Save_G: why not Element/matrix?

For encryption?

Nah

Matrix's encryption is unreliable and generally considered insecure because they love transmitting metadata

cockliuser: doesn't Matrix support PGP?

* cockliuser: doesn't Matrix support PGP?

Ah, confused it with Conversations/xmpp

matrix uses the tech quite similar to that of signal messenger

the problem is metadata

<annwyn[m]> "cockliuser: doesn't Matrix..." <- > <@annwyn:matrix.org> cockliuser: doesn't Matrix support PGP?

> Ah, confused it with Conversations/xmpp

what matrix uses is (double ratchet etc.) much better than pgp. With matrix/signal you get forward privacy in the event some decryption keys get compromised. With gpg, you got one key and if it gets compromised your whole chat history can be decrypted.

the difference is: signal shares it voluntarily, while self-hosted matrix requires a whole server to be seized

signal shares "what" voluntarily?

discussion here implies signal is vulnerable to metadata leaks

of who-when messages who

and possibly IPs

Nebraskka: Signal is not vulnerable to most metadata leaks because the client is built to prevent any metadata leak

You can also run your own Signal server, but that isn't needed for most threat models because their encryption schemes are secure enough to prevent metadata leaks

Matrix on the other hand, just doesn't care

There was an issue where even if you ran your Matrix server, it still phoned home

* doesn't care (about metadata)

cockliuser[m]: > <@cockliuser:matrix.org> Matrix on the other hand, just doesn't care (about metadata)

more like, matrix by design uses a lot of metadata events for its messaging stuff.

any github issue related? because you control it's behavior in configuration, so no calls happens anywhere but where you configure it to

cockliuser[m]: > <@cockliuser:matrix.org> There was an issue where even if you ran your Matrix server, it still phoned home

I am running one, and in its config files, I tried to shut off any and all phoneing-home events. But god knows what it is doing..

<Nebraskka> "any github issue related..." <- Many github issues but I found this link that sums most of them up

what exactly is being mentioned as "metadata issue" regarding matrix? usually it's about who-when contact who, and matrix has advantages on that

thanks, thought afaik it was an overall protocol reference docs and it's dns is unresolvable at the moment

recommendations for email provider - not 14 eyes country?

any ideas?

tutanota is good...but 14 eyes

doesnt really matter if its zero knowledge encryption. But if your sending an email without pgp doesnt matter where it is cause it can be read

Many privacy oriented services like to pretend that the physical location of their services exempts them from falling into the nets of the global surveillance apparatus. One commonly cited case of a “Fourteen Eyes Free Zone” is the small nation of Switzerland.

Despite claiming that data hosted in Switzerland is more secure as the country is outside of the 14 Eyes (which is technically true as Switzerland does not belong to the 14 Eyes agreement), the Swiss Federal Intelligence Service (NDB) does monitor the communication of non-Swiss persons, just like any other secret service.

Dan (Is not the man & Braxman Tomsparks Advocate): good link, I'll have a read

Buying monero has became a massive pain in .au. Anyone across an easier way?

Atque, what methods have you tried?

I'm in the same boat

currently getting ready to try localmonero

its either that, or buying a spyware coin and swapping it to Monero

that's how I see it

aus?

use local monero

DanIsnotthemanBr: ty

jannies are asleep post rare justins?

<kyclol[m]> "image.png" <- psyop

lemme guess, I am supposed to use elite wallet?

kyclol: VERY interesting

tell us more

If someone buys from kraken and sells at localmonero, is the coin still vulnerable to EAE attacks

mind you, I don't really understand what an EAE attack is

jollyboy[m]: > <@jollyboy:matrix.org> mind you, I don't really understand what an EAE attack is

start here

<Save_G[m]> "how does this data base thing..." <- Snapshots

giusep11: This chat is English-only. If you wish to speak in Italian, please join #monero-italia:monero.social

is there a UK monero group?

Hm?

Please reword the question

how to start i downloaded the gui wallet in advanced mode now it's downloading the blockchain for me

I had a basic wallet and I entered unmineable but I didn't trust it and I redid the wallet but it's slow

so you do NOT want to download the blockchain (run a node)? or you do?

