchain with needless transactions ?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> It's kind of digesting slowly at least, maybe he is done

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oad/xmr.mx/TpejikStQazDuPsrKBOhunTb

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> yep

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> pretty sure it can't really be any normal use. Not for that amounts of consolidation TX.

<a​r-:abga.be> Perhaps a bigger p2pool miner moving the coins away from his mining wallet.

<t​ermox:matrix.org> By over filling the nodes, as they drop off, couldn't you get some network info from there. Like how tor sites get overloaded until they drop off and then get corrolated to changes somewhere else near the same times stamp.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> that is actually easy to confirm or infirm, please wait

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> not from p2pool miner

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> not really

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> its too random for that

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> my memory was off, I was thinking about a different paper unrelated to consumer willingness to use cbdcs. the real figure is around 75% after a year:

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> m.guardtime.com/files/CBDC_research.pdf

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I work in the industry and privacy is a great concern. CBDCs will be private OR will subsidize access to data by central banks with annual payments, like free $30 per year to spend. consumers have positively reacted to this

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oinist.org/QbCirpNjrjnygOAZFlOECbcq

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oinist.org/bhrzlqxNWMgQpnECbmcLqsDB

<m​atrix975:matrix.org> this increase in trasaction volume could be a stress test from wealthy pockets. They're likely accumulating Monero for themselves and possibly pressured exchanges that delisted XMR sell to their holdings to them with the threat of legal scrutiny. Possibly a bot is doing the accumulation of any XMR sale from various sources.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> lol, cbdc scam

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Privacy will be only agains other slaves, it will be transparent for the owners/admins

<m​atrix975:matrix.org> this increase in trasaction volume could be a stress test from wealthy pockets. They're likely accumulating Monero for themselves and possibly pressured exchanges that delisted XMR to sell to their holdings to them with the threat of legal scrutiny. Possibly a bot is doing the accumulation of any XMR sale from various sources.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> its only really beneficial if you are trying to pinpoint a server location

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> wrong. a simple argument against this is that politicians and the very people who use these cbdcs will want privacy too

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> there is still ongoing research into how privacy can be implemented, banks haven't found a method yet. that's why I'm here doing my own research :)

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> read a guide for running the optimal DNM once and it mentioned taking your site down on purpose in random intervals to make it harder to correlate with real outages

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> So how that will work if they want to audit people?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> it could work similar to monero with viewkeys

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> it wont

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> What if I send my wallet in space?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> current system is already more transparent

monerobull, lol, there are guides for that?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> they wont give that up

<m​atrix975:matrix.org> So how that will work if they want to audit people?

<m​atrix975:matrix.org> they audit the poor, monero is for them to avoid audits and taxation

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> what if you light all your cash on fire?

<m​onerobull:monero.social> bluey: of course. it was mainly about showing how hard it actually is to run one. title was something like "oh so you want to become a darknet kingpin?"

ah lol that one

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> listen, I have experience in this space and you don't. I'm not sure where this rumor has spread about CBDCs and it seems to only serve the interest of cryptocurrency investors. CBDCs will be provably private

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> You know what I mean, what if they can't get access to the wallet. How they are going to get the view key

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Right now, banks, you just have to present them with mandate or things like that and you can get access to infos

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> is that why the EU just voted for a 3000€ cash limit?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I can't say anything more but a cbdc will likely not be a cryptocurrency

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> because they just love people to be free and everything?

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> it's too inefficient

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> oh so the cash limit is for efficiency and not surveillance? that makes total sense!

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> especially if you consider all the other erosions of privacy they are voting for

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> to prevent money laundering, yes

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> sooooo... surveillance?

<r​ucknium:monero.social> 2008soon: Specifically which industry do you work in? Anyway, here is some of my analysis of how cryptocurrency can help people with low access to formal banking: rucknium.me/posts/financial-margina…ization-and-cryptocurrency-payments

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Sooo, how they would prevent laundering if it's private... oh, wait, it will be totally transparent for them lol, privacy only again low slave

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> id argue a cash limit makes it way more resource intensive to investigate cash-based money laundry

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I don't want to dox myself too much because I have a lot of haters here, but I think you can get a general idea

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> tax auditing. this is already a thing with cash?

rucknium, not just the poors! Sanctioned people too. Now it is just quality-of-life for me, but might be vital soon.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> now you got a guy going to 10 different locations and buying 2000€ stuff instead of them buying a handful of 10k€ things

