libera #monero

11 Aug 2025

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• 04:58
  m-relay
  <s​bt:nope.chat> How to make methamphetamine?
• 05:00
  m-relay
  <s​bt:nope.chat> Tor is kinda centralized. Way more than it should be. Majority relays are in germany. You can't be a directory authority without identifying yourself which is concerning.
• 05:43
  m-relay
  <o​frnxmr:xmr.mx> thats why i use mullvad
• 06:58
  m-relay
  <e​ddie:oblak.be> same here +/- made half in PPLNS of what I paid
• 07:18
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> the other asshole breaks even
• 08:46
  m-relay
  <e​ddie:oblak.be> For P2Pool I can't seem to find numbers on the share difficulty, does anyone know where I can find it?
• 09:21
  sech1
  You can find it by running P2Pool and checking the logs. But the easy way is to multiply hashrate by 10 for p2pool-main/mini, and by 30 for p2pool-nano
• 11:30
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> what would happen if large pools start submitting hash into p2pool rather than mining directly?
• 11:30
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> would doing this reduce their reward or disadvantage them in any way?
• 13:15
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> they will be neither advantaged nor disadvantaged... the payout will always be proportional to their hash rates (especially true for large hash rates)
• 13:20
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> the reason a 51% attacker can force orphan blocks is because they can continue building a private chain with bigger cumulative diff, right?
• 13:21
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> from what I remember, cumulative difficulty is calculated as the summation of how much difficulty blocks had to overcome
• 13:22
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> when it comes to choosing the canonical chain, why not switch to the summation of individual blocks' difficulty?
• 13:22
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> for example, current network hash rate is 5
• 13:23
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> *5.5 GH/s, so blocks will have to overcome 5.5G * 120 difficulty
• 13:24
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> however, each block can actually have difficulty quality of much higher
• 13:35
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> basically, the canonical chain would be: chain with highest cumulative difficulty + lowest sum of PoW hashes
• 14:31
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> for a 51% attack, one must have the cumulative hashrate divided by 1.9
• 14:31
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> it's not easy because your hashrate also grows the total hashrate
• 14:33
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> not really
• 14:33
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> the 51% attacker can build a private chian, and only expose 1-2 blocks at a time to drop blocks from other miners
• 14:33
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> thus, he can do it without increasing the difficulty
• 14:34
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> if now the HR is 5GH/s, to get to 2.6GH you're adding to the 5 and so it scales becoming 7.6GH/s of which you need 4GH/s to attack so forth
• 14:35
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> you're right, b/c they can selfish-mine and hide the blocks
• 14:37
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> maybe a solution could be having a p2pool-style share-chain directly in the consensus protocol
• 14:38
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> fyi, you can also 51% p2pool
• 14:38
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> think of p2pool as just another monero chain but with shorter block time
• 14:38
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> you cannot hide blocks from p2pool
• 14:42
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> controlling the p2pool sharechain is irrelevant for an attack
• 14:44
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> you find a share, publish it to the network
• 14:44
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> build a private chain of shares
• 14:44
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> every time someone else finds a share, publish your own... you either get uncle'd or uncle other miners' shares
• 14:44
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> hmm... so it depends on how uncle is decided
• 14:44
  m-relay
  <n​eromonero1024:monero.social> I totally forgot how uncle is decided... whether it's "first come, first served" or whichever share is better quality
• 15:01
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> even if you uncle other miners and get most of the reward, you still cannot attack the main chain and orphan blocks
• 15:01
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> alright, you've 51%'ed the p2pool and getting most of the rewards but that's it, right?
• 15:02
  Cindy
  so basically p2pool is free from the same disadvantages 51% attacks have?
• 15:03
  Cindy
  why not just force all mining to be from p2pool?
• 15:03
  Cindy
  via consenus
• 15:05
  m-relay
  <l​eonarth_:matrix.org> .
• 15:11
  Cindy
  oh wait i forgot you suggested that
• 15:11
  Cindy
  i didn't scroll up sorry (my terminal is small)