If not, youll need to switch from "local node" mode to a "remote node"

I was interested in mining and therefore I need the wallet

is this file needed? XMRig miner?

Yes

Xmrig is the best foss mining software for monero

you dont have to run a node to use a wallet. Just need to use a TRUSTED node

Running a node helps the network, but so does mining. So each his own. Or both.

buy monero on kucoin exchange? good idea?

I'm thinking buying from an exchange in a 'non-western' country is preferable, because our data is not as meaningful to them

You cant kyc on kucoin as an american

does that mean you cant signup?

Usually its better to ask questions than to offer solutions to problems that we dont know about

Xyproblem.info

You can trade crypto to crypto on kucoin

You can also trade crypto to crypto on tradeogre

You can also swap crypto to crypto on many swap sites/services (such as trocador.app)

thanks

But perhaps none of these reach your goal - which is still unknown at this time

my goal is to stack Monero

jollyboy[m]: Based

18.7 is suicide stack

from the comfort of my own home, preferably

jollyboy[m]: That is very vague

kucoin is either in Hong Kong or Seychellas (cant figure out which)

Or america

it might be based in USA?

unless you believe what noncompliant exachanges tell you

Could be in north korea. Cmon now

Im just thinking, western KYC laws wouldnt apply right, if it was hong kong or seychellas

lol

No

Youre thinking "kucoin is a regulated entity that is obviousky telling me the truth about their HQ location"

And forning opinions around such a wild assumption

Xyproblem.info

xy problem..but to find a solution you need to ask people about each solution

ofrnxmr[m]: Lol. Imagine giving kucoin your id lmao

jollyboy[m]: Did u read

Cuz thats not what it says

it says, tell people about the problem, not your proposed solution

BTC going down, XMR going up.. the stable coinnnnn

Precisely

giving ID to kucoin....what would be so bad?

or giving it to kraken?

can you tell me, without joking, what is so bad about that?

The problem is?

Again with your solutions

you said "Imagine giving kucoin your id lmao"

indicating giving them your id is a bad idea, right...

(any sorry for going on about this silly stuff)

"how can i use coinbase to self custody xmr using a webwallet"

Is not a question

jollyboy[m]: Mhm

And you want to take the long route

Eliminating each of your sokutions 1 by 1 before you do what step 1 should be

Xyproblem.info

You expkained your goal. It was too vague

You want to stack xmr at home? Any and everyway you acquire xmr will accomplish that

problem definition:

scared of KYC, want to obtain Monero

Localmonero

I'm trying that at the moment

Finish trying lol

some people deny you based on country though

I mean

complete the try

I need to go to a cash changer to make the payment

so its not from the comfort of my own home

which is fine

why would you have to do that

Unless YOU decide thats how YOU decided you want to pay

one guy denied credit card payment based on my country, he said 'I have no way to explain to my card processor, a payment from your country'

you see its not all so 'cut and dry'

Youre "buying" xmr using debt

And complaing about kyc?

the meaning of your statements isn't clear, I can only guess what you mean

your card know who you are and youre not even paying for the xmr - visa is loaning you money

Might as well use kraken

there not loaning me, it gets taken from my account

Credit? Is a loan

kraken - you purchase data will remain with a USA company, forever

Visa doesnt settle instantly either and csn be revoked

thats what I dont like

And credit wont, lmao?

anyway, Im not taking out a loan

credit card doesnt know the nature of the transaction

kraken and others do

anyway, how many Monero users buy from american exchanges do you think?

jollyboy[m]: Lol

your 'laughing your ass off' alot, haha

jollyboy[m]: Most of them

yeah...

Either directly or by buying litecoin etc and swapping for xmr which usually comes from binance

interesting

that is very precise information. so it seems certain exchanges do certain swaps

Not really. What interesting is that someone afraid of kyc would like to mix no-kyc with credit

No

Onky certain exchanges HAVE xmr

So when a swap service needs xmr, they get it from whoever has liquidity

if 'da gabament' has a crypto crackdown, they can go to the exchanges and say 'who bought da coins?'

but if you buy localmonero via visa, the trail is very different

am I wrong?