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> this limit is only imposed on anonymous transactions. if you provide identification for these purchases, you don't have to abide by this limit

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Yeah but if they don't have access to the digits

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> And you shotgun everyone entering your place to get the view key.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Cash is an excellent launder tool afaik

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Banks do laundering to for themself or high network customers (at least HSBC did) 😂

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> even if you KYC there is a 10k€ limit

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> the limit is perfectly fine. for groceries, etc. you can purchase whatever you want anonymously. bigger items like a car and house already require identification

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> yeah, nice scam indeed

Also a ton of laundering occurs in the traditional bank system as well, probably most of it)

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> aka you will have to kyc if youre ballin and want to buy that 15k€ mega tv at the electronics store

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> scratch that

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> you cant even buy that tv with cash

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> so much for legal tender

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> there is nothing wrong with this

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> What about people that are totally out of the system?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> that you need a bank account to spend your legally earned and taxed money?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> They won't want back in I assume, else they would be already in or would not have exited

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> there is NOTHING wrong with that?

<b​asses:matrix.org> cuz KYC doesnt work

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> use of cash has declined significantly

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oinist.org/dDGyJQPQyPspvEhuMQBjWiJa

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> oh yeah then we can just ban it completely!

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> why bother with a limit?

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> too much burden

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> lol, no idea where there stats come from.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> But it's been over 10 years I did not see a single cheque

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> And everyone use cash, only 1/3 of the place accept the platic stuff

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I agree for people who are unbanked there are issues but by the time CBDCs will be fully implemented, this is approx 2030 by current estimates, we hope that people have better access to internet connections, etc. to use CBDCs

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> from the research paper I linked above...

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> ive been waiting for them to install fiber here for 4 years now...

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> everyone here have internet but there still not using even plastic lol

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> we SIGNED 4 years ago

you wont be allowed to use cdbcs if you have an opinion though

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> don't be surprised if a CBDC looks similar to monero, but has centralized systems in place to maintain compliance

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> no, that's false and misinformation

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> So they won't be able to lock you're money?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Canada already did that to there people not so long ago, I don't think they will relinguish that privilege

<r​ucknium:monero.social> I have seen a lot of research papers that try to use Monero as a base and then make it traceable with a master key basically. Papers are in moneroresearch.info

I am so glad I use cash everywhere!

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> I even use cash to buy on Aliexpress and Temu 😂

People recognizing the importance of it give me hope. I hope to one day close my bank account for good - I know for sure some jobs pay in cash)

ravfx, gift cards?

Overall I avoid online stores where you have to prepay, with very rare exceptions.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> thanks for linking this!

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Naaa, press checkout, choose cash, save qr code, go pay at random convenient store

This is a thing? Never encountered)

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> It's a thing in Latin America

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> because people use cash

<r​ucknium:monero.social> There are many other Monero-related papers there. The search function needs to be fixed. The search basically does "OR" instead of "AND" when you put in multiple words. The latest version of the software fixed it, but we haven't updated yet.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> if a CBDC was implemented and operated exactly like XMR, except that a central bank can access your transaction history, only with extreme cases such as suspicion of ill use with proof from law enforcement, sunbonnet, etc., or in aggregate (anonymized data) for macroeconomic indicators for mt would you use it? you funds can't be locked and you will be able to spend it everywhere l<clipped message>

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> ike cash with the previous exception

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> ahh, I hate that kind of broken search thing.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> It's like mercadolibre search function 😂

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> nop

ravfx, keep up the good habits there, guys!

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> this is likely what a CBDC will look like, with potentially a bonus of getting paid as an incentive for the data you offer

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> I already exited the scam system over 7 years ago, don't even have a bank account lol

BASED.

<a​remor:matrix.org> Yes. After the SW arrest.

