i think i asked this in the past but forgot the answer. is the only privacy risk to using a remote node (rather than storing, the whole blockchain locally) that the remote node can log the ip of the transaction?

i understand side-channel attacks and opsec eg if someone from $city demands ransom using monero, connects to a remote node to receive it, then disconnects, then the remote node could just check all ips coming from $city to narrow down the suspect

i see something about remote nodes being able to reduce the privacy provided by ring signatures, but i don't know if that's still relevant

threat model: purchased monero from a kyc exchange in my real name. monero received by a local wallet with a remote node via tor (assume no traffic correlation attack risks). at a later time, that monero is sent to an adversary which is able to collude with the kyc exchange

so the thing i am wondering is what the adversary can conclude assuming they control/monitor the kyc exchange, the remote node, and the entity that i send the monero to

<c​ynicalme:matrix.org> Is there a guide on litecoin swapping at all?

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is this spam?

<l​iamjoes:matrix.org> ✅got some clone 💳cards🏧 and fake bank notes 💷 AAA+grade💯🇬🇧 available 📩

<l​iamjoes:matrix.org> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…matrix.org/mBwOyoKSAlUWhCqDIzEHKntq

wow this place is just spam central

<r​ottenwheel:kernal.eu> Moooods! xmrscott endor00 charuto

<l​iamjoes:matrix.org> what u say mate

<l​iamjoes:matrix.org> English?

<m​cneb10:envs.net> Banhammer we need some ban hammeriong right now

<i​gna:xmr.mx> Yo what countries...

<g​unter:kyun.host> This is fine, just don't say anything mildly based or the Banhammer will get you

<l​iamjoes:matrix.org> Dm me

<i​gna:xmr.mx> Yo i can't

<i​gna:xmr.mx> Dm me instead

<i​gna:xmr.mx> Anyways do u got Chile cards

<i​gna:xmr.mx> That are ready 2 cashout..

<g​unter:kyun.host> Hey man we don't need pounds we already have the kilogram

<a​remor:matrix.org> Reports say Localcoinswap works.

<a​remor:matrix.org> What have you used in the past?

<a​remor:matrix.org> Did a long time ago

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Thats a relay server

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Not the main server

<k​arano:poddery.com> anyone wanna help me in connecting my node to tor ?

<m​cneb10:envs.net> sure

<m​cneb10:envs.net> you just gotta set the hidden service dir for the keys/hostname and then the port i'd assuming

<m​cneb10:envs.net> ive done it before

<k​arano:poddery.com> i am using fedora

<k​arano:poddery.com> i install tor from project

<k​arano:poddery.com> i am not sure whether instructions there are upto date or not

<k​arano:poddery.com> do i need to change the se linux to permissive

<m​cneb10:envs.net> have you checked this?

<m​cneb10:envs.net> getmonero.org/resources/user-guides/tor_wallet.html

<k​arano:poddery.com> yeah i was reading this

<k​arano:poddery.com> but with this command `sudo systemctl restart tor@default` i get an error

<m​cneb10:envs.net> i've never used SELinux so i cant help you with that

<k​arano:poddery.com> but with this command `sudo systemctl restart tor@default` i get an error

<m​cneb10:envs.net> yes the tor systemd service is weird

<m​cneb10:envs.net> try just doing `sudo tor`

<m​cneb10:envs.net> if you have already setup the torrc file

<k​arano:poddery.com> yeah i put the 2 lines in the config file

<k​arano:poddery.com> then ran this in sudo

<k​arano:poddery.com> but still i get error

<k​arano:poddery.com> ` job for tor⊙ds failed because the control process exited with eror code.`

<m​cneb10:envs.net> what is the output of `sudo systemctl status tor⊙ds`

<k​arano:poddery.com> ` failed to start tor⊙ds -Anonymizing overlay network for tcp.`

<m​cneb10:envs.net> any error messages?

<m​cneb10:envs.net> what happens when you do `sudo tor`

<k​arano:poddery.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oddery.com/oSOWxfXzsNIXSVgQHtJhiTTO

<m​cneb10:envs.net> ok service is configured good from what it looks like

<m​cneb10:envs.net> theres the stupid restart limit thing in systemd thats causing the error

<k​arano:poddery.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oddery.com/rePjCirDVkEABGwWeGoHKQXc

<m​cneb10:envs.net> ok systemd service is configured good from what it looks like

<k​arano:poddery.com> ohh i see

<m​cneb10:envs.net> also maybe try `sudo pkill tor`

<m​cneb10:envs.net> and then wait for the service to restart

<m​cneb10:envs.net> the output of `sudo tor` says that tor is already running

<k​arano:poddery.com> same error as this

<k​arano:poddery.com> is there anything alse i should do in the config file

<m​cneb10:envs.net> not really if you followed the guide exactly

<m​cneb10:envs.net> tor is supposed to run as a seperate user in debian

<m​cneb10:envs.net> maybe its the same for fedora

<k​arano:poddery.com> ok

<k​arano:poddery.com> which user

<m​cneb10:envs.net> is there a user that has 'tor' in it

<m​cneb10:envs.net> on my server it's called `debian-tor`

<k​arano:poddery.com> toranon

<m​cneb10:envs.net> ok so the systemd service will run it through that user

<m​cneb10:envs.net> so we want that

<m​cneb10:envs.net> if you try running it normally what happens?