Yes

so tell me all about it

Who is setup to accept credit card payments?

And sell xmr while doing so?

Regulated businesses. Duh

theres a few on localmonero, it seems

Mhm

but the paper trail is so different

And you think the gabanment doesnt know they SELL CRYPTO

I dont know

When their registered business is a crypto sales business?

No kyc = no kyc

Im just saying to find those transactions....they would have to get data from visa

and go that route

and exchange would just give them 10GB of data in JSON

I dunno wth pissed in "lemonade" youre trying to drink... but thats a cup-o-piss now

In your scenario, what would that crypto-cracking-down government do to you after they found out you bought XMR at one time in the past?

Lols, like evert credit seller on LM

hahaha

yes but what crypto did they buy

whats the transaction ID

No kyc = no kyc

not "theyll never know. Who's gonna know?" Sprinkle a little kyc and then go buy from a honeypot

etc etc, visa purchase aint got all that metadeta

jollyboy[m]: If youre afraid of buying xmr 💀

you telling me Ive got to meet someone at the airport to get your 'pure no-kyc'?

Id never tell these fools "i bought doge". Wa am i, getting scammed?

Naruto Uzumaki visits Monterrey and meets Governor Samuel Garcia and starts a romantic escapade with him. Naruto was feeling restless as he wandered through the streets of Monterrey, Mexico. As he walked, he stumbled upon a seedy bar called "El Coño Rojo," which loosely translates to "The Red Pussy." Naruto was intrigued and decided to check it out. justpaste.it/Naruto_Makes_Love_Samuel_Ga

Nah. I buy xmrx bcuz its bettrr than visa #stepyourgameupvisa

sprinkle a little kyc...

rcia

Naruto Uzumaki visits Monterrey and meets Governor Samuel Garcia and starts a romantic escapade with him. justpaste.it/Naruto_Makes_Love_Samuel_Garcia

Brooooooooo

Naruto sucks

plowsof @plowsof:matrix.org: please kick this tasteless asshole

Yes

must be a bot?

mathew kratter trader university - wanna buy bitcoinc anonymously - go to the airport

serisouly laughed so much

when I saw that

Yeah lol

Me? I just empty kraken reserves

you use kraken?

(Im considering it)

Well, quite in general, how many things can you still do fully anonymously without problems in today's world?

Not everyone CAN kyc, but someones gotta keep buying pressure on them

what do you mean buying pressure?

I mean, if we never buy on exchanges, who is?

If there is no buy orders, the price can freefall

so if no one sells/buys on exchanges, XMR price will fall?

Right

Because we spend it > store sells it on binance

when storr sells, no buyers = price drop

Ive always been surprised at just how bad monero users are at trading stocks

someone needs to teach you

like all things in life

Example.. do you remember gamestop?

Where would you know from how Monero users trde stock?

I remembering hearing about it

The wallstreetbets short squeeze?

from trading monero Lol

Of

Oh*, how they trade stock --

Because monero is adversarial. Monero traders, if they were good at it, would be able to squeeze binance

Instead we have moneruns and nobody calling out the stupidity

Meaning nobody understands, or anybody that does is trading against xmr

Monero viral adoption similar to gamestop, shoukd be easier than gamestop

And actually accomplish what gamestop shilled

You speak in riddles for me ...

Gamestop was a singular event, mostly a black swan event. Don't you put too much into that?

No

If gme was xmr it would have never stopped

the rules of gme are "how to perform a short squeeze"

Monerun cant even do something as simple as look at the gme playbook

How to perform a *successful* short squeeze. Such are very far between.