I need it for uni stipend now, and for paying a tutor. But hope to close it one day.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I don't think this is possible in any western or european country

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Indeed, you need to move to an actually free country for that.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> CA/US/EU too far gone

First - I am not there. Second - enough jobs pay in cash, and it is actually possible to live cash-only.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I wouldn't call these countries free, but rather delayed with their laws. once western/european countries implement a CBDC, so will the country you live in

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I wouldn't call these countries free, but rather delayed with their laws/policy. once western/european countries implement a CBDC, so will the country you live in

Like, you have to register when renting by law - yet to my knowlege, most tenants and landlords don't ever bother with this. If they cannot get rid of living unregistered, they cannot get rid of paying for this in cash either.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Lot of peoples will endup beheaded if they where trying to force that scam in here

based

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> not if the right incentives are in place

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> what even is your point

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> El Salvador is a good example of attempting to implement a CBDC-like system, but the incentives offered failed

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> No one trust the state with money, like that's the minority, it's why there using cash.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> a CBDC wont fix that

monerobull, nah, don't feed a troll. I am holding on from doing that.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I've read lots of points in favor of cryptocurrency ECONOMICALLY and I'm just voicing my concerns for those who are heavily invested in projects like xmr. these projects will fail, without a doubt. while I marvel at the technology being used and I would expect this to improve, my point here is to say don't expect xmr to be a viable option for worldwide cash use. from my perspectiv<clipped message>

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> e working in an industry that is close with regulating this type of stuff, xmr won't survive, unless you're using it for niche cases

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I also like to educate people about what CBDCs will likely be implemented, not the misinformation commonly spread

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Nigeria is also a nice example

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> if you live in a country with a corrupt state, cash or metals will always serve as a better option for barter

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> There all corrupt, just different way and at different level

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> trust is all central banks are about and this is the resource they need most. if a central bank is not trusted, then anything, from mt to a CBDC, will fail

When is the central bank even trusted? All it can use is force, on which the govt has monopoly.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> all centralized systems are corrupt to some level, yes, but the best we can do is reduce this level to the lowest possible. I think monero is a good example of trust with the CCS and previous bad actors in the community. we are humans after all and every interaction requires some level of trust

<r​ucknium:monero.social> I don't know what the economic case for CBDCs is. How does it increase economic efficiency, etc.? I haven't looked to hard, but I have looked. Frankly I also question why central banks want to add another variable to a complex system when they didn't handle COVID-related inflation well. If they don't understand the system now, why make it more complicated?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Well, current banking system is slow af, especially for tx between juridictions

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> inter banks system in my country : instant

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> try to get money from bank in some western country, two days, including week end

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> inter banks system in my country : instant

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> try to get money from bank in some western country, two days, excluding week end

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Crypto obsoleted that.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> So the admin have to fix it so they can at least get thet right

and still ppl prefer to stick with bitch ass banks instead of migrating to crypto

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> It's hard to migrate to crypto now, in most place

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> I can buy monero without kyc at the convenience store but it's not the case for any western/euro country

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> now they have KYC everything and some of them have also limite (in quantity or X coins banned)

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> from the top of my head:

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> - speed/efficiency => current credit card systems are costly

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> - equality and inclusion => for the unbanked, CBDCs is an alternative to cash, but will be available for purchasing items online. there will be no need of a bank account

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> - monetary policy => tracking macroeconomic data like money supply, inflation and other factors will be easier than ever. this is one of the most important things needed and the benefits of implementing mt with correct data has substantial benefits

<b​asses:matrix.org> any country*

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> so it's a pain for normies to get crypto (in US/CA/EU)

convenience store prolly has cameras with facial recognition so there's non-consensual kyc

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> It's not an alternative to cash, for a thing, I have to be in the system to use it

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> it's won't be permissionless

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> this system will be heavily regulated in western/european nations. I'm not sure about your country and I can understand if there is mistrust for using such a CBDC then

Yea, and then they get the taste of power and go all in, not even bothering with lube anymore

great_taste, you can hide the face tho. Or buy from a person instead of store.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> 2008, we are also not trying to be the global cash replacement

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> it won't happen, this power trip you speak of, but I understand the fear surrounding it. by the time cbdcs come along, we can expect a high rate of adoption though and this will happen no matter your opinion. I'm just providing well-backed research on the topic

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> monero is already 100% doing what its supposed to do

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Monero is supposed to be the extension of cash, but online

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> and it works as such

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> It work fine imo.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> even when asshole spamming the network

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I conflated the goals of btc and xmr for a moment there. xmr as cash does currently work with all the hurdles, but I think this will be too difficult to use compared to cbdcs (which will offer privacy) in the future

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> yeah and the spam helped push forward the move to fcmps

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> and pointed out some issues

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> there are many smart people working on cbdcs

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> cbdcs will offer "privacy"

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> and they are working in your best interest, no matter what you think

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> not a criminal allowing interest, but one for freedom and privacy

heh

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> sound like a scam

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> even if it wont be abused in the beginning, a few years down the line the power that comes with control over a cbdc will 100% be abused

