<n​eromonero1024:monero.social> any admin of #monero-markets:monero.social here?

<n​eromonero1024:monero.social> that fker is spamming the fk out of the room

<s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> Seems fine to me

<s​nowman:tetaneutral.net> x.com/zooko/status/1834636670219493786

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> On fluffychat (android) and no icon too

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Monero is literally just (proper) e2ee messaging apps' crypto equivelant so saying you want compliant privacy is like saying you want a backdoored e2ee messaging app 😒

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> did zooko say that

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> thats funny

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> look at this

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> x.com/zooko/status/981486196307062784

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> bwahahaha

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> back in 2018

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> He also said "z cash is winning" in august which may be exaggerated to some degree 😭

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Does anyone actually use zcash for private transactions (genuine question)

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> I don't even see it accepted in many places unless they accept hundreds of coins and insta convert to usdt

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> I noticed it went from 30 bucks to 40 bucks

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> they have good tech but the tokenomics are terrible

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> and it is not really a complete solution

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> After they figured out how to get rid of the stupid signing parties

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> But the lack of default privacy...

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Isn't it like 3% of transactions are private?

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> That's like ltc level lol

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> I don't think the ceremony is that bad

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Bitcoin's halving thing instead of smooth decrease goes against everything in behavioural economics and was probably a random algorithm chosen to not make it too complicated idk why they're saying it's the best way

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> You still have to trust them though which isn't good in principle no matter how secure it is in practice

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> as long as a single ceremony member does not conspire, ceremony is safe

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> yes but you also have to trust that it is not premined like bytecoin

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> ceremony actually requires less trust

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> and if the tradeoff is that you can make the transactions, say 10% smaller that would be worthwhile

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Unlike something like a hash onion where you just need one person to not be evil this is something that happens IRL so (as an extreme example) you bribe people to be evil or threaten them and their families

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> doesn't matter. If someone is in the ceremony and deleted their keys afterwards there is no bribing happening

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> you're not getting the key back

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Before the ceremony

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Surely someone has a list of everyone attending

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> let me put it another way, if there was a new ceremony every year, and anyone could join would it still be a problem?

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> you could just ensure that you participate in the ceremony yourself so you would know that it is safe

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> you don't all have to be in the same room

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> you could even have anonymous people take part

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Oooh ic

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> 👍👍

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> x.com/zooko/status/1558211567748988929 this zooko character seems kind of based

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> xcancel.com/zooko/status/1261427609168052225 and this

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> oh yeah

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> ever heard of zooko's triangle

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> or like BLAKE3

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> BLAKE hashing algo

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> and other stuff

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> zooko is kind of a big deal

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> he's zooko for coco puffs

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Oh he's a legit cryptographer and not just a twitter user 😭

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Mb didn't realize

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> "Zooko" sounded like a screen name lol

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> yeah zcash is interesting

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> they have a dev tax on the miners though

<n​obfg9000:matrix.org> and some other decisions I disagree with

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> I'm more of a results guy

What other weird decisions there are?

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> For some reason people don't like zcash for actually transacting and it's probably not just first mover advantage

Not researched Zcash, as it is not accepted anywhere anyway, unlike Monero.

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Wait til he blocks you

<n​eromonero1024:monero.social> didn't zooko bash Monero as a coin that "nobody uses" in a recent interview?

<n​eromonero1024:monero.social> or that's someone else?

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Not @nobfg9000 but

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> - not private by default

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> - trying to have exactly the same tokenomics as bitcoin for some reason

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> - spending so much on marketing (including paying snowden)

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> - didn't do shit about chainanal "were completely shielded, with the sender, receiver and amount all hidden, enabling Chainalysis to provide partial information for over 99% of ZEC activity." from wikipedia

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> - not as community driven like monero (although maybe this speaks to the size of their community more than anything) probably because zcash started as an academic project while monero was organic coming out of cryptonote and is now headed by a corpo

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> - doesn't seem to address the elephant in the room of monero bigger = larger anonymity set

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> I don't have xitter fortunately 😁

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Too many centralized platform accounts are never good 😒

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> web.archive.org/web/20170515214237/…com/zooko/status/863202798883577856 zooko contradicted his 2017 self with that tweet 🤷‍♂️

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> I kinda get what he's saying? (Like tor is not an unstoppable wall for law enforcement even if they don't use any exploits) but I don't think these "soft vulnerabilities" should be left intentionally imo

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Like if someone submitted a patch to magically fix timing attacks with zero impact on performance or UX the tor devs wouldn't reject it because "law enforcement uses timing attacks to catch people and it's not really a vulnerability as in CVE-worthy"

"And by the way, I think we can successfully make Zcash too traceable for criminals like WannaCry, but still completely private & fungible." --zooko

lol what

from several years ago :)

ahaha

their is a tweet somewhere that I will not try to find in my present state

<3​21bob321:monero.social> Zcash bends over for regulators

<x​mrscott:monero.social> .zooko

no monerobux :(

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> What's monerobox

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Is it like that wownero bot thing on the subreddit

Hi, i have been using monero gui to sync a local node. I have been using a free vpn which sometimes disconnects. After restarting monero gui wallet and the node sync I have noticed that the size is almost 200gb? I thought it was around 150gb??

<h​bs:matrix.org> The YT channel CryptoTips just did a video about Monero for beginners youtu.be/BWMoE7kDE14

150 is just outdated info, the unpruned blockchain is around 204~GB now

yeah i was just about to say that. Thanks. I just wondered, when does it get to point when it's too much storage/time to have a full node

<d​ave.jp:matrix.org> A few years

1 of my nodes has a 1TB SSD and the other has a 2TB SSD

I wonder what the definition of a few years is

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Pruned node is ~80gb

<o​frnxmr:monero.social> Grows at abt 1/3rd the speed of full node

<c​owboy_coffee:matrix.org> my unpruned nodes are out of space, just got the new SSDs.

<h​bs:matrix.org> What channel should questions about monero-lws be directed to?

If #monero-lws does not exist, here seems ok.

somebody should write a monero wallet emacs package, xmr.el -- something minimal.

so that I can use monero without having to leave emacs.

<h​bs:matrix.org> Well M-x shell and then launch the cli

@h​bs:matrix.org well, I don't do `M-x vterm` and use git cli. I use Magit magit.vc

magit is an example of how convenient + powerful UI/UX can emacs provide for cli tools.

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Emacs mentioned

<search.censys.io> can u guys see this

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> If you mean if the bridge works, yep

<search.censys.io> amazing

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> all thanks to transient.el 😊

<d​aybreak:nitro.chat> Surprisingly there ain't any emacs frameworks for building dashboards like the magit repo view which is unfortunate because they would be pretty useful for xmr.el