<k​arano:poddery.com> how do i change to that user

<m​cneb10:envs.net> the systemd service will do it for you

<k​arano:poddery.com> without sudo ?

<m​cneb10:envs.net> with sudo

<k​arano:poddery.com> same error

<k​arano:poddery.com> ran ` sudo systemctl restart tor@default

<m​cneb10:envs.net> can you do `sudo journalctl -xeu tor@default` to see the full log

<m​cneb10:envs.net> and see if there is anything interesting in there

<k​arano:poddery.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oddery.com/UMEWyRNxsRRssFXKSOgmDCFP

<m​cneb10:envs.net> try scrolling up

<m​cneb10:envs.net> with the arrow keys, there may be something interesting

<k​arano:poddery.com> i scrolled up

<m​cneb10:envs.net> or check `/var/log/tor/notices.log`

<k​arano:poddery.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oddery.com/hRdQBOsjGbjygqqqdGKGiclI

<m​cneb10:envs.net> ok that is an issue

<m​cneb10:envs.net> this is stock installation, correct?

<k​arano:poddery.com> yeah

<m​cneb10:envs.net> ok so it cant find the default config

<k​arano:poddery.com> how do i solve this 😅

<m​cneb10:envs.net> for me it is at `/usr/share/tor/tor-service-defaults-torrc`

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> ls -l the file to make sure its there

<m​cneb10:envs.net> yeah

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Also hello, hooray for helping others!

<k​arano:poddery.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oddery.com/pmBOAPIalGilaEmJfJawpsnL

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Ah so you are on a Debian based box

<m​cneb10:envs.net> no they are on fedora

<k​arano:poddery.com> fedora

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Oh interesting

<m​cneb10:envs.net> its trying to read 2 default config fiels for some reason

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Can you ls -l /etc/tor/torrc for me?

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> I could be wrong

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> There very well may be two

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Mine had two

<m​cneb10:envs.net> er wait yeah

<k​arano:poddery.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oddery.com/xTCPknCVxpNBGKjrsDLXtQuB

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Bingo

<k​arano:poddery.com> i think its there

<m​cneb10:envs.net> theres a torrc at `/etc/tor/torrc` and `/etc/torrc`

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> That's the main config file

<m​cneb10:envs.net> i did not know that

<k​arano:poddery.com> i see

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> All good!

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> So one sec, let me focus on the main error again

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Yeah try restarting the service now. Might need another adjustment but perhaps that's enough according to these docs

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> community.torproject.org/relay/setup/bridge/fedora

<k​arano:poddery.com> should i replace the config file according to this guide

<m​cneb10:envs.net> i dont think so, the guide is talking about setting up a bridge

<k​arano:poddery.com> sudo systemctl restart tor.service ?

<m​cneb10:envs.net> not a hidden service

<k​arano:poddery.com> i see

<m​cneb10:envs.net> sure

<m​cneb10:envs.net> tor.service and tor⊙ds are different things too

<k​arano:poddery.com> i just installed tor

<m​cneb10:envs.net> tor⊙ds represents your hidden service

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> I think the bridge is old terminology? Anyways

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> The main error seems to want a defaults.torrc right?

<k​arano:poddery.com> ` systemctl enable --now tor`

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Yeah do thst for sure

<k​arano:poddery.com> yeah

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> You could do ln -s /etc/tor/torrc /etc/for/default.torrc

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> That makes a link

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> So if it reaches for either one youre set

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> You could do ln -s /etc/tor/torrc /etc/tor/default.torrc

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Damn autocorrect wrote 'for' in the second path

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Auto incorrect

<k​arano:poddery.com> symlink is created

<k​arano:poddery.com> but tried restarting the service and getting same error as earlier

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Kk make sure my silly autocorrect doesn't screw you over

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Make sure its tor not for

<k​arano:poddery.com> haha yeah i got that

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Alright let er rip and let's we what we've won

<k​arano:poddery.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oddery.com/FMgOtSLfCXqPhQhZJkKccXig

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Kk so we need service log output

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Fire off

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> journalctl --unit=tor

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> You can also let the log flow freely in another window with

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> journalctl -f --unit=tor

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Makes it easier on me when I need to restart it a bunch

<k​arano:poddery.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oddery.com/jlCeBeVEcFhoYVjgnJSOheFK

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Yoooooooooooo

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> She lives

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Now you just let her work

<k​arano:poddery.com> ok

<k​arano:poddery.com> now next

<m​cneb10:envs.net> nice!