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> the state working in your best interest 😂

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> the definition of "criminal" can be changed quite easily

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> you'd be surprised at who is working for the "state", more specifically central banks, right now. lots of contributors in cryptocurrency are getting involved

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> they abuse surveillance tech left and right already. stuff implemented to catch pedos is used to track small time pot dealers

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> we even have regular ass cops using that nightmare tech to stalk their exes

traitors

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> please don't confuse the government and central banks. these are separate entities, for a good reason. if the law is changed, that is an issue with the government, not a CBDC, and in the case where you're suspected of a criminal, it would have to be upheld with evidence in court before any "threat" is posed to your CBDC money

great_taste: indeed.

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> did the truckers in canada go through a trial before their money was taken?

Governments and central banks are the exact same entity in my opinion. Under different disguises

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I wouldn't call them traitors, but people who have finally come to their senses. I thank everyone who has worked in cryptocurrency and banks are actually happy about it since all this research is helpful for developing a safe, private CBDC

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Naaa, money just gone (bitcorn) lol

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Or frozen (bank)

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I'm going to stop now as I don't like arguing politics. that's not my job here

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> lmao

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> "the justice system will prevent abuse"

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> "they already abuse it"

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> "uhm actually ill stop talking here"

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Imajin not be able to transact when the grid/net go down

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Or when random chinese hacker find a way to cause issue to one of these CBDC blockchain, like halting it for a week, would be so funny

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> But anyway, all of that might no append, it only take a few Nato troop in eastern europe and it's going to cancel all of that

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I highly recommend checking out bis.org for unbiased information on CBDC development and research or, even better, contribute your efforts by applying on the careers page for the bis or your relevant central bank, they will likely have positions opened for CBDC related work if you have the experience

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I'll end it at that

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> And ill end it at "Absolute power corrupts absolutely"

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> and also: youre nitpicking and biased. i win. bye bye.

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> despite what many of you think, I'm here to help you

<b​asses:matrix.org> nah, terrorists

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> it may take time for you to understand but I can wait

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> They all say that

are you getting paid to spread cbdc propaganda?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> "I'm here to help you"

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> no I'm just giving opportunities in the field for those interested

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I heard CCS payments are not reliable as of late

heh "I'm from the government and I'm here to help"

great_taste: xD

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> I've heard they raised 350k in 2 days last week

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> the grants given for CBDC research are quite the amount, that's all I'll say

you're delusional to think you're going to convert any of us

there are two types of people in a monero chat: hardcore libertarians and feds

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> right now, it won't happen. eventually, just know that there are opportunities available. I'm not trying to convert anyone

<m​onerobull:matrix.org> The grants given for bike lanes in Peru are 350 million euros, so what

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> I can't be a fed, I'm too unprofessional. I'm just an employee who works in a related field

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> to what I discuss

<2​008soon:bitcoinist.org> it's all fun, don't take it seriously! use this as a learning experience if anything

great_taste, you forgot another type: just a normie failed by their banking system)

<o​rban.1:matrix.org> Any idea when the the xmr congestion will be cleared up?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> <10MB remaining

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> ~1HR and it should be all digested

<c​haser:monero.social> is this the best room for getting help with monerod, or is there a better one?

<c​haser:monero.social> by using `pop_blocks 100`, my node is syncing again, but the sync is very slow (almost as good as not syncing at all), and surprisingly monerod doesn't make use of the devices immense resources (it consumes only 300 MB RAM, 0--1% CPU). I noticed I have only 2-3 outgoing connections, which I tried to improve on by restarting monerod with multiple `--add-priority-node=` options, but<clipped message>

<c​haser:monero.social> this didn't help either my sync issue or my note count. any ideas what's going on here?

<o​rban.1:matrix.org> I still have a transaction that hasn't cleared . hopefully soon

<b​asses:matrix.org> twitter.com/zooko/status/1786067258852233245

<b​asses:matrix.org> >2) Monero transactions aren’t really private in some, possibly most, cases. Its current privacy protections are fragile and have failed to protect users in real life many times. The Monero devs know this and are working on upgrading it to Zcash’s level.

<b​asses:matrix.org> >2 cont’d) All blockchains including purely transparent ones are vulnerable to counterfeiting attacks. Counterfeiting attacks have succeeded on mainnet against Stellar, Firo, Bytecoin, and Bitcoin! Security is hard. Zcash’s security is the best.