You cant just withdraw. You need to set sell orders

Because they need to cover their shorts

And you cant just market buy and then leave

Without limit orders, price is allowed to freefall

So if youre binance, you can papertrade xmr right back down to levels where monerun people are in the red. There are no real buy orders stopping you

Thats what is known as a wall

You need to set walls and FORCE binance to sell xmr to you at a loss. But lack of traders means binance barely has to sell any xmr to push the price down

Unlike other crypto, monero DOES have some nice unique qualities.

when it gets slapped down on an empty orderbook, people show up and buy the dip

And xmr tends to recover very fast due to actual peoply waiting for a dip

but yeah. Gme was a flash in thr pan because its basically a shitcoin

Not sure what you mean. BTC at USD 10,000 would also get a hell of a lot of "actual people" buying the dip, no?

no

Btc "actual" users are a tiny fraction of the volume

And bts has a lot of walls made by big money

Do people buy thr dip? Of course

but those people were already on echange

And had most of their buy orders already blown through

Xmr orderbook = empty > volume shows up

btc orderbook = full > rugged > using leftover cash to reenter positions or buy the dip

What did you mean earlier with "squeeze binance". If Monero traders were able to successfully do that, what would happen? Who would profit, in which way?

Those wallstreet bets guys would be far better off if they knew about monero instead

"Shill, shill, shill.. Your were born to shill."

<ofrnxmr[m]> "You need to set walls and..." <- Unfortunately it is stupid for a low volume trader to do this; if the wall is broken it only means you have overpaid for your XMR.

Its even more stupid to TELL binance ahead of time to remove their sell walls

Then market slap a buu

Then run away with your overpriced xmr thinking you accomokished something

While binance proceeds to sell xmr right back down

ofrnxmr[m]: "imma monero extremist..in da lab likea chemist."

If im binance, im looking forward to monerun

Going to sell a few thousand xmr at a higher price than normall? Cool

Ill buy back next week at a 15% dip

<ofrnxmr[m]> "Because monero is adversarial..." <- I'm inspired and greatly wish to become a good monero trader who understands

Please shill and force learning material towards my direction; are you advising us to stop taking part in monerun? or do away with it altogether?

Monerun needs to look at gamestop and follow what they did

Monerun as it is, benefits the exchange

As ceetee said, we dont have enough buying pressure to empty the reserves or to even create solid walls

The intent should be to empty orderbooks and replace them with 5k sells

its really hard to understand the dynamics, its not intuitive, at least not for me

yeah. Thats why WSB was good

They got a lot of people who dont understand, to just follow some simple steps

And watch it snowball

Trust the plan.

ofrnxmr[m]: Isn't this what the ngu-klique also achieved over at the btcland?

"5k sells". Please elaborate.

"Just stack sats bro. Don't think.."

rbrunner: Limit sell xmr @5k so the orderbook shows real liquidity

I offer some XMR for some equivalent of USD 5000?

yup

And that's more than plain nonsense that everybody will just plainly ignore?

(or any high enough number that whoever is shorting cant buy back)

No, thats setting the weight of the liquidity on the orderbook

Thinking about it, the problem is that binance can just close withdrawals and wait for the market to cool down. Their short position does not have any interest associated with it

* any interest rate associated with

exactly. Just like with gme.

problem os. Xmr is xmr. They have to hand it over eventually. And they cant sell xmr they dont have

So if they are paper selling xmr and letting me set limits at 5k, but nobody can accquire kiquidity from them

= short squeeze accompkished

Time to close the next exchange too

And what's preventing this? Not enough people with the required trading knowledge?

Fixedfloat cant get xmr from binance - needs to go to kucoin

Kucoin prices are higher because mkre vokume and less kiquidity

Once kucoin fucks around or runs out, kraken get hit

rbrunner: Yeah

Interesting theory.

ofrnxmr[m]: Really, that simple?

And i think a bit of misdirection where xmr people are active\y told to avoid trading it

Xmr as an asset has outoerformed a lot of things

"If something looks too good, it usually is". Only the lack of some trading knowledge is between us and taking down Binance, yeah right.

Tell that to gme

ofrnxmr[m]: This message needs to reach to a broader audience. Out of this chat room

Yeah, and why don't we have a repeat of GME once every month?

because we dont talk to wsb peopke

Normie cattle easily distracted would be my guess

If your views conflict with reality, reality wins.