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Uh oh what's next

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Cobras?

<k​arano:poddery.com> so tor is running correctly ?

<m​cneb10:envs.net> yes

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Looks happy to me

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Whole bunch of "connected" words in the status output

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Green status font

<m​cneb10:envs.net> mine looks the same

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Excellent

<m​cneb10:envs.net> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…955a488e879042f11789168923745189888

<k​arano:poddery.com> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…oddery.com/nZKTUEBHSaTpjxhuxmTYPSJc

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Ah yes

<m​cneb10:envs.net> oh yeah that

<m​cneb10:envs.net> you need to generate the keys

<m​cneb10:envs.net> for the service

<m​cneb10:envs.net> idk how to do that

<m​cneb10:envs.net> i cracked mine

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Does it automatically

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Mental Outlaw does a great tutorial for this actually

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> If you dont mind watching his stuff

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> If I recall, for me it was a simple as adding a new line to /etc/tor/torrc

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Tor detected the line, found no existing config, made one

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> And the only trick is making sure it talks to your node by setting your firewall, node, and tor hidden service up to use the same port and IP address. Highly recommend 127.0.0.1 so your node only ever talks to Tor

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> And the only trick is making sure it talks to your node by setting your firewall, node, and tor hidden service up to use the same port and IP address for their unique parts of the common purpose. Highly recommend 127.0.0.1 so your node only ever talks to Tor

<k​arano:poddery.com> ot it got it

<k​arano:poddery.com> yeah i think i didn't out it in this config

<k​arano:poddery.com> i had put it in torsocks.conf

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Oh via the proxy eh. I haven't tried that yet

<k​arano:poddery.com> so i don't need to bother about the output systemctl status tor@default

<k​arano:poddery.com> i just ran systemctl restart tor

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Not if you saw a green tor service running

<k​arano:poddery.com> i get the onion hostname now

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Yeah that's different on certain systems for whatever reason

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> What do you see when you run

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> netstat -tulpn | grep -e 18081 -e 18080

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> With that we'll check the ports are open where expected

<k​arano:poddery.com> do i need to put a password compulsorily?

<k​arano:poddery.com> and i need to generate the password hash for the config file ?

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Oh a tor service password? Its not strictly required

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> You could though. I dont know the process as I haven't tried that myself

<k​arano:poddery.com> i see thanks

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Glad I could help!

<k​arano:poddery.com> so i should be able to connect through tor now ?

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Well, tor will open the connection

<k​arano:poddery.com> the onion address should remain rhe same right

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> As long as your firewall and monerod are configured correctly you should be able to talk to your node yup. It can be flaky sometimes though so you might have to retry a bunch

<k​arano:poddery.com> this didn't give an output

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Only changes if you mess with the folder. It uses the key inside the folder as your hostname and to identify itself

<k​arano:poddery.com> but did open 18081 and 18089 ports

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Probably missing the tool. That's not out of the ordinary

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> You can run

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> sudo dnf install netstat

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Should pull it down

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> 18089 or 18080

<k​arano:poddery.com> i get an error in wallet "socks connection refused"

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Hmm yeah netstat will help you ensure the right port has tor listening

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> I can't help much with socks at the moment since I haven't used it

<k​arano:poddery.com> unable to find a match: netstat

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Yup try the command j mentioned

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> One sec I'll link it

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Here

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Or did you not find an install matchM

<k​arano:poddery.com> netstat is installed i guess

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Or did you not find an install match?

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Maybe I'm using the wrong name for the package that includes netstat

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Oh shit this is where Fedora slaps

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Run

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> dnf whatprovides netstat

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> One of the comfiest tools it has lol

<k​arano:poddery.com> i think its listening at 18089

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> It'll actually look netstat up and tell you what package to install

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Kk then keep trying your onion service

<k​arano:poddery.com> ohh i forgot enter the port after the onion address

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> That'll do it

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Jibbityjabbity.onion:18089

<k​arano:poddery.com> yay ! it connects now!! 😃

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Booooooooooooooo yah

<k​arano:poddery.com> thanks bruh 🙏

<k​arano:poddery.com> pretty much hijacked this chat for one issue 😂

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Glad I could help!

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Lmfao

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Yeah you can DM me next time if you like

<k​arano:poddery.com> sure 🤟

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> 🤙

<k​arano:poddery.com> one more quick question, does my node now connects to peer nodes also on tor ?