<b​asses:matrix.org> Zcash dev claiming Monero is not private

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> According to mempool data, it should have cleared by now

<o​rban.1:matrix.org> Just cleared now. Thx

To me this looks carefully and artfully crafted to incite controversy. Whoever wants may bite. If you do try not to attract too much shame and ridicule on Monero

oh look, it's zooko bashing monero again,

the guy that said this "And by the way, I think we can successfully make Zcash too traceable for criminals like WannaCry, but still completely private & fungible."

looks like this channel had a spam attack while I was gone :D

To be honest, for a sensitive usecase I find it unwise to depend just on one tool anyway, like XMR bought on a KYC exchange. XMR's protection here, buying carefully and KYCless there, making your payment through Tor too... And so on. I cannot estimate hoe safe Monero is, but would never treat it as fully safe.

Very relieving to have a low threat model, but fun to learn about this) About to download some docs on Monero and learn more about its mechanicms)

<p​cre:monero.social> I bought Monero for a friend. 1000$ kyc-fee every day for a week. It is fun to have money for once.

I buy mine for cash too because I am scared of using my card online)

<p​cre:monero.social> Yes - I like cash too.

I pretty much only use cash with few exceptions (like how I had to order a part that was very specific and needed prepaying). :)

<p​cre:monero.social> Good attitude.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> I hate "prepaying"

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Always endup with "leftovers"

<p​cre:monero.social> I try to pay a lot with cash.

ravfx, wdym leftovers? I don't usually use the "wallets" on sites.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Fortunately I can order online at most place with cash, not the case for western/EU place

When ordering online, which is by itself rare, I usually pay cash upon reception in the office.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> I tought you where talking about prepaid credit card

Ah, we don't have those here sadly.

<p​cre:monero.social> You might consider to pay in Bitcoin/Monero online.

Well... I did see obe offering, but it could only be bought with another card, which is better than nothing but so gross that I opted out.

<p​cre:monero.social> Shopinbit here in Europe

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Can't buy with bitcorn or monero at all locations

pcre, not always available. I do pay for some services in them, indeed.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> shipinbit is EU only except for there concierge service, I think

I am so thankful it exists because I have a server and a domain now) Although for a domain, I might have to swap into LTC or something, because sadly XMR is rare amobg registrars.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> For IT stuff it's pretty much available.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> plenty of place to get servers/vpn/internet stuff with crypto

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> and site like Newegg accept btc too

<p​cre:monero.social> @BlueyHealer We should become online retailers ourselves.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Try buying scientific equipement using Monero or even Bitcoin... Have fun!

ravfx, yes!! I do just that! The XMR VPSes are more common than domains though.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Not going to stock up on expensive scientific equipement for a micro chance of someone buying my stuff before it become obsolete.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Sadly, It's why we have concierge services, but they charge a premium for that

I am still searching for a "proper" registrar.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Namesilo work

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> you can pay with shitcoin (bitpay)

What is consierge? Here it means the person who sits on the entrance of an apartment building)

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Someone who buy the expensive thing for you and forward it to you

ravfx, some others, like Porkbun, accept BTC too - but I hope to find XMR because BTC's fees would be too much for a very small payment like this.

<p​reland:matrix.org> I kinda want to make a “Monero price index” that will regularly check the current market conditions for different commodities and Monero

Bitpay?

<p​reland:matrix.org> Cuz I don’t think people really realize how bad/undervalued many parts of the eco there are

Apparently LTC, which I have also seen, is lightet on fees at least, but idk.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> It's a payment processor

Caveats with that?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> When XMR is not accepted, I just use Tron

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Faster and cheaper than ltc

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> and accepted pretty much everywhere

Only seen Tron mentioned here. Never sae accepted.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> But LTC work too

saw

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> look for TRX/Tron on payment processor, most of them accept it

<p​cre:monero.social> I use BCH/BTC or LTC if no XMR is supported.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Trx fee like less than 10 cents or something

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> and TX is ~instant

<p​reland:matrix.org> I think a lot of the issues with using crypto atm is that everything isn’t “priced” in that crypto; the commodity is actually priced in fiat

Oh, nice, lines up with what I have seen, ravfx

preland, I prefer it this way tbu

tbh

<p​reland:matrix.org> Like image if you went to the store and a 5 pound bag of apples cost ~3.58405729958 USD

<p​reland:matrix.org> Not only is that weird, it would also be exhausting to have to deal with weird pricing like that *constantly*

Idk, mine just takes the price corresponding to fiat.