And have an aura that trading is taboo or something

Wbs is all abiut NGU to crush shorts

Xmr is like "eww"

ofrnxmr[m]: > <@ofrnxmr:monero.social> exactly. Just like with gme.

>

> problem os. Xmr is xmr. They have to hand it over eventually. And they cant sell xmr they dont have

how long is "eventually"? I think they can easily sit it out for 2 weeks, maybe 4, without looking like they are insolvent. That's plenty of time for markets to cool down

Gme went on for months before the bankers couldnt squirm anymore

ofrnxmr[m]: We do have that. Another taboo we have is, "Don't buy Monero." or, "Monero is not an investment." Both of which are outrageously stupid. Causes us to shoot ourselves on our foot.

Example

Gme trading was disabled on ibkr

Options positions rules were chsnges to sell only and shit

Do i want people trading xmr? Not any longer than it takes binance etc to learn their lesson financially

k4r4b3y[m]1: Its a balance. XMRs value proposition comes from the fact that is is used as a currency. This hard backlash against moonbois gives it some legitimacy to new users imho

ceetee[m]: A currency can also be hoarded. Monero is also a store of value. We shouldn't shy away from that proposition. Shows others a weakness of ours.

The trick though, is if moonbois get xmr - theyll hold the first usabke crypto or stock theyve ever had

And might just fackin use it!

Doesn't matter if this proposition is truthful or not. What matters is saying "monero is not a storr of value" is an admission of weakness.

becsuse there is no reason to sell xmr

ofrnxmr[m]: Yes. People should hoard Monero and use it for products and services.

If you want to face binance, you have to frame it as a fight against unjust banks - f them over and detach yourself from the banking sector in one go

ceetee[m]: our current global situation is an excellent env for this tho, right?

k4r4b3y[m]1: I like to recommend people a "f it" fund in XMR that can pay for food and shelter for a month or two

people currently dont have the spare cash to gamble. Also plenty of people lost some GME and will be hesitant to try again

In the end it was not those who set their sell at 5k, but those who sold to the newcomers at 300

as usual only retails gets fcked

I agree. But when people have the cash again, they should see XMR as a store of value, in addition to other functions of money as according to Aristotle.

One thing I go apeshit everytime I hear certain btc'ers say is this: "monero is interesting from a medium of exchange perspective. But not from a store of value one."

This motherfuckers think that a transparent ledger can store any value away from the violent coercion of govt mafie.

Mafia*

ceetee[m]: Right, but in xmr its different - becauae its not JUST ngu

Its viral adoption

k4r4b3y[m]1: their block reward is like piling more and more gold in a bank, while reducing the amounts of guards each time. Of cause it will implode eventually...

for viral adoption there ate too few places where you can spend it yet

6.25 btc per block lol

Imagine if btc went to 1m

What the difficukty woukd have to be to justify paying out such money

ceetee[m]: Not with a wsb-like run

speculative

Gme only has one marketing angle

"Buy because fk wallstreet "

Thats jist a trojan horse for xmrs real qualities for retail investors

crypto in general is dismissed by the general population because there sooooo many scams

Exactttlyyy

I dont think we could reach critical mass without the normie's who only see the scams

Viral xmr is like "i slipped, fell, and landed on the only non-scam?"

Perople accept doge and shiba becuse of viral nonsense

I have nightmares of finding out cake wallet is a scam

Yes. Cake wallet is really a vampire

Or does magical things

Not sure how the monero code can be a scam

Or do you mean some feature of cake?

ofrnxmr[m]: you mean the default connection to their servers?

nightmares are hard to describe but yall are making me think I'm about to have alot more of em

r4v3r23[m]: He said scam

garbage either way

Stack, feather, monerujo, all make default connections

you know what im talking about

And up until a year ago, all wallets made default connections

dont down play it

Cakes default connection are to their node and the fiat api btw

Playbwhay down? Feather does the same

Except to 8 nodes and then third party services

Stack does the same, to their own node

And technically local nodes for gui even make defaut connections to seed nodes and dns

I been lurking this chat like 2 weeks tops, and i'm pretty sure ofrn is satoshi

Not sure how im downpkaying it, when im the one who opened the issue

im not dr craig wright 😂

ofrnxmr[m]: then you know its not making the same connections as monerujo

ofrnxmr[m]: and caused a storm about it when they didnt allow users to disable it

Monerujo doesnt show fiat values

?

Feather

Default

Stack

default

k

care to show me where feather shares metadata with their central server, even when using own node?

If you run in default mlde, feather makes a bunch of externsk connections to third party servifes

Cake offers an onion for the fiat api - i cant say the same for any other fiat api

Everyone else is pulling from kraken or coingecko

ofrnxmr[m]: cetnral server, please

s/cetnral/central/

Coingecko and kraken arent central servers?

Or are you asking "does tobtoht run a fiat api"

And the answer is, no, he doesnt

are they FEATHERS central servers?

he relies on someone elses

so no

So if feather feather uses cakes fiat api, then what?

s/feather//

all of a sudden its not central?

Do you know what an oracle is?

a price oracle*

If youre using a fiat api, you are relying on a price oracle to feed you good data from somewhere

i know shady shit when i see it

Its nice to just plug in coingecko. But why would you trust coingecko if their orices often diverge from exchsnges?

And coingecko has shitty proposaks to try to have prefered treatement on germonero.org

👍️

Its ok to feed them price data xmr/usd at xyz time, but using cakes onion is a nono

I run with fiat apis off anyway

Hence my issue and the reason stack allows you to disable it

ofrnxmr[m]: Is this a dogwhistle for chainlank talk?

No, its about price data all comes from somebodies central server

Whether that be xauxag or usdxag or xagxmr

You either need multiple apis to reach all markets, or you need to create an oracle that tracks multiple markets

on locakmonero, you can set a sell price as

max(coingeckoxmrusd,krakenxmrusdbid)

Why would anyone do this? Because prices arent the same everywhere. Coingecko telling you your balance might vary greatly from whatever is actually trading on a certain exchange

monerokon meeting in 10 minutes in #monero-events:monero.social

Is there a way to make loading the wallet faster?

It's been about an hour, wallet still isn't open

Height 2561684 / 2885102

To be fair, I haven't opened the wallet in probably a year

But monerod HAS been running the entire time

I just didn't use the wallet cli till just now

wallet is open and you are waiting for it to sync

no idea how long syncing a year's worth of txs takes

an hr sounds like a long time

but then I use a super computer

not a pi

25638 monero 31 52 0 73G 3173M uwait 1 17.5H 7.51% monerod

Damn, monerod must be leaking like crazy

Anyways, it's a 2 core SkyLake

I had a 2 core without AES and it was slow

oh yeah def no AES

wallet sync was recently improved but I think only for txs after the date of the improvement

nioc: ≈$0.0054 • ≈ value of: 1 SYNC • Source: cmc/ccc/altm

^^ look at me, imma rich lol

*only for blocks after

Ouch.

just synced 7k blocks which took ~10 seconds

so on this modern comp a years worth of blocks should take a few minutes

Impressive. Very nice.

hello which is a good choice of remote to use?

Just use feather wallet on desktop and monerujo on android.

okay thanks.

19:32 <riceandbeans> But monerod HAS been running the entire time <-- monerod can't sync wallets on its own

<housemate> "hello which is a good choice..." <- remote node?

you can try using monero.fail to find one

okay, thanks

<ofrnxmr[m]> "Snapshots" <- explain please

I need a payment gate solution for monero that can be implemented in an online shop

hello, are you using wordpress?

monerobull[m]: No idea what they are using

seems to be a custom website with comgate

well custom website made from some template

static pages

pay.binance.com/en maybe?

trocador payment gateway?

hmmm dunno

They don't seem to like self-hosting

nowpayments.io ?

bcs they probably want to be paid in FIAT

<ShaneonConduitrs> "I need a payment gate solution..." <- btcpayserver