<k​arano:poddery.com> or it still connects to peers only over clearnet

<k​arano:poddery.com> should i add my tor node to monero.fail ?

<n​ihilist:m.datura.network> You can only add monero nodes there

<n​ihilist:m.datura.network> If you have an .onion link to your monero node, then yea I recommend making sure it's listed there

<k​arano:poddery.com> i understand, i said in context of monero

<k​arano:poddery.com> just submitted!!

<k​arano:poddery.com> can i make a custom name for my tor node url address

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> I know selsta needs reliable onion nodes as well

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> To help folks sync over tor I believe

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Yeah theres a guide somewhere online iirc

<k​arano:poddery.com> so will my node automatically find peers over tor ?

<k​arano:poddery.com> or it will connect to clearnet nodes too

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Depends on how you configure tor. I think by default unless you restrict the p2p port to 127.0.0.1 local address, then it searches the clesrnet

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> I dont really care if I relay node traffic in the clear since that's not my threat model

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> RPC over onion via 127.0.0.1, with username and password

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> And I just save my onion address

<k​arano:poddery.com> i will run `peers` in my monerod terminal

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> I dont wanna be noticed except for 020

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> *p2p

<k​arano:poddery.com> ` print_cn` gives only ipv4 clearnet hosts 🤔

<k​arano:poddery.com> ` print_cn` gives only ipv4 out clearnet hosts 🤔

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Yes, that's p2p

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> You have 18081 and 18089 on tor yes?

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> P2p is 18080 iirc

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> So you have the end that people normally stick in the clearnet in the clearnet

<k​arano:poddery.com> i am using --restricted-bind-port=18089 right now

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Ah okay so you should ensure your monerod daemon is only listening on 127.0.0.1 for p2p if you only wanna sync over tor

<k​arano:poddery.com> i am using --rpc-restricted-bind-port=18089 right now

<k​arano:poddery.com> --rpc-restricted-bind-ip=0.0.0.0

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Yeah that's all interfaces

<k​arano:poddery.com> ohh

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Which means it talks to your router

<k​arano:poddery.com> so i should not bind over all interfaces ?

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> You want to only talk to your router through tor

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Right

<k​arano:poddery.com> ok

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> You only want tor to talk to stuff locally

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Before it sends it out

<k​arano:poddery.com> is there any need for --p2p-bind-ip

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> That should be the parameter that sets your p2p address.

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> To be safe perhaps set that to 127.0.0.1 too

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> But tbh unless the feds are going to drag you to a blacksite for sending monero sync data I think it might not be worth the extra effort

<k​arano:poddery.com> lets try it

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Haha sure, why not is a valid path as well

<k​arano:poddery.com> i am okay if clearnet and tor peers are both connected

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Fuggit, yeehaw, etc

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Chad moves

<k​arano:poddery.com> still ipv4

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Oh shit my bad

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Youre tryna go ipv6 yeah?

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> Here I was going on about subnets lmao

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> I'm not much good with ipv6. We dont get much up here in syrupland

<k​arano:poddery.com> no , for tor nodes

<a​xmasta:matrix.org> You dont want ipv4? Am I misunderstanding?

1

<k​arano:poddery.com> i want tor peers in addition to ipv4 if thats possible

<k​arano:poddery.com> i think i am missing some monerod option

<k​arano:poddery.com> should i keep --no-zmq ?

anywhere to download a (more or less recent) pruned blockchain directly over http? monerod over tor seems slower than wget

it will take more than a week to download at this rate, but i know with my internet i can download 100gb in only 2 days even over tor...

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> nah unfortunately its pretty slow and outdated from monero website

wdym?

i'd just like a download for a (pruned) blockchain that i can then sync more quickly

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> only source for downloading the blockchain over http is getmonero.org. And afaik it's rate-limited, you can bypass that of course by using download manager like aria2 but gl with corruption

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> There is no http source for pruned blockchain afaik

oh i see, how rate limited is it?

using tor, i can just have two or three wgets downloading different ranges

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> idr but so slow that I preferred to sync it myself

for some reason even when running with tor (via torsocks), it is spamming my firewall with blocking outgoing attempts to port 53

<e​vilalbantrader:monero.social> Hi all)

jesus it really is spamming my syslog HARD with outgoing dns attempts

did i misconfigure it? "DNS_PUBLIC=tcp torsocks -i monerod --p2p-bind-ip 127.0.0.1 --no-igd --prune-blockchain --sync-pruned-blocks --rpc-bind-ip 127.0.0.1"

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Hi evilalbantrader

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I don't think you did

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> wait

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> don't do that

?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Do not pass monerod through torsocks. Monerod do not support downloading the blockchain over Tor

well it's doing it, it's just very slow

and that's what was on the monerod github

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Yes because other nodes are connecting to an exit tor relay

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Can you give me the link

because it's spamming dns request, would "--disable-dns-checkpoints" be helpful? and sure

actually github.com/monero-project/monero?ta…b=readme-ov-file#using-tor-on-tails

no wait the first one was correct lol

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ok nvm I didn't knew it was possible. I remember an issue on stack overflow stating it discouraged

would "--disable-dns-checkpoints" prevent it from constantly trying (and failing) to connect to dns?

"W WARNING: no two valid DNS TXT records were received" appears every time which i assume is due to it trying to connect to dns without tor for some reason

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I don't know. You can try

no luck

--proxy fixed it, no need for torsocks

and holy wow now i know why it's slow. i'm i/o limited

my internet isn't even fast, so i thought a usb 2.0 flash drive would be enough

estimated 40 dAys now//

??

maybe "--db-sync-mode fastest:async:250000000bytes" would help?

does it have to reread the entire database for every single downloaded block?

no

but fast random access helps a lot

usb 2.0 is not fast

you need an SSD

using a usb flash drive

it's faster than my internet so i thought it would be enough for an initial sync

"faster" how?

maybe it's fast when you copy one big file

this is not how Monero syncs

you need fast random access

i thought an initial sync would just be downloading the entire thing

It is downloading _and_ verifying

verification is the heavy part

each block can't be verified individually?

i'm at 1% sync right now and it's slowing down significantly. will it be much slower when i am all the way up to 50%?

damn this is bad. i need to have this ready within a week, and it's saying it'll take me over a month just to sync

is there any way to just download the whole thing (which would take about 2 days with my internet) and then verify it after?

sech1: something must be wrong. judging by its estimate and the speed of my usb drive, the ~50gb pruned block chain will require 40 *terabytes* of i/o

Don't just multiply speed of your usb drive by the number of seconds

If it says 10 MB/s, it probably 1 KB/s at best when doing random accesses

it's an ssd

it can do nearly 100mbit/s random access when i put it in the 3.0 slot

You said usb 2.0 flash drive

it's not an ssd

it's mlc flash

it's a flash drive

they have shit controllers compared to an ssd

flash drive is a type of ssd it's just not a high performance internal one

i just mean it's not rotating disk

yes, and now you see how much it is "not a high performance"

what kind of i/o is required for downloading and syncing the blockchain initially?

a lot of random reads, not so many writes

it seems right now it's a lot of writes because if i run "sync" it hangs for ~5 minutes, so there are a lot of dirty buffers it's trying to flush

is there any way to optimize this, like downloading a pre-pruned and pre-synced blockchain? (and then manually syncing only the last ~month worth of transactions)?

sech1: according to iotop it's about 1.5 MB/s write and 50 kB/s read

current eta is 2.4 months

<k​arano:poddery.com> hey @sech1 , can my monerod connect to peers on tor ?

<k​arano:poddery.com> how can i configure it ?

i must be doing something wrong. even with a slow flash drive, that's so much writes that i wouldn't be surprised if the drive died by then

i can't use a remote wallet because apparently that defeats or reduces the decoy addresses/ring signatures or whatever, which harms privacy

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> you can trust sech1 on this. And I even confirm. This is unfeasible to sync monerod on an USB flash drive

damn

i have nothing else (except internal spinning rust)

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> the USB controllers are optimized for sequential writes and lightweight load. Worst case scenario for LMDB which require random access

Best you can do is to sync to an internal SSD and then copy the lmdb files

only internal ssd i have is 2010 era 16gb caching ssd

how bad are using remote nodes for privacy then?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> 16GB caching?

<k​arano:poddery.com> why do you want download the blockchain over tor

downloading it over tor isn't the issue, it would only take about 1-2 days to download it. apparently i/o is the issue

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Remote nodes only know that their connected ips have sent a transaction. So if you choose a reputable remote node and set it to untrusted + you don't care about them knowing you send a transaction its not an issue

but don't remote nodes reduce the number of decoys? something like that?

<k​arano:poddery.com> no

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> no

threat model: purchased monero from a kyc exchange in my real name. monero received by a local wallet with a remote node via tor (assume no traffic correlation attack risks). at a later time, that monero is sent to an adversarial entity which is able to collude with the kyc exchange

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Maybe you're confused with the Black marble flooding discussion on Reddit ?

no i haven't seen that discussion, what i've seen came from localmonero, some monero website, and several stack exchange post

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> having your node synced through tor won't help you on this

>Some other less significant but still also worth mentioned compromises with public remote nodes: the pool of decoys is smaller,

>Thus, the node will know which output in a ring signature is the real one once you send the transaction: it's the one it did not supply.

that's what i was reading

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> > s instead of your wallet selecting from the entirety of the blockchain, you only select outputs from the those the remote node gives you to select from

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> This imply the node is malicious

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Yes this is real, but that means the node is malicious

which i would like to avoid

it makes it seem like the privacy of using a remote node (even without it knowing the ip) is significantly less

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> There are no perfect solution. Just stick to node trusted by the community like Rino and Cake Wallet

what about in that stack exchange post, it says "This is now done: the wallet selects the outputs it wants, so the daemon only knows that one of them is the real one, but not which, which is the same as any blockchain observer can know."

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> hey Ruckniumis there a way to automatically fuzz public nodes in order to see if they are messing with the decoy selection ? Like asking the call thousands of times and inspecting its distribution, so that whenever a node is out of the average/planned distribution we know its messing with decoy selection

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> oh well sry for ping then

?

(i didn't see anyone reply)

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> nah I pinged Rucknium with a question but your quote from stack exchange make this question usless

oh

am i right to say that "this is now done" is referring to the wallet choosing the decoys, not the remote node (as a form of mitigation)?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> last time I asked I was told that the wallet did the decoy selection

and that applies to popular wallets like feather?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> so original statement. If you don't care about the node knowing you sent a transaction you're good

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Any wallet yes

oh good! so the privacy for a remote node, even if the remote node, the kyc exchange i purchase from, and the entity i send coins to all collude, i still have identical privacy as if i ran my own node? (assuming hand waving away theoretical weaknesses in tor or traffic correlatio)?

can i just use monero-client-cli to connect to a remote node or is it better to use something like feather wallet?

syntheticbird: i'm confused because that stack post linked to a commit moneromooo-monero/bitmonero 30203f1 which is in something called "bitmonero" and not the actual monero client?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> hold on

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I had to take a coffee

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> that's because in 2016 it was colled bitmonero not monero.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> called*

oh lol

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> but anyway I think it unrelated because you have linked critics about remote node diminishing decoy pool in 2020 and its a commit from 2016

oh hmmm

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Afaik the only issue with remote node is that they know the timestamp at which you send a transaction, because they are the first one to relay it. And, if malicious, they can mess up the output distribution to make you take more of a particular output

what does "take more of a particular output" mean?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> before RingCT, output did gave amount in clear, even today transactions are building rings on top of preRCT and postRCT outputs, which I don't remember how but anyway your wallet call the node to know the distribution of each amount

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> and then the decoy selection algorithm pick up outputs based on that distribution

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Honestly there is more but if you are really worry about your threat model you should look at "Breaking into monero"

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> it's on youtube and also podcast, I've heard lot of good things about it

but all of that requires the remote node being actively malicious, right?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Exactly. That's the whole point.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> As long as you choose node you trust, that you enable SSL or use Tor, it's perfectly okay

docs.featherwallet.org/guides/nodes

>execute an attack that may reveal the true input of a transaction. This attack does not reveal how much is spent or to whom. This attack has a low chance of succeeding and Feather will warn you if it detects this attack.

interesting

s​yntheticbird: "or use tor" but tor won't prevent a node from performing any attacks, it just will prevent it from knowing whether you're a target worth attacking i assume

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> SSL and Tor is used to mitigate MITM attack between you and the node. That's why I said first "Choose node you trust"

ah right

then lastly, is there any wallet that you'd recommend? i'm familiar vaguely with electrum for bitcoin so i suppose feather wallet for monero is good?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Feather wallet is a reputable wallet indeed. Tho the UX of monero wallets are different from electrum. Your wallet will need time to sync all the outputs that have been sent/used in the blockchain since last time you closed your wallet. So it's not instant synced like electrum.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> There is also Cake Wallet for mobile

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> The Monero GUI for desktop is also very good

honestly i don't plan on saving lots of money so i think each wallet i use will be single-use, so once i use it i can just get rid of it

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> That's a reasonable way of using Monero

i prefer it to the mentality of "too the moon" haha

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ✨ We love money ✨

can someone who has installed it before confirm that "8185 E158 A333 30C7 FD61 BC0D 1F76 E155 CEFB A71C" is the correct fingerprint for feather wallet public key?

just wanna do my due dilligance :p

<i​love9999:matrix.org> when are rings going from 16 to

<i​love9999:matrix.org> the new number

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ilove9999wdym?

<p​cre:monero.social> I think he means this: getmonero.org/2024/04/27/fcmps.html

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> oh

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> ilove9999There are no new number for next hard fork as Monero is transitioning to FCMP w Seraphis or FCMP++. This is a new paradigm where every output of the chain is a possible output in the transaction. Maybe you were also referring to the Grootle proof proposal which would have pushed rings up to 128.

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> Before 2026

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> let's make a trolling campaign for releasing FCMP at the same time CBDC is released

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> by releasing*

<b​asses:matrix.org> docs.featherwallet.org/guides/nodes

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> He linked to it earlier in the discussion

<c​haser:monero.social> there may be a hard fork between now and deploying FCMP++, which may increase the ring size.

<c​haser:monero.social> a​aabbb: I can confirm that that is the correct fingerprint for the Feather release signing PGP key, and has been since at least December 2021.

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> They can also provide you bad decoys 🤔

<t​igerix:matrix.org> Is it known how much tps Monero could potentially handle on a modern cpu?

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> yep check benchmarks on xmrig

<t​igerix:matrix.org> They are regarding hashing for mining, which isn't the same as handling a Monero fullnode right?

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> 🤔

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> dunno about hashing

<t​igerix:matrix.org> Xmrig benchmarks are about the performance for RandomX for cpus, which isn't the same as running a Monero Node verifying the Blockchain.

tigerix there are only estimate but no real testing has been done

there is much room for optimization for one, right now most of what is done is not multithreaded

<t​igerix:matrix.org> Xmrig benchmarks are about the performance for RandomX mining on cpus, which isn't the same as running a Monero Node verifying the Blockchain.

<a​rmpits1:matrix.org> Is buying second hand computers with cash and then using them to mine monero a good way of laundering money

<a​rmpits1:matrix.org> Does it make sense to mine Monero using your GPU+CPU or is it only really a CPU thing

just CPU and even then if paying for electricity it will take a long time to get your cost back

at some elec prices you will actuall lose $$

just buy monero

Octopus have an API for their electric prices - it would be possible to have a rig programmed to only mine at certain prices when it makes money

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> because IRC is piece of shit ware

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> so is matrix.org homeserver none should be using that

<t​igerix:matrix.org> @niocat Do you have an estimate?

no but I don't think that there are any really good estimates

<a​rmpits1:matrix.org> Yes but I don't pay for electricity

again any estimates are purely theoretical

then you find bottlenecks that you didn't expect

when actually using at high throughput

people have tried to use testnet to see but I don't know the numbers and even those turned out not to really stress test as if it was main net

armpits1 there are mining calculators where you can figure out how much monero you can mine based upon your hashrate

this ofc assumes that the network hashrate remains as it is today

tigerix sorry that I can't give you a clearer picture, maybe others can chime in

again whatever the current tps is there is much optimization that can be done

this has been discussed in recent dev meetings

<0​x1zxq7896lp2zero:matrix.org> yep

<n​ot_thankful_for_today:matrix.org> Guys, I have several questions I'd like to ask to gain deep understanding of how monero works. Who can help answer a few questions in regarding to Monero?

<n​ot_thankful_for_today:matrix.org> Guys, I have several questions I'd like to ask to gain deep understanding of how monero works. Who can help answer a few questions in regards to Monero?

<k​jeks:matrix.org> Is it that bad? Ive heard it leaks metadata but to whom and which homeserver doesn't do that?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Are we really surprised coming from a 88's software

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> it leaks literally everything by default there is no encryption

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> and like matrix doesn't do that.. well i wouldn't trust matrix.org they are in the UK and are terribly incompetent when it comes to system administration

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> mine HS is run by a really cute german guy that i connect to over tor

<k​jeks:matrix.org> germans usually are trustworthy

<k​jeks:matrix.org> but how can you be sure? what are the concrete evidences that the homeserver some random guy is providing you is safer than matrix.org?

<k​jeks:matrix.org> I mean, is there a way to test for leaks?

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> and like IRC is fine for public conversation, but there literally isn't a single client that doesn't suck

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> bcs the MSC spec so that the voice calls and text messages are end-2-end encrypted

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I've little to no confidence in germany tbh

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> AGAIN ON MATRIX.ORG CAN WE DEFEDERATE ALREADY

<b​asses:matrix.org> Same with Matrix. all clients sucks

<b​asses:matrix.org> idk how it is with xmpp tho

<b​asses:matrix.org> probably shittier

<b​asses:matrix.org> ??? metadata can be collected

<n​ull:pain.agency> the clients are not very good

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> there is bcs the encryption is handled by the clients and homeservers only manage federation

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> same they are incompetent, but my HS admin is cool

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> and i have a cool rust-based client that can do cool shit

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> also the home-server is written in rust 🤔

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I would have wished everyone to go over revolt.chat but it turned so bad. Greatest open source fall after Bitcoin

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> it was also rust-written

<k​jeks:matrix.org> Hmm, that says a lot. I use element, is there a better option I'm not aware of?

<k​jeks:matrix.org> I've been testing Session but it is almost impossible to find rooms like this.

<k​jeks:matrix.org> You need somehow to find an admins ID and ask him 'pretty please let me in your room'

<k​jeks:matrix.org> Srry this is going beyond Monero scope, if there is another room I could talk about this it would be better

<k​arano:poddery.com> try monocles

<k​arano:poddery.com> what do you want to do ?

<k​arano:poddery.com> you don't need encryption in public groups

Session is sus because basically no average person can host a node.

<k​arano:poddery.com> try xmpp , its true decentralisation and freedom there

I DO host it, indeed!

<k​arano:poddery.com> cool

Wish it got as popular as Matrix.

<k​jeks:matrix.org> I want a service that doesn't expose my personal data, thats all

<k​jeks:matrix.org> I noticed it mostly uses german nodes. But aren't those tor nodes?

<n​ull:pain.agency> I'm already using Gajim and Monocles

<n​ull:pain.agency> Gajim is actually pretty good and keeps getting better

<n​ull:pain.agency> I don't really like Monocles though

Never tried Monocles.

<k​arano:poddery.com> yeah it keeps things much organised

If I am to try a new client, it is probably some terminal one.

<k​arano:poddery.com> its the only client from 2023 xD

<n​ull:pain.agency> profanity-im.github.io

<a​rmpits1:matrix.org> I'm a really small miner, I use old hardware with like 1.5KH/s for $0.03/day

<k​arano:poddery.com> hope you are on the latest one.

<k​arano:poddery.com> though i agree it has some bugs

<b​asses:matrix.org> not e2ee

<b​asses:matrix.org> centralized

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> It was supposed to be self-hostable, for federalized, but self-hostable. and for e2ee they were too busy dealing with pirating nintendo games

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> not federalized*

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> priorities right? They told e2ee was supposed to come after vocal. vocal got delayed, clients got renew, they clients delayed, e2ee is still not a thing and revolt is still proprietary

<n​ull:pain.agency> >was supposed to be

<n​ull:pain.agency> they're hostile against selfhosting Revolt

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Yes they were at the beginning, but people complained so they did packed up docker images and planned on making docs.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I say "did" and "planned" because these mfs didn't update these images and never made a single doc except saying "Third part instances are dangerous"

<n​ull:pain.agency> Revolt is memeware

<n​ull:pain.agency> no one should bother using it

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> be honest with yourself, it it hadn't turned into woke madness it would have been super great

<n​ull:pain.agency> yes, and if they were actually working on the project

<n​ull:pain.agency> I tried it today

<n​ull:pain.agency> it is literally the same as it was 2 years ago

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> no no. Since 2 years ago they turned off the new client beta

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> 👍

How are they even sustaining it all?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Donations

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> but they don't receive a lot since people discovered mods were fucking dictators and that the project was proprietary

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> fortunately Revolt is cheap to setup since main backend instance is like 4GB of RAM

4 gigs for just a chat server??

Even Matrix is not such bloat, wtf

<n​ull:pain.agency> that's nothing for Matrix homeserver admins

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> No no, its centralized and real time with a lot of features. I'm actually impressed its running on 4GB and not more

My Conduit takes 130 megs and it is already egregious.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> its your own instance ?

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> like you're the only one using ?

<n​ull:pain.agency> Conduit sucks, I think Conduwuit is better as it is better maintained and has more features

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> I hate you: github.com/girlbossceo/conduwuit

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Its had only 3 releases

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> third time I hear about transfem.dev in a README.md

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> Maybe it was fork not a long time ago

Yea, I am the only user.

<s​yntheticbird:monero.social> make sense then

Xmpp shits on it so much. It has several users yet is around 30 megs.

<p​reland:matrix.org> “I like discord” 💀

<n​ull:pain.agency> my Prosody takes up 103MB

<n​ull:pain.agency> how does it manage to use only 30MB

How many users/chats do you have? Maybe it is just me having a few.

<n​ull:pain.agency> I never check my server's stats but I think I have around 10 users

<n​ull:pain.agency> and 3 MUCs

<3​21bob321:monero.social> 2 weeks ago

Ah.

I have less. Are users your alts or other people?

<n​ull:pain.agency> other people

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Almost got them

Ah, then makes sense

<a​a01matrix:matrix.org> ottimo

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> PSA: Undisclosed vulnerability in element-desktop reportedly in Rust SDK Crypto

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> matrix.monero.social/_matrix/media/…de/hFW4X66ZEIlpauLBc7lsVWomMrrPNkWK

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> (couldn't find the exact message, but NixOS Devs are under embargo to disclose details about it so it's likely real)

<5​m5z3q888q5prxkg:chat.lightnovel-dungeon.de> possibly in element-web and android as well

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Reaponsible disclosure

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Responsible*