<p​reland:matrix.org> Also note the “~”: as prices are unstable, it makes it very difficult to trust the true value of your own currency

<p​reland:matrix.org> Wait, is there something to panic about? I love panicking! /j

I thought newegg stopped accepting btc years ago

I wish Steam accepted it directly.

it as in XMR

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> At least can get steam card but it's anoying to use

<p​cre:monero.social> I'm thinking about selling wine for XMR. I live in a wine region here and know the producers.

Lol nice.

<p​cre:monero.social> For you without tax @ BlueyHealer.

I want to be either a seamstress (in perspective), repairman or English tutor for XMR.

<p​cre:monero.social> XD

<p​reland:matrix.org> The issue is that Monero must be able to stand on its own as an independent currency (otherwise it becomes a glorified mixer), and in order to be independent it has to have *some* level of price stability relative to goods and services.

<p​reland:matrix.org> (Btw I won’t be able to respond for a few hours after this cuz I’m entering my Faraday cage)

:)

<p​cre:monero.social> Don't get into debt guys.

<p​cre:monero.social> All with a sense of proportion

Why bring up debt?

<b​asses:matrix.org> njal.la and incognet.io (heard they are very expensive when renewal) they are domain proxy registeration, so you are not really the owner of the domain

Not getting into this shit either, unless maybe for buying an apartment.

<b​asses:matrix.org> Tron or USDT on Tron?

I use njalla temporarily, ye - was looking for "proper", non-proxy registrars specifically.

<b​asses:matrix.org> TRON or USDT on Tron?

I know 1984.is, but it doesn't suit my needs.

<p​cre:monero.social> Do you also have the feeling that people are getting angrier and angrier because they don't understand that they are being fucked by an invisible inflation tax?

<k​arano:poddery.com> x.com/wasabiwallet/status/1786083838415769673

<k​arano:poddery.com> wasabi coordinator shuts down:

<k​arano:poddery.com> x.com/wasabiwallet/status/1786083838415769673

<a​remor:matrix.org> Spooked!

<a​remor:matrix.org> Seems to be driving up XMR/BTC

<b​asses:matrix.org> namecheap accepts btc lol

<b​asses:matrix.org> but kyc too sometimes

"company" <<<<<<<<<<<

coinjoin coordination

and then they wonder

<a​remor:matrix.org> A necessary step though. Most don't even go that far

<a​remor:matrix.org> The most XMR that they have on their books, the most likely they will be to start setting nice round numbers.

<a​remor:matrix.org> And probably fully surveilled

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Because LTC is not?

<a​remor:matrix.org> At least ltc is decentralized and censorship resistant and open source.

<a​remor:matrix.org> The more XMR that they have on their books, the most likely they will be to start setting nice round numbers.

<b​asses:matrix.org> >After years of relentless dedication to improve Bitcoin’s privacy, zkSNACKs, the company pioneering the development of Wasabi Wallet, is shutting down its coinjoin coordination service, effective June 1st, 2024.

<b​asses:matrix.org> >Blog post announcement link:

<b​asses:matrix.org> blog.wasabiwallet.io/zksnacks-is-di…in-coordination-service-1st-of-june

<b​asses:matrix.org> lol

<i​gna:xmr.mx> so is ltc (except the instant)

<i​gna:xmr.mx> TRX is commonly accepted because of USDT which uses its network

<i​gna:xmr.mx> otherwise it'd die

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Yep, but it's also... fast...

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Yep, they can censors you, but if it don't get stuck when the swapper sent it to you it should not get stuck when you send it away (always use fresh address)

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> The Censor thing is the main thing agains it, it's like ETH at the end.

<i​gna:xmr.mx> fast isn't always good, remember that some cryptos get higher fee when fast

<i​gna:xmr.mx> | Yep, they can censors you, but if it don't get stuck when the swapper sent it to you it should not get stuck when you send it away (always use fresh address)

<i​gna:xmr.mx> mfw money lanudering

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> you usually use that thing to buy shit on where they don't accept XMR lol, other than that (and usdt), it have no use

<p​aranoia_machinery:monero.social> since joinmarket is the only one left for btc keep in mind that it isn't very good:

<p​aranoia_machinery:monero.social> oxtresearch.com/toxic-recall-attack-unwinding-joinmarket-case-study

<i​gna:xmr.mx> what if they don't take xmr and trx

<i​gna:xmr.mx> what if they don't take xmr and trx (and obviously, usdt)

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> I don't remember seeing that, if you manage to find such a site, go to another one that have the same product?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> And if you don't find then use the LTC and wait a lot more

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Or Doge but fee are higher than LTC, that coin so useless

<i​gna:xmr.mx> there should be another crypto thats good as xmr (and ltc) but also accepted a lot like btc

<i​gna:xmr.mx> does people even use doge anymore

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Well, maybe, it's still not zero so at least people gamble it

<i​gna:xmr.mx> there should be another crypto thats good as xmr (and ltc) but also accepted a lot like btc/eth

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> The reason XMR is not accepted at much place is because it's private, if a coins as good would exist, it would not be better, people would still say no because private

<i​gna:xmr.mx> beside sof that, it's because its not also that known

<i​gna:xmr.mx> beside sof that, it's because its not also that known and many exchangers even removed it

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Admins definitively don't want use to have privacy, and most payment processor stay away from real privacy coins because they fear they could be abliterated by USSA

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Admins definitively don't want us to have privacy, and most payment processor stay away from real privacy coins because they fear they could be abliterated by USSA

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Admins definitively don't want us to have privacy, and most payment processor stay away from real privacy coins because they fear they could be obliterated by USSA

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I think challenge for the next years will be to improve UX of plausible deniability. XMR not being illegal is good an all. But what if people start using the circular economy. I wouldn't be surprised for gov to at some point prohibit the owning of XMR.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> The privacy be default etho only work inside Monero. If you regard all cryptos, Monero is the optional privacy, therefore it is sus

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> The thing should use port 443 by default for node to node and for RPC

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Protocol should have opcode so the client can tell it if it's connect RPC way or P2P way.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Ideally using TLS like other web shiet..

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> So it look like normal web shiet

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Right now ISP can just log all connection to 180xx and send log to the slaves owner(s)

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Wasabi censored txs, suck shit

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> lol, yeah

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> And they blocked USSA, wonder why?

<3​21bob321:monero.social> In bed with chain anal

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Yeah, in bed with chain anal but still blocked USSA users

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> say a lot about how much they are scared that the same will come to them

<p​aranoia_machinery:monero.social> they announced they are shutting down operations they are so scared

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> What, now they are just shutting down?

<p​aranoia_machinery:monero.social> after jun 1st, no more wasabi at all, not just for US

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> oh my

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> another one bite the dust

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Bitcoin have zero privacy, now that all bitcoin privacy is getting cancelled

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Bitcoin have zero privacy, now that all optional bitcoin privacy is getting cancelled

<p​aranoia_machinery:monero.social> joinmarket is the only coinjoin left and it cxan be demixed because the maker/taker fees are essentially doxxic change breadcrumbs that allow chainalysis to unwind the mixes

Also how does it impact the user if a payment processor is used for the crypto payments?

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Not much, it allow the user to pay with whatever the payment processor accept.

<r​avfx:xmr.mx> Note that the payment processor might have tracking cookies.....

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Nom nom

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 1 week later open up under different name

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Good that they are gone so people dont use it

<p​reland:matrix.org> It depends on how you look at it

<p​reland:matrix.org> From a standard view, there are a few concerns, whether it be reliance on a (most likely) centralized middleman, invisible fees (which can be brushed off as “market/liquidity fluctuation”), or potential surveillance concerns (I’m not concerned about the last one as much because it’s technically feasible at every single step in a transaction)

<p​reland:matrix.org> From (my) point of view, it is hazardous, as it completely removes any influence that the underlying crypto (XMR in this case) has on the product. It also stifles adoption, as vendors are disincentivized against using the currency, and will instead opt for their own currency of choice (another thing I thought of: if the payment processor was ever compromised in any way, it would h<clipped message>

<p​reland:matrix.org> ave an incredibly large effect on vendors, especially in the case of crypto theft)

<p​reland:matrix.org> Think Silicon Valley Bank, sans the FDIC

<p​reland:matrix.org> To be clear, I’m not opposed to payment processors entirely; I don’t think they are a permanent solution.

if someone runs a node with Tor / I2P inbound connections and wants to get added as a seed node please add a comment here: monero-project/monero #9316

what version of C++ do we use?

C++17 in the master branch and C++14 in release branch

thx

why